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Well it could be a long hot summer if there’s no May election and Hunts latest cuts to councils really start to bite, causing the kind of services people just take for granted being slashed.
Council cuts could lead to civil unrest, local government chiefs warn
The big problem is that for most people, what they think of as public services is the NHS and what’s provided by local government.
If council services end up in (even) more of a mess, it will blow back on HMG.
A glance at any local Facebook will tell you that you can get away with pretty much anything, but woe betide anyone who messes with wheely bin collections
Our (recently become Labour controlled) borough council has made some unpopular cuts and the local Facebook group Tories are all making it about a poor Labour council rather than 14 years of government cuts.
Same here (Wokingham).
It's never returned anything other than a Tory MP, yet somehow all the out of work Tory councilors since the last elections are all over Facebook saying everything is the fault of the Lib/Lab coalition in the last few months.
Apparently they left the accounts in such a state there wasn't even the money to pay for the bin bags (we still get printed bags rather than wheelie bins).
Anyone remember in school when the maths teacher said "you'll never have a calculator in your pocket when you grow up"?
Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you, the Prime minister of the United Kingdom:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/rishi-sunak-benefits-national-insurance-b2510044.html
To be fair, we have to assume Sunak has a reasonable grasp of 'play group' level maths, but we should also consider how very rich his wife is, and how rich his 'colleagues' are.
Rare post in this thread. Why are the Tories effectively saying that they have created a problem (rising numbers not looking for work) and then tell us they will fix it by making us rich next parliament if they are elected and interviewers don't ask the obvious question? Boils my piss.
interviewers don’t ask the obvious question?
Yep, that is most interviews. They always seem too rushed and don't probe into the bullshit they are being given. Simple question such as how, what, where, when, can you give me an example etc,.
I'm still not buying a May election.
What they got - 3 weeks?
Thing is about the current climate - nothing surprises me...
I’m still not buying a May election.
Guardian reckons autumn - also predicting a pretty bad result in the council elections due in May...
What they got – 3 weeks?
more like 2 weeks
Yeah they have missed the window for a May 2 general election, unless they want a very short general election campaign. Which as things stand would be daft imo.
A long 4 week general election campaign would give the right-wing press plenty of time to dissect and criticise labour policies, and maybe turn things round a tad for the Tories.
The general election campaign will focus more on Labour policies than the day-to-day failings of the government, as is currently the case.
Mind you still daft for the Tories to leave it another six months imo. The only party whose support has increased significantly in the last year is Reform UK, mostly at the expense of the Tories. There is no reason to believe that will reverse in six months time.
It was apparently assumed by pretty much everyone in Westminster that it was going to be a May election and I don’t doubt that was the plan.
But that failed to factor in Rishi’s main character trait…
He’s a bottler.
I can’t see anything getting better for the Tories between now and the Autumn, but it could well get worse. They’re going to be decimated in the local elections, which isn’t a great look.
Still… looks like Rishi’s bottled it. Again.
There is no reason to believe that will reverse in six months time.
As I said a couple of pages ago, they'll be holding out for something - anything - that can be used as leverage or that can be weaponised a bit. Same way that Leave tipped the balance in the final few days of referendum campaigning, the longer the Tories can hang on, the more they can asset strip, blame Labour-run councils, promise golden unicorns etc and the more chance that something will be their "Leave moment".
Escalation in Ukraine or Israel/Gaza, some positive movement in the markets that actually shows some beneficial effect for consumers, another tax giveaway...
Or a colossal ****-up from Labour which unfortunately looks imminent pretty much every day, they seem to have this knack of being really quite underwhelming.
Perhaps this is an apt thread to post this opinion on why we're all ****ed, good to see Gary is finally getting more airtime in the press.
Lower interest rates and possibly lower inflation (and thus energy prices) are the reasons to hang on.
Plus people don't give up power easily
That's not to say things won't get worse of course. 'Cos metrics don't tell the actual picture but are good for sound bites.
UK inflation is currently 4% so getting down to say 2% is unlikely to be a hot topic in October.
Edit: Recent increases in energy prices aren't the result of inflation btw. They might fuel inflation but the huge increases in energy prices of the last couple of years weren't caused by inflation.
the world economy will bounce next year who ever gets in will clearly be responsible for the positive momentum.
you never know rish may get back in,
More Tory voters would turn out this coming May if it was a Genral Election.
Another way of looking at it is that an Autumn election still gives the Tories time to get rid of Rishi.
I think he's toast. After May it will be obvious to the Conservatives that they'd stand a better chance in an Autumn GE with a lettuce at the helm. I think it's odds on that he'll be dropped.
Or maybe Sunak wants it this way, skulking off into the undergrowth after May's carnage might be the least ignominious outcome for him. As politically unastute as he is, perhaps even he realises that if he stays as prime minister, the Autumn result will likely be even worse than the worst of current predictions.
Shame really, as I was quite looking forward to Rishi humilliating himself on the campaign trail.
Or maybe Sunak wants it this way, skulking off into the undergrowth after May’s carnage might be the least ignominious outcome for him.
He won't be skulking anywhere, he'll be CEO / Chair / "advisor" to some American bank or tech company within 10 minutes of losing the election. He'll trot off without a care in the world, him and his wife making the most of those Green Cards, watching their earnings go up and up.
He may even get himself a slot on Fox News or the Tucker Carlson show.
Shameless **** that he is.
50-odd Tory MPs allegedly trying to unseat him now, rats in a sack territory. Hopefully they won't succeed, as it will mean the election definitely gets pushed back while they elect another no-hoper. If I were him, if any move to get rid of him looked liked succeeding, I'd just call a GE immediately anyway.
The headbangers who want to unseat Sunak want to install Boris back in again. Just a couple of obvious snags to that plan chaps, eh?
In the meantime Jenrick has been doubling down on his authoritarian, islamophobic extremism in the Daily Heil. The fact that Rishi is once again silent would suggest this is all part of the election strategy and we can expect a lot more of this Tommy Robinson-esque shite
He's just too scared of the Jenrick/Badenoch/Braverman axis of the party to rein them in at this point. Even slapping down the likes of 30p Lee caused him enough problems.
I used to think that, but I now believe he’s fully in agreement with them. I honestly think this is all an orchestrated campaign by number ten to whip up hatred and division to try and get the far right loon vote back from Reform.
They know they’ve lost everyone else already, so that’s all they’ve got left to try and retain at least some seats. They actually think racist pensioners and Sun-reading, flag-wavers will save them
I kind of agree with you binners but I'm not sure if Sunak even cares at this point (or ever did). He has no more authority over his party than he does over the public at large. The party has gone feral.
If he stays Labour will get a majority.
If Braverman wins the leadership Labour will get an even bigger majority. (Binners, you'll also win at the bookies so a win-win for you!)
If Poundshop Penny wins then the Tories could recover their position slightly but Badenoch will slaughter her in any debates so she'll only win if the MP's conspire to keep Badenoch off the final ballot.
Badenoch is the candidate Starmer would least like to face.
so no budget bounce, people feel no better off
wipeout in locals in 6 weeks time looks very likely
polls settling around 20pts behind labour: would mean tory majority of <100
and 30p lee about to join reform?
Badenoch is the candidate Starmer would least like to face.
I can't see here going down that well with the voting public. Its not like she's got a track record of being good at carrying swords, or anything.
Have you seen her interviewed? She makes rishi look like one of the great orators. She's as dim as a solar garden light in January. Just a Tuton Street sock puppet. She's even more tetchy and irritable than rishi, her arrogance shining through in her 'how dare you question me?!' attitude. She's clearly as vile as Cruella, but we just haven't seen it yet as she's still a minister so can't be as vocal as her main opposition for the top job. The membership love her, but then they still love Liz Truss
Anyway, in this mornings latest edition to the rolling shitshow
Three Tory ex-home secretaries warn against politicising anti-extremism
When Priti Patel is saying that you may want to dial the language down a bit, you know you're in trouble
Badenoch is the candidate Starmer would least like to face.
IMO she's a classic cheap watch, falls apart at the slightest 'prod' - can you tell me why you think otherwise?
Mind you still daft for the Tories to leave it another six months imo.
I don't think there's much beyond choosing the lesser of two weevils. If they hold a GE in May they absolutely will get hammered. Something (anything) might happen between now and autumn.
Rishi's week is about to get off to a great start.
Theres a Reform Party press conference in half an hour which the Telegraph are saying is to announce 30p Lee's defection from the Tories
Hasn't 6 bob knob already been kicked out of the Tory party?
Is it really a "defection"?
Hasn’t 6 bob knob already been kicked out of the Tory party?
The Tories rather reluctantly withdrew the whip which sort of forces the MP in question to become an independent (although they are still in the HoC and can still vote and they still get their MP salary) until such time as they apologise or whatever and are welcomed back with open arms and a quiet word that although the party agreed with all the abhorrent things he said, they kind of had to be seen to do something.
But an MP can defect off elsewhere, like the egotistical George Galloway has done several times.
Hasn’t 6 bob knob already been kicked out of the Tory party?
I get the feeling he was 'on a break' and was due a Cruella-esque return before the election. A slapped wrist, do the usual sorry/not sorry and you're back in. He's still masssively popular within the party who regard being openly racist as 'common sense'. He seems to represent what a privately-educated posh boy thinks a working class person is like.
The problem for the Tories is that Reform are picking up their core supporters and all without a recognisable front man in the mould of Farage. Looks like they may now have one.
he'll back in the tory party within a week, the big cry baby snowflake won't like all those mean opposition mp's picking on him when he tries to find a seat.
30p has gone
I'm watching the live press conference.
What utter dog eggs.
He wants his country back, apparently
Surely he got it back already - from those nasty unelected bureaucrats in Brussels wot kept making up rules we had to follow?! For people who banged on about Taking Back Control, they still don't seem to have much Control.
I blame the woke leftie cabal that secretly runs everything. They ruined poor Liz before her true genius could shine through, and now they're targeting 30p before the light of his Common Sense can be felt by us all.
Will, we finally have the NF as a mainstream party.
Welcome to a dystopian 70's redux.
That said, he's more of a trouble for the Tories in the short time.
Long term this country has some real issues.
Aww bless - at least Reform become a proper political party now they have an MP.
“I feel we are slowing giving our country away… we are allowing people to erase our history… we are allowing people into our country who will never integrate and adopt our way of life” Anderson says. Adds he will never apologise for remarks about Mayor of London.
I listened to it on the radio so I don't know if he had a tinfoil helmet on. I presume so.
I suppose this means the Tories and Reform will now be having a racist race to the bottom in the run up to an election. Gove is due to reveal the governments new definition of extremism on Wednesday, so I'm sure they'll start there.
Gove is due to reveal the governments new definition of extremism on Wednesday, so I’m sure they’ll start there.
This interests me, it'll be met with legal challenges of course, BUT... I can see Tory MP's having their collars felt if the laws are tightened up. Which will be more than a little amusing.
https://twitter.com/radartabs/status/1767166136766910777?t=-jvN-_sYC7pdObje_9Ou7Q&s=19
It's a rare move that increases the average IQ of both parties! 😂
^^lol
I can see Tory MP’s having their collars felt if the laws are tightened up. Which will be more than a little amusing.
It won't happen ahead of an election ie it won't happen, and it won't be retrospective, but imgine if someone was compiling a dossier to hand to the Police the second it got royal assent....
Edit - ignore me, it wouldn't need legislation so maybe could happen....
^^ It must have dawned on some of these far right Tories (extremists?) that they could fall foul of such laws. They are nasty but they aren't thick.
In reality they would wear it as a badge of pride. It's utterly surreal to think that one of the main demographic that could be affected by this are members of parliament though.
Did we find out who was laughing at 30p at his press conference?
Everyone?
Tice owns a fair bit of it...
Weird double post.
Anderson was right about one thing, people in the 'real world' are sick of being told by politicians that everything is too difficult or too expensive to deliver. When the mainstream parties spend all their time making excuses for not doing the stuff voters want, the likes of Anderson will always be there to tell them that's because we're allowing too many foreigners to come in. How the hell have we got into a position where the Labour party are frightened to campaign for and fund a functioning health service and dental care and the likes of Reform are the only ones talking about it?
Reform are the only ones talking about it?
Bollocks.
It has to be said that everyone on TV, radio or the net that say they are voting Reform all have very similar reasons and none of them are anything other than vague notions of "things have gone too far", "we want our country back" etc etc.
They (the party) only mention non immigration issues for pretense, I doubt 99% of their supporters are even aware they have any other policies.
The news conference today tells you everything you need to know about Reforms policies. "Something, something extremism, take back control (again), islam, something something extremism..."
Bollocks.
Is your eloquent critique of Daz's comment based on the fact that like the Tories and Labour Reform UK also isn't talking about increased funding for the NHS?
If so I wholeheartedly agree. All three parties agreed on one thing concerning the crises facing the NHS. They all claim that the NHS doesn't need more funding it just needs to "reform", yet again.
It turns out that apparently 40 years of relentless restructuring and reforms hasn't been enough and the NHS still needs to do much more restructuring and reforms. According to the Labour, the Tories, and Reform UK.
Hang on a minute.... don't Reform UK openly want to privatise the NHS?
Given that they're not even a political party, but a business entirely owned by a certain Mr N Farage, with very opaque funding, that's somewhat unsurprising
It has to be said that everyone on TV, radio or the net that say they are voting Reform all have very similar reasons and none of them are anything other than vague notions of “things have gone too far”, “we want our country back” etc etc.
While reading that, I was hearing this... on Radio4...
"thousands and thousands of people from countries what are not at war... time we did something for the people of this country"
Anyway, Reform's policy on NHS is the normal clearing the slate for a small state stuff... no income tax for NHS workers not in top tax band (boo... taxes bad).... spend billions more on operations in the private sector paid for by delaying bond buy backs (don't call it borrowing...) nothing progressive, radical, interesting, or about securing the future of the NHS... I don't want to miss-quote John Major too often but... "The NHS is as safe with his this lot as a pet hamster would be with a hungry python". They'll tag a "save the NHS" badge on their campaign... again... but if you fall for them... again... [ I agree millions probably will ]
Hang on a minute…. don’t Reform UK openly want to privatise the NHS?
And Labour wants to hold the door open:
https://www.thenational.scot/news/23932636.wes-streeting-wants-nhs-wide-open-private-sector/
“Why is it for example that where a treatment or technology is proven to work, proven to deliver better outcomes for patients and proven to deliver good value for taxpayers’ money in one NHS trust, do those innovators then have to try and tout their wares one by one around every other NHS trust?”
Sounds like changing NHS procurement for tech and treatment to be closer to how how it purchases drugs. Seeing how the disparity between NHS trusts for tech for treating diabetes can directly effect people's lives... and the prices those trusts pay for that tech... Streeting may well have a point. The NHS has the purchasing power to reduce costs when buying tech, and should be able to remove the post code lottery when it comes to rolling it out... given the direction to do so. What's the point of a national health service that doesn't make use of its scale and national reach?
Bollocks
Nope. In between the NF impersonations Anderson was talking today about how normal people can't get a GP or dentist appointment and how no one in parliament in either of the two main parties seems to be too bothered about that, let alone intending to do anything about it. He's absolutely right. Of course his solution of getting rid of all the foreigners is total bollocks but without the former he wouldn't get a hearing on the latter. Lee Anderson and his ilk are the direct result of the abject failure and cowardice of mainstream centrist politicians and the media soap opera that surrounds them.
Yes, we heard all that from the same people in 2016... pointing at problems is easy. Pretending that all the other parties... even Sunak's... aren't also talking about the NHS is nonsense though. They all have plans for more spending, to differing degrees. Letting Tice and co claim the NHS as something "only they are talking about" is an odd move. And bollocks. Worse than that, the bait and switch is obvious. Again. They'd dismantle it if they ever actually got into power. There's not one key person in that "party" that hasn't expressed the wish to do away with the NHS in the recent past.
I’d forgotten ‘ol 30p had led calls for MP’s who change parties to face a by-election… The man is the definition of integrity 🤣
Not forgetting of course that he started out in Labour!
Former coal miner (in fact a member of Arthur Scargill's National Union of Mineworkers) and he was a Labour councillor before he got suspended for what I'll politely put as actions against the travelling community.
Off he trots to Conservatives where e campaigned for Brexit (of course), got caught saying various anti-semitic and sexist things and his views got progressively worse over time.
And now he's found his natural home in Reform.
dazhFull Member
Nope. In between the NF impersonations Anderson was talking today about how normal people can’t get a GP or dentist appointment and how no one in parliament in either of the two main parties seems to be too bothered about that, let alone intending to do anything about it. He’s absolutely right.
Sorry, I know this wasn't a reply to me.
Anderson was just trying to make capital from the woes of the NHS, something he has been more than happy to assist in dismantling whilst in government. He has no genuine interest in any gripes (they aren't policies) he might give lip service to, except one of course. The mention of GP services etc is just about him linking any real or perceived grievances to immigration. It's no more complex than that and it's a playbook at least as old as Brexit. He/Reform have no policies that merit even the slightest analysis. Hell, I don't even mind that massively (he's a politician doing politicking), I just mind that it's used as a poor smoke screen for the truly nasty stuff they would like to inflict on some minorities in this country.
To state the obvious they don't even need a smoke screen for themselves, they propogate it so their voters can do the whole, "I'm not racist but..."
Everything reform is, is just shit smeared wrapping paper gaffer taped around a massive brick of racism and grifting off the back of said racism.
where do extra NHS workers come from?
The workshy lazy yoof of today of course!
They'll be given a spot of National Service first - the gammons love any mention of National Service - and that'll teach them some discipline. Then they'll be fit and healthy to work in those 40 new hospitals.
Common sense innit. Just like Lee.
Point of order
Streeting is paid by private healthcare companies. He does not have the interests of the NHS or patients in mind. He is only interested in whats in it for him
The Times reporting Johnson is going to campaign in the red wall with Sunak at the GE!🙃😁
"We're going to need a bigger fridge."😂
Tory donor in racism/ misogamy shocker plus a little added murder.
A major Tory donor has apologised after reportedly saying MP Diane Abbott made him "want to hate all black women" and that she "should be shot".
You'll be glad to know the comment was in no relation to her gender or colour. Which leaves me a little confused by the above comments which mention her gender and colour. Plus a bit of murder.
Luckily he dug himself out of a hole by saying:
The newspaper reported that he went on to say: "It's like trying not to be racist but you see Diane Abbott on the TV, and you're just like I hate, you just want to hate all black women because she's there, and I don't hate all black women at all, but I think she should be shot.
Then send on to further dig himself out of a hole with:
"[The executive] and Diane Abbott need to be shot."
Phew, lucky save.
He's a Biggie too. No, not in that way I suspect, but as a donor. Circa £10 million last year. Even by Tory standards, that's a big old bung.
Motive? Not a clue?
Mr Hester is the founder and chief executive of TPP, a Leeds-based company that specialises in providing healthcare technology.
Oh, he's funded at least one, yes, just one of Sunak's helibob flights to the tune of £16k.
Yep, nothing to see here.
Luckily the Tories are tightening up the laws on extremism just in time. 🙃
Now, in a statement he's made he adds a little nuisance,or rather he thinks it does. I'll paraphrase: "I was just being rude, not in the slightest bit racist? Why? I came from Ireland as a child therefore I simply can't be a middle aged, white, male, ultra rich racist. Anyway, this doesn't mean I actually said what I am apologising for saying. Ok?
Righto then.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68539981
It’s come as something of a shock that, as donors to the Tory party are normally the nicest people with the purest of intentions
Anyway… we know know Lil Rishi has reached the true depths of desperation if he thinks bringing back the sex yeti is the answer. I’ve no idea why we’ve been singled out in the north to be blessed with his presence.
Still not sure how you can have donors to political parties. If you want to donate to the countries government workings then it should just go into a pot that is shared equally with any party that wants to stand.
Paying money directly to a party is nothing other than corruption. In this case paying back for the £400MM in contracts from government and securing more future contracts no doubt.
And wanting to kill all black people was taken out of context so give him a break.
Reform are basically the Gammon protest vote.
And wanting to kill all black people was taken out of context so give him a break.
Come on Kerley, I know you are a reasonable guy from your posts on here, are you honestly going to defend what he said based on "lack of context"? Note that he hasn't denied saying it, only that it was simply "rude". It appears Abbott who is a bit of a hate figure for the far right thinks that's not a great descriptor either. I suspect she is better qualified to spot a bit of overt racism then either of us.
The newspaper reported that he went on to say: "It's like trying not to be racist but you see Diane Abbott on the TV, and you're just like I hate, you just want to hate all black women because she's there, and I don't hate all black women at all, but I think she should be shot.
Ok, he tried not to be racist, is that really a win? He tried to discard a completely flawed and arbitrary world view but just couldn't help himself?
I mean, yes, under full Oxford Dictionary Pedant rules , yes, he wasn't going to shoot her in all likelihood but he definitely thought about hating all black women because she is a black women with views that upset him? Ok, he didn't don his KKK Halloween outfit in the boardroom and slap his Glock on the table but how much context is more than enough to know he's a little bit more than "rude"?
Come on, would you express that opinion at work or anywhere else in regard to a black women's opinion you disagreed with?
Come on Kerley, I know you are a reasonable guy from your posts on here, are you honestly going to defend what he said based on “lack of context”?
I am pretty sure that Kerley's statement was made with a healthy dose of sarcasm.
Huffington Post this morning had a story about Johnson maybe looking to get back into politics via Henley, only for the current Tory candidate to categorically state she would not stand aside for him.
It would be a tone deaf move if Tory HQ booted her out to make way for Johnson, so maybe that is on the cards.