Forum menu
Realistically it'll make no difference at all to the Commons votes on Tuesday.
The government might lose the "customs union" amendment (for what it's worth...a minister has to come and report on progress...) and the "meaningful vote" one, but that's probably it....sadly. Labour are going to abstain on the single market one, in favour of their meaningless load of tosh which may not even get voted on!
All those trade deals are looking promising in the light of trump seeming to want to start a trade war with the rest of the world
But blue passports though
For balance, some good news… if we can convince the EU we're serious, not saboteurs… (they might well view this as more cakeism though… I really don't know).
UK to apply to stay in European standards system after Brexit
https://amp.ft.com/content/94ef2bb0-6b31-11e8-b6eb-4acfcfb08c11
Back to Landrover…
As many of us have said… get rid of immigrant workers, and the country stands to lose not just their jobs (and spending and taxation) but also lots of other jobs that depend on their work…
https://twitter.com/rehaklubomir/status/1002074338386903040
Solihull Brexit results
68 484 leave
53 466 remain
I wonder how many of the 1000 workers being laid off voted Briexit.
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/jaguar-land-rover-cutting-1000-14528136
Bloke I know worked at Solihull for years says they were always going to do it - points at what happened at Cadburys despite years of promises they wouldn't there too.
A guy that drinks in my pub said...
Well, there that settles it then. 😂
Have you thought about painting that statement on the side of a bus?
How did he know ninny? Was he on the board,or prescient,or a figment of someone's imagination ?
All the more reason to paint it on a bus
Some better artists available though
Cor, even ninfan doesn’t seem convinced!
Today's votes.
What exactly are they voting on?
Are these proper votes that Enola has to obey or mere suggestions that don't reflect the will of the people and are to be ignored.
The main ones just seek to prevent the government ruling out a shared customs area, and to allow parliament to send the gov back to the negotating table in the result of a bad or no deal. There is also a sensible EEA measure, but Corbyn has already killed that one.
What exactly are they voting on?
When the legislation enabling Brexit got debated in the Lords, the Peers inserted a number of amendments which would make a hard Brexit much less likely. Now the legislation comes back to the Commons and MPs vote on whether to overturn these amendments.
https://news.sky.com/story/live-tory-mp-resigns-from-government-over-brexit-11402270
I hope a few others show some integrity too.
I hope a few others show some integrity too.
Theres more chance of me marrying Kylie
By the sounds of it, May is getting pretty desperate. Apparently the present line from number 10 is 'vote with me, or you'll end up with Boris as PM'
Which goes to show that despite being the most shambolic government ever to have been in office, that the previous line of 'vote with me, or you'll end up with Jeremy Corbyn as PM' simply isn't credible in anyones book
And this is being highlighted by the man himself whipping his MP's to abstain on key votes over the next 2 days, therefore spurning the chance to defeat the government, and missing the opportunity of presenting a more credible Brexit policy than the present muddled nonsense coming from the labour front bench
Can't quite believe how useless Corbyn is. With all what is going on, he should be on the attack on all fronts. But no.
Corbyn has spent his entire career, such as it is, denouncing the EU.
The Tory's are busy delivering what he's always wanted, so he's no intention of doing anything to stop them
I truly despair at the opposition to this government.
Corbyn is too blinded by ideology to seek a pragmatic solution.
https://news.sky.com/story/live-tory-mp-resigns-from-government-over-brexit-11402270
Whispers of a revolt, leadership challenge and more to follow Lee with numbers up in the air at the moment
Leadership challenge leads to replacing awful with bat shit crazy. No winners in that scenario
I very much doubt there will be a leadership challenge now - none of the contenders want to be the next tory leader as they know its only leading to opposition and being blamed for the brexit mess. they want to be the leader after next.
I'm out, apparently.
nah there wont be a revolt Lee is ajust a rare politician being honest with the electorate, the government & most MPs will keep pushing the same story that we can get what we want, itll be quick & easy etc etc
In the meantime more auto manufacturers will follow JLR, ironic that such a 'british' company would be the first to start moving thanks to brexit, they said in September that they were only expanding their Slovakia plant as a hedge against brexit.
Its obvious that JLR can see that none of the governments plans as workable; max fac or customs partnership
todays votes just kicking the can further.
Imagine if your Job was delivering a project and before a huge meeting you didn't read what was going on
Davis stumbles over Grieve's proposed change
The Brexit secretary admits he "hasn't had a lot of time" to read and consider the amendment that would bind the government to be answerable to Parliament if it secures no deal by November 2018 and February 2019.
Amid braying from the opposition benches, he shoots back: "This is an interesting perception of Labour's view of how easy it is to make constitutional law on the fly."
He insists the government will not back down any more and change its own amendments.
The complete incompetence is now becoming just day to day normality
It’s all a bit of an unholy mess, really
Institute for Government has done an anlysis of the governmente Brexit prep
10,000 new staff, £2billion quid...............
and they are not ready & wont be ready any time soon
some interesting points: last time customs procedures were changed in EU it took 7 years to implemement from deciding structure to rolling out, we have 2.5 years & have decided what structure will be yet & wont know before October at very earliest
nearly all non-brexit related work has been put on the back burner & will be for years to come
basically because May,Cabinet, Tory party, Government all divided on what brexit means whitehall paralysed & unable to plan properly, in contrast EU set its position out early on, finalising their offer early this year, they wont change from what theyve put on teh table now.
Insane & unjustified amounts of secrecy means no department or par;aiament knows what other teams are up to- making the work almost impossible when some areas really require very highly specialised 'experts'
There are
over 300 ‘EU exit workstreams’ across almost 20 departments. But each of these
workstreams is having to prepare for multiple scenarios with different deadlines and
different outcomes. Perhaps most critically, all of these plans must add up to a single,
coherent response from government.Despite
the fact that the Border Planning Group brings together the UK’s border expertise,
that border was excluded from its original remit. The Border Planning Group was only
given oversight of the Irish land border in April 2018.Firms in the financial services sector, for instance, started enacting
contingency plans for a ‘no deal’ scenario months ago, after general reassurances from
the Chancellor and Treasury failed to persuade. Manufacturing firms, in particular in
the automotive and life sciences industries, are also now pressing the button on
contingency plans without guidance from government.
That’s the fallacy, people simply expect that shutting borders will immediately mean that more positions are filled by British born employees, not realising that training takes years and that’s before you have to free up funding for infrastructure projects.
Ive tried explaining this to a pet Brexiteer at the pub who responded along the lines of “blue passports and control, innit”.
I’m learning to save my breath for explaining income tax to my cat, who’d have a far greater chance of grasping that concept.
Squeaky bum time for Maybot
does she cave in & allow a meaningful vote or risk losing what looks like an increasingly shaky vote for her.
Only scheduling 12hrs for the15 votes has turned HoC into a bit of a frothing mess, I think some Tory rebels backs are up now
It does appear to be raining will of the people form the more gammony members there, it's as if they are worried something might not be all right with the plan
This government has staked it’s very reputation upon delivering Brexit, but after ten years of stagnant wages, austerity and growing dissatisfaction with the status quo, the Tories are terrified that an economic hiccup will result in another 1997.
I'm just relieved that despite the seeming chaos, unpreparedness and lack of direction there are "grown ups" behind the scenes who've got the matter in hand.
I’m just relieved that despite the seeming chaos, unpreparedness and lack of direction there are “grown ups” behind the scenes who’ve got the matter in hand.
Pffft and, indeed, Wibble.
From the office of the Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union
and backbone went to jelly
****ing bottlers
All on a promised amendment that has yet to be specified apparently, and like the ****ing worms they are.....
sounds like May has climbed down & agreeing to Grieves text being in the bill
And May's election decision bites her on the arse again. Weak and wobbly.
no shes only climbed down on half of it, basically the non-binding bit
so we could still get a no deal, even though the government havent prepared for one! made even more likely as the both the Tory 'plans' & the labour arent acceptable to the EU
edit peston disagrees with my assessment
https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1006570842912935936
no shes only climbed down on half of it, basically the non-binding bit
Thats how I read the results, I mean I hope Pestons appraisal is more accurate than mine, but I'm struggling with it.
Timing is everything, I suspect that if things get testy with the EU there will be a coup attempt from one faction or other. Numerically, there seems to be a growing number of Remain MPs and it would appear that the initial Brexit fantasy of a low-tax, low regulation marketplace off the shore of mainland Europe will be hideously damaging to the electoral fortunes of the Conservative Party.
I am so confused with all of this now.
More plate spinning 🙂
* bottlers
All on a promised amendment that has yet to be specified apparently, and like the * worms they are…..
Well when it’s their jobs on the line 🙂
Just seen Aaron Banks on the telly, oh he is cruising for a bruising.
The gist of Banks's defence is that he wasn't to be taken seriously and that his campaign needed to appeal to emotion instead of reason.
If he was as above board as he claims, then why obscure his business dealings in Gibraltar away from prying eyes here?
*answers on a postcard to: "I've nothing to hide, honest guv" competition, 1 The Money Was Just Resting In My Account, Craggy Island...
Has Davis offered to resign yet ?
I'm not convinced by any of this. Going to get those german classes booked again.
So brexies MPs think May hasn't given anything away, the rebels say she told them she has.
She's kicked the can for 5 whole days until it gets written up.
Then someone's gonna be right pissed off !
Irony obviously being that no deal hasn't been an option possibly since b4 we triggered a50
Who knows where this will end up, but yes it does seem like more can kicking... Stolen from another forum...
<div class="Tweet-header">
No 10 sources say agreement is for more discussions, with 'likely implication' of a new amendment - again, that's not what more than a dozen MPs believe the PM told them earlier tonight - three of them present told me the PM even said 'this is a matter of trust'... trouble ahead"
If she does go back on assurances, it destroys any hope of 'rebels' trusting assurances in the future, and it's not the end of thingsso they still have many, many opportunities to nerf Brexit. She hasn't won the war if she does that. If she does that she's won the battle but lost the war
Edit:: From another tweet,
One of the Tory rebels told me earlier - 'if she *s us, she's *ed'
And from Faisal Islam
One rebel just told me if the Government reneges on the PMs personal assurances made this afternoon on meaningful vote - they will vote it down next week...
May is certainly walking on a knife edge..
Whether you respect the guy or not, Tony Blair was far better at telling a room full of people what they wanted to hear.
maybot has to tell them in 2 separate groups, problem is that both then go & tell the world what she promised each of them
wonder what shes thinking tonight?
its all too much for the sun
They must be apoplectic - They've missed a very easy you / EU pun
Telling different people different things, lying, manipulating and, ultimately, people reverting to type and looking after their own skins.
At least we’re consistent.
Nearly two years since the abomination and the national humiliation rolls on.
Just seen Aaron Banks on the telly, oh he is cruising for a bruising.
In fairness, he's an utter duplicitous shit, but at least he gave the Parliamentary Committee with the respect it deserves by heading out for lunch when he felt like it.
I'm a bit confused by all this now?
Have we resolved the fairies and magic unicorns Oirish border thing then?
Ok, so car brands have to protect themselves both from the effects of Brexit on production, and from the negative PR effects that questioning Brexit has in our current climate… but the CBI can speak out without walking that same tightrope…
CBI chief: Car firms face Brexit extinction
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/business-44462829
Have we resolved the fairies and magic unicorns Oirish border thing then?
Pah, plenty of time left to come up with some kind of coherent plan and invent the technology needed to operate it.
https://howmanydaystill.com/its/brexit-6
Telling different people different things
On that subject… a useful, but far too late, pair of suggestions from the IPA…
https://twitter.com/jason_kint/status/1006725764446859264
Bit of a bizarre recommendation IMO - I don't think anyone is individually crafting political ads for the consumption of a tiny number of people, they are simply using personal data to sort us into larger receptive/non-receptive groups.
So some are saying she made concessions, Brexit Bulldog says they haven’t surely she has just lit the fuse to blow the Conservative party apart?
She must just have a plan, no body can be this clumsy can they?
If the sun is that upset I should be feeling happy.
I'm not.
Surely left and right are out of date now. The parties should be in or out.
Mass defections to the Lib Dems please.
Corbyn is a **** but I'm liking Ken Clarke.
Crazy.
She must just have a plan, no body can be this clumsy can they?
I think the plan is just to survive to the next day. Tomorrow the plan will be to survive to the day after that.
The CBI can bleat on about car manufacturing going extinct, but the whole history of this thing is about Tory politicians putting their party before the country, and it's hard to see that changing. Do leopards change their spots?
Crazy.
Tell me about it. I never once imagined that I’d have reason to send Michael Heseltine a thank you letter. I had a really nice response from him too.
IMO
Yes, your opinion. Just ignore the recommendations of experts in their field. Carry on…
Fortunately I can still remember Ken Clarke's enthusiastic trousering of tobacco industry cash as they tried to get third world kids hooked on cigarettes, so I can take a more nuanced view of his character.
Any port in a storm, I suppose.
Has Davis offered to resign yet ?
He only does that alternate weeks now. Doing it weekly was a tad too obvious demonstration of attention seeking.
This week he is "taking people out".
I think the plan is just to survive to the next day. Tomorrow the plan will be to survive to the day after that.
Most definately... I’m not sure who’s on the driving seat of this fiasco, two years/billion down the line and they still haven’t figured out what they want.
Yes, your opinion. Just ignore the experts. Carry on…
Ahem. That would be ignoring the industry, rather than independent experts. So needs to be viewed from the context of a group who sees actual regulation approaching and is trying to head that off.
Plus the difference between calling for a 'moratorium' (voluntary, not forever) and a 'complete ban' needs to be pointed out to your Tweeter.
It's encouraging because it suggests that they know the matter may well be taken out of the hands of the industry to self-regulate, and are lobbying hard to prevent that.