Right then, I have my test (again, but let's not talk about that) on Tuesday and have been trying to learn about buying a banger that won't give me headache. Alas, I don't know much about cars but have an idea of what I want. This is where you come in.
So, my budget is small. I know you buy cheap, you buy twice but I can't stretch much beyond £1k for the car. I'll get something better in the future. I want something economical to run, low on tax and insurance and not prone to regular, expensive failures. Moon on a stick?
I've been thinking of an estate so I can put the bike in without removing the front wheel. I also climb so room for a mat and gear is necessary. Equally I could just suck it up and get a little hatchback (easier for parking/finding spaces?) and good rack, but I don't like the idea of driving about with the car on the outside: I plan on lots of long distance trips to ride in various places as I'm working towards MTB coach qualifications. Some of thee are going to be with the missus or a climbing/riding chum. The same counts for driving to mountains &crags to complete my ML/SPA logbooks.
I've had diesel recommended due to economy, I'd love a car that runs on grease from the chippy but that requires a bit more planning/knowledge/faff. I've also had recommendations to go with German or Japanese. I've been learning in a 207 and new style Fiesta, the 207 was nicer to drive.
I don't deny my tyre kicking understanding of cars, I'd like to learn & do as much maintenance on it myself as possible. I'm 28 so hopefully won't be crippled by my insurance costs, I plan to add my mum as a second driver to reduce the premium.
Recently I've been looking at Polos, Passats, 207s a few others.
And this:
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What do you recommend and what should I avoid and look for?
Cheers 
Peugeot 205 106 citroen Saxo. Take someone who knows what they are looking for.
Any of those can be had for 500 with mot and some tax super easy and cheap to run and fix if it does break or you park it backwards through a hedge.
Insurance will probably decide what car you get for you so double check you can get insurance on any motor before you buy it.
Pug 306 estate or hatch 1.4 petrol prob a good bet diesels are either more expensive or have been to the moon with an epileptic plasterer in the back.
Cheers for the recommendation, excuse me for being dense but what would cause me to not get insurance for something? Or is it that the insurance on some is going to be prohibitively expensive?
Expensive or if you rang up for a quote on say a BMW m motor they would prob just laugh and ask if you could take out a mortgage.
Mk3 golf 1.4 ...... Slow well built insurance is ok.... Economy is not great but they are robust.....
Nissan Almera not a pretty car but robust and simple better than newer nissans with shared Renault platforms...
Almera In The classifieds could be worth a nosey.
think about what boy racers choose and pick something else.
Ah ok, so I need to get something they think I can control and won't be prime pickings for pinchers. I'm after practical, not flashy so I reckon that should be ok.
Any tips on age? A lot in my budget are 10-12 years old and I've read about some engines becoming less efficient and struggling to pass on emissions tests once old.
have a look at some insurance websites for quotes.
use a spare email address to avoid the spam.
Insurance is more the issue than the car. A friends son had a 1 ltr Seat Arosa and was 3 grand for an 18yr old to insure it. So dont think of anything bigger than a 1 ltr for a boy. Daughters insurance on her £500 Polo was £1400 TPFT. Just to give you an idea. Insurance for kids is with Bell and Admiral, the rest are pretty shocking. Statistics show with insurance that Corsas and Fiestas driven by an 18yr old lad will be in a hedge within the first year. Get a micra, it will only be driven by grandmas and people thinking out the box for crash statistics. My daughter can verify this, with nearly all the boys destroying their cars within 6 months.
Good luck with all that. I dont think age will make much difference as a guy at work is 26 and facing the same quotes
shared Renault platforms...
I know some cars share internals (VW/Seat) and apparently the above too. This is a good thing right? I've assumed it means easier to get parts and more places to get the thing repaired or serviced. I've had some friends recommend Fords for their relatively cheap parts in large supply. I've also heard Fix Or Repair Daily sums them up too.
Any more opinions on enclosed estate snugness vs rack and hatchback?
Some handy hints RE insurance Thrusty, fits with mrmo's comment.
Mrmo has it - it might seem counter intuitive but young people like Saxo's and Corsa's and so they get crashed a lot. Cars that are not cool don't, so a 1.1 base spec Saxo could cost more to insure than a much bigger and more useful (but less cool) car.
Early berlingo? Petrol mid sized MPV? Nissan/Toyota/Mazda estate??
[i]Any tips on age? A lot in my budget are 10-12 years old and I've read about some engines becoming less efficient and struggling to pass on emissions tests once old. [/i]
The emission test is based upon the age of the car, but obviously as something ages its not running as optimum as it once was.
But TBH, at £1k you need to be looking at something with 12m MOT and insurance you can afford. And, you do have extra money for the insurance, as a newly qualified driver you could easily be paying +£1k for the lowest group.
[i]I've had some friends recommend Fords for their relatively cheap parts in large supply.[/i]
It not just Fords but cars produced for a long period in large numbers - my previous 535i was cheap for consumables, and surprisingly so is my current Jaguar (discs/pads all-round for £100 etc).
Buy whatever your grandparents would have, chances are it'll be undesirable, cheap to run and statistically not crashed by first time drivers whilst probably be being bigger and more comfortable and powerful.
My first car was a Nissan Bluebird, bigger, faster and cheaper to buy, insure and run than all my friends first car fiestas, corsas, 106's and stuff.
Nissans and Mazdas are excellent reliable cars, but they rust like a tin can in the surf!
Pugs are arguably a bit less reliable, but are cheap and usually have good bodywork on the older models.
Germans are pretty good, but expensive, and in most cases overpriced, in my opinion anyway.
Toyota Corolla?
Mazda Demio?
See the other thread from sambob, http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/any-reason-not-to-get-a-16tdi-octavia-estate
He's looking at getting a 1.6TDi Octavia estate, which he can afford to insure at 17, so that could easily tick all your boxes. They have a huge amount of space in the back, my Octy hatch can take my Inbred with 6" forks, both wheels on and just the saddle taken off, with the back seat dropped. A small car like a Saxo would be very compromised on space, plus Octies aren't known for being driven by boy racers with back-to-front baseball hats and a huge exhaust pipe!
Hmmm:
His parking's a bit off but it looks ok to my carnoob eyes. Whatever I go for I'd take a chum to check it over.
I quite like the word "ambiente" it just screams snazzy 😉
{declares self interest} My nissan almera could fit the bill for you, though as everyone ahs said, check insurance as it's not clear cut, groups are only the start of it.
If it helps I'd even stick a fresh 12months MOT on for a fellow STW'r, it flew through in Nov so I've no concerns. She's nothing tasty, but very reliable and efficient! and roomier than a golf! 😀
Tiboy, how far from Brighton are you?
Like parkesie said. Saxo or 106. Cheap to buy. Room in the back of a 106 for 2 dh bikes with all wheels removed yet still economical and cheap to tax/insure. Stick with the idea of a litre or 1.2L. More than quick enough for a learner driver and you'll happily pootle along in faster traffic on the open roads.. unlike a Mk 1 1.1 fiesta from my time. :O/
I had an older nissan micra that ran very well for its age and cost. It cost £190 with a years MOT. Put about 5k on it with no probs. Best £190 I ever spent!
Although I suggested a 1.4 golf and an Almera.... The one reservation on the Nissan is the price of spare parts.....
Joe Bloggs from next door (it's surprising how similar we are!) has been quoted £1209.46 (annual) or £184ish a month for the Focus in rob jackson's link.
That seems lower than I assumed I'd be charged, is this good? I guess a dealer should be a bit more secure, although used car salesmen are a bit of a cliché. Hmmm. Also, it is kosher to remove the back seats of said Focus and leave them out to free up space?
removing seats is fine as long as they are present at the mot
My insurance was £1.5K fully comprehensive for 8K miles last year for a Toyota Corolla 1.6 automatic (insured for £.4.5K) as I bought the car with UK provisional license.
This year it is £1K with my UK provisional license but hopefully it will drop further as I passed my UK driving practical last Wed.
Rover.
Cheap and unfashionable, but quite nice to drive.
Ah, I've just read a bit about insurance. I think 3rd party etc sounds better, the quotes are getting closer to £1k.
If you are only spending £1k on the car, for insurance go with whatever is cheapest - for me been an old boy, its Comp - but when you are online try all the options to get the best price.
Herman Shake - MemberAh, I've just read a bit about insurance. I think 3rd party etc sounds better, the quotes are getting closer to £1k.
Yes, 3rd party is much cheaper but so long as you are confident at driving go for that one otherwise fully comp for 3 years ...
ChrisL of this parish has one of those Ambientes, it's a very nice car, sensibly specced etc.
If that's your budget, it ought to give you a decent amount of choice. TBF I'd suggest buying on price not neccesarily on model- bang into Autotrader your budget, your basic requirements and see what's available nearby. There's a lot to be said for bangernomics too.
Insurance- on an inexpensive car TPF&T [i]probably[/i] makes more sense, but try both. I was expecting to have to pay hundreds extra on my first car, which made no sense on a £1000 Focus, you just do the numbers and think "There's no way there's a 1 in 5 chance I write off this car in a year, I wouldn't drive if I thought I was that bad!". But then I got quotes, and one of them was just pounds more than the TPF&T.
Reasonable size, small engine, should be doable. Small estates seemed cheaper to insure for me, they've got more throw-weight in a crash but they're less boyracable and possibly less nickable.
Just as an experiment I just ran autotrader for my postcode, £500 to £1000, found a Multipla for £750 with reasonable miles, 10 months MOT. They're cheap as it gets to insure, because nobody will steal it, vandals will ignore it as smashing it up will only improve it, and nobody will crash into it for fear that Teh Ugly is contagious. Perfect.
Peugeots keep popping up, a 2002 307 works out pretty good; £795 price, £901 insurance and tax is only £30 due to low emissions/good mpg (or however it's worked out) putting it in band C. 62mpg too, nearly twice that of the Focus.
Cheers for the pointers NW *mind wanders to modding an estate for teh lolz*
Ah balls. I misread the model and it's the more recent 307 that sneaks into band C. I got too excited 😳
I've also learned that mpg is not a single thing (it seems obvious now) but there is a motorway and urban rating.
I've think I've decided to go for front wheel off, bike in the car but still feel an estate is a bit too much car for me.
Thanks for all of the advice so far 🙂
I've also learned that mpg is not a single thing (it seems obvious now) but there is a motorway and urban rating.
Don't pay too much to the manufacturer ratings on fuel consumption. They tend to over-estimate them quite wildly.
Do check insurance groups before writing cars off. Some of them might surprise you.
Bigger cars will do less well on fuel (and on your budget diesels may not be the best option), but they can be massively cheaper to buy.
Don't scrimp too much on small cars either though. There's some real dogs out there and it's a competitive market for the ultimate cheap runabout. The premium will pay itself back twice over if you get a good one, but you'll pay in comfort too, or lack of.
Don't ever let anyone put you off buying a cheaper car. In 15 years of driving I've only bought one that was over £1k. The rest were well under. Aside from the British ones (Ford and Vauxhall) they've all lived long and fruitful lives. All around the 5 years and 50k miles mark. Some of them weren't even serviced in that time! They all would have lived longer if they weren't neglected. Current motor cost me £750 and after a year of ownership it has just went straight through an MOT. I will add that they've all been Japanese.
Prices have risen a lot in recent years. Lots of one-man traders out there buying cars from ebay/gumtree/etc, only to put them back on ebay/gumtree/etc an hour later but for twice the price. But there's plenty of honest sellers too. I think it pays to seek them out.
Nice one Butcher.
butcher - Member... I will add that they've all been Japanese.
That is your clue. Reliable, easy to fix and relatively cheap to run.
VW golf, stay away from anything french, in your price range they will all be sheds.
[url= http://www.vwt4forum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=252020 ]http://www.vwt4forum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=252020[/url]
Insurance groups don't tell the whole story.
With all other details the same, my 05 BMW 330i is cheaper to insure than my 01 Pug 306 HDI.
It's partially related to crimes/thefts/accidents ascribed to that model of car.
I'd get quotes on anything you're interested in and go from there.