I think there's the bigger picture too.
TDF 2025, Pog goes on the attack and Vingo looks at Kuss, "can't mate, i got nothing" says Kuss.
Why would you... why would you go all in for the bloke who didn't help you when you needed it.
Id like Kuss to win it, but think its unlikely.
Sepp has stated that he wants this, but in a previous interview he said he wants to just do his thing in the shadows.
https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sepp-kuss-clings-onto-vuelta-a-espana-lead-i-want-my-shot/
Jumbo is full of 'superstars', however after watching the Netflix episode with Jumbo and Wout Van Aert basically got told in not so uncertain terms that he was a super domestique/a helper and not get ideas above his station (paraphrased) when he went off on last years TdF.
JV and PR are the defacto leaders, do they need another one? Likely not. After yesterday, and preceeding days, JV and PR have shown they are the superior riders.
The Jumbo management dont care, they get the Vuelta win. I think they have genuinely said to Kuss - suck it up buttercup - you want it you have to get it. If PR or JV get it they just supercharge their superstar status..... if Kuss gets it, then they 'lose' a domestique (they may do anyway next year) and change team dynamics
For all the stick and hate that Vingo is getting are we really saying that if Remco or Pog were 8 seconds down on a Grand Tour win they'd just suck it up and roll in?
For all the stick and hate that Vingo is getting are we really saying that if Remco or Pog were 8 seconds down on a Grand Tour win they’d just suck it up and roll in?
He should never have got to 8s 😀 This is his wingman, the man who's dragged him up every hill on the planet, pulled back break after break without disucssion, he's dragged his arse up and around stage after stage time and time and time again. Every Tour, every race, when you need a many in the hills, it's Kuss.... he's there.
So you turn him over and beat him to the only victory he's ever likely to get LOL....
‘It’s only the Vuelta’…wow?!?
‘Yeah, don’t worry, its only the US Open, not Wimbledon…’.
"historic sporting gesture"
For all the stick and hate that Vingo is getting are we really saying that if Remco or Pog were 8 seconds down on a Grand Tour win they’d just suck it up and roll in?
Are we 8 seconds behind Sepp or a fictional teammate in a situation where no other team are likely to be able to challenge.
If this was the first or second week of a race it'd be totally different.
Amidst the hyperbole surrounding Sepp Kuss and his teammates effrontery in racing, something forgotten seems to be the clear message that Remco is not a grand tour rider (yet, at least), and the idea that he only didn’t win the Giro cos he was poorly now looks a bit fanciful.
Amidst the hyperbole surrounding Sepp Kuss and his teammates effrontery in racing, something forgotten seems to be the clear message that Remco is not a grand tour rider (yet, at least), and the idea that he only didn’t win the Giro cos he was poorly now looks a bit fanciful.
I've never thought he was/is... in the same way WvA isn't either.. That's not a criticism, it's just a reality of how they're made.
Historic victory :0)
Historic victory :0)
yeah I overstated that :-). More realistically, not in the same level as Vingegaard, Pog et al.
yeah I overstated that :-). More realistically, not in the same level as Vingegaard, Pog et al.
You mean the guy wearing #1 🙂 Get your point comparing to Vingo, although you could say Remco and Pog are similar.
Entertaining though based on today, but I wish he'd stop for Poole, my vg team needs him to score some points!
Sean Kelly really does just need rolling off into retirement. It's terrible listening to him now. Not quite at the stage that Phil Liggett got to but close...
Roglic and Vingegaard are being dutiful teammates today.
Sean Kelly really does just need rolling off into retirement
He is a one man cure for insomnia
Well yes.
Someone has had some words with them - Vingegaard sat up a few metres before the line and conceded a few seconds to Kuss.
That should be enough for Kuss to win, there's little else in the way of GC stages. Tomorrow is a sprint stage, Saturday is very lumpy but not mountainous - potentially a day for a breakaway to just be left to it. And then Sunday is a procession into Madrid, a Vuelta equivalent of the Paris stage of the Tour.
so will it now be Jonas looking for pastures new ?
Tricky ain't it, who'd leave and go where... I think Kuss must fancy a try on his own team maybe one day, maybe EF Education as a leader for them, or possibly Groupama... Can't really see where else he'd fit... Unless INEOS actually want to win something one day soon 😀
Is there a problem with the forum? I can’t see all the posts saying what a good thing JV did today 😂😂🐈
so will it now be Jonas looking for pastures new ?
More likely to be Rogla if anyone? Today fits pretty well with the Danish mentality, and Jonas has a very clear right to be considered leader for 2024 TdF. Roglic wants a shot at it but has a less clear case to be JV leader.
Felt quite bizarre watching today's stage. What should be a GC bike race just felt like a scripted WWE match to guarantee a fairy tale ending.
so will it now be Jonas looking for pastures new ?
I thought he was contracted with Jumbo Visma until about 2027 or 2028?!
Question is where any of them would go. They've got a superteam at the moment, able to turn up to 2 races simultaneously (Vuelta and Tour of Britain) and win them both. In the case of Vuelta, there's no-one else within 3' of the top 3 who are all Jumbo Visma!
There's a separate question of whether that stifles the racing for the podium but in the past the reason for riders moving on is that you tend to get a "nearly leader" who wants to move out of the shadow of the "actual leader" and get a shot at their own GC glory. It doesn't always work out of course but in Jumbo Visma, you've got 3 guys on the podium who between them have now won a Grand Tour each this year so there's not really any need for any of them to go elsewhere.
I think Kuss must fancy a try on his own team maybe one day, maybe?
we went through similar at Sky with Landa, was nose breathing while gc leaders on other teams were dying, not really worked for him
... there’s not really any need for any of them to go elsewhere.
From a rider perspective. I wonder what the team make of it. They potentially have another grand tour winner, which they'll be expected to pay, and treat like a grand tour winner... They already have 3 megastar riders. How big is their budget?
Part of me wonders if that has influenced their tactics.
TdF 2024 looks interesting, if Roger and Vingegaard both turn up...
What we need is Poggy, Roggy, Vingey and Remco at the Tour. Then Sepp takes yellow on a windy stage 15....
Felt quite bizarre watching today’s stage. What should be a GC bike race just felt like a scripted WWE match to guarantee a fairy tale ending.
Team sport vs. individual sport. It's like a football team winning the world cup but only the top scorer gets his name on the trophy. Can you imagine the shenanigans that would occur on the pitch? 😂
so will it now be Jonas looking for pastures new ?
Why would he do that? he's just shown everyone (and perhaps more importantly; Sepp Kuss in particular) that he's the best rider in the world right now. He could of very easily danced off into the distance, but instead has pretty much been the perfect team mate - when it made a difference. And despite Kuss saying he wanted to earn the win all by himself, he knows, along with everyone else, what just happened.
so will it now be Jonas looking for pastures new ?
Not a chance. Strongest team for the hardest race next year. Rog was robbed by Pog, so obviously wants his chance again, and the two riding do serve as insurance. But it's Rog that will be looking elsewhere for TdF GC ambition. You don't lose a two times tour winner. Sepp can now continue to serve loyally, increase his salary, retire whenever, live off being a GC winner and not need to be in the limelight like the others.
Three different winners of the three Grand Tours from the same team is a cycling milestone. Same rider winning two? Meh.
Hard agree to the above.
Why would he do that?
he’s just shown everyone (and perhaps more importantly; Sepp Kuss in particular) that he’s the best rider in the world right now.
He could of very easily danced off into the distance
why wouldn't he ? road cycling greatness is measured in grand tour wins (and this sort of thing matters to ultra competitive types that win these things) and his current team has told him to take a dive.
anyway the point is probably moot for contractual reasons 🙂
I think it festered with Froome (going by how his mrs bitched about it 😉 ) for years though he was made the team no1 the next years so he stayed.
And despite Kuss saying he wanted to earn the win all by himself, he knows, along with everyone else, what just happened.
So much this. I really like Kuss (with the caveat mentioned above, that I have no real idea what he’s like) but with the best will in the world this win (if it happens) do not put him in team leader bracket.
Felt sorry for Ganna.... he just died..(not literally)
Felt sorry for Ganna too, not many that could sustain a sprint over the distance he did! Hate to see what his power numbers were... probably more than i can sustain for 5 seconds
I'm not hugely into the road side of things, but... the Angliru. Respect is due.
Congratulations sep kuss. i can’t wait to see him serve either Rog or Vingo in the next grand tours. He'll be worth two team mates at least. Not a jv fan, but chapeau. what a precedent to set!
Is ganna a sprinter now then?
Congratulations Sep Kuss, a worthy winner.
Sad the Grand Tour season has finished.
As a huge 'G' fan it's been sad to see him struggle in this, his last 'big race'. This was not his finest Grand tour but he's still a great rider and I wish him all the best for the future.
Edit: Congratulations HIGGO, you came 41st out of 18,885 in STW velogames. I was last :O)
Is ganna a sprinter now then?
There's a surprising amount of crossover between good TT/pursuit riders and sprinters, especially since the 4km team pursuit on the track more or less went from being an endurance event to being a sprint.
It's very similar to a sprint leadout - that ability to sit there and just wind it up and up.
Remarkable from Jumbo-Visma though, not sure any other team has ever done that - all three GT in a single year with three different riders.
Delighted to see Sepp Kuss win. I've always likened him to Barry from Mogwai - whenever he sticks on a guitar and walks to the front of the stage you know you're going to get your face melted off. Likewise whenever Kuss makes an appearance on a mountain stage.
Kudos to Jumbo Visma as well - I was getting a bit fatigued by all of the excellent racing this season. In stepped JV to make the race interesting in a new and completely unexpected way!
Is ganna a sprinter now then?
well, apparently not 😂. And nor is Remco. Groves, though, what an acceleration and what timing !!
Photo that would make their DS well up with tears, and probably has every other DS scratching their collective heads
Strange one for me, great to see Kuss win, as he seems a genuinely nice guy, but the teams dominance seems to show that they are going to dominate for a few years yet. Whilst Remco is a fantastic individual he just does not have the strength of GC team around him, he was left exposed so many times by his team.