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EG Group have applied a £30 limit, the others will surely follow. I think that’s fair ploy
Faster than the supermarkets but still slow. Slap the idiots down early preferably using apache gunships.
Went from Newbury to Kidderminster and back after work to pick my mum up for weekend, no diesel anywhere on way back.
Well I spent the day driving the truck getting held up in all the traffic caused by queues spilling over onto every road near a petrol station round most of the South Wales Valleys. Even the Murco in Ferndale (which is stuck up a valley to nowhere) had a queue down the street with the owner acting as a marshal to keep the forecourt flowing. most surprising though was the BP services at J33 of the M4, the most expensive fuel for miles. Queues right back round to the main roundabout, which was incredibly annoying as it was blocking off the lorry pumps I needed. 1 1/4 hrs to get to them and what looked like lots of people filling up their weekend cars, spotted a V8 Mustang and a pair of Lotuses plus a motorhome or four.
People are nuts.
Was on the M25 evening and thought I'd have a look at the BP in Clacket lane, was quiet but 1.64 a litre for Ultimate.
Closer to home I drove past some silly queues so I don't mind having paid the premium not to do that.
Some of us still have painful memories of the great salad cream drought of 1997
Don't laugh, there's trouble in artisan sourdough circles 😉
Yep, as someone said, it's official. The government are going to grant temporary visas for EU HGV drivers.
Which sector next?...
The issue with that is that it's not guaranteed that the EU drivers want to come over here. Why would they when the IR35 loophole is closing, they get treated like crap and the drop in the value of the £ makes it less attractive compared to staying at home. Don't forget the EU has a shortage of drivers too.
the good news is it does signify the first bit of irrefutable proof that Brexit isn't all sunny uplands.
Come to the UK to drive a lorry.
It’ll be temporary, you’ll have no rights, and we’ll treat you like shit, then tell you to **** off and turf you out again as soon as you’re done
That’ll have them battering down the doors to get here I’m sure
the good news is it does signify the first bit of irrefutable proof that Brexit isn’t all sunny uplands.
Desperate ****s in the Ministry for Excuses will be on double overtime this weekend.
Europe! Allowing European lorry drivers to pop across and plug our shortage. Who’d have thought…
Ah yes...proof we've taken back control if ever you needed it!!! thats the whole point...it was never about anti immigration...just controlled immigration - a concept the remain side never actually grasped and still haven't. And the Eu is part of the problem and the reason why HGV drivers wages have remained stagnant for decades....and the reason why the average age of HGV drivers is 55 with vast swathes of them leaving the profession due to retirement or atrocious pay and conditions. No the EU is actually one part of a multi-faceted problem that has been going on for a very long time that has led to this point. And Brexit doesn't explain why vast swathes of the EU and other countires are also suffering from driver shortages and logistics disruption at the moment. This problem pre-dates Brexit and has actually been something that the industry has been battling for over a decade. Covid and shutting down the global system and causing massive disruption to the normal workings of the global economy has brought it all to a head.
Same with car washing...I earned as much washing cars at weekends when I was 14 for a pocket money top up than a band of 4 immigrants earn to wash my car down the local car wash. I used to get fiver and if I were to support the local modern slave trade I'd only pay a fiver for 4 people to wash my car today. Go EU!
Come to the UK to drive a lorry.
It’ll be temporary, you’ll have no rights, and we’ll treat you like shit, then tell you to **** off and turf you out again as soon as you’re done
That’ll have them battering down the doors to get here I’m sure
This. I really hope they have the dignity, and cash reserves, to tell us to **** right off
Pfft! brimmed both cars (and the jerry cans) last week, I was panic buying before it was cool sheeple 8)
This. I really hope they have the dignity, and cash reserves, to tell us to **** right off
I kinda hope they dont. Since whilst being shown to be right is nice I do like to be able to eat/drink and drives places.
Car washing. Pretty sure labour laws are sidestepped in that industry. And you do know 4 people take 1/4 of the time or less per car assuming the same effort.
I thought hand car washes were mostly about money laundering.
and I fortuitously felt hungry on the way home yesterday so stopped at the garage for a snack and filled the tank at the same time. Be good until things settle down again…
it was never about anti immigration…just controlled immigration – a concept the remain side never actually grasped and still haven’t.
No, it really was about immigration. Why would you want to control it, if you didn't like it? Don't forget we could have controlled it anyway, we just didn't bother. So this line is just a smokescreen. It WAS always about immigraiton, it was always anti-foreigner.
This problem pre-dates Brexit
That I'll agree with. As someone said in one of these links - it's not purely because of Brexit, but Brexit has harmed our ability to deal with the problems we're facing. It'll always do that, because we're smaller than we were in the EU, we have far fewer allies, and far fewer resources to draw on. Working together with your neighbours is always going to be better and make you more resilient.
I thought hand car washes were mostly about money laundering
They are. The latest scam is dog breeding
it was never about anti immigration…just controlled immigration – a concept the remain side never actually grasped and still haven’t.
Bollocks! The HGV. Drivers and fruit pickers are just the first to become obvious. Over the next few years plenty more areas will become increasingly apparent
This is just the tip of the iceberg that has been artificially suppressed for the last 18 months
Covid has been a very handy merkin
I’m sick of being (reasonably) diplomatic with you clowns. If you voted for Brexit then you’re a *ing moron
Have the lucidity to realise where blame lies. It’s not with the EU. It’s far closer to home
This is only the beginning of the new reality. Expect plenty more backtracking, sector by sector, as the chasm between the promised ‘sunlit uplands’ collides with the world as it actually is, as opposed to how it exists in John Redwoods head
*s, the lot of the charlatans who facilitated this pointless and unnecessary shitshow
I hate Brexit, but this current fuel and haulage crisis isn't caused by Brexit. Sure it has played a part in it but the seeds of this crisis were sown long ago. 5 years ago our child minder was a long distance HGV driver. He worked out it was a better, happier and healthier life working with his wife doing childminding in their house. Childminding is hard, underpaid work as well but he assured me better than sleeping in laybys and getting treated like shit for low pay.
The stronger link between Brexit and the haulage crisis is the reprobate conservative party. Both caused by raging incompetence and a preference for dogma. These problems have been known about for years and years - yet it takes a full blown crisis for these ****wits to take action. A decade in power.
The driver shortage isn't due to Brexit, though its acted as a catalyst and accelerated the problem.
Ir35 hasn't helped.
I'm doing my class 1. I don't want to be a driver but it's a skill that's very handy in my line of work.
Its gonna be about 3.5k all in.
Jobs are about 11 to 12ph basic, to earn 50k that's 4 or 5 nights out tramping. Once you get a steady job.
Would anyone here like to invest 3k to then earn 11 quid and sleep in a truck 4 nights......
No
That's the problem
When the shit really hits the fan, bog roll and petrol = Molotovs!
No doubt our commonwealth cousins will be enlisted to save us again in our latest darkest hour.
Duncancallum above nails it really.
The European Road Haulage Assoc have been raising the lack of drivers being trained as an issue since 2005.
The reasons for the decline in drivers working (there are 600,000 licensed in the U.K. but not working) are why we are where we are:
- massive downward pressure on wages caused by free flow of labour (e.g. Romanian drivers living in their cabs for 2 months at a time then going back home vs. Drivers here who have housing costs)
- IR35 which means individual lorry owners are now classed as employees and can’t recover costs
- low productivity at distribution centres caused by poor dock scheduling, lack of warehouse optimisation and slow unloading
- a myriad of controls (backed by fines) on where drivers can park
- antisocial hours exacerbated by planning restrictions that require shops to have deliveries in the early hours of the morning
- loss of amenities for drivers in the pandemic - no toilet facilities, meal facilities and the constant threat of robbery whilst parked up
Jobs are about 11 to 12ph basic, to earn 50k that’s 4 or 5 nights out tramping. Once you get a steady job.
Would anyone here like to invest 3k to then earn 11 quid and sleep in a truck 4 nights……
No
That’s the problem
I'm still stuck on the agency treadmill with my Class 2 and anything paying less than £12 p/h doesn't get a driver right now. Class 1 is around £14 and up just to get a body in the seat. I've had work paying anything from £12 to £19 p/h, the £19 was for food deliveries and was really high pressure and physical to the point it wasn't worth the money. They were offering the high rate to entice drivers in with a 12 week bonus before it dropped to £13 standard on a 45 hour week which worked out at £32k a year but the stress from the pressure on the runs meant that of the 4 that started with me only one got past 3 weeks. I haven't heard of any tramping job paying over £30 per night out so to get to £50k a year is a lot of hours and staying out every night you can, not sustainable.
Come to the UK to drive a lorry.
It’ll be temporary, you’ll have no rights, and we’ll treat you like shit, then tell you to * off and turf you out again as soon as you’re done
That’ll have them battering down the doors to get here I’m sure
This. I really hope they have the dignity, and cash reserves, to tell us to * right off
Going by the talk on the truckers facebook pages and forums very few European drivers are even considering coming back over. The overriding feeling is why come over here for an indeterminate amount of time to earn no more than they can back home and be treated like crap. Lots have taken the Brexit vote to heart that they are not wanted here by most of the population and are not a pool of people who can be summoned for a short fix then told to **** off again in a few months. Brexit has done severe damage to the relationship and will take a generation to fix. Expect the shortage of drivers to continue for a while yet.
My car says it has 68 miles left in it, the golf course is 7.7 miles away and each school run is a 3 mile round trip so I should get through to next weekend easily enough. I would have chucked another £20 but the queues were starting to build up.
Wife's car has the light on and she need to drive more than I do so she headed out at 3.30am to the station down the road and there were queues, police, no E5, and angry people shouting at each other. Carnage
So you use your car for golf and a short school run but she's the one that has to go out for fuel in the middle of the night 🤨
Who says chivalry is dead?
Police out in force at an petrol station with petrol here. Mrs Anagallis allowed £25 of diesel. At least that means I can take mum home tomorrow. Old car having what we expect to be final MOT of doom Monday, might have to siphon diesel out of it at this rate!!
Can’t see many European drivers coming back temporarily.
I’m also not convinced about the argument that this will blow over as people’s fuel tanks will now be full. That argument ignores that the stupid people will continue to put £5-15 in every time their gauge goes down a bar. Also many people will not be thinking about the repercussions and be encouraged to top up by the emotive ‘warnings’ of the gutter press.
I think instead of setting a maximum amount of £30 of fuel like some retailers are doing, there should be a minimum of 40 litres unless you can prove your tank is smaller than that. This will forcibly put people back to their usual routine.
Naturally this will cause a problem for a small number of people but that will be temporary and less problematic than the panic we are now experiencing.
Can’t believe all the idiots out there, I just used 3/4 of a tank driving round looking for somewhere to fill up.
I’ll echo what Duncancallum said. I have over 15 years of driving HGV’s under my belt. When I did my training it cost me just shy of £2000 for both licenses. The first job I got through an agency was paying me £8.40 an hour. When I progressed to Class 1 after 4 months I got a job paying £8.50 p/h.
There were less restrictions on the amount of hours you could work then either, so I was hammering in 70+ hours a week and out for 5 night. I would start on a Sunday at 10am and not be home until 19:00 on a Friday night. It was fine for a couple of years but I soon got sick of it.
I then got a job with a company who operates tankers, this was 2009 and the wages were £9.05 p/h. It was a good job at the start but the transport manager (owners son) got greedy and took on more work and put pressure on the experienced guys to pick up the slack. The work load increased, along with the hours.. but no increase in pay! This continued and as I gained more experience I was under constant pressure to be somewhere early to tip an inexperienced guy first or load a trailer. I was putting in 60+ hours every week and racking up 2500km+ every week (my record was 3800km driving in a week). I discussed the issues on many occasions but was fobbed off, wage increases were like pulling teeth and only pennies in the pound. When I left it was a £12p/h for driving around with flammable, corrosive, toxic and other dangerous liquids being carried. Then you have the services or truck stops.. ah where to start. Fancy having a shower where someone else has taken a dump? How about using a toilet that has piss all round the seat, or parking up in a muddy bit of waste ground or a service station where the ground is stained in urine and the smell in almost unbearable.. and be charged up to £30 for the privilege! Oh and you will struggle to get a decent meal if you don’t want a KFC or Burger King 🤢. Then to wake up in the morning and find your diesel has been stolen or your curtain slashed. Then off to your delivery where you are treated like the scum of the earth, no toilet facilities in some places that keep you waiting for hours. When you tell them your needing tipped so you can get parked up as your running out of hours they delay you so you incur and infringement which if VOSA prosecute you for has to be paid by you, even though your company sent you in there anyway. Add that to the morons on the road and being away from your family, is it any wonder there is a driver shortage?
Who in their right mind would read the above and say “yeah, that’s the job for me”. My experiences are not the exception, they are the norm in an industry plagued by greed, managers who have never driven a lorry and an infrastructure decades behind other countries when it comes to facilities to name a few.
Would I like out the industry? Absolutely.. but nobody seems to want to employ an HGV driver for anything other than driving an HGV, I have nearly 16 years in the transport industry where I have picked up a host of transferable skills but I can’t even get a job interview if it’s not driving related. On the plus side I now work doing domestic fuel deliveries, I drive a 6 wheeler, I’m home every night, start at 06:15 and I’m usually done for 16:00, but it’s a hard physical job pulling the hose out 20+ times a day, my knees, elbows and shoulders are wrecked. Will I manage this job for another 30 years until retirement? No! But at the moment it’s all I can get.
Anyway.. rant over. Sorry, needed to get that off my chest..
Ps.. THERE IS NO SHORTAGE OF FUEL. I’m in the fuel industry and believe me there is plenty fuel. The garages will be re stocked by early next week.
Have a nice weekend.
Ps.. THERE IS NO SHORTAGE OF FUEL. I’m in the fuel industry and believe me there is plenty fuel. The garages will be re stocked by early next week.
Everybody knows that, the issue is can you get to work on Monday? You sound like Boris Johnson saying things like that.
There's no shortage of fuel and yet the police are out in force trying to stop disorder at petrol stations!
Add in the problems that driving in the UK is tough
I would happily drive a 40t truck down through France or Spain or Germany
The uk network of A and B roads must be hellish for articulated vehicles
Angry gammons cutting you up, diving up the inside on roundabouts
Stopping up your chuff when you have to reverse into a yard
I know itv will be the same in most towns in Europe but they seem to be able to create by passes or out of town infrastructure
My mate failed his HGV medical on high bp, he was offered £200 a day for class 1 but his cert had lapsed
Good post @1981milked . Can't blame anyone for not wanting to play that game.
It's a perfect example of what happens when you allow a strategically important industry to be run entirely by the market.
Just been out for supermarket shop, went past a few filling stations, all out of petrol (East Kilbride) and spoke to an attendant who advised none in the vicinity at any brand or supermarket forecourts. Wife’s car ( which I was in) has about 1/4 tank left, son's the same. They are both working and commute by car.
Mine is a diesel, which seems to be still available and I have 3/4 of a tank anyway and am WFH so don’t need to drive much apart from visiting my mother tomorrow. Think I’ll do a local ride from home later farther than drive half an hour with MTB on back though.
BBC Scotland reported a “few” petrol stations had queues for petrol yesterday. My local one didn’t. Because it had no petrol.
Bye Bevan had it right. You can’t trust a Tory. And well done Brexiteers you’ve created carnage.
Because the gonks are reading the papers and watching the news and believing what they are being told. It’s monkey see monkey do. There is no point trying to tell these people otherwise though as they just want a band wagon to jump on.
And well done Brexiteers you’ve created carnage.
So basically you want a lifestyle off the back of paying Eastern Europeans peanuts and having them work under hellish conditions for months on end?
cake - what's your solution?
According to johnson '...we're transitioning into a high skill, high wage economy'.
Yeah, right.
We're definitely transitioning - into a banana republic; an increasing irrelevant country - a faded post-colonial power; dismissed by the US and Europe; all we can offer to the world are lessons in how to screw-up monumentally.
So basically you want a lifestyle off the back of paying Eastern Europeans peanuts and having them work under hellish conditions for months on end?
That's actually a really compelling argument. Not sure Brexit is the answer though... That would be decency and morals. Oh..
So basically you want a lifestyle off the back of paying Eastern Europeans peanuts and having them work under hellish conditions for months on end?
Nope but that is how it was working. By stopping that dead you get to the point it is now. A proper plan to get UK drivers paid properly and under good conditions needs to be executed before you send all the migrants back who are currently filling the positions.
Question:
If conditions for drivers (especially roadside) are so much better in comparable EU countries, why do people blame the conditions here on the fact we used to have EU drivers? It wasn’t the fault of “foreigners” that in the UK we treat workers like trash, and fail to provide for even their basic needs and safety.
Can’t believe all the idiots out there, I just used 3/4 of a tank driving round looking for somewhere to fill up.
😜
Can’t believe all the idiots out there, I just used 3/4 of a tank driving round looking for somewhere to fill up.
Lovely. 🙂
Jumped in the first station I saw in the way home, busier than usual but not mad, payed an inflated price for my normal half a tank of diesel. One (normally quiet) station on the way home had a queue out on to the road, I wasn't even going to attempt driving past the busier stations in town...
Got home and my Missus (who has never actually put fuel in a car) skipped her normal greetings and asked me urgently if I had put petrol in the car, I scored an empty minor victory by saying no and going on to point out that it uses diesel, but that I had put half a tank of that in. To which she said "I would have filled it up" setting aside the spurious idea that she even knows where the hole for dinosaur juice is located on our car I pointed out that I had put in more than enough for our planned journeys over the coming week...
She remains unconvinced and thinks we should resource hog, mainly because she spent all day WFH and viewing alarmist news, she was also an excess bog roll purchaser a year ago... This is how panic buying works.
My own pet theory is we're heading into the last week of Q3-21 and Boris fancies a bumper crop of fuel duty. There is enough for everyone, but lets convince the great unwashed to buy a bit extra.