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He's just another old ****. **** him. His type won't be around in a couple of generations....
Stephen Fry and Christopher Hitchens sum up my thoughts rather brilliantly during this debate in London. Expect an angry mood to have rubbed off on you if you watch the whole (but frustratingly rushed) thing:
Mr Woppit seems to have seen the same thing I did...
Edit: Elfinsafetry - it is relevant since, in the Pope's view, Stephen Fry cannot be a moral, respectable man unless he apologises, feels ashamed, and promises never to have sex with someone he loves ever again for the rest of his life.
It is a distinction that I would be keen to draw between me and the pope too.
I'm a bit surprised Hitchen's children have a godfather.
😆I'm a bit surprised Hitchen's children have a godfather.
Ok. So why does[b] Christ[/b]opher Hitchins have a problem with the idea of a Catholic priest babysitting his children then?
Stephen is a gay man who is the [b]GOD[/b]father to my children and I'm proud to call him my friend. I am perfectly happy to have Stephen babysit my children and he has done, in the past. If, on the other hand, a Catholic priest in full regalia turned up to babysit, first I'd call a cab, then I'd call the police." - Chris Hitchens.
Christopher Hitchens is an idiot who has also now shown that he is a hypocrite.
Closed?
Apparently not. Weird. I've never seen that happen before...
Which is good, as debate and discussion is healthy, as long as folk can avoid nastiness.
.So your happy for your childs education to be funded by this organisation however you harbour such strong views of distain towards them?
Err Yes, I'm quite happy to take thier funding, even though I find thier beliefs incomprihensible and thier leaders morals questionable. I even lied to them in order to secure a place, do I feel any guilt or shame, err No
What I resent, in addition to all the above, is that £18M OF taxpayers' money is being used to help finance this paypal visit in the context of Osbourne's cuts. This is yet a further abuse of innocent members of the public.
Wherever the parish priest went in my school (Xaverian, Manchester), you could tell from the stream of boys running away. He groped me once. It never occurred to us at the time to say anything to anyone else...
What I resent, in addition to all the above, is that [b]£18M[/b] OF taxpayers' money is being used to help finance this paypal visit in the context of Osbourne's cuts. This is yet a further abuse of innocent members of the public.
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11305217 ]
Lord Patten, the prime minister's representative for Pope Benedict's visit to the UK, reaffirmed that the total cost of the Pope's stay to the taxpayer would be between [b]£10m[/b] and [b]£12m[/b].The Catholic Church is also expected to make a contribution of between [b]£9m[/b] and [b]£10m[/b] towards the costs.
[/url]
Err Yes, I'm quite happy to take thier funding, even though I find thier beliefs incomprihensible and thier leaders morals questionable. I even lied to them in order to secure a place, do I feel any guilt or shame, err No
You're quite a role model for your children, aren't you?
Why thank you johnners I like to think so
Ok. So why does Christopher Hitchins have a problem with the idea of a Catholic priest babysitting his children then?
I think it might perhaps have something to do with the fact that a number of catholic priests have spent the last 20 years or more either raping children, or covering up the rape of children by their fellow priests.
Sure, its a minority, but a significantly larger minority than outside the catholic church...
I went to a catholic school, o the priest went to jail for... Child abuse. I have no respect for the catholic church...
He is just another old man to me but if he wishes to have a debate with me he is most welcome.
I suspect you might lose 🙂
Too right Filthy. Get what you can from them. I send my kids to a C of E school. I understand completely that religion is a load of old toss, but it;s the best school in the area. I have no problem lying.
Anyone who thinks different is naive, deluded or just plain stupid. Or religious, which is possibly worse.
This post is overwhelmingly disgraceful, I am ashamed of you.
Or religious, which is possibly worse.
Worse than teaching your children that dishonesty is acceptable?
Sure, its a minority, but a significantly larger minority than outside the catholic church...
As someone pointed out earlier, many more children are abused by a family member. Be interested to see some statistics for what percentage of Catholic priests are in fact nonces. By your reckoning, the fact that a child is far more likely to be abused by a family member than a Catholic priest, then shouldn't everyone who is the relative of a child be locked up?
Yep. I am very clear on this.
I understand completely that religion is a load of old toss..... I have no problem lying
Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, or so help you god...... that sir, I can most definitely do.
Imagine if your kids end up buying into all that crap?
Did you have to get them christened to get them in?
Anyone who thinks different is naive, deluded or just plain stupid. Or religious, which is possibly worse.
Or maybe just honest ?
You might be surprised to learn that some people believe it's important to teach their children to be honest.
Although I assume that you would be happy to rob a bank - if you felt you could get away with it and it provided more opportunities for your children.
No...they're pretty smart. Not christened, and they treat the stories just like they treat other nice stories that they hear at school. Bible/Beast Quest/Koran/Harry Potter etc etc...it's all good.
Yep. I am very clear on this.
Ok, so now that you've admitting to being a liar, is it ok if we no longer believe in anything you say?
yes teaching your kids dishonesty is always the best course. I am sure they will grow up to admire your hypocrisy just as much as we do. Fingers crossed they forgive you 😉
I don't really care, why would I?
Anyway. Goodnight.
teaching your children that dishonesty is acceptable?
Well they just don't learn these kind of skills in school, I feel it my resposibility as a parent to educate them (joke before I get flamed)
Actually the school has to take a certain number of non catholic children from the area, so it's more likely that she got in that way. I didn't get her indoctrinated into the catholic church or anything, in fact I think the only lies was on the application letter where I expressed my admiration towards thier church and beliefs.... believe me that was very difficult for me, I still feel dirty for saying it.
Aren't their different levels of faith school?
Ie there are loads of C of E schools....My Dad is a head teacher at one, none of his children are christened/baptised...whatever, and he's worked tirelessly to beat the local minister into submission only allowing him 15 mins a week to talk religion. It is the only school in that village, to avoid it would mean a 20 min drive.
On the other hand there are full blown bible bashing Catholic schools where an hour+ a day is devoted to religious studies with nuns taking many of the classes?
If you're not religious and send your child to one of the latter... have a word with yourself!
As someone pointed out earlier, many children are abused by a family member. Be interested to see some statistics for what percentage of Catholic priests are in fact nonces.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/belief/2010/sep/07/if-only-catholic-church-did-pr
Only thing I could find: according to Ann Widdecombe, who is in favor of the catholic church: [i]"After all the dust had settled in America, 98% of priests were untouched by allegations, let alone convictions."[/i]
So Ann is showing off that only 1 in 50 priests have been formally accused of child abuse. But that is admittedly allegations. Given that we are talking about America, lets say half of the allegations are untrue and just people looking for a chance to sue. Thats [i]ONLY[/i] 1 in every 100 priests abusing children.
To be honest, I don't really believe it is that high. But isn't it worrying that Ann wasn't able to give a upper bound that was lower?
I respect him 'cos hes the Pope but the Catholic Church have an awful lot of owning up to do..
steve_b77 - Member
No intolerance, I'm married to a Catholic despite very strong Protestant roots.By we I mean the nation/government, allowing someone who knowingly harbored and allowed a sex offender to continue on their way, as shown in the link above into the UK.
Was he not invited by the goverment to visit?
Papal visit?! Those swines emptied my account after an ebay sale went bad.
The title of this thread has changed a day after it was posted, namely the spelling of the word Papal.
How did project do that?
I don't really care, why would I?
But as you've admitted to being a liar, then surely you actually really [i]do[/i] care? 😉
Mind you; You've told us you're a liar. But if you are then that means you're actually [i]not[/i] a liar, but indeed an honest man.
But then if an honest man told someone he was a liar, then he'd be lying.
😕
The title of this thread has changed a day after it was posted, namely the spelling of the word Papal.How did project do that?
He couldn't have done.
Maybe it was the work of God? 😯
To be honest, I don't really believe it is that high. But isn't it worrying that Ann wasn't able to give a upper bound that was lower?
I thought I read last week that the church itself admits the figure may be as high as 6% 🙁
Although I assume that you would be happy to rob a bank
me too, if I could do it without injuring anyone - given the recent record of banks I'd feel it was poetic justice 🙂 In a kleptocracy, honesty is unrealistic...
Elfinsafety - Member
By your reckoning, the fact that a child is far more likely to be abused by a family member than a Catholic priest, then shouldn't everyone who is the relative of a child be locked up?
1. On average, children have far more opportunity to be abused by a family member than a catholic priest. Most parents are decent enough not to leave their kids alone with a man who will tell them that if they don't love god then that same loving god will let them burn in hell for eternity. All kids in the world are - unavoidably - vunerable to abuse from parents.
2. When in the world did I say or imply that anyone who might in the future abuse a child should be locked up?
me too, if I could do it without injuring anyone
Yeah but you'd probably really frighten people, which could harm them psychologically.
There are six million Catholics in the UK, if some of their tax money is used to finance this visit I don't have a problem with that. I don't agree with all government spending but am comfortable recognising this is a cost of living in a free society.
As far as Pope Benedict is concerned and his attempts at sorting out their issues with paedophilia are concerned, there is certainly evidence that he was hampered in trying to sort this out before his elevation to the papacy by other more powerful cardinals. I hope, and by his public apologies, which is a not insignificant step, he is now taking the first steps to overcoming to these vested interests in the Vatican, which is a considerably more than the previously more charismatic John Paul II did.
It is unfortunate that peoples' view of the Catholic Church is consumed by these problems because it ignores the good that it does, which they are more than happy to recognise when it comes to educating their kids.
I am not a Catholic.
Yeah but you'd probably really frighten people, which could harm them psychologically.
anyway I wouldn't know what to do with the money... the things I want are mostly things I have to do myself 🙂
which they are more than happy to recognise when it comes to educating their kids.
I was educated in a Catholic school, but I never would have sent my children to one
I was educated in a Catholic school, but I never would have sent my children to one
Which is a perfectly unhypercritical position to take.
Which is a perfectly unhypercritical position to take.
well, when I chose my school, I just wanted to be with my mates and had no criticism of my religion (being 10). Later I learned different. I don't call that hypocrisy or hypercriticality