Agree with a lot of the above, Spacey etc. Morrissey was a particular blow as I really was a big fan of both smiths and solo stuff. Nick cave had an interesting take on it, that when the material is out there it's the listener that has ownership of it rather than the artist. Explained a lot better than I have tried to summarise there. Worth a read of you Google it.
I'll also chuck in Bono and U2, struggle to listen to these days.
Perchy, explain the pic please …. ta
It was painted by an artist by the name of Adolf Hitler.
Generally considered to be something of " a wrong 'un"
Here's another one...
You can almost feel the evil staring out of it, can’t you?
Did Jedward paint it?
Nick cave had an interesting take on it, that when the material is out there it’s the listener that has ownership of it rather than the artist.
That's fine for the days when we primarily listened to tapes, cds, and vinyl. They've already got your money and denying yourself the pleasure of listening to their music doesn't make any difference.
Now with most music being streamed you're giving them an admittedly tiny amount of money each time you listen but it all adds up.
Same with Morrisey – allways an utter bellend but dodgy politics does not invalidate him unless he steps over a line to racism or similar
You should probably do some reading, TJ. He once said that Germany was the rape capital of Europe because of all the immigrants, as a random example. There's plenty more. Oh yeah, he's a "For Britain" supporter, they're the ones that make UKIP look cuddly.
Perchy wins the internet, again
Prefer the first one. Has a nice bucolic feel if a bit derivative
The Hiter pics are a bit different. The only reason you'd take any notice of those pictures is because of who they are by. What we are talking about is music which would be accepted as good 'art' in itself but where the artist is suspect in some way.
Yet politically and to some degree physically a “rong’un”
Johnny? Go on then, explain...
Any news on Ryan Adams? Haven't been able to listen to his music since a thread on here.
What we are talking about is music which would be accepted as good ‘art’ in itself but where the artist is suspect in some way.
I don't think Hitler recorded many songs.
Although I believe his Nuremberg rap album was quite popular on the continent when it was first released.
Cougar
...
I don’t really have any moral issue with the Smiths. I’ve always thought they were shit, self-indulgent navel-gazing dreary toss.
edit - hang on, that might not work, try this one
Adolf Hitler designed the shape of the VW Beetle
No he didn't. It was Porshe and some Austrian bloke who's name I forget. Hitler just told 'em to do it.
I don’t think Hitler recorded many songs
Didn't he write 'Wir Fahren Gegen Engeland!!', or was that Goering?
cougar - my point really was talk is somewhat different to actions. Unsavoury politics is not the same as rape.
I note what you say about Morrisey tho - since he started with the far right stuff I have simply ignored him so did not realise the extent of it. Perhaps he has crossed a line?
I don’t think Hitler recorded many songs.
His signature dance was popular though. Everyone in the streets was doing it for a while.
Didn’t he write ‘Wir Fahren Gegen England!!’, or was that Goering?
Dunno......His classic " Four world cups and , you know, a score draw on the World War front come the summer, Oompah, Ooompah!" was never release due to unfortunate circumstances.
I note what you say about Morrisey tho – since he started with the far right stuff I have simply ignored him so did not realise the extent of it. Perhaps he has crossed a line?
He definitely has to my mind. I could try and google you examples but, well, I'm sure you can do that also. (-:
Didn't he once release a song about the National Front? Or have I imagined that?
He definitely has to my mind
How is it remotely relevant if you don't like the music anyway?
Adolf Hitler designed the shape of the VW Beetle
No he didn’t.
Yes he did, for sketches follow the link below and there's at least one further sketch I've seen but doesn't seem to have made it on to the Iterweb.
Hitler did a lot of graphic design work. Some more discussion of the Beetle and other symbols he came up with here:
https://ww2podcast.libsyn.com/selling-hitler
Morrisey – allways an utter bellend
This should be his strapline.
How is it remotely relevant if you don’t like the music anyway?
It isn't to me. I was talking with someone for whom it might be.
Are you here for five minutes or the full half hour?
Yes he did, for sketches follow the link below and there’s at least one further sketch I’ve seen but doesn’t seem to have made it on to the Iterweb.
Huh. I sit corrected, apologies.
He once said that Germany was the rape capital of Europe because of all the immigrants, as a random example
what an idiot - when everytone knows it is really Sweden..
"In August 2018, SVT reported that rape statistics in Sweden show that 58% of men convicted of rape and attempted rape over the past five years were immigrants born outside of the European Union"
"In March 2018, newspaper Expressen investigated gang rape court cases from the two preceding years and found that there were 43 men having been convicted. Their average age was 21 and 13 were under the age of 18 when the crime was committed. Of the convicted, 40 out of the 43 were either immigrants (born abroad) or born in Sweden to immigrant parents.[51] Another investigation by newspaper Aftonbladet found that of 112 men and boys convicted for gang rape since July 2012, 82 were born outside Europe."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_Sweden
I read that wrong for a minute and thought 58% of men in Sweden comitted rape...
Wow...
Ride of the Valkeries - everyone loves it (well except the Viet Cong). But... Wagner!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wagner_controversies
Off topic… but Josef Ganz and Ferdinand Porsche are the main names connected to the Beetle design. After all these years, it might be time to stop propagating propaganda about Hitler’s own contributions to the project. Airbrushing out Ganz’s work and replacing it with the idea that Hitler was the originator of the design is particularly nauseating.
Adolf Hitler designed the shape of the VW Beetle
No he didn’t. It was Porshe and some Austrian bloke who’s name I forget. Hitler just told ’em to do it.
His input is largely moot. The history of the Beetle and VW post-war is largely a positive one.
It's easy to just say Hilter was this comic baddie who enslaved his own people before trying to take over the world, but the conditions that allowed him to such power came from WW1 reparations which were, to say the least, spiteful.
Germany wanted it's version of the Model T (20 years later) as much for national pride as anything else. That's what the Beetle was for, it wasn't made to commit mass murder or form an Empire.
At the end of WW2 it would have be easy to repeat those mistakes, punish the German people with another generation (or 2) of reparations.
The VW factory was a wreck, it was a British Officer who over-saw it's repair and re-opening. It gave local people jobs, created an economy and restored some pride. It gave German some much needed exports too.
They only made about 100k Beetles pre-war and about 21.5m post. It's a loud, slow, polluting shit-box of a thing by today's standards, but for it's time it was an excellent design.
What has Roger Waters done?
Still waiting for an answer on this one. Went to see Us and them at the cinema Sunday, he seemed to push all the lefty liberal buttons. I'd love to know if I should feel guilty or not ??
The Beetle project was a way of getting more money from citizens to fund the war effort, and as a propaganda tool in the “people vs the elite” narrative Hitler depended on. No one got their “people’s car” until Hitler was taken out of the picture. It’s subsequent success and place as an international icon is a thing of joy and symbolic of the rebuilding of post war Germany… just don’t go claiming Hitler designed it.
No idea about Waters… his last album was pretty damn good… but he doesn’t exactly hide his bitterness at world politics… so if that’s not your thing… the lyrics may put you off the music.
I don’t think Hitler recorded many songs.
He's pretty good in this one
Produced of course by another wrong un
I boycotted Die Antwoord about 12 seconds into the first of their 'songs' I heard (I'd just seen Chappie) on account of the fact they're ****ing awful and they produce awful cliched toss.
Lost Prophets, I feel for the rest of the band, they're fairly local to me and whenever they come up in conversation you end up speaking to someone who knew someone, who knew someone, who knew one of them.
Apparently they were all nice Lads, including Watkins at the start. He wasn't born Evil, he was never short of Ego even before they were a band and he certainly went that way. IN the last few years of the band he was meant to be unbearable, very controlling and sadistic with it, he liked younger women and got off degrading them. Went he got into Crack everything got worse, nothing was too extreme for him. The band didn't speak or associate with him outside of performances.
A relative of mine was working at Parc Prison when he was on remand, again this is mostly rumour, but apparently he never accepted he did anything wrong, his Barrister had to convince him to plead guilty on some counts at the last possible opportunity, but only as a way to reduce his sentence and to work on an appeal. He's a nightmare prisoner, he can at least convince prisoners (and staff probably) he has the means to offer them money outside of prison to get phones etc and he's still trying to groom young women with Kids, refuses treatment etc. He's due for release in 2041, he could technically be released in 2031, but he'll have to prove remorse to the parole board and he's too arrogant to do it convincingly.
Apparently there's still a fan base, even some of his solo projects are still shared on file sharing sites, the mind boggles.
I note what you say about Morrisey tho – since he started with the far right stuff I have simply ignored him so did not realise the extent of it. Perhaps he has crossed a line?
Most definitely crossed a line. Has been nearing the line over the last 10 years or so but is now well over it. Based on that I choose not to listen to him.
What he says may not bother some of you but so what, it bothers me so I make that choice.
As long as nothing bad comes out about Mark E Smith (that I don't already know) I am still okay.
As much as I like Ian Brown I do not like that he is a stoner. Hardly a bad crime I know but it still irrates me.
just don’t go claiming Hitler designed it.
I don't think anyone has - the evidence doesn't support it.
What the evidence does support is that Hitler designed the 'shape' of it and that shape persisted into the 21st century.
In the context of this thread that's relevant. In the context of history less so since AFAICT all cars in the early 40s were styled like that and the 'design' I've seen was little more than a curved line.
Like others I'd have described myself as a Lost Prophets fan, and every now and again I still find myself humming rooftops. Would I ever stream their music again? - probably not. Watkins is a grade A piece of 5h1t, and despite the respect I have for his bandmates & their music, I have more respect for those he's impacted in his actions.
Wagner wasn't very nice.
Bought a T-shirt off the Lost Prophets guitarist after seeing them in Y2K supporting Pitchshifter and Earthtone 9 (memories!)
Lost interest after the first album but they seemed like genuinely nice chaps at the time, gutted about what Watkins seems to have turned into, he's done so much damage to so many people, utterly grim situation for all involved.
The lead singer of one of my favourite hardcore bands, Champion, seems to have been a proper creep as well, massively torn about what to think about this, went to some incredible gigs with them playing and the rest of the band apparently weren't aware either.
Wagner wasn’t very nice.
Nope, but in spite of that he *was* a liberal and would have been strongly opposed to the Nazis.
Which makes him a great addition to this thread. We need a Nazi to turn up and say "I still listen to Wager in spite of his politics being unacceptably liberal." 😀
What the evidence does support is that Hitler designed the ‘shape’ of it and that shape persisted into the 21st century.
No. The evidence is that Hitler drew sketches of the shape that the designers had already designed. He was not the originator of the shape (bonnet, rear, wings or overall). It’s just propaganda that worked so well, it still hasn’t died.
Not exactly saying I'm a Little Richard fan, but I find Lucille a bit of a toe tapper.
I must admit though, that when I read somewhere that he was a token pervert who enjoyed watching people get jiggy, whilst being w**ked off and having his titties chewed (hahahahaha) I do find myself skipping it on shuffle more often than not!
Lost Prophets were one of my favourite bands. I didn’t even consider playing their music for years after the facts came to light and like many others was very surprised that it was that Ian Watkins they were talking about and not the bloke from Steps.
I will admit they have become a guilty pleasure recently.
Never liked The Smiths, most of MJ’s stuff or Glitter. Grew up listening to The Who though.
Yet politically and to some degree physically a “rong’un”
Johnny? Go on then, explain…
Nothing too explain really, just politically and monarchy motivated... he was classed as a "rong'un" for that era, along with many that protested against the establishment...
Thats all..
Got to love Nick Cave. His position on Mozza probably could apply to Rock And Roll Part 2 and Billie Jean as well.
I still think there's something in my argument though, if you listen to music created when the artist was already a wrong un', it's more likely to be somehow tainted by that wrongness.
Nobody will ever stop me enjoying ABC by the Jackson Five anyway.
The evidence is that Hitler draw sketches of the shape that the designers had already designed.
Sounds plausible - provide a source for that and everyone will know in future. In the meantime there are two credible authors who claim it was the other way round.
