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Can you identify the exact first point and everyones position on it and the criteria for right and wrong. You do have a habit of trying to twist everything after all.... Still not commenting on if sessions needs sacking for misleading us congress I see.
criteria for right and wrong.
Whoops, looks like we are back on the moral arguments
I refer you once again to buggery, abortion and religious slaughter - Morality is in the eye of the beholder.
Not at all, just your usual criteria for deciding what you actually said
[quote=ninfan ]@Lebowski
The previous page contained such coherent arguments against hunting as:
If people want to dress like arseholes and have jolly japes around the countryside on their horses...
Upper class twits prancing round the countryside like dicks...
The red coats, horses and hounds, horns echoing,..
Well getting dressed up and charging across the landscape on horseback with your mates is important ..
Which sit in the factual bracket of how mountain bikers should be banned because they all wear day glow Lycra and run over ramblers - people making these arguments are only revealing their own ignorance, shed loads of hunts out there that have nothing to do with horses (and that the burns inquiry accepted were an effective form of control too) - I've hunted with hounds loads of times, Never been a horse there.
You do realise the horse bit isn't the issue?
It's the ritual torture and slaughter of a random wild animal.
The "hunters" could be riding penny farthings for all that aspect matters.
But still, you keep trolling away. It's an admirable way to make a living.
Ah I see we are into the standard ninfan approach of pedantry and whataboutism.
I pointed out hunting had nothing to do with people being on horses
Yes you did.
And I pointed you to the "Introduction to Fox Hunting for Kids" booklet from the Countryside Alliance (those infamous town-dwelling lefties) which is inconveniently full of pictures of people on horses.
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Does that booklet prepare them for being daubed with the blood of the fox on their first hunt (when it dies by something other than being ripped apart by hounds)?
You do realise the horse bit isn't the issue?It's the ritual torture and slaughter of a random wild animal.
So why are there so many posters ranting on about toffs on horses?
Makes you think that it's really got nothing to do with animal welfare, and it's really all driven by childish leftie 'class war' tactics
Like it always was
So why are there so many posters ranting on about toffs on horses?
I didn't rant about toffs on horses.
Does that booklet prepare them for being daubed with the blood of the fox on their first hunt
No but it does have a handy section explaining to children why the ban on fox hunting is wrong.
[b]Why did the Government bring it in?[/b]
• Some people do not understand how a hunt works and why it is needed
• Hunting was wrongly thought of as a ‘posh’ activity and some MPs saw banning it as part of a ‘class war’
• Some people see hunting as a cruel sport
• Some politicians thought that a hunting ban would get more support[b]What are the problems with the Act?[/b]
• It is confusing, for example it is legal to hunt a rabbit with dogs but illegal to hunt a hare
• It is difficult to police and wastes valuable police and court time
• It does not protect the fox from suffering and under the Act, more foxes are in fact be being killed
• It makes it difficult for farmers to protect their livestock
• It is class war and creates a divide between country and city people
• It bans a valuable wildlife management process
Oh and a word search.
Horses are more photogenic than blokes on foot on a Yorkshire moor,
Hunting supports employment and maintains country skills
So why are there so many posters ranting on about toffs on horses?
I havent mentioned toffs on horses
I just think its unnecessarily cruel
has anyone mentioned toffs? - I think its all in your head ninfan, the only people chucking insults about are you (though 'townie dwelling leftie' is only an insult from your perspective)
tbf I did compare jamba to Alan Partridge for his 'usual fox behaviour' comment 🙂
Tory toffs on horses gets ninfan aroused.
Makes you think that it's really got nothing to do with animal welfare, and it's really all driven by childish leftie 'class war' tactics
Well it may make you think that but that is because you put anybody that cares about anything other than themselves down as a leftie.
I hope the hunting debate rolls on and on as it might just remind the general public exactly where tory priorities lie.
So where was Anthony Wedgwood Benn on this scale then, an actual titled Toff, and a leftie..
One could almost conclude that May wants and is trying her damnedest to throw this election?
So the woman who once accurately described the Tory party as the 'Nasty Party', as that is how they are perceived, now proposes her support for having posh people chase a defenceless animal around, then get their dogs to tear it apart.
I suppose it could go down as a sort of reverse epiphany 😆
I want to know whats in the kids fox hunting wordsearch!
One could almost conclude that May wants and is trying her damnedest to throw this election?
That thought occurred to me as well.
Perhaps the solution is to put it to a referendum?
I suspect the result would be rather more decisive than Brexit.
Will of the people and all that eh?
why...
• Some people do not understand how a hunt works and why it is needed
wrong...
• It does not protect the fox from suffering and under the Act, more foxes are in fact be being killed
So hunting's needed to keep fox numbers down? But under the act, more foxes are being killed?
Difficult to see who's got an issue with the ban? Other than the people who just enjoy it.
Or is the issue that the wrong foxes being killed? The nice ones, not the nasty ones? How does a hunt decide which is which?
Don't be facile, Graham, it's far too complex a subject to expect the general public to grasp sufficiently well to make an informed decision.
No charges over election expenses (imo sa expected, simple issue of classification / which box to pur a number in)
Que endless ranting from never-Tory voters
One way to change the subject from fox hunting anyway 🙂
Perhaps the solution is to put it to a referendum?
I'd support that, I also suspect it would be a clear no. As I have said before I like the Swiss Referendum system
Great news - [s]got away with it[/s] [i]The Crown Prosecution Service said it had examined files from 14 police forces and while there was evidence of inaccurate spending returns it did not "meet the test" for further action.[/i]
"meet the test"
The test being that you need proof of motive… breaking the rules isn't enough, it needs to be shown to be provably deliberate. Claims of ingorance of the law is a valid defence here, unlike most laws. You can be fined, but not via CPS/courts… they can't touch you unless you're on record as planning to break the rules, basically,
That's the Tory CPS for you.
Oh look big election campaign battle buses ... 😀
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Do you like big buses? 😛
I like! 😆
CPS still looking into Thanet, and you'd assume they'll have to be more careful this time?
and maintains country skills
Such as ripping foxes apart.
Anyway it's gone beyond fox hunting. It's all about putting the bins out now.
The Crown Prosecution Service said it had examined files from 14 police forces and while there was evidence of inaccurate spending returns it did not "meet the test" for further action.
Don't want to upset their paymaster's do they.
Who'd have thunk it? The CPS don't want to upset the boss.
And obviously the message it sends now is "Forget the rules! They don't apply! Just do what the hell you like!"
I'm sure Sir Lynton has received it loud and clear
Who'd have thunk it? The CPS don't want to upset the boss.
Tad unfair.
There wasnt enough evidence to show individual candidates/agents deliberately broke the law. Part of the reason for that was central office told them it was okay.
It was always going to be hard to prove unless the police had found an email or something saying "yes the battlebus should be local spending but lets stick it in national to keep under the limit".
That the fox vote gone then..
http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/environment/foxes-regret-voting-tory-20150709100002
ninfan - Member
round here there is/was a mounted hunt
Ah, 'round here'Right
Thanks for proving my point
@mrlebowski - but you live in a town now, right?
What was your point? Because I'm buggered if I can see how that proves what you wrote.
I suspect you just firing posts off randomly.
Anyway to spell out my point that you seem to have failed to grasp.
1. Not against toffs on horses or anyone else on horses charging across the landscape. If I ride I'd fancy doing that. In fact I do on an MTB - anyone object if I join in.
2. Not against control of the fox population - just not convinced that charging across the landscape is a sensible way to do it with the minimum distress to the fox before it's killed.
3. I am concerned about people who wrap pomp and ceremony round killing I think it says a lot about them. (I also feel that having religious beliefs should exclude an individual from any office where they get to make decisions that one might expect to lead to people dying - i.e. If you believe in a heaven you might view,say, soldiers dying differently - but that's a different discussion).
4. I am aware that a lot of hunters aren't toffs and I am aware of hunts on foot. And I know and discuss these sorts of things with folk who hunt and farmers and landowners. They conduct themselves with far more dignity and considered response than you ninfan - though I'll leave it to you to decide if that's a high bar.
City boy by birth, but spent the last 20 years round North Yorkshire, mainly in small villages.
I used to see the hounds being exercised as I drove into work.
@mikey. I would imagine the UN can and does come up with very similar reports relating to just about any country. Thecanary is a anti Tory, Corbyn supporting vehicle best left on facebook.
@mikey. I would imagine the UN can and does come up with very similar reports relating to just about any country. Thecanary is a anti Tory, Corbyn supporting vehicle best left on facebook.
So? That doesn't mean it should be dismissed out of hand.
turns out I was right in the first place
Nah, just proves your bias, your lack of objectivity & your idiocy..
I agree mikey, every government can do better and to highlight those areas is a good thing. But your posting of it and the canaries highlighting it is just left wing political propoganda. That's fine there's an election coming up. But be careful what you wish for especially with British voters. Some of the failings in that report will be seen as successes by many !!
is just left wing political propoganda
Spoken like a true Tory.
I'm not saying it's gospel, by any stretch of the imagination. Just something that needs investigating further.
Spoken like a true Tory.
Not really I'm more or less politicaly neutral. I've voted for all the major parties plus independents at some time. Whoever I feel will screw up the country the least gets my vote. But I do have an inclination towards less government so slightly more inclined to vote conservative than labour.
If you have access, the actual paper is on the UN Human Rights website and says all of the things that article does.
Thecanary is a anti Tory, Corbyn supporting vehicle best left on facebook.
A couple of weeks ago in this very thread we were lamenting the imbalance caused by the lack of left-leaning press in the UK and you suggested that [url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/is-may-about-to-call-an-election/page/13#post-8420804 ]"If people on the left bought more newspapers we'd have a more balanced press."[/url]
Odd then that you'd encourage people to avoid The Canary.
Avoid the Canary. For all the same reasons as you should avoid Westmonster.
A couple of weeks ago in this very thread we were [b][u]lamenting the imbalance caused by the lack of left-leaning press in the UK [/u][/b]and you suggested that "If people on the left bought more newspapers we'd have a more balanced press."Odd then that you'd encourage people to avoid The Canary.
The very reason Kerry Anne Mendoza created the Canary