Good answe tinas. Minor bit of fiddling around the edges not a majir policy but * tips cap* 😀
Since we’re talking about Rory Stewart I decided to look at his voting history. It’s pretty appalling imo but otherwise exactly what I would expect from a Tory MP.
I see no evidence that he wasn’t a typical Tory MP.
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/24964/rory_stewart/penrith_and_the_border/votes
I reckon how Rory Stewart behaved when he heard the division bell rung in the House of Commons is more important than his behaviour in front of a TV camera.
The trouble with looking at voting records is that almost all of it is either whipped votes or opposition day motions. Holding them up as being representative of an individuals views is completely pointless. If we'd had (or we get) a decade of Labour governments I'm sure there'll be a whole raft of opposition day motions with nice sounding titles for them to vote against.
If you listen to the rest is politics podcast it is a pretty constant line from alister campbell to get at rory stewart for his voting record.
"more important than his behaviour in front of a TV camera."
Funnlynuff first time I saw him was during the bad floods in the Lake District of a few years ago.
I might be mis-remebering this but I recall the the Beeb cut to him, live, and for the first minute or so he raged at the Met Office.
He appeared to blame the scale and damage of the floods on the "tax payer funded" Met Office.
🤷♂️
If you went into politics and stuck to your principals without compromise, you wouldn't make it very far or be in politics at all.
If it were 650 MP's that I 100% agreed with then it wouldn't be a democracy.
Good answe tinas. Minor bit of fiddling around the edges not a majir policy but * tips cap* 😀
TBH I expected a response based on it being the wrong drugs policy and dealing with addiction as a health issue would be more productive, my counter would have been that prison isn't the real world therefore a zero tolerance policy can be made to work at least for longer term inmates.
People seem to be socialised into the cap doffing deferential idea that political leaders should come from a tiny section of the wah wah elite and be completely remote from the electorate. We really could do with a break from the old-Etonian and PPE musical chairs.
Acknowledges this might be quite a wait…
wasn't same sex marriage part of the Cameron Govt? Marriage Act 2012/13? (whenever it was introduced)
How does that redistribute power and wealth?
He appeared to blame the scale and damage of the floods on the “tax payer funded” Met Office.
Isn't the Met Office funded from it's commercial activity?
Eaten alive by local radio presenters although they may have all got together beforehand to lay the traps.
To be fair, none of the questions I've heard have sounded anything other than blindingly predictable for the UK's PM today - that she can only (somehow!) make herself look worse when replying to them speaks volumes.
How does that redistribute power and wealth?
It probably does as much to redistribute power and wealth as the report that says prisons are safer that TINAS found. it's an example of a Tory policy that's not aimed at making the already wealthy more wealthy, which is what you asked for.
Can't wait to see the local TV interviews 😂
So the bar has been set at ‘name me any policies from the Tories that aren’t awful’
So far we have just 2…
😂
Can’t believe Liz is still defending this shit show…
The trouble with looking at voting records................
................. is that there's no escaping them.
They either reflect someone who is there to vote on their convictions, or they reflect someone who is there to tow the Party line - however morally bankrupt - in order to keep their job.
Either way, it hardly reflects well on Stewart.
So the bar has been set at ‘name me any policies from the Tories that aren’t awful’
So far we have just 2…
😂
That wasn't the question posed.
Name a single tory policy that does not act to concentrate wealth in the hands of the powerful and wealthy?
They either reflect someone who is there to vote on their convictions, or they reflect someone who is there to tow the Party line – however morally bankrupt – in order to keep their job.
That's because you're confusing politics with standing on a soap box on the high street shouting at people (or the modern equivelent, sitting behind a phone screen). Liz is currently in the process of ****ing arround and finding out that you can't just stick to your principles regardless.
Even* Starmer said this week that the (likely) next labour government won't be able to do all the things that a labour government would normally like to do. Because in the real world you don't get what you want.
*Awaits accusations that he's really a Tory.
Simon Clarke put a post out last night on his Facebook page advertising Liz's radio round. It's been taken down - the comments started off critical last night and descended into rage after her appearance.
Normally he has a loyal following of Brexit ultras.
They either reflect someone who is there to vote on their convictions, or they reflect someone who is there to tow the Party line – however morally bankrupt – in order to keep their job.
Either way, it hardly reflects well on Stewart.
That's politics though isn't it?
Give way on some issues so you can keep your job and possibly do some good in other areas that you are more committed to.
Stewart couldn't cope with the contrdictions thus he quit
That wasn’t the question posed.
Name a single tory policy that does not act to concentrate wealth in the hands of the powerful and wealthy?
Those two replies did actually answer the question as written. Granted, it was pretty obvious that that the intent of the question related to financial policies and the redistribution of wealth upwards, problem was with the question not the answers.
Stewart couldn’t cope with the contrdictions thus he quit
He didn't quit, he was fired. Probably because he was a Remainer. Precisely the same reason why he's the darling of other staunch Remainers, regardless of him being every bit as appalling as other Tory MPS.
problem was with the question not the answers.
Yup.
Stewart couldn’t cope with the contrdictions thus he quit
It was more that he put up with the contradictions to get himself in a position to possibly become leader, when that failed, then he packed it in.
Stewart couldn’t cope with the contrdictions thus he quit
I'm confused, he quit rather than serve Boris, surely we can all agree that is a demonstration of sticking to (some) principals?
A d as the Nuremberg trial showed "I was just following orders" is no excuse.
Godwins law I win
Except the point you just made was that he refused to follow? More Oscar Schindler than Claus Barbie?
Talking in general to about Stewart
A d as the Nuremberg trial showed “I was just following orders” is no excuse.
Fun fact; "I was just following orders" (Superior orders) has been used successfully as a defence, they had to make special provision to stop the Nazi hierarchy claiming it at Nuremberg .
I'd imagine 'Fun Facts' of the Nuremberg Trials is a pretty short list.
Indeed.
I've just read "The Nurenberg Trail" by John and Ann Tusa. It's a really interesting read, It's one of those subjects where you think you know about it, but turns out it's more fascinating than you'd expect.
Rory Stewart is quite likeable.
trail monkey : He’s just another Public School, born to rule Tory with a despicable voting record on the NHS, Welfare and Tax.
The Difference with this one is that he was the right shade of Remain to beguile Centrists and make them believe that he was something else.
Thats a very simplified argument, If Rory voted against the government on such issues then he would be removed from the tory party.
Rory Stewart is quite likeable. I highly recommend The Rest is Politics podcast with him and Alistair Campbell. They’re both highly critical of the current government but with both of them there’s a bit of balance and good thoughtful conversation.
Yeah agreed, you don't need to have the same beliefs as he does or expresses.
Still a tory tho. It shows how debased our politics has become that he seems so good and moderate
I'm not sure he is a Tory .. not the current definition but I'm not holding his upbringing and beliefs against him but I wouldn't vote for him unless he's the best chance against a Tory.
Its not tribalism
Its understanding that the Tories exist for one reason only. To keep power and wealth in the hands of the powerful and wealthy.
Yes the one nation conservatives realise they have to keep the rest content and look after them in a paternal way but no tory will ever redistribute power and wealth in any significant way.
IMHO splitting hairs to call it tribalism or not... or split tribalism into sub categories.
To keep power and wealth in the hands of the powerful and wealthy.
This is why it is and isn't tribalism.
You probably have a different idea of "wealthy" than I do and I have a different idea to Rory and he probably has a different idea than Rishi.
The main tool the Tory's use seems to be splitting the poorest classes (as in EVERYONE earns under £10-£20M a year?) from the real wealth.
He didn’t quit, he was fired. Probably because he was a Remainer. Precisely the same reason why he’s the darling of other staunch Remainers, regardless of him being every bit as appalling as other Tory MPS.
Yep its back to Bojo getting rid of anyone who didn't wholeheartedly support Brexit,which had the unfortunate effect of draining the er 'talent' and leaving you with a bunch of numpties.
(Double post for some reason)
Rory Stewart is quite likeable.
Boris Johnson built his entire political career on his perceived likeability. It certainly wasn't his competence or attention to detail.
It's nice to have politicians who are nice, it is however a poor reason to support them.
to get himself in a position to possibly become leader, when that failed, then he packed it in
No. He knew he had no chance of becoming leader. When he entered the leadership race, he said it was to make sure someone at the hustings was telling it as it is. Which he did. He laid out a possible way through the post Brexit chaos (that didn’t include cancelling it, by the way) that his party could take, by explaining the hard work and diplomacy (and, yes, compromises) that would be required. I didn’t agree with him as regards how to deal with the change in the status of the UK, but he was engaging with reality (including the reality that he couldn’t become leader). Since Johnson got rid of MPs refusing to back him and his “plan” (they weren’t sacked for not backing Brexit, they were sacked for not backing him and his undisclosed plan for dealing with it) they have just been dealing with each other and their close vested interests, with an increasing unwillingness to deal with the reality beyond their own internal politics, and beyond Westminster… never mind beyond the UK. Where are we up to with sorting Northern Ireland… for example… and where does that leave us as regards USA and EU politicians, markets, businesses etc?
Perhaps he was trying to position himself for the job Truss ended up “doing”… Foreign Secretary and Trade Deals… but I doubt it… not impossible though. It’s a job he could have done better than most in his party at that point… you don’t have to want the Tories to be in power to see that.
The interview with him on the other thread shows that he is a Tory, just one that is not nakedly neo-liberal. He himself says that he is more into tradition and the environment and sees himself as being more on the left wing of the party than other people.
He sounds reasonable. He's educated. He's seen how the world works and probably would be able to survive a coalition government somewhere like here in Sweden or Germany, but he will have no place in UK politics. Well, not for many years.
I’ve just read “The Nurenberg Trail” by John and Ann Tusa. It’s a really interesting read, It’s one of those subjects where you think you know about it, but turns out it’s more fascinating than you’d expect.
I'm hoping for sweeping berms and not too many man made wooden features.
I don't want a Tory in charge but that's what we have.
I'd rather Rory in charge than Liz and given the shallow pool we have to choose from, what Tory would we rather have?
I’m hoping for sweeping berms and not too many man made wooden features
I’m going to ride it on my Nuremberg Raleigh
Me too 🙂
Rory Stewart seems competent..... and frankly I'd take that at the moment, regardless of the colour of the rosette they are wearing
