Lol at Dazh for articulating it better than I could.
dazh
She’s not even been in power a day and if reports are correct she’s already proved the people on here wrong that she’s a rightwing ideologue who wouldn’t lift a finger to solve the energy price crisis.
Just my thoughts here, I'm not getting into the big "discussions"in the thread ok guys.👍
Anyway...
In fairness, I and many others in the last few pages have pointed out that she will change policy at the drop of a hat. She doesn't have any real ideology on my opinion.
Policy will be decided on the hoof, just as Boris did.
Just my opinion anyway.😁
We won’t be paying it back.
Yes we will.
Remember that the Tories exist purely to keep power and wealth in the hands of the powerful and wealthy.
There is no way on earth they will do any redistribution towards the less well off. What they will do is a con. Pay a bit less now pay a lot more later.
Oh bugger off.
No thanks.
Devil in the detail of Truss’s plan, will it be a loan ala Sunak’s plan, or a straight out bailout or a combo of both
As I predicted, it'll be the former that's proposed at first. The public and Labour will drag her towards the latter by Christmas, I hope.
will it be different for businesses
That'll be the big question, once domestic users are clear what's happening for them and SME businesses are folding everywhere.
She doesn’t have any real ideology on my opinion.
I think she does however she wont let that get in the way if there is too much bad press. So expect the taxcuts and other perks and then just enough to keep the press quiet going the other way.
So it will be like a small mortgage for energy? Maybe, as energy costs seem to be ever increasing, it will be something that you can pass on to your children.
Will this also be used to help pay for new nuclear?
All the voters care about is the number on their bill.
I don't.
The UK energy market is broken. It needs fixing not propping up.
All of the utilities need nationalising.
The country needs more left wing policies to fix this damage that has been done by the far right nut jobs.
LOL! Wouldn't matter who got the PM gig - most on here wouldn't give any conservative a chance no matter what they achieved - create world peace, end famine, solve global warming - even the slightest thought of praising a Tory would send them into convulsions. 🙂
most on here wouldn’t give any conservative a chance no matter what they achieved – create world peace, end famine, solve global warming
I don't recall any of those things being promised by a tory, ever...
Good old Liz. Not just a pretty face.
Yes we will.
What with? Where's the money coming from?
We won't.
Tories gonna tory muffinman
They willnever do anything that redistributes wealth to the less wealthy. Its against their entire reason for existing.
They will try to con folk that that is what they are doing but it will be a con
the-muffin-man
Full Member
LOL! Wouldn’t matter who got the PM gig – most on here wouldn’t give any conservative a chance no matter what they achieved – create world peace, end famine, solve global warming – even the slightest thought of praising a Tory would send them into convulsions.
After 12 years of only really delivering austerity, yes, I'm not really inclined to give the latest in a string of Tory PM's much praise frankly.
Rone
Increased future bills
solve global warming
When Conservatives were proposing and supporting distributed on land renewables, I praised them for it. I know plenty of people with solar on their roofs because of those old policies, and I can see the windfarms on all my rides. They've long since moved well away from that. The Conservative party has been transforming itself while in office... none of that has given people much to cheer them for. Unless you welcome Brexit of course, for some abstract reason.
to be paid back by consumers over the next 10 to 20 years.
It'll never happen. This is simply a bone thrown to the rightwing of her party and to cover her previous 'no handouts' position. Although given Rayner's brainless and economically illiterate 'we can't keep pouring money in' comment I doubt we can rely on labour to change it in future. In the end there'll be little between labour and Truss on energy prices. The energy companies will continue to make profits, consumers will pay roughly the same prices as now (or less once wholesale prices reduce), and the govt will underwrite the whole thing, wasting tens of billions in the process as opposed to doing the sensible and economically prudent thing of nationalisation.
I don’t.
The UK energy market is broken. It needs fixing not propping up.
All of the utilities need nationalising.
The country needs more left wing policies to fix this damage that has been done by the far right nut jobs
Agreed but all this is going to happen in stages of need.
Rone
Increased future bills
People can't afford the bills.
Same problem.
It’ll never happen. This is simply a bone thrown to the rightwing of her party and to cover her previous ‘no handouts’ position
Exactly this.
Can someone link the me the details for package not seen it anywhere yet?
^^No details actually announced as yet, other than what's been mentioned on here.
Oh, government backed loans for energy providers, that's the mechanic being used.
Speculation going on with small business intervention. Sounds like they haven't actually decided how to do that yet.
Same old arguments back in the tumble dryer again. Right is evil, left will take over the means of production.
If its not paid back by consumers it will be " paid back" by austerity cuts.
Make no mistake. This will be used to make the rich richer and the poor poorer
Anyone noticed the usual drip-drip of a few different versions of the help supposedly coming into the usual media outlets? They're still doing the whole 'See what sticks' thing that plays o the popular mood rather than what actually needs to be done. I've also noticed not a lot of talk about help for businesses, just households. New name, same old Tory bullshit.
And yet just two miles up the road from me people are losing their shit because a large solar farm is planned.
On land you can barely see from any road, and land that would in all likelihood be used for housing in the next 5-10 years otherwise.
I got collared by some NIMBY in Devises while popping into a local shop last week asking me to sign a petition to oppose a Solar Farm near there. I looked at the plan he had with him and said it was a good idea as it's either that or a load of identikit New Builds. Seeing as solar panels don't make any noise or create traffic congestion I told him it was the best use for the land. He looked all confused as his brain tried to process that if they defeated the Solar Farm it wouldn't stay as a field.
most on here wouldn’t give any conservative a chance no matter what they achieved – create world peace, end famine, solve global warming
That's just a list of things the tories will never, ever deliver - so I guess 'most on here' will never be given a chance to prove you wrong...
Don’t you find the over reactions to the topic drift more tedious?
Honestly, yes.
This is where we do run into presentation issues vs what we need the PM to do. Outside of “we believe there are incoming nukes. do you want to order Trident to respond?” how important is this good look? Isnt it better to have someone go “let me think about that for a bit”?
Cool. You've got four minutes. Tick tock. 😁
I'll give her the benefit of the doubt, of course. None of us have any idea what she's actually going to be like as PM, she could turn out to be a breath of fresh air. It's like objecting to the new Doctor Who actor before filming has even started. But what's the phrase, hope for the best and prepare for the worst?
To be fair she has got form on shit in the sea, rewarding the rich, deregulating labour etc etc. It's not like she's come with a clean sheet.
Don’t you find the over reactions to the topic drift more tedious?
They're not over-reactions, they're deliberate attempts (by one poster in particular) to cancel the views and opinions of anyone who doesn't agree with them. That's a much bigger problem for a discussion forum than topic drift. TBH it's no different to any other form of bullying on social media and it needs to stop quite frankly.
It’s like objecting to the new Doctor Who actor before filming has even started.
We were right about that though...
And yes, though I doubt it, she could be totally unlike what we expect and we should at least give her a couple of months so we can see what she has planned.
They’re not over-reactions, they’re deliberate attempts (by one poster in particular)
Who exactly is this internet bully your talking about? I genuinely cannot see it?
I generally try to find the good in people, so I don't sit in the all Tories are bastards camp - however they've cleared house of nearly all the non-bastards. FFS BJ got his own brother ousted from the party, who happened to be that increasing rarity of a competent moderate conservative MP.
Truss is an archetypal Tory Bastard - small government, trickle-down economics, deregulation, screw the little people, screw the environment. Her records, words, and history in government fill me with dread
It’s not like she’s come with a clean sheet.
This.
TBH it’s no different to any other form of bullying on social media and it needs to stop quite frankly.
Sorry, but who is doing the bullying? Who's trying to cancel views? You told me to "bugger off". I'm not willing to give Truss the benefit of the doubt. I've seen enough of her already, she's been in government since... what, the whole twelve years of this lot being in power? Yes, I've already judged her, she's not new, not a breath of fresh air, just the Tories playing their "fresh player" PR game, yet again... prepare for VIP lanes for everything, more impoverishment of workers and those who can't work, more reductions in all our rights, and an even more hostile environment for people not born here.
I generally try to find the good in people, so I don’t sit in the all Tories are bastards camp – however they’ve cleared house of nearly all the non-bastards
Agree with this
Surely someone has run the maths on this plan... previous to her being instated, shes in the same party, so surely the same people have worked o nthese figures and its been waved around before...
i cant see that a party leader actually makes that much in the way of decisions, just a figurehead on the ship..so the new PM and new announcements are part of a bigger plan and to make the current talking point (energy crisis) sweeter to the genral public.. without actually fixing anything..
Energy price cap, paid for by the tax payer..
wrong solution, right solution is to make the high energy users contribute more, encourage everyone else to use less best they can and provide incentives to be much less grid dependent.
Would labour do any better? impossible to say.. all i see is an economic imbalance, not just in this country but globally. but it's fine, we can make the voters happy for another 4 months while we work out what we are doing
I generally try to find the good in people, so I don’t sit in the all Tories are bastards camp – however they’ve cleared house of nearly all the non-bastards
Agree. I always thought that poor chap who was stabbed seemed a decent sort. Even years ago when he was being tricked by Brass Eye he seemed genuinely enthusiastic to help.
Good to see the same posters giving a new Tory leader the benefit of the doubt.
I have repeatedly said that all the likely Tory replacements to Johnson are imo likely to be worse than him, in terms of their effect on the lives of ordinary people. And I certainly believe that with regards to Liz Truss, I consider her to be more right-wing than Johnson.
If however I am proved wrong I will be extremely pleased. By the attitude of some people on here there will be quite a few who will be disappointed - they are clearly hoping that Truss will prove to be worse than Johnson.
Apparently it will be good for Labour.
Even years ago when he was being tricked by Brass Eye he seemed genuinely enthusiastic to help.
Lots of MPs of all parties genuinely want to help their constituents. The Conservatives have always had plenty of genuinely public service minded MPs. Loyalty to our last PM, and his open ended key policy, were put ahead of all that at the last election though, and lots were kicked out.
Richard Murphy on LBC James Oh Brien at 12:45 if anyone's interested.
I'm sure there will be plenty of Truss stick!
Who’s trying to cancel views?
Well, there's your tedious backseat moderation attempts.
Looks like after totally shunning Sunak at the announcement yesterday and those she is appointing to cabinet, she is doing very little to settle the divide in the Tory party.
As usual it will be a vipers den tearing itself apart as the country burns.
.
Richard Murphy on LBC James Oh Brien at 12:45 if anyone’s interested.
Thanks for the heads up. Doesn't sound like they're giving him much time though!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62801913
Energy firms would use the loans to subsidise customer payments, with them repaid by additions to bills over 10 to 20 years...
Sounds like exactly the first roll of the dice that I predicted. The pressure to change the policy will hopefully begin at the next PMQs... I can't see the public accepting that "pay in your later bills" policy, and Labour and the other parties need to make that clear and push for something better.
...or repaid via future taxation.
It'll be this, eventually. Or at least painted as this. The future bills idea won't survive this winter. Windfall taxes (under a different name) will continue to play their part. If they don't, then the public watching the oil and gas companies laugh all the way to the bank won't end well for the new PM.
Richard Murphy’s thoughts
https://twitter.com/richardjmurphy/status/1567057832284983297?s=21&t=Sj8YUQ3cM0vOKsEdy3kZCg
Lots of MPs of all parties genuinely want to help their constituents.
Like I said before, you have far too much faith in these people. I think there's a tiny few MPs who actually want to help their constituents, and they're almost all outside the tory party. It would be more accurate to say that many MPs want to help their constituents as long as it doesn't threaten establishment power and doesn't damage their political careers. The end result is that constituents very rarely receive any help from their elected politicians.
“ Looks like after totally shunning Sunak at the announcement yesterday and those she is appointing to cabinet, she is doing very little to settle the divide in the Tory party.”
It’s this kind of statement that really underlined why politics is so tribal / now puts so many people off.
Having actually watched the announcement yesterday I saw Truss specifically thank Sunak from the stage - there was no “shunning” apart from a confected story of refusing to shake hands when it was clear to see that no hand was proffered by Sunak in the first place.
I’d also wager that even that most experienced politician would have an “oh carp” moment in the few seconds after they had just learned they would be PM the next day. Indeed there’s a story in the Times today describing how Tony Blair stuffed up his PM inauguration with the Queen immediately after he was elected because he was “flustered”.
