TBH I'm not for or against it in principle, I'm a bit confused as to why you'd do it though - kid won't care or be interested, it's not got a benefit that I can see. Ho hum.
Doesn't look like a tough route, in fact looks like the sort of route we used to take newbies up as you can bearly do any harm especially when top-roped. Ah well.
It's great that she's taking her kid around so much. A good mum.
Maybe she needs the risks explained in detail. The thought of inversion doesn't bear thinking about.
She could have gone for the " SURPRISE " option 🙂
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I think the climbing may be an unnecessary part of the "I want my kid to be part of everything" lifestyle she wants to enjoy.
This really. I applaud her not wanting to wrap the kid in cotton wool and involve her in what mum and dad (or whatever) are doing, but I reckon this is taking it a bit too far- especially as Mum seems to think it's dangerous enough that [i]she[/i] needs to wear a helmet. I can't really see what anybody's getting out of it, other than maybe the Mum making some sort of point and using the kid as a prop.
Does anyone remember the man who 'forced' his son (5 years old?) to walk along Crib Goch whilst being roped together?
Does anyone remember the man who 'forced' his son (5 years old?) to walk along Crib Goch whilst being roped together?
No - got a link? Interesting thought - I'd be tempted to "force" mine, but I don't think he'd enjoy it much. In what sense exactly are we talking "force"?
aracer - had a quick G but couldn't find it, will keep trying!
This entire thread is us assessing the risks.
How many of the complainers have used pushchairs to ferry their kids around? And been responsible for pushing the poor little sods into the traffic when trying to cross the road??? 😆
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Yeah, but it's OK because he had a helmet on.
makes it quite likely that if she did slip and hang on the rope she would invert in her harness.
I very much doubt that, TBH.
I've got a similar sling, and I would say that when they turn upside down, the baby doesn't fall out.
I wouldn't climb with it on, but then I suck at climbing. I imagine once you are good, there are some climbs which are 100% that you can go up no problems.
I imagine the kid enjoys it - our 20 month old loves being high up, and things like going down hills at 20mph in the bike trailer and jumping both wheels off the ground over speed bumps.
I've got a photo of mine at 13 months that some of you might disapprove of, but which was perfectly safe. Hang on.
I think she has ruined her career now!
What parent would trust her with their child after this 🙄
She seems to be one of those mums who wants her child to go everywhere with her because it makes her stand out, makes people look at her and gets attention for it.
If she went on her own, no child, she wouldn't get any attention.
It's like those women who carry around small dogs in their handbags.
Rose at 13 months.
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Minimal risk (I was jolly careful, and it was a lot less technical than most places I've unicycled!), she enjoyed it, it's a funny picture, everyone wins. I have to admit I went about 5 metres and only did it the once. I don't think I'd do it anywhere else or try anything more hard until she is old enough to understand how to do a dismount from shoulders in an emergency!
It looks unsafe to a lot of people, but I am a lot better at unicycling than a lot of people. I've done 1000 commuting miles on roads without any unintended dismounts, let alone falls. I'm also pretty good at graceful unplanned dismounts from the mountain unicycling. Riding a 24" freestyle unicycle on a flat surface for 5 metres is way less risky than crossing a road.
I still wouldn't choose to climb with a baby in a sling, but I do think as basically a non climber, I'm totally unqualified to risk assess what good climbers do with their babies.
She seems to be one of those mums who wants her child to go everywhere with her because it makes her stand out, makes people look at her and gets attention for it.
To be fair, she might just like doing outdoors stuff, and think it is nice to enjoy it with her baby. Many of us on here are like that, it's just that we don't feel it is sensible for us to do crazy climbing things.
Or maybe even a set up picture to make a point?
You have to look at who is benefitting from it though.
Kids that age would have more fun running round the playground, rather than sitting on their mums back, looking at rocks. it is boring.
when you have children, you have to adapt, and sometimes separate your own activities, from family time activities.
I am a lot better at unicycling than a lot of people
I got told I would never reach a level of skill where I'd be allowed to ride a uni with one of our kids on my shoulders 🙁
I LOVE THREE CLIFFS!!!
All I can see is a woman crawling along the floor with a child on her back, what's the problem? It's the bloke in the background doing a horse-piss I'd be worried about.
30 years ago no-one would have batted an eyelid at this.
If I were a parent (oh wait, I am...) anyone telling me how I should bring up my kids can flip off.
Interfering do-gooders, imposing your precious little principles on others like they're some kind of divine untouchable commandments.
How superior you must all feel, what with being perfect in every way and everything.
Butt out, go and finish insulating your own delicate little darling kiddies against the world with cotton wool and bubble wrap.
^^ totally missing the point
^^ Believes there's a point to all this 😉
Oh fercrissakes, you want to go and see how kids in developing countries live on a day to day basis. Yeah, the helmet thing is a bit discordant - if that's a word - but I used to climb a lot and on low, well-used UK crags I never once had anything land on my head. The closest I came was pottering about at the base of Dow when someone dropped a krab that landed a few feet away from me and would have hurt.
Wonder how much the sanctimonious prigs at the Mail paid her for the image it apparently pinched from her blog...
No one has 'interfered', no one has 'imposed' anything, no one suggests that kids should be insulated. No one is claiming to be perfect, but if you think that maybe it reflects a little on you.
Some of use have an opinion based on our knowledge of shit that can happen on easy climbs, what kids do in backpacks etc.
You have an opinion too. It's different. Keep your soggy knickers on.
EDIT: BWD - I've had gaggia classic sized rocks miss me by a few feet. just sayin' like.
30 years ago no-one would have batted an eyelid at this.If I were a parent (oh wait, I am...) anyone telling me how I should bring up my kids can flip off.
Interfering do-gooders, imposing your precious little principles on others like they're some kind of divine untouchable commandments.
How superior you must all feel, what with being perfect in every way and everything.
Butt out, go and finish insulating your own delicate little darling kiddies against the world with cotton wool and bubble wrap.
I guess you left the wee winkie smilie thing off the end.
Basic parenting skills would question why you were prepared to expose your child to a danger that you weren't prepare to accept for yourself- why does the mother wear the helmet.
Irrespective of the real or perceived risks, I'd be thinking[i] 'whoah, why am I the one putting on the helmet here?'[/i]
30 years ago I think more people would have been concerned by the photo than they are today- even getting on for 40 years ago pretty substantial attention was paid to safety issues in outdoor education.
Nobody's getting sanctimonious here, but joao3v16 there's shitloads of people telling you all the time what you can and can't do with your child, and many of them you'll have to listen to, like it or not.
Just a point about the whole "mother in helmet, so should the toddler" thing:
It occurs to me that we're looking at one photo from the day and criticising based on that.
It is quite possible that the mother [u]doesn't[/u] feel she needs a helmet on that climb. She might just still have it on from an earlier climb. Or perhaps just wanted to keep her hair out of her eyes.
We can't see the climb, it might just be a little wall - certainly someone is able to get a close up photo of her from directly above.
Tell you what though: I reckon the Daily ****ing Mail and the like have caused significant more damage to kids' safety and health over the past few years with things like their deeply misguided and dangerous anti-MMR campaigns than any number of parents pottering about without putting full PPE on their kids.
It is quite possible that the mother doesn't feel she needs a helmet on that climb. She might just still have it on from an earlier climb.
This is what I thought too. Maybe the kid asked to go climbing with mummy after seeing her up on the rock, my lad would have done that. So you pick him/her up and choose an easy scramble you've done fifty times, top-roped, no loose rocks etc, someone snaps a picture, you think nothing of it. Her biggest mistake was uploading the damn thing to the internet... 🙄
EDIT: BWD - I've had gaggia classic sized rocks miss me by a few feet. just sayin' like.
Gaggia Classic, the new unit of rock measurement... One day all rock-fall will be measured in high-end domestic appliances. 'Yeah, did you see that boulder - proper Smeg fridge size?' 'You reckon? I thought it was more of a Siemens washer-drier. Or maybe a Bosch dishwasher.'
And talking of domestic appliance... coffee 🙂
I think the mother needs knee protection in this pic
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^ Ha!
First thing i thought on looking at that picture was "i'm not sure whether i'd rather have the mother catching or throwing". I'm such a sexist 😳
3 pages and no one has noted that the newspaper article states that the mother siad she had her helmet on because it was an automatic action for her, but with all the coverage etc says she regrets having a helmet on in the photo.
I don't think I would do it, depsite being a climber with an acceptance and well informed knowledge of the minimal risks in top roping situations. But that doesn't mean she souldn't have done it.
Who are we to judge? There's been threads on here asking about cycling with backpacks before the baby is big enough to go in a child seat. I can't see a helmet being effective with a baby being strapped into a backpack due to space andangle of neck issues.
3 pages and no one has noted that the newspaper article states that the mother siad she had her helmet on because it was an automatic action for her, but with all the coverage etc says she regrets having a helmet on in the photo.
I think that may be a later edit. Don't remember reading that in the original article. Think the headline has changed a little too actually.
3 pages and no one has noted that the newspaper article states that the mother siad she had her helmet on because it was an automatic action for her
Not sure that helps her cause. Why is it in an automatic action for her?
I think that may be a later edit.
Yeah, they've definitely changed the article and headline since yesterday. Typical DM, fanning the flames.
as a father with a 2 year in my honest opinion that is a little bit stupid.
im not a climber but why would you take a risk.
I know of an experienced climber/outdoor activity type. He intended to become a trainer of other enthusiasts.
He was rock climbing. When the rock above him became loose, it fell. Luckily he heard it and seeing it falling on him, ducked his helmeted head in towards the rock, so only got hit on the head with light small fragments.
However he could not do the same with his foot and the rock struck the back of his heel, ripping off his climbing shoe and all the back of his actual heel and half of the sole of his foot.
He had to have assistance getting off the cliff, given he was bleeding and injured. At the hospital he had to have a skin graft on his foot. They said if it did not take he would have a lot of problems walking. It did take but he ended up giving up a lot of outdoor sports.
Still, it was his own fault - if he had thought to put a kid on his back I he would not have the foot injury as the rock would have landed on the child instead. At least it would have died quick with no helmet, unless it was unlucky and had to live with a brain injury.
I am not a fan of coddling kids, but either the parents are fools or have a huge need to get attention for themselves at the cost of their child.
I am not a fan of coddling kids, but either the parents are fools or have a huge need to get attention for themselves at the cost of their child.
I wasn't aware the child had died.
In fact I'm pretty sure it was completely unharmed, had a great time with mum and benefited from being taught from an early age how much fun being active in the outdoors can be.
As for the "huge need to get attention", do you honestly think she wrote to the Daily Mail and said, [i]"Can you please nick some pictures from my personal blog and then use them to stir up frothing indignation against me, questioning my suitability as a mother and potentially ruining my future career?"[/i]
EDIT: BWD - I've had gaggia classic sized rocks miss me by a few feet. just sayin' like.
That has to be middle class comment of the year..
had a great time with mum and benefited from being taught from an early age how much fun being active in the outdoors can be
You can't quantify that anymore than we can assess the risk from one possibly posed photo. My kids spend all day mucking about in the countryside in a way that would make the DM wet its collective knickers, but I won't know for 20 years if it's instilled a love of the outdoors or a loathing and a preference for Sky+ and big tellys.
My 2p worth - seems of dubious benefit to the child and an unnecessary additional risk. If she were old enough to climb herself, and express a desire to do so, fair enough.
If she were old enough to climb herself, and express a desire to do so, fair enough.
As someone said, quite possible that she already expressed a desire to do so. Mine certainly would in that situation.
Perhaps mum thought that, like you, being encouraging would send help the right message?
I know of an experienced climber/outdoor activity type.
...
I am not a fan of coddling kids, but either the parents are fools or have a huge need to get attention for themselves at the cost of their child.
You're assuming there's anything there to fall on them. The entire route might well be about 20 feet in total. Looking at the coil of rope next to the belayer, I'd be surprised if it's directly comparable to the situation your 'person you know of' was in. In MTB terms, it's like judging a mother cycling along a towpath relative to an accident involving a DH racer you know of.
Unless they're also roped in, I'd say that the biggest risk they've got there is probably falling photographers.
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That harness is rubbish. I don't really care about the helmet issue, but if she slips and inverts the kid will fall out and fall on its head, and it's not hard to see the kid wriggling out on its own accord.
That'd be the [url= http://store.ergobaby.com/Baby_Carriers/Original ]ERGObaby Original[/url] that [url= http://aimevenhigher.blogspot.com/2012/01/adventures-in-babywearing.html ]she talks about on her blog[/url]?
"...if I had known about this dream of a carrier all along, I would have used it from the outset!There isn't anything I don't like about this carrier. We have used it from quick runs into the shops, she has napped in it on my back while I do housework, we've had long mountain days together... I've even climbed with her on my back in it. This is about as comfortable as babywearing gets. And it offers the option of having baby on the front or back, something we have taken full advantage of. And while Ffion sits lower on my back in this carrier, she has always been very happy and content in it."
She seems fairly happy with it.
probably bored to tears because she can't see anything.
that would be why other carriers hold the baby high up.
but then i wouldn't have thought that has crossed their minds
A two year old is quite capable of telling you if she is "bored to tears because she can't see anything".
