[Closed] Mistresses or lovers. Can it work?

druidh - Member

Junkyard - Member
says the unmarried man with no children

FTFY

30 year successful monogamous relationship however.

yes but you have sex dont you[rhetorcial please dont answer] This issue has provoked such scorn than multiple users are using aliases when we have aliases anyway.
No one thinks this is good or desirable.

It's difficult and i'm not going to condemn the OP for straying, we all make our own relatavistic choices and then justify them.

I was in a relationship for 9yrs, for the last 5 yrs it was effectively sexless, she even told me that she could only have sex when piddled out of her skull which as you can guess made me feel wonderful...
Anyway, yes i cheated. Opportunistic stuff, never a 'secret relationship' although i suspect if one had arisen i wouldn't have complained. Our relationship eventually floundered and died like most bad ones do, lots of recrimination and bitterness leading to my attempted(ish) suicide.
Now i'm with a wonderful woman who not only loves riding her bike but wears me out in bed!

Basically, life's too short by half to waste it with a partner you're not happy with. Your kids will eventually be happier to see you with someone you love than enduring the constant sniping of a loveless relationship.

Just wish i'd taken my own advice back in 2005.....

- I have 2 small kids and have had sex once since the first was born.

That's a real bummer - bet you were hoping it would take a few more goes then that to get pregnant again 😉

Wow Crikey, brave post. I hope the OP can take some wisdom from it.

Dare I say that many women can have 'body issues' once children have been born? Pregnancy and childbirth are quite traumatic physically, sometimes, er, sorry but not sure how to phrase but you get the gist.

One's whole persona can change, particularly if breast-feeding. Men can find this quite disgusting. One becomes a 'mother' and less a 'lover' perhaps?

Apologies but I'm not very good with words. 😳

Why do so many women always use sex as a control?
It is all too often on their terms even though they know what men want. I think that many wives/ girlfriends use sex to their advantage (maybe without even realising) and take their men for granted.
It's like the wedding day is all about the bride really and once they have a husband, home, kids then they play this dangerous game on "no sex unless on my terms or unless I'm drunk". I know many guys that would never have had affairs if their wives hadn't played this stupid game. And isn't it always the guy that gets the flack and the blame by the families and "friends" they've made over the years.
Grrrr...sorry but I really understand where the OP is. Breaking promises and vows is very often caused by stealth as mentioned above before the guy goes down the path of an affair.

tyger - that may be a reason to end the marriage but having an affair is never excusable IMO

The OP is ****ing deluded if he thinks his mistress isn't going to play some major role in the future. There will come a time when she may not want to be the other woman and when she does, expect a major shit-fan interface.

My guess is he also doesn't actually want to have sex with his wife any longer.

Everything has already changed, MTFU and make the change official.

TJ - until you've been there you can't judge. I'm sorry but so often guys that end up having affairs do it because of what I mentioned.

However, if all is well with the guys marriage and he's being selfish and wants to "play the field" to satisfy his ego then I agree with you - but this is not true in this case.

I know what a sex-less marriage is like. I guess that (to most men), that lack of physical intimacy is tantamount to lack of emotional connection, which makes it hard to reciprocate.

If you've tried talking about it already and she simply isn't willing to do so, then you have to give her an incentive. "I'm having an affair" might be one, but "we need counselling or I'm leaving" might be better. She is obviously aware of how much you love the children and (under it all) still love her, so no incentive currently exists. You need to completely convince her that you are prepared to leave.

I can see that you are trying to find some sort of middle ground which keeps your home together, but seeking solace in another person is pretty selfish unless you've explored all other possibilities.

IMHO those condemning the OP out of hand

I'm not so sure that many are. I think that most married people will have had difficult patches at some point and a lot will have had opportunity. The point isn't to say that it's wrong, it's to say that you have to make a choice, you can't have both.

Remember also that if the partner has been staying at home with children all this time (for example) then that is exhausting and there may just be no desire. It may be time to escape for a week without children to get it back.

None of us have any idea if the above paragraph is the case - it's just to say as others have done that if you want the sex back then the whole relationship needs to be looked at and there are places to go for that. The sex may be that last part of the relationship to arrive (as it often is in the first place).

Everything has already changed, MTFU and make the change official

nope. Sounds as though it is changing rather than has changed. Find photos of before you were married, honeymoon etc. Is that a person you would want to be with. Find out where they are now

As usual Druidh talks sense.

i've learnt a lot reading this

EDIT: Changed my mind.

Why do so many women always use sex as a control?

That may be what you think, male ego and all that. IMO obviously.

It's beyond the realms of most men to look at the big picture.

It's beyond the realms of most men to look at the big picture.

rot.

[url= http://www.****/femail/article-1211104/Think-men-unfaithful-sex-A-study-shows-WOMEN-biggest-cheats--theyre-just-better-lying-it.html ]There may be a good reason for her lack of interest.[/url]

The OP probably feels alive for the first time in years, good luck to him.

morality and whatnot aside. I really respect this guy for being honest with himself and adressing whatever is troubling him. Sometimes it is really hard to be honest with yourself. Be honest with the other half as well. Or just live a fake life. whatever!

The Daily [s]Mail[/s] Wail - tabloid tosh. 🙄

CG - nice!

I hope this never happens to you!

🙂

It's beyond the realms of most men to look at the big picture

Ouch! I worry that there is a silent consensus among women that all men are brutish and ignorant of relationship matters. Of course I don't know your experiences, but neither myself or my male mates resemble that remark at all. In fact I quite resent it 🙂

tyger - I really do feel that you've made an unfair comment but appreciate that you may possibly be talking from personal experience.

The biggest failure of marriage, imo, is due to lack of communication and this can be tied up with embarrassment, ego, shame etc etc.

Can I slip into old git mode here? I really do question whether people are programmed/able to live together for any considerable time. This is of course a completely jaded view as it is extremely unlikely that I would ever be willing to share space with anyone. 🙄

buzz - I'm old, jaded and cynical! Can't you tell??!!

CG - firstly my comment was not a general comment towards [b]all[/b] wives or partners - just some. That said I agree with you that communication should be the answer but guilt and control seem to be the weapons of choice used by many women.

After you sh@gged the other bird for the first time did you feel guilt? How would you feel if she was at it?
Do you still find your wife attractive? Do you do things together?
Be spontanious- take her away for a weekend somewhere just the 2 of you.
Or you could just continue nailing the ass to the floor of the young thing with the unbelievable t!ts

genuine lol!

get 2 (or more) mistresses, then when the wife finds out about 1 you can give her up in a big show of sorrow and regret....whilst still keeping 1 on the back burner.

then everyone is happy!!

My uncle still wasn't married in his fourties which people found strange, then one day announced he was leaving the area and disappeared without trace for ten years until tracked down by a family member.

Although he never talked about women to anyone, he had been the lover of a work colleage in an unhappy marriage for most of her marriage; when the woman's last child reached 18 they disappeared together. They both died recently, still happy together after 60 or so years.

Some women do it for me and some don't despite being attractive, intelligent, delightful people. I'd have been daft to marry one of the ones that didn't. It strikes me a lot of women do though, how many claim never to have had an orgasm? And how many admit to simulating all the same?

I said I wouldn't come back to post more - yet here I am - which perhaps shows my lack of strength of character.

Many of the posts here have been really useful to me. Some which are more dogmatic ("leave her now - you only get one life" or "I've never had sex with anyone else so you are evil if you do ") are less helpful and perhaps show lack of understanding of the complexity of real life. A bit Fundamentalist really.

Some more information.

My wife probably did not have enough lovers before she met me. I'd done alright and had fun. I've always assumed that I must have been doing something wrong with her and that I was to blame for her not being interested but it would get better rather than worse. She hasn't been really interested for all our marriage and before it, not just since having kids. I have suggested counselling, sex therapy, toys etc etc. I don't believe there has been someone else for all that time as we have moved around a lot. She says she isn't gay and has not ever been abused, but just that sex isn't that interesting or important to her - and to other people she has talked to.

I don't want to make love to someone who is not enjoying it. But I know other people who didn't enjoy sex till they met the right person much later in life. Maybe I am not the right person - but we have kids - and a life together that I value a lot. So I take the blame for being comfortable with her and accepting this situation when it was a bit better in our early days.

To be honest, if she could take a lover who got her to understand what it was about, and that then attitude transferred to me, it might be the best and fairest situation. I don't think that is going to happen. I think we are doomed to another 30 years of companionship and little or no sex. But also few hugs and little spontaneous affection.

I don't want to do is hurt the kids by disappearing the minute they are 18. I certainly don't want to leave now. I've been that child. Perhaps I do need to try again to have the conversation which talks about options. eg,

1) Marriage breaks up (bad for both of us and for the kids - given we are happy and functional most of the time)
2) Wife accepts my needs and allows me to have another sexual/intimacy outlet.
3) Wife accepts the need to talk and do something about sex/intimacy together. But how would she feel about this with the threat of 2) as a possibility? Not exactly encouraging trust and intimacy is it?

My coward's plan has been

4) Try and be the best husband I can be, except in having a secret friend who is an emotional and sexual outlet - who also needs that in her life at the moment.

But this does my head in. I am not a natural at deceit. And how do you force people to communicate when they don't want to?

Thanks for the honesty from everyone

In the spirit of your last post I will apologise if I appeared harsher than warrented.

I do very strongly believe honesty and trust is the only way forward. Its possible you can regain this without telling her about the affair but think about crikeys post and what Druidh said. IMO the affair must stop now if you want to save the marriage or you must leave.

It might be you need to give your wife an ultimatum. "help me look for a solution or I will leave" You have to be clear you are not prejudging outcomes and you are not blaming her.

Especially if you are not a natural at deceit your wife will know something is going on and it will eat you up inside anyway.

Good luck.

Perhaps I do need to try again to have the conversation which talks about options. eg,

1) Marriage breaks up (bad for both of us and for the kids - given we are happy and functional most of the time)
2) Wife accepts my needs and allows me to have another sexual/intimacy outlet.
3) Wife accepts the need to talk and do something about sex/intimacy together. But how would she feel about this with the threat of 2) as a possibility? Not exactly encouraging trust and intimacy is it?

I believe it would be best to have a conversation that talks about options. But I wouldn't bring option 2 into it except as a last resort (in fact, for me not even then!). In asking your wife to visit Relate with you (all this tied in with my previous post which regards counselling as not just the best option, but in fact as a really positive choice) I would try to explain how hard you are finding having a relationship without physical intimacy. And that's it. No thoughts of what might help this (beyond counselling), no options of 'don't ask don't tell lovers, just an (or possibly a number before she does agree) open and frank talk by you of how hard you find the loss of intimacy in the relationship. Don't make it about her "since you don't want sex". And have investigated where the nearest counselling is and what their availability is before each of these conversations, so if she asks questions about taking it forward you have answers ready.

Here's the link. [url= http://www.relate.org.uk/sex-therapy/index.html ]Relate Sex-Therapy[/url]. Before talking with your wife read the common problems (particularly [url= http://www.relate.org.uk/sex-therapy-service-common-problems/234/index.html ]this one[/url]) and the [url= http://www.relate.org.uk/case-study-sex-therapy/index.html ]case study[/url]. Maybe after having broached the idea with your wife once or twice, tell her you've looked at the website and would like her, in her own time and space, to read the either of the two above pages. It may be that she feels the loss of intimacy as well, would also like to change the relationship in a good way, but can't herself see how to make that change.

Blah blah, lots of words, not that much order - up too late and then too early! Good luck.

nice TJ I am sorry but let me reiterate my points again Well done that helped clear up what you really thought again.

What markie says i think you want to save the marriage so at least try. You need to discuss this in a forceful but supportive way.
Dont mention 2 EVER - it would need to be her suggestion IMHO-people tend to not at well to blackmail - come to counselling or I will get a comfort shag is neithe persuassive, loving or supportive

Best of luck

I still feel that your relationship is doomed, like you say you want a normal good sex life and your wife doesn't.
You having an affair should confirm to you that you need intimacy.

Wether it ends now, in 2 years time or when the kids leave home it will end.

I too was in a loveless sexless relationship, i ended it and have remarried and couldn't be happier, it's simply the best thing i have ever done.

I still say if you want out do it, life is far to short.

Sorry if this sounds harsh.

I have to say, it seems far too many people on here have had/are having a similar experience with regards to loveless and sexless relationships.

Are all mtb'ers so obsessed that we're crap shags or what? 😥

Option 2 isn't a possibility though is it, it's the current reality. Talking hypothetically about something that's happening now is likely to make you feel more awkward rather than less. If you start talking you'll tell all, you've told us, you'll tell her, I think you feel the need to tell her and will - we'll see - do keep posting.

Perhaps I've known a non-representative sample of women but IME they fear and resent emotional involvement with another woman more than sex. Despite the dire warning of one above poster, using prostitutes is more likely to be tolerated than you falling in love with and having good sex with another woman.

Having had sex with another woman (or man if I felt so inclined) I'd tell my wife before having sex with her again. I promised her as much when we first met as in a previous relationship the first I knew of my girlfriend's other life was catching an STD - fortunately of a type easily treated with antibiotics. I'd then live with the consequences of telling her, something I've always found easier than living a lie.

Going even further back into my own experience I realised my then steady girlfriend was seeing another guy. I lived with it quite happily and never confronted her. We amicably went our separate ways years later for other reasons and she never did know I knew. I could go on but not without another pseudo.

She knows your sex life is an issue, if she kicks you out when she learns you're having (have had) an affair it will be the excuse she needed not the reason.

Apparently Kim Cattrall was like this until she met her husband that was a theapist, and then she enjoyed sex so much she wrote a book on it. They are not together anymore...

Are all mtb'ers so obsessed that we're crap shags or what?

Update - if anyone is interested...

looks like we are planning a timetable towards when I am with my lover rather than my wife, and for the rest of our lives, but choosing a time which is the least academically damaging for my kids. Nothing can protect them from all the emotional effects 🙁

sometimes 2 people meet and they are just fated to be together... Perhaps we should have met 20 years ago - but I would hate to have not had my children who I love intensely. But this was not just about sex in the end - but about intimacy and connection and love.

It isn't going to be easy - and was never going to be whether I stayed or went. For any of us.

Thanks to everyone (including TJ - and I really [i]do[/i] mean that) who contributed to this thread before.

"the least academically damaging for my kids"

just do it now, and quickly

Missed this first time round but would like to wish desperategit good luck and I hope you (and your 'ex') find happiness in the future as you sound like a decent chap.

ps. couldn't have offered much input anyway as I'm single (yet again) and intend to remain that way for the forseeable 😉

It must be a relief that you've made a decision but there is never going to be a good time for your children. Mine are adults and that didn't make it any easier, even though there was nobody else involved.

iDave certainly talks sense - don't drag it out.

Good luck for the future.

So does this mean you are getting divorced?

Just seen this thread. Hope I'm not too late but you should have taken a 3rd lover just in case the "love" you think you feel with your lover is just being c**t struck. HTH.