I would wager that neither of them even know how to operate a dishwasher or where the tablets are kept.
Every time Sunak tries to show he's a Man of the People, he shows how little he knows. Did you see him trying to use a hammer? Fill a car with petrol and pay for it on contactless?
Not a clue.
I'll go further with that wager - I bet he doesn't even know where in his house the dishwasher is. There'll be some minion dealing with that sort of stuff.
The choice of extremism is an interesting one. I doubt many folks in the country are worried about it above say, crumbling social services, cost of living, inflation, a failing NHS, but of course the Tories* have nothing to say about those things after more than decade in charge and failing.
*embarrassingly for Starmer, neither really do Labour, but I think folks are willing at least to give them a go. Witness that Rochdale or any internal problems over Gaza has had zero impact on their polling.
I’ll go further with that wager – I bet he doesn’t even know where in his house the dishwasher is. There’ll be some minion dealing with that sort of stuff.
Exactly my thoughts when I heard that cobblers this morning. I bet he doesn't even know the name of the member of household staff tasked with stacking the dishwasher.
He really hasn't cottoned on to the fact that his 'man of the people' routine isn't working because we all know he doesn't know how to pay for petrol with a bank card, he travels everywhere in a private plane or helicopter, his wifes net worth is the same as the GDP of Norway and he's just had a new swimming pool built at one of his many enormous houses
Trouble is, when you are an extremist - everybody else looks like an "extremist". Most of this recent discussion: tax payers footing damages bills, files on "leftists" etc was unthinkable hyperbole not long ago - well maybe not the files bit, but the window has shifted.
It's not just the Gullis, Six Bob Knob types - The Squirt himself is rather far right, and he blocks roads.
I've just had yet more Tory party election bumph through the door, which means I've something to line the cats litter tray with.
So theres definitely not going to be an election in May then? Hmmmmm
Does yours even mention the Conservative party? Ours didn't.
Anyone listening to Hunt? Lots of announcing delayed programmes as if new ones... small nuclear projects being a good example... and childcare another... and house building.
Anyway, amongst the dry stuff, he keeps having "tax raisers" jabs at SNP and Labour...
Now onto a simultaneous jab at both immigrant workers and those out of work... double target... oh, no real announcement to go with any of that. This is just top lines for an election, isn't it.
Does yours even mention the Conservative party? Ours didn’t.
Not a mention of the conservative party. No logo's. Nothing.
Anyone would think the brand was completely toxic?
British NHS, British company invested ISA, Brit’s back to work, no immigrants propping us up, invest in British, Britain etc etc.
Right wing populous drivel But if you can’t see through it, it does sound as if Last Night of the Proms, Jerusalem or Dame Vera Lynn should be played over the top
Here comes the actual announcement from Hunt... the tax reduction announcements...
- oh, first one is a new additional tax... on vapes
- second one is an actual cut... in the tax on first class and business flights (not economy)
- tax break for people making large profits on selling high value houses
He’s back onto the falsehood that low taxes = higher growth, **** sake you utter **** government investment creates growth.
Anyone listening to Hunt?
I'm reading the text, I can't stand to listen to his smarmy and badly formed jibes
The hypocrisy of all the barbs about the SNP and Labour raising taxes when he's been doing that by stealth the whole time.
Anything new in here that will actually help people who are less well off? Aside from not charging people a further £90 when they've hit rock bottom
Non-dom tax changes... to pay for tax cuts. Invest it you ****ers!
Oh, great.... first change is for people earning more than £50K only... that's what he means by "working people".
for people earning more than £50K only… that’s what he means by “working people”.
They think that if you can't earn 6 figures you aren't trying hard enough.
Perhaps I misheard. It did fall into the section he introduced as tax cuts... but then so did the new vape tax.
"I will make a one-off adjustment to rates of Air Passenger Duty on non-economy flights only to account for high inflation in recent years"
Reporting does say that means an increase in APD for higher cost/space seats. Can't find how much. Sounds like a policy I'd support (there has to be one).
As for the non-dom changes... there's to be a "new scheme"... none of the details of that yet set out. This isn't a tax announcement, it's a(another) vague top line policy reveal only. I think Mrs Sunak and others are perfectly safe 'till after the election. In her case I predict she'll be out of the country, well before any change that impact her will be in place, along with her husband.
Not a mention of the conservative party. No logo’s. Nothing.
Not going to work when the person goes to vote though as it is clearly marked that the candidate is conservative
Oh, great…. first change is for people earning more than £50K only… that’s what he means by “working people”.
Couldn't see this (not that it affects me)
The thresholds for this (currently kicks in at £50K):
https://www.gov.uk/child-benefit-tax-charge
To be changed to... starting at £60K, top limit £80K.
Does yours even mention the Conservative party? Ours didn’t.
Ours does, but it needs to as our local MP's attack line is only the Conservative & Unionist Party can stand up to the SNP here.
Interesting though that he blabs on about local stuff, including how "the UK Govt has directly given £x to the Borders" but doesn't have the printers address on it - is that because we're not in an election period, and it's only during an election a party has to show the printers address?
intheborders
. . . . but doesn’t have the printers address on it – is that because we’re not in an election period, and it’s only during an election a party has to show the printers address?
Is that a thing?
The thresholds for this (currently kicks in at £50K):
https://www.gov.uk/child-benefit-tax-charge
To be changed to… starting at £60K, top limit £80K.
first time the threshold has changed since it came in nearly ten years ago. and still based on single income not household.
ie single household income at the 60k will start to lose it, two incomes at £59,999 and household income of £119,998 will retain in full.
And that TimesRadio clip is really worth a listen.
first time the threshold has changed since it came in nearly ten years ago. and still based on single income not household.
ie single household income at the 60k will start to lose it, two incomes at £59,999 and household income of £119,998 will retain in full.
The worst part is that you need to start doing a self assessment tax return, even if you're PAYE. No-one tells you this*, and you get threatened with fines for having not done it for previous years. Guess how I know.
Utter ball-ache**.
* Maybe they do, but when you've been PAYE for your entire adult life it's unsurprising that it can pass you by.
** Grr
Is that a thing?
Yes - legally election material has to have the details of who is publishing it and who has printed it.
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/political-registration-and-regulation/imprints
and still based on single income not household.
ah, moving to a household based assessment by 2026.
so never then.
the-muffin-man
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/political-registration-and-regulation/imprints/blockquote >
Ah that I get - I was just a little confused about the printer thing. If I was a printer I know I wouldn't want to be associated with some of the propaganda pamphlets.I do like playing spot the logo on our local (conservative) MP's junk mail. It's been absent for some time (and he's the current minister for justice)
So the conservatives are briefing the press to crow about how they've nicked the money that Labour had allocated for funding the following
The Tories say these are the policies Labour was planning to fund with £1.6bn from the abolition of non-dom status.
- More NHS appointments (£1.1bn per year)
- Breakfast clubs in schools (£186m per year)
- More NHS equipment (£171m per year)
- More NHS dental appointments (£111m per year)
And the Tories says these are the policies that Labour plans to fund with £4.9bn from the extension of the windfall tax.
- Home insulation programme (£1.32bn a year)
- Green-related jobs (£500m per year)
- Setting up GB Energy (£1.66bn a year)
- Creating a sovereign wealth fund (£1.46bn a year
Loathsome (H)unts
ie single household income at the 60k will start to lose it, two incomes at £59,999 and household income of £119,998 will retain in full.
Yup, stupid policy implemented in a stupid way.
Just make child benefit universal, and use tax rates to balance out.
But the point was that today’s announcement is for people earning over £50K only. A strange priority. Well, not if you’re aiming to attract those people to vote for you of course.
ah, moving to a household based assessment by 2026
Ahh… so increase the burden of working out this stupid charge. Just bin it, recover the cost through direct taxes, and save everyone the admin.
But the point was that today’s announcement is for people earning over £50K only.
I'm no fan of hunt, but you can't change that policy without that being true.
I’m no fan of hunt, but you can’t change that policy without that being true.
Yes you can. Bin the charge. Increase higher rate income tax to adjust for it.
Same goes for all the threshold stuff… instead of dragging more people into higher tax bands… increase the rate paid by high earners. So much going on with the tax system at the moment that seem to seek to push/spread the tax burden further down the income scales.
So apparently the blue shitebags are now challenging labour to explain how they will fund their pledges now the tories have nicked them and blown the money. > https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2024/mar/06/spring-budget-2024-jeremy-hunt-tax-cuts-conservatives-labour-uk-politics-latest-updates?CMP=share_btn_url&page=with%3Ablock-65e88a198f08b10542c9c87c#block-65e88a198f08b10542c9c87c
On Politics Live earlier, laura trott was interviewed immediately after Starmer had responded.
One of her inane comments was...we have to pay back the £400 billion covid-related spend; a perfect opportunity for Jo Coburn, as host, or Faisal Islam or Vicky Young to ask the obvious questions - did UK gov borrow the money; if so, from whom; if no money was borrowed, what is there to pay back.
Simple, focussed questions but...nothing; what a lpost opportunity.
The budget headline item that refers to the withdrawal of the current Non-Dom status tax break, already points towards the exemption that will ensure the replacement system has absolutely no teeth and will be easy to circumvent.
Anyone surprised..?
I am the target market for the child benefit changes, with two young children, living in a nice town in the south east, with family incomes around the existing cut off.
They can still all get in the sea so far as I’m concerned.
Is that a thing?
As The Muffin Man said yes it's a thing.
The othere reason for the intensive leafletting that is going on from some parties just now is that there's no official campaign announced so there's no limit on spending.
When the official campaign starts spending is limited.
Bim Afolami is getting torn a new one on channel 4 news. He really is another utterly clueless Tufton Street sock-puppet
To summarise: despite your national insurance gimmick, everyone’s tax will be going up due to fiscal drag and you’ve nicked a couple of Labour policies that up until last week you’d been saying were terrible ideas… is that about it?
and you’ve nicked a couple of Labour policies that up until last week you’d been saying were terrible ideas…
Labour had a plan to implement full broadband at one point (the Corbyn years maybe?) and the Tories rubbished it completely. Before later admitting that the country needed broadband improvements.
I see a lot of this, and the previous budget being around bringing in cuts and pledges to fund areas, knowing that Labour will be in soon and have to reassess this, and in their first budget having to increase tax, or cut pledges.
The tories must be looking at 2029 now, this upcoming election is dead in the water, they've enough troubles with the reform element trying to create something even worse than the current tory party after the election.
The tories must be looking at 2029 now,
Think they'll be in the wilderness for at least two terms.
First term in opposition they'll elect Farage or similar as leader and go full National Front, which is far from the centre ground. Then after getting troucned at the second election, they'll change tack.
It speaks volumes that a Tory budget by this bunch of charlatans is such a meek affair that it hasn't really managed to knock Donelan's antics off top spot in the news.
Has Hunt decided whether or not he's standing at the next election? He looks in real danger of losing his seat. I almost feel sorry for him, probably gone through his whole privileged life being told how amazing he is and not really getting anywhere on true merit. The spotlight of 'one of the great offices of state' seems to have rendered him as basically a clueless little schoolboy. Zero merit to anything he's doing/saying, and not smart enough to argue back against the proper neo-liberal nutters.
The spotlight of ‘one of the great offices of state’
Problem is we've run out of half decent, let alone great, people to hold these offices. Turns out if you stick a half wit in these posts, it becomes a mediocre office of state eg the Home Office has been completely dysfunctional for over a decade.
He’s back onto the falsehood that low taxes = higher growth
It's not entirely untrue, they just do it the wrong way round. Reducing the tax burden on people who'll actually spend the money rather than hoard it would be hugely beneficial.
It's confusing when two different people have the same name isn't it.
Reducing the tax burden on people who’ll actually spend the money rather than hoard it would be hugely beneficial.
That sort of depends what they will spend it on doesn't it so not really a great way to higher growth.
Bring on the Asset stripper 😀
That sort of depends what they will spend it on doesn’t it so not really a great way to higher growth.
Not really - even if they spend it all on fags and booze, that's still a significant sum going back as tax.
"the poor" or "those on benefits" are spending every penny they get because they have no other choice. There's nothing left over to save or to stash away for a rainy day, it's money that's straight back into circulation with all the tax (VAT, fuel duty, etc) which that entails.
The rich who squirrel their bonuses away to offshore accounts or run it through holding companies to avoid tax are doing no favours to the economy whatsoever.
Not really – even if they spend it all on fags and booze, that’s still a significant sum going back as tax.
What has that got to do with growth?
Everyone knows that smoking stunts your growth
Hunt is on Radio 4 now. It takes some front to now be talking about your new-found enthusiasm for ending the non-dom tax status as its so unfair. They're absolutely shameless!
Fair play to Amol Rajan for referring to him as the 'Fiscal Drag Queen'
What has that got to do with growth?
Not a lot but you don't grow the economy through tax cuts, you grow it through investment in infrastructure, services, education, housing and healthcare.
Unfortunately, what we've just had are tax cuts that benefit the richest households 12x more than the poorest and with more massive cuts to public services planned. And that's coming off the back of 12 years of austerity and asset stripping where the roads are crumbling, the rail services are expensive and unreliable, schools and hospitals are falling down and the only answer the Tories have is that 300 immigrants need to be sent to Rwanda.
Fair play to Amol Rajan
He's doing a great job. Reminding Hunt of his own past overblown declarations of the benefits and implementation of new IT in the NHS.
Enjoying him laughing off Hunt's attempts to turn questions around on him.
He's giving him a proper roasting here and he's is now being berated by Hunt for merely stating facts to challenge his relentless stream of gaslighting bullshit
Its all very 'Brexit' isn't it? Everything will be just fine if only you'd all just believe
Not a lot but you don’t grow the economy through tax cuts, you grow it through investment in infrastructure, services, education, housing and healthcare.
Yes, which is why I questioned the statement, not made by you, about tax cuts = growth. People who 'hoard' money are not going to spend it because of a few tax cuts and even if they did that doesn't equal growth.
and the only answer the Tories have is that 300 immigrants need to be sent to Rwanda
At a cost of over £1 million each
And accept 300 back as part of the deal….
Fair play to Amol Rajan for referring to him as the ‘Fiscal Drag Queen’
Fabulous. About time.
Am I alone in thinking there has to be a tipping point somewhere where the population realises that getting a few hundred quid back in annual taxation is no use if you can't afford to buy groceries, afford to take a train, get a GP appointment or operation date, can't get your kids into a local school, or have to spend hundreds fixing your car because you keep hitting potholes.
There has to be a national moment where we realise the actual value of public services far exceeds a few baubles chucked at us during the Budget.
Also, if you really want to grow the economy with tax cuts, you give the tax cuts to the least wealthy, to ensure that 100% of that money is spent on goods and services. Giving it to the wealthy just ensures that most of it will be hoarded.
@martinhutch - Listening to the phone in on 5 live this morning (so you don't have to), absolutely nobody is buying it. They normally have at least a few mad home counties Tory pensioners or unhinged, ranting Sun-reading cabbies, but there is nobody. Just a succession of people stating just what you have.
The tipping point appears to finally have been reached.
Rishi is going to be sadly disappointed if he's expecting an improvement in the polling on the strength of yesterdays budget
Am I alone in thinking there has to be a tipping point somewhere where the population realises that getting a few hundred quid back in annual taxation is no use if you can’t afford to buy groceries, afford to take a train, get a GP appointment or operation date, can’t get your kids into a local school, or have to spend hundreds fixing your car because you keep hitting potholes.
Yep. I pointed this out to my MP, and not only did our 'tax cut' get spent on a private healthcare consultation & follow-up for my OH but because of their screwing up of public services it meant that now the waiting time for a private consultation is longer than it use to be for an NHS one!
Listening to the phone in on 5 live this morning (so you don’t have to), absolutely nobody is buying it.
Had the good fortune to listen to the Nicky Campbell show yesterday and pretty much everyone calling in was making this point, or a variation of it. They did, of course, have an IEA Tufton St shill economist on 'for balance'...
Not a lot but you don’t grow the economy through tax cuts, you grow it through investment in infrastructure, services, education, housing and healthcare.
It can be both.
If you 'give' everyone £450, most of us will spend it because we either have to, or make discretionary spends. Which means more jobs, higher wages, more taxes, etc.
If you employ a few thousand extra civil engineering contractors, doctors, nurses, dentists, etc and buy the associated materials (everything from concrete to drugs), that also pushes up wages, results in more spending, grows the economy, etc ,etc.
Just depends on how different sectors of the economy are doing and a bit of politics, but neither is 100% wrong.
I'm sure this has been mentioned before in various places but just look at the top 10 countries for highest living standards v top 10 countries for highest taxation. Basically the same list. Top 10 western countries for lowest income inequality is also broadly the same list too.
Nice to se the governments continued commitment to 'Levelling Up' with the announcement of a massive investment in the disadvantaged northern town of...
*checks notes*
...Canary Wharf
I’m sure this has been mentioned before in various places but just look at the top 10 countries for highest living standards v top 10 countries for highest taxation. Basically the same list. Top 10 western countries for lowest income inequality is also broadly the same list too.
Causation vs correlation though.
With my worst Tory hat on : high taxes discourages high value individuals from locating there, which then requires higher tax rates on everyone else.
With my MMT & profligate spending hat : high taxes are only required to reduce inflation. I.e. you only need high taxes in countries that are doing very well.
I don't disagree with your hypothesis, but I doubt neither it not my devils advocacy completely explain it.
e.g. Norway frequently tops those lists, it has a sovereign wealth fund (which means it can afford a lot of spending), it also has high taxes, and still has a high cost of living. So I suspect it's as good an example of the taxes keeping the cost of living/inflation in check as it is high taxes correlating to a high quality of life.
With my worst Tory hat on : high taxes discourages high value individuals from locating there, which then requires higher tax rates on everyone else.
Remember when all the bankers were apparently going to leave London if tax was imposed on their bonuses?
Yep - look at Switzerland, Hong Kong, Australia - No HNW individuals there to speak of really.....
Sorry but that argument is an absolute fallacy - unfortunately,
I am so glad I can now visit the UK on a cheaper business class flight, to fully enjoy my non-dom status, and bask in the improved area around my hotel in Canary Wharf while I meet my banker.
Remember when all the bankers were apparently going to leave London if tax was imposed on their bonuses?
They kind of did, a friend worked in some sort of executive support function at one of the big investment banks. They didn't wholesale lay people off or move them. But they did stop recruitment in the UK and ramp it up in Germany and France. Brexit was a big factor too though.
It's just the kind of thing you do quietly though, some political donations here and there to try and influence rather than taking out a 2 page advert in the Guardian rubbing their noses in it as you swan of the Cayman Islands.
Economics is one of those "sciences" where the best you can conclude seems to be a bit of this model, a bit of that, and a sprinkling of some other. The current Tories policies / models they believe in / philosophies clearly aren't "right", but they're probably not wholly wrong either (NI cuts will boost growth, just not growth in the NHS or fixing potholes).
Not to mention taking a trip out to that impoverished northern town of Cambridge. If ever a city needed levelling up it was that wasteland with nothing but the most famous university in the world and an absolutely massive tech gold rush sector going for it.....