So despite this other woman you are still in a happy relationship and it hasn't been prompted by a there being "something missing" in your marriage?
Understand the strong feelings... but does sound like that early honeymoon period you get with most new relationships. Very easy for that to cloud your judgement. Know people who go from new relationship to new relationship as that initial period of infatuation wears off. Unfortunately i suspect a period of separation from this new woman is only likely to make those feeling stronger, especially if you still end up seeing this woman out and about regularly (guessing she is a work colleague.)
Zokes, Tazzy, regarding your test about thinking of my wife falling for another. It doesn't really evoke any massively strong feelings other than a generalised fear of how it would affect the kids lives and a feeling of what a waste. Very similar to how I feel when I consider the nuclear option myself, really.
That then, is a very big problem, and one you both clearly need to work on to resolve one way or the other.
However, don't mistake lust for love with this other lady. You probably felt exactly the same about your wife when you first met her. Leaving your wife may well be the single biggest decision you make in your personal life, especially as both staying in or leaving 'a loveless relationship' with the mother of your children will have consequences for people who utterly depend on you.
It may be that six months, one year, you still feel that you can't resolve your relationship with your wife, and that it's better for everyone concerned if it's ended. But right now, were you to make that decision, you'd be doing it for the wrong reasons, and with clouded judgement.
Its not gone too far yet so walk away. Don't see her. It will take 6-12 painful months to get over her. And then you will realise how much you love your wife. And you won't regret it for the rest of your life.
stur - Member
Far to many people can't stand to be alone these days and as a result will shack up and settle down with anyone. I found a girl like your describing and consider myself the luckiest man alive. But I would bet a lot of the "MTFU" or "grow up" advisers on here are the same guys that have to get permission to ride their £3k bikes once in a blue moon, between ferrying the kids around, being generally bitch whipped and eyeing up younger women in the supermarket. I bet if you sat with these same guys while they where drawing there last breaths, they would tell you different. It's your life pal, not the wifes, not the kids.. yours. Sounds selfish but its a fact. If you feel this way about this woman go for it. But also be prepared to ride the shit storm that WILL follow.
Dont want to play the devils advocate here, but this response is very real.
This video for you OP and goodluck! .. Whats worth the price is always worth the fight 🙂
FFS try the goodies first!
She might have a fanjita like dr evils underground lair.
FFS try the goodies first!
She might have a fanjita like dr evils underground lair.
😐
Stay married and make her your Mistress.
it's just a temporary infatuation you are seeing the 'grass is greener..'
aka...
Have a tommy tank to get it out of your system and then realise it's not based on anything solid
Your a dad, end of. Once you have children what you want is always second. Don't be a dick and stop thinking about yourself.
People aren't reading the OPs subsequent posts. He has never expressed any intention of leaving his wife and kids. OP, Only time will tell. But your plan on the last page looks like a good start. Try to do the right thing, and avoid doing anything that you know is wrong, because its those actions that will poison any future relationship, no matter which way you end up going...
Some thoughts which may or may not apply....
A lot of men I know seem to turn into childish little tits when they have kids. "I don't get any attention.." blah blah. Get involved with your kids lives ffs, in a few years time they'll be offski with only what they have learned(yes from dickheads like you) to arm themselves against the world.
The post about your missus finding her own mr incredible was a good one. Maybe shes not too bothered about you cos she already has? Yep suck it up ,roll it around, how you feeling fella?
Don't put this woman on the back burner, that always leaves you with a safety net, and will cause your marriage to fail. Tell her its over.
Spend the next year or so trying to make a go of it. Tell your wife she HAS to go to relate with you cos you're ready to walk.(FFS don't mention the other woman BIG mistake)
If it doesn't work, get your self the hell out of there. Build a new life. Stay involved with your kids. fight for that right if you have to.
To the people holding grudges for stuff done in the past, you probably either weren't old enough or weren't there to hear and see the full story, there's always two sides. Grow up. Set your kids an example. Be bigger than they were. Life REALLY IS too short for that shit.
Good luck op.
Remember to tell your kids you love them
Two things to say.
1. Agree with the woman to stay away from each other for a few months and see how you feel then. You might decide you've just avoided the biggest mistake ever or you might know you really are right for each other.
2. This is my 2nd favourite kind of thread. The best ones are neighbour and in-law disputes.
She has herpes O.P.
Go and romance your wife and play footy with the kids - you chose this life.
I know nothing about relationships, but bear with me - you both have partners you love, both have kids you adore, but you have a connection and love to talk, without anything sexual?
Isn't that the definition of a good friendship?
People aren't reading the OPs subsequent posts
Dam straight , we've not got time to read 5 pages of the OP back tracking and changing his mind. I'm a dad, I'm busy.
He met somebody he has clicked with and is thinking he wants to change life A for life B, life A has his children in it. he wanted advise on coping with it, therefore stop think of yourself, your a dad, end of. Grab yourself a hand full of tissue and go think about her on your own, we're you not hurting the people your supposed to protecting.
I realise I may be oversimplifying the situation, but I'm not a big fan of parents who don't put the children first.
Well done you, johnkgriff, for firmly toeing the line, and stating the obvious. Except;
...I know I can't split my family up for the sake of my own selfish needs. I wouldn't even ask her to split hers up. For what it's worth we have both said that we wouldn't think twice if it weren't for the children. But they put a very different slant on things.
From the actual first post, this doesn't a fault sound like someone who is not (at least trying) to put his kids first.
If he's not thinking about it, what's the point of th original post
"I've met somebody nice, i think id like to be friends", I meet nice people all the time and don't come on STW asking if I should be their friend.......
Also, I'm not toeing anyone's line.
To be honest not much on here gets me involved, but I've had a couple of mate come to me over the years with this kind of line and it is more often than not a preamble to - I'm leaving my wife (and possibly children) for X or Y cos she really gets me 🙄
OP, is her name Emily Green?
Is the OP a carefully planted Mumsnet troll..
Brilliant if so.. 😉
To be fair you only live once.
Why be miserable?
One of my friends has dumped his wife and kids for his own selfish needs. He's rich and doesn't give a dam and he's much happier until he gets lonely. His teen kids are messed up from it and his wife suicidal.
Why are you married to a woman you don't love? Does she love you? Relationship counselling?
stay married and make her your mistress
Otherwise known as the 'French Option' 😆
Dam straight , we've not got time to read 5 pages of the OP back tracking and changing his mind. I'm a dad, I'm busy.
You could have put in [i]some[/i] effort in though.
At least read the first post on page one and comment on that, rather than what you imagine it might have said.
but I'm not a big fan of parents who don't put the children first.
so you put the kids first, stay together and the children get brought up in a household with simmering resentment? that is far more damaging than a well managed separation where the children know they are loved. Far too many people leave it too long to point of catastrophic failure when the kids will get royally screwed up.
From personal experience I've just separated from a 19 year relationship (12 years married) , no one else involved, we just work better and are happier apart as we have become such very different people. My son knows he is loved, spends time with both parents and I've even signed over the house and lost about 80k in equity to ensure that the family keep the home so that there is minimal disruption to my sons life. If she finds someone else that can make her happy then that's brilliant, she's a top lass, we just drive each other mad and make each other sad when we were together. Staying together for the sake of my son or because it was financially convenient was a no brainer as we spent so much time trying to be apart form each other and he was picking up on the vibes despite our best efforts to put a happy face on things. I'm sure there are loads on here who will condemn me for being less of man etc... but you know what...bollocks to you...everyone's life is different and the only solution is to be honest about yourself, look at the situation honestly and sometimes leaving is the harder choice but the better way for some.
excuse you for bumping into and actually finding true love...
if she goes through with the marriage you will know that she doesn't feel the same...so you'll have to forget about it...
i would sit tight, and say nothing....
if she doesn't get married, you've got a decision to make..
good luck
My mum and dad split after 24 years my dad worked away and ended up cheating on my mum with someone else they used to argue allot when he was at home etc etc but even tohough my dad worked away them splitting up had a massive impact on my two brothers and me (them more so) things got much harder when my dad re married, my mother didnt cope very well looking after three angry young men which esentualy ruined her, my two brothers have both had very seriouse mental health problems as a result and have both attempted suicide at some point (the elder being far worse) so for me if you marry someone and (decide) to have kids you owe to them if possible to see them through to adulthood at least?
OP - you're clearly in a 'vulnerable' (hate that word) state of mind and place right now.
Firstly you need to sort out your marriage and get counselling. You need to be able to look both yourself, your wife and your kids, in the eye and say 'I have tried my darn hardest'.
Secondly, put some distance between yourself and this 'incredible woman'. You need a clear head, for the sake of your kids too.
FWIW I do agree with tazzy's comments and feel that he's very brave in going against the consensus on here. He speaks sense and, actually, have some experience of this myself. BUT very much a last resort.
Isn't that the definition of a good friendship?
Do your partners both know all about this? If so, it might be a [b]good friendship[/b]. If not, it's probably an [b]emotional affair[/b].
emotional affair.
Is that still classed as cheating ?
(Genuine question)
In a Legal (grounds for divorce) sense
Or in a "Moral" sense.
Errmm, I'm not an expert, but . . .
I think the law changed in the 1970s, so that adultery in itself was no longer a sufficient ground for divorce. Nowadays, the spouse also has to find it intolerable to live with the cheating spouse.
The more common ground is "unreasonable behaviour", and I guess an EA could fall into this category. And often it is just the early stages of a physical affair.
But enough of this dreary talk - the OP is sorting out his marriage, isn't he?
"brought up in a household with simmering resentment"
Bit of a distinction: ^ usually is when ones betrayed the other and they stay together to work it out for the sake of the kids.
Wheres the simmering resentment if neither cheated?
See.
Wheres the simmering resentment if neither cheated?
trapped in a loveless marriage, knowing that you are together purely for the sake of kids, no physical connection or contact, more displacement behaviour than you can shake an entire man cave worth of bikes at,knowing that you are seen as purely a source of financial security, no willingness to go to relate, nope can't see any reason for resentment in those sorts of situations at all hora..it's all just black and white isn't it? 🙄
So you got hurt, and then married someone safe. Years down the line you've recovered. Your wife's a really nice person, nothing wrong with her, but there's no zing. Plus, children take up lots of time, money and energy. You're both tired.
Sex takes a back seat. A man's sex drive (or so it seems to me) is diminished by... um, nothing, a woman's sex drive is diminished by: feeling bloated, feeling fat, dirty dishes, untidy house, worrying about the rabbit/gerbil/hamster, something on tv, problems with in-laws, parents, children, school, bills, mate having better clothes, next door's car, the weather (I'm allowed to say this, I'm a woman), where to go on holiday, worrying about getting pregnant again, messy sheets - oh, the list is endless.
I don't think you have met the most incredible woman in the world. I do think you've realised that something is missing though, and it's been a useful wake-up call.
Can you get away by yourself for a weekend? (Do not invite Ms Incredible). Have you got a tent maybe? Take your bike and get away, do some riding, and some thinking. Come back and have a word with your wife, she may not be happy either. Time for some straight talking.
Whatever the **** else you do, don't stay together for your children. Children always know when something is wrong, they pick up on the sniping and jibes. It's a terrible example for them and a horrible atmosphere too.
Good luck!
I think tazzy writes a lot of sense. If the unhappiness comes through at home that can be bad for children. From memory I think most of a child's adult behaviour style is determined by 5 ( in terms of insecure, confident etc).
Tazzymtb its called never take the other person for granted.
If you become idle etc ANY new relationship will go the same trudgery.
22yrs here.
Karonine (f) friend was saying that her boyfriend is literally a machine. Wants it all the time/even when ill. I laughed and said 'typical healthy bloke'!!
Tazzymtb its called never take the other person for granted.
OMG I never thought of that!
can I live in your world please? does it have unicorns and clouds made of candy-floss?
hora LOL - ex-boyfriend wanted loads of attention when ill: I HATE anyone being around me when I'm ill. Leave me alone to be ill in peace! 🙂
trapped in a loveless marriage, knowing that you are together purely for the sake of kids, no physical connection or contact, more displacement behaviour than you can shake an entire man cave worth of bikes at,knowing that you are seen as purely a source of financial security, no willingness to go to relate, nope can't see any reason for resentment in those sorts of situations at all hora..it's all just black and white isn't it?
I think this is miles away from the original post, this doesn't sound anything like the marriage he has. I do kind of see what you mean about somebody who is just using you, but if you want to take the discussion I'd say you chose to have children with that type of person, but your children didn't chose either of you as their parents.its something you should have put a bit more thought into before going down that road.
Unfortunatly I am in a world were things haven't gone to plan and life/relationships come under the kind of pressure that most marriages don't come up against and all to often blokes (mostly but not completely) cut and run, cos they never really thought about how strong things were before they started a family.
Nealglover, think I made myself clear in the second post - put some effort in.
So many people that I would like to reply to; Sorry if I miss one but I appreciate everyone's input (Even Horas... 😉 ).
So many people are assuming that this is a physical crush, infatuation thing, and that a w%$k will go a long way to solving my problems. Cheers, but thats not really it; I fancy/am sexually attracted to women all the time, (I am a bloke after all) and I can handle that perfectly well. As corny as it may sound, this is a higher plane of connection. That is what has completely thrown me. (Not that I don't fancy the arse off her, I do, but I could easily deal with it if it just that...)
johnikgriff - Member If he's not thinking about it, what's the point of th original post
OK, of course I'm thinking about it; I'd be lying if I tried to say I haven't daydreamed a million possible scenarios to see how it could work. But, importantly, I'd like to be clear here, I have also almost completely dismissed it as pie in the sky, can never happen, stuff. What doubts I do have are based around the same kind of thinking as Tazzy's points; ie, is it [i]really[/i] better for the kids if I hang around, when neither of us want to be together, really. BUT. We are not at that stage at the moment, and if I buck my ideas up, and if my wife bucks hers up too, maybe this can be fixed. And I owe it to my wife and family to try my damned hardest. The point of my original post wasn't really 'help me to feel better about maybe walking out' as much as 'help me figure out a way to move forward, because I've stupidly allowed myself to get into an excruciatingly painful situation of entirely my own devising and I can't find the exit'. And I've recieved a lot of good (and some frankly shoddy :lol:) advice in that regard, thank you.
eggshellblonde, cinnamon_girl, Karinofnine, a very special thanks. a reasoned, level headed response from women is greatly appreciated. Some of your thoughts were bang on, some less so. It really ISN'T the sex side of things, its the emotional side of stuff that I've been missing out on, but i guess most of the principles still apply. (except I'm not quite sure how to have the emotional equivelent of tommy tank; ummm, charidee work maybe? lol. dunno).
Anyway, thanks all. Hora, you're a lovely, simple bloke, aren't you? 😉 (and I'm told you have a staggeringly beautiful phallus, so I suppose everything balances out in the end...)
Stay married and make her your Mistress.
Depends how good you are at compartmentalising... Exploring a new relationship will be good for you and in turn good for the energy you share with your kids.
I've only read bits of this thread so I'm going to contribute my own experience and it may be totally irrelevant. But this is STW and I must be heard!
My parents stayed together for my sake until after I'd left uni. At times it was amusing how much they clearly hated each other but mostly it was just an unpleasant environment to grow up in. Looking back it's clearly had a fairly large hand in making me the misanthrope I am today. Of course, they never asked me, but I think I could see the relationship was broken long before either of them could. I don't remember them ever being happy as such, but it definitely got worse slowly over many years. I don't know if it may have started out like the OP? Certainly I have subsequently heard bitter accusations of cheating, but to be frank I really don't care about that. If one of my parents cheated, it wasn't on me, it was on their spouse.
I guess what that boils down to is don't stay together "for the kids", stay together because it's what both of you want. Or don't. But leave the new woman out of the equation, you either want to stay married or you don't.
Unknown, Thank you for that perspective, it is not often heard.
I was thinking about this while out with the dogs.
It could be that your wife's unhelpful remarks could mean that SHE wants out, but doesn't quite know how to start that conversation. So maybe you are going to have to be the one to start it.
I'm sure Ms Incredible does make you feel amazing, I know that feeling, those snatched moments, the unity of the misunderstood - it's intoxicating, better than Class A. I really do understand BUT if it IS love she will wait. If you just **** off with the new woman, it will feel great for a while (and it may very well last) but any left over shit will taint your new relationship.
What has to happen here is that, years into the future, you can look back on this and see that you did the right thing - for everyone - and that includes [b]you[/b]. So you need to do some thinking, and then some talking, and some more talking, until you sort this out.
If you split up, in the future your children will accept new partners, but not now.
Try to engineer some space for you and your wife to have that chat, be brave, and honest, listen to what she has to say.
Let us know how you get on.
to re-hash a few earlier posts (I should have noted who they were- it's taken so long to get through the thread) with my own experiences:
i've refused to have anything to do with my dad since 98/99ish, and will never see him. By association I've cut off his side of the family (they'd tell him where i lived/when i was coming around), and I miss my cousins, and my grandma's not got many years left - it's a {sweary} odd feeling deciding that you won't go to the funerals of these people.
I think, but obviously can't know, that had my dad had some dignity about the whole thing it'd have been an option to keep in touch. instead, my mum knew he was having an affair for a year before he left (he took her to a restaurant to break the news so she wouldn't make a scene), i knew a few months before the split (always remember there's nowhere in the house you can talk that the kids don't know how to eavesdrop on), when he announced he was leaving he showed us (little sister and i) a photo of his new girl-friend, then asked for a hug. I'll never forgive myself for not taking a swing at him at that point. in the next few months he came back and left again twice - trying it all for size. the ****
I was 17 at the time, and we'd not got on for years, so it didn't directly effect me much (my group of friends all had similar home lives so we never went home till the pubs shut), but my 13 yr old sister slept with mum for the next year. i despise him for the mess he made of my sister and how he walked over mum.
Nonetheless, i understand why he acted like he did - he's a coward. I'm the same, i see so much of him in the things i do, we only differ in that i don't forgive, or ask forgiveness (that sounds more preachy than i mean it to). resultantly, i've never wanted kids as i know what kind of father i'd be, and i've been celibate these last 5 years as i inevitably act a ****, and it's not fair on anyone involved. (he complained to mum a few years ago that if my cousins had forgiven his brother's (simultaneous) affair, why hadn't i forgiven his)
oh, plus: a workmate when i was at university offered me the pearl of wisdom about the in-a-relationship young lady i was courting "if she's sucking you off while she's got a boyfriend, what do you thing she'll do when you're going out with her?" - he was bang on. (you can subby this for declaring love/ emotional affairing - that stuff doesn't sting much less i imagine)
in summary - however the marriage pans out, don't treat the kids like fools. they'll know, and resent you for it.
I think that shows more than anything children's feelings really do matter and disregarding them can cause years of pain. However the harm can happen if parents stay together or split - it all comes down to how it's handled.
I think I am with tazzy in that I feel it is best not to stay where you are if you aren't happy, but I know many who do and I don't see that as wrong - just not for me. I guess I might say life it too short where as friends in that situation would argue childhood is very short so they are prepared to sit it out.
Years ago I got into a similar situation. I was in a bad relationship and got a lot of support from a male friend who was similarly despondent with his. Initially it was just about having someone to talk to but things developed and we ended up having an affair. I split with my partner and after quite a while he said he was going to leave his wife.
I loved him and did dream about being together but in my heart I knew for him it was just a case of the grass being greener. I had left my partner as I knew it would never work whereas he was only going because I was there. I knew if I wasn't in the equation he would stay where he was.
When I told him I only wanted him to leave his wife if he didn't want to be with her not because he wanted to be with me - it didn't go down too well, we saw each other for a while afterwards but it eventually stopped. I moved away and missed him, thought of him often but knew I did the right thing for them.
Strangely I was back driving through the village last weekend and noticed the time, I remembered it as the time he would always walk to the pub for a beer after football - and as I went round the corner there he was! 20 years on doing the same thing, obviously happy with his chosen corner of the world and life he has. I am very happy I didnt spoil their family life.
My dreams really dont involve living in the same village forever, I would have probably been a nightmare for him in reality and then would have then got the blame from all angles for wrecking what he had. Sometimes it is better to know you love someone and think the world of them enough to let them live the life they need.
I guess all I can really say is do what is right for you - but you will have to let the other lady decide what is right for her. If you truly cant stay where you are you will know and that should be about just you and your wife and no-one else.
Ps and if you children are below 5 - I would wait before making any monumental decisions until you have slept properly and got over the early years madness.
wununeredandeighty!
