[Closed] Last night it was our turn. Break in track world.

"Should I have gone outside?"

No. You absolutely did the right thing. No bike is worth being stabbed or attacked for.

Good luck on the insurance.

I would have done the same thing. In fact, I probably would just have gone back to bed, so you have kudos for staying up.

You have all your nice bikes still, and everyone is unharmed. That's all that matters right now. In due course the scrote will contract ebola of the penis and die from blood loss. That's the way it goes.

Wow, you actually saw the guy break in

Genuinely not sure what I'd do. I think I'd hope to scare them away before they actually got in, but I guess you were hoping the police would turn up in time. Shame you couldn't lock them in!

You did the right thing but when people ask 'should I have confronted them', I always wonder if you could confront them with one of these.....

[img] [/img]

I mean they can't be illegal can they? People get shot with them every weekend & the cops don't do anything. (they bloody hurt at close range as well)
Good luck on the insurance.

They came back the same night after the police had been?

Jesus.

That's pretty worrying, now he knows where the bikes are and what you've got there's a strong possibility he could be back.
You will need to up your security. Get some anti burglar/climb paint on the top of that wall for starters.

I admire your restraint. I would have been out there im afraid. Can't believe the ****s came back

I think I would have been out there with a cricket bat. Or perhaps trapped them inside and awaited the police. Hope is all gets sorted

Hmm tricky one. Not worth getting a shoeing (or worse) over some property but at the same time hard not to try something to stop them just getting away. Bit shit the police didn't respond in time but I guess they were on other calls. I'd have probably just got a camera recording and shouted when I heard them making noise below and hoped to spook them and film them as they ran off.

Absolutely the right decision. Nothing you own is worth your life and you never know if they are carrying a knife. Agree about increase in security though. Big German Sheperd?

Oh also, take the wheels off the bikes they won't get far without wheels.
A bit of a ball ache I know but you're? a soft target now.

a full carbon spare road bike ignored for a 1992 hardtail!

Sounds like the work of paramilitary wing of retrobike

You should have owned them with Bombers.

Traditional innit.

That's really shit OP, some real scrotes out there. As others have said, nobody is hurt and that's the main thing. I'd have gone out and confronted them, but I'm an idiot in those kinds of situations and the red mist descends. You did the right thing.

Sounds like the work of paramilitary wing of retrobike

That made me giggle

You should have owned them with Bombers.

Traditional innit.

The retrobike crowd would actually find that arrousing, especially if they've got the three piece lowers with the machined arch.

Wanted them nicked. Wanted them in the back of a riot van so I can wave at them. I bet my wife's bike the good guys would come thorough. Fail.
They nicked an old highly recognisable bike.
They ignored road bikes
Through the forced door that's all they could have seen. Holiday time for the bikes and battleship steel door for the cellar.

Deploy a rabid, mark 1 Fido in the cellar every evening. (You need one that doesn't give a warning bark before it gets going, these are very rare). Once Fido is secured in the morning call the police to collect survivors and take away the body parts.

You did the right thing.

When I was woken up by burglars in the garage I legged it downstairs. They'd tied the door shut. But they'd heard me running down the stairs and legged it. I'm not sure what would have happened if I'd caught them but I wasn't thinking rationally, let's say.

Having considered it, I think that IR security cameras are the way to go. They can be had very cheaply online, and getting a picture of them is probably the best thing you can do.

I'm suprised you did nothing. Dissuassion might have worked: music through a guitar amp and 2x12 painfully loud with roadside upstairs windows open, PA telling everyone what's happening if you have one with a microphone. All the lights on inside and out. Bike lights for blinding... . Attract as much attention as you can, get as many witnesses watching as you can.

If nothing else the police would know which house.

Don't beat yourself up about it, I'm sure your wife is a little more attached to you than her old bike.....maybe?

Fit one of these to the cellar door? [img] [/img]

consider security lights as well as upgrading the door.

consider a complete steel doorset including a steel frame, there are lots on the market that don't look like they came from a battleship or draw attention.

talk to your neighbours to see how they accessed their garden/ encourage them to do something.. maybe plant some Pyrocanthus / fix fences etc...

as you've been robbed remind the neighbours to get some advice as almost certainly the scrotes have scoped out other things / properties to rob in your area

Burglars tend to focus on quick in and out, imo. They'll assess a job based on how quickly they can get away if they get caught. We had a break in in a student house, they left behind loads of computers and whatnot, just filled a bag with CDs and grabbed my camera case so they could run out with it.

I understand people recommending not intervening, as it could get nasty, but I really don't think I could sit in silence if some **** was breaking in.

Not sure that CCTV is of any use either. Neighbours spent a fair bit on their system installing. When they were broken into they got some really good footage but as the scrotes had covered up their faces with what looked like buffs the police said they couldn't identify them for the footage. All they could do was provide a crime number and claim off the insurance, same as when my garage was broken into.
They shared the footage on Facebook hoping to identify them but as with the rest I've shared a bit of a fruitless exercise.
The thieves know they are going to be recorded and take measures to prevent themselves from being identified. All you can do is secure the property the best you can and make sure you have the right insurance cover.

I've read about convictions from home CCTV but yes, it's not hard to foil. What else can we do though once you've got stout doors and Almax chains?

^^ I fitted one of those poacher alarms to the shed at the bottom of our (long) garden in our first house after we had an intruder. As my Uncle can testify - they're bloody loud - he'd decided to wander down to borrow the ladder without telling me what he was doing. I think he pretty much sh*t himself.

For us it was more to kick off the dogs, than a deterrent in and of itself. We were the end of a terrace of four houses all with gardens only accessible from the top end. All houses had dogs of various ferocity - one neighbour had some rather scary working GSD/sheepdog thing crosses.

After a spate of local break-ins the agreement was that should someone trigger the poacher alarms the backdoors would be opened and the dogs left to meet the people coming back up the garden. My proposal was for paintball claymores hanging in trees across the gardens...

What else can we do though once you've got stout doors and Almax chains?

Not much. A very loud alarm is the best deterrent in my opinion and vigilant neighbours. Make sure your insurance covers you valuables as many bikes are now way over value that most policies pay out without them being specified.

I'd have done entirely the wrong thing and been out there with the nail gun... 😳

[i]been out there with the nail gun...[/i]

Nail their feet to the kitchen floor!

One thing confusing me - so they broke in.. just for bikes?? and took crap ones? ****ing morons.

All houses had dogs of various ferocity - one neighbour had some rather scary working GSD/sheepdog thing crosses.

When our garage was broken into the second time they had managed to remove the shiplap cladding from the side entrance only to find it had been sheet'd out with 12mm ply on the inside (after the first break in) without get our GSD barking. Only when they opened the main garage door did they trip the alarm which had the dog barking.
I can only assume who ever had broken in must have already got the dog used to them as it would normally be straight outside through it's dog door at the slightest noise. Just as well I loved him as he was useless as guard dog.

You did the right thing but when people ask 'should I have confronted them', I always wonder if you could confront them with one of these.....

I mean they can't be illegal can they? People get shot with them every weekend & the cops don't do anything. (they bloody hurt at close range as well)
Good luck on the insurance.

Saw a YouTube vid once where a group of guys set a sting, then as the thief was stealing a bike, the all jumped out and paintballed him . 'Twas merica though

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xi6XtthI2F0

Personally I would have tried to scare them off. Not confronted them as such, not worth it. As said above, they might now see you as a soft target and come again.

Its sh** like this that makes me realise I could never move back to the UK. How has the law ended up making us completely and utterly defensless in the face of crime against our hard earned homes?

molgrips - Member

When I was woken up by burglars in the garage I legged it downstairs. They'd tied the door shut. But they'd heard me running down the stairs and legged it. I'm not sure what would have happened if I'd caught them but I wasn't thinking rationally, let's say.

Owned them with your incredible IQ?

They took bikes that I had assumed would be too difcult to get to. Sadly I was wrong. Strangely if they returned to the cellar for the bikes they had seen and found them all gone why continue? The owner has clearly noticed you'd been and would be on guard. They don't want road bikes as they missed the road bike to get to the incomplete bike. CCTV and a solid steel door is on the way.

What else can we do though once you've got stout doors and Almax chains?

Spread the risk. Don't keep all your eggs in one basket.

Its sh** like this that makes me realise I could never move back to the UK. How has the law ended up making us completely and utterly defensless in the face of crime against our hard earned homes?

Or move in with Nowthen in whatever Utopia he lives in 🙂 There's room or all of us isn't there?

Its sh** like this that makes me realise I could never move back to the UK

U Ok Hun? Xxx

Shame you weren't cooking chips at the time, don't you always sling your hot oil out the window after? Perhaps just as someone is leaving below? Not that you'd expect someone to be in your backgarden as you are making your early morning snack. Isn't that just what everyone does with their hot oil?

You need to borrow a Caucasian Mastiff for a bit, keep it in the cellar!

[img] [/img]

mikey-simmo
Wanted them nicked. Wanted them in the back of a riot van so I can wave at them.

Event that would be a hollow victory, as they'd be out in about 5 mins, as the police seem to be powerless to actually lock people up these days.

Personally i'd have put up "Caution High voltage" warning labels everywhere, and then 'accidentally' left my half finished mains powered hobby project right behind the door.......

Event that would be a hollow victory, as they'd be out in about 5 mins, as the police seem to be powerless to actually lock people up these days.

Yet our prisons are overflowing...

Its sh** like this that makes me realise I could never move back to the UK

What, other countries don't have burglars? Wow!

Or you referring to the fact we aren't allowed to summarily shoot what we consider to be intruders? If you think about it, that is actually a pretty bad idea.

Hands up those who would consider people scratching around in your cellar in the middle of the night like this to be "intruders" . . . .

Apparently they deserve the benefit of the doubt...

I think you are allowed to defend yourself. I don't think you would get into trouble for smacking a burglar.

You get into trouble when you start punishing them yourself.

Or you referring to the fact we aren't allowed to summarily shoot what we consider to be intruders? If you think about it, that is actually a pretty bad idea.

You can in America, only if they are black though.

Just look how that has helped eradicate crime there.

Defence in depth:

Large area of gravel outside the shed/cellar door. Impossible to get to the door quietly.
PIR sensors with lights attached but keep the sensitivity down so that the neighbours' cats don't set them off.
Motion sensor inside the bike room, give yourself a 30 second gap to enter the key code.

In addition to any locks accessible at the door maybe some form of lock that can only be operated from within the house.

Don't think quietly was on the agenda. Two huge bangs as they kicked the door in then bashing about the cellar let me know they didn't care. Having though about it my bombers were away that night.

molgrips - Member

I think you are allowed to defend yourself. I don't think you would get into trouble for smacking a burglar.

I think (without googling) that you are only allowed to strike/attack if you feel that you are in danger of attack and your strike needs to be proportionate to the danger you felt.

So you'd probably get in trouble if the burglar has a half decent solicitor.

You can in America, only if they are black though

Don't perpetuate the lie.

BLM are racist bafoons.

BLM are racist bafoons.

Potentially racist typo alert!

BLM?

Black Lives Matter.

You absolutely need to set a Just Giving page so we can donate to you...

Its the done thing when you have stuff stolen 😉

I think one of the really tough things about this is you end up feeling 'unmanned'/bested by inferiors. Everyone thinks they'll be out there fighting but actually the fear/terror kicks in when it's really happening. Bet your heart was pounding ringing 999?
But think about it. This is an audacious/reckless burglary - they returned after seeing the cops. Probably on crack/cocaine, creating Pulp Fiction delusions of grandeur/power. Probably motivated by drug addiction. Irrational: took cheap bikes, left money bike. They are seasoned criminals - been in jail, lived on estates where violence is the only status activity. I'm assuming you are a decent, unviolent person. They are pumped up on adrenalin, ready to confront you - "we'll have to hit him if he comes out lads" -there will be more than one of them - you are basically scared and not used to violence.
So what would be more 'humiliating' in front of your woman: getting a kicking or worse, or losing some bikes. And, I know this is heresy on singletrack, but it's only a bike.

But I think it's still tough, psychologically. Maybe you need to talk it through with your partner...it was her bike. Did I think you did the right thing? Yes.Would I have done the same? Yes. But what does she think?
-you went out and took preventative action and saved the crown jewels (bikes and metaphorically).
-you rang the police, who let you down - badly - on this occasion.
-they weren't breaking into your home risking safety of your kin folk.

It's not your fault.

^^^ like

Unless you're a martial artist (and even then) its just not worth the agro confronting burglars, as lotsroad summarises so perfectly above, the sort of people who do this kind of thing are from backgrounds where violence is engrained into their very culture and they will give you a good kicking, or worse.

Even if you get the better of them, they'll be back with numerous uncles and hardmen from their estate to finish you off.

Best way to deal with them is to vote for political parties who don't underfund the police or create socioeconomic conditions which drive people to crime.

I think one of the really tough things about this is you end up feeling 'unmanned'/bested by inferiors. Everyone thinks they'll be out there fighting but actually the fear/terror kicks in

I've been there face to face with intruders in my home - quite unwittingly and unexpectedly. Opened my front door and stepped straight into the crime scene. And for starters you're right - fear and terror really does kick in - they were terrified - like cornered wild animals. And you've no idea how you'll act unless you're there in that moment, least of all keyboard warriors saying what they'd do with the benefit of [i]your[/i] hindsight - everybody saying what they'd [i]probably[/i] do - they've absolutely no idea what they'd do. Your choices aren't your own.

I was surprised at how extraordinarily calm, clear and collect I was. It seemed to make no sense - but there was no need to get aggressive, even to raise my voice - they were literally bouncing off all the walls with fear, one of them considered jumping out the window even though there was only really railings below to land on.

No matter how brazen burglars seem to be - they are shitting themselves with fear - all the more so if someone turns up. Theres no point and no purpose in doing anything to elevate that - not with someone who has nothing to lose. The moment you are present you've made everything they're frightened about worse. They're frightened they'll get caught red handed - they have been. They're frightened they can be identified - theres someone standing right in front of them who can testify. They're frightened a crime against property has suddenly elevated to a crime against the person and become a lot more serious and more solvable in the eyes of the police and the courts. In that situation a little bit of fisty cuffs is neither here nor there.

but it's only a bike.

It is indeed only stuff. It'll probably be rendered obsolete by new 'standards' quicker than they can fence it.

I think you did well to stay cool, calm and collected OP. You have probably got a better initial outcome than I would in that situation. I get aggressive when I am scared and that has led to some poor decision making... You deserve applause IMO for not falling into that trap!

You absolutely need to set a Just Giving page so we can donate to you...

I'll chip in a few quid on the proviso that you buy a Caucasian Mastiff or set up a bunch of wacky, yet elaborate, traps like those used in Home Alone.

To all those debating what you'd actually do, it's simple, fight or flight kicks in and you're programmed one way or the other. You don't know which until the shit goes down. Letting the authorities deal with it is the sensible option. Chances are that if you do fight you'll end up in court for it

Best way to deal with them is to vote for political parties who don't underfund the police or create socioeconomic conditions which drive people to crime

Some people just can't help themselves!

One thing confusing me - so they broke in.. just for bikes?? and took crap ones? **** morons.

These are the sort of people who think a Carrera is the best bike you can buy.

It's the scum bags who follow you back from trail centres that know what bike to steal.

I think you did well to stay cool, calm and collected OP. You have probably got a better initial outcome than I would in that situation. I get aggressive when I am scared and that has led to some poor decision making

Totally agreed. Last year I was sleeping in the lounge at my folks when I was woken by the door to the integral garage going, then some knocking about in there. Without thinking, grabbed a wine bottle and prepared for braining action. Barged through the door, and encountered the intruder. My ****ing brother, who'd popped in at 4am to pick up a bike. Considered braining him anyway 😉 Just a lesson for me that there are a lot of unknowns in that kind of scenario.

What was the upshot of your encounter maccruiskeen? You left me hanging . . .

Sorry to hear this. We we done over in Nov in the old house. We popped out to walk our son in the park Sunday 3ish. Out less than 2 hrs so unless very bad luck we were being watched. Kicked gate and shed door in. Took hammer from shed and in broad daylight smashed a window in of a small Victorian terrace. I think they were disturbed as they got a lot of stuff but despite having the keys to the asgard didn't get any bikes.

I have spent 6 months completely unable to sleep, the slightest noise or creak (new house is noisey) would have me patrolling the garden with various used sporting equipment. Only since I've fitted a smart alarm and cctv as well as lots of alarmed locks, used sports equipment in strategic places and various sound bombs have I started to feel vaguely safe and I've done what I can.

My main concern with finding myself in that situation again is not about being scared but more about the aftermath....

What was the upshot of your encounter maccruiskeen? You left me hanging . . .

This could be the start of a compelling part work 🙂 I could be the Charles Dickens of my generation.

I let them out and called the police.

The perps had dropped everything they'd been trying to steel so the the police fastidiously fingerprinted everything whilst giving withering reviews of my CD collection as they came out of the bag one by one.

It was quite interesting as you could virtually trace their route round the flat as the stuff came out of the bag in reverse order. High value items (cameras etc) came out first, then CDs (back when they had at least a nominal value), last items out were beers and wine. Their first destination was the fridge.

What was interesting was the opportunism - people worry about break-ins if they are leaving their home empty for a time - going on holiday or whatever. But if a house has been empty for weeks as far as potential thief knows you could still come home any minute. But if they see you leaving the house they know you'll probably be gone for half an hour or more. When I worked in a prison cons would tell me if they were on a bus and saw someone locking their front door they just got off at the next stop and went and burgled the house - couldn't help themselves it was pretty much a gift.

My flatmate had left the house and we passed each other just round the corner as I was heading home - the thieves had obviously seen her leave and broke in knowing it was empty for at lease 20 mins - I turned up at the door 3 or 4 mins later.

One thing confusing me - so they broke in.. just for bikes?? and took crap ones? **** morons.

Expensive items are hard to sell and more traceable. Better to take a lot of things you can sell for a quid each than one thing you can't sell for hundreds or thousands - unless you have a ready buyer in advance.

basicly to force entry into property the thieves will be equipped with tools, that will have damaged your property and they dont care, the same tools will be used on you to make their escape.

either ring police or make a lot of noise. or both

[url= http://www.crimepreventionproducts.co.uk/personal-alarms/chaperone-140-decibel-mini-keyring-personal-alarms ]This[/url] wouldn't be hard to rig up as a booby trap. Confronting someone in your house is difficult, I would make as much noise as possible to try and scare them off and make sure you leave them a clear escape route, whatever they take it's not worth killing/dying over. Or you could do what my Mrs did when she woke up to see a leg coming in through the window, grab hold and scream!

Plenty of folk saying they would confront burglars... very easy to say whilst your sat at a keyboard.
I really should bolster the security of my garage and make things a bit more difficult for theives.

I had a long chat with the the police chap after our intruder legged it (disturbed by the sound of my wife grabbing the kids and running into the bathroom and shouting out the window - followed by said neighbour + dogs arriving on the scene)

Weapon by the bed = no-no. You're setting yourself up for trouble. So no baseball bats etc.

A large, 4 cell maglite is another matter. That's just there in case of a powercut...

From the sound of things the aftermath can be worse than the crime. I can't imagine how it must be to feel unsafe in your own home. The thought of if it will happen again and the general unease must be awful to deal with.

Plenty of folk saying they would confront burglars... very easy to say whilst your sat at a keyboard.

A large, 4 cell maglite is another matter.

I think it would all depend on the circumstances. Multiple guys in your house armed with hammers....pretty sure it would understandable you grabbed a golf bat or kitchen knife to protect yourself / family. After all how are you to know they are just there to steal a bike? Not like they ask permission.

If you smack them over the head as they run away....that is a different matter.

I was told by the pc career crims rarely carry stuff to break in as they will be known and risk being picked up for going equipped. Quite easy to find a tool or big rock in someone's back garden.

They might have also said a few broken bones, let's say a broken arm would be considered reasonable defence when being attacked by 2 guys with hammers...

From a Copper mate, try not to get involved but if you must, hit them once with whatever you have to hand (oh I was putting a picture hook up and hadn't put tools away) hit them very hard so they don't get up.

Oh they got in, I was woken up, naked, mrs and kids to protect so I grabbed what's to hand.

Not sure what I'd do but I don't think I could let what I've worked hard for be "liberated" by some scrote.

Interestingly I remember listening to a SA Copper on the radio dryly commenting about how after the law regarding shooting people on your property changed with reference to the perps either having to be a danger or nicking something and the number of bodies that they were being called to with a bloody great bullet hole through the torso and a pristine TV set in the corpse's arms!

Ming the Merciless

From a Copper mate, try not to get involved but if you must, hit them once with whatever you have to hand (oh I was putting a picture hook up and hadn't put tools away) hit them very hard so they don't get up.

Seriously? God I dunno but that (along with all the maglite talk) sounds like a way to end up on trial for manslaughter. Or indeed having the maglite/hammer/bat taken from you and being beaten to death with it.

Well, you never know what you're going to do in the heat of the moment. In Barcelona, a pair of thieves targeted us, one distracted us, whilst the other took my bag and made off on a bike. Someone alerted me (I had no idea, the distraction tequnique really works!) - before I knew it, I don't think it was a conscious decision, I was sprinting after the guy. I caught up grabbed my bag, gave an almighty heave, sent him sprawling, and retrieved my bag.

[url=

basement-garage needs one of these[/url]

Something the keyboard action heroes always forget is even if you fly downstairs in your M&S pyjamas holding a cricket bat or maglite, there could be 5 or 6 blokes with knives staring at you.

The other thing is they will know where you live and even if you did get a few good swings in with your weapon of choice, they will either escape or be released from jail at some point. I'd rather not have somebody out to settle a score with me or my family while we sleep in our beds.

Hope the insurance pays out OP, good luck.