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Although this final season of Brexit is very entertaining
Some angry Doris turning up with a couple of dragons and putting us all out of our misery is probably the best we can hope for at this point.
Sorry..... spoilers
Some angry Doris turning up with a couple of dragons and putting us all out of our misery is probably the best we can hope for at this point.
you called?
Some angry Doris turning up with a couple of dragons and putting us all out of our misery is probably the best we can hope for at this point.
you called?
I've made my position quite clear: the immolation - bring it
I wonder. In the event of a snap election actually being held then, as usual, I think Mr. Farage holds the key. If he decides to field candidates everywhere, I reckon the Leave vote will be largely split and the Tories overall share will be diminished, as will Labours as many hard core Brexiteers who have traditionally voted Labour seem quite happy to vote for his party as we now know. However, I am not so sure those same hard core Labour Brexit types could stomach voting for the Tories. So in the case that Farage decides not to field candidates, in order to not split the leave vote, I wonder if those same hard core "working class" Brexiteers would in fact go back to voting Labour or even not bother to vote. So in either scenario, the Tories may not do as well as they think they might.
Just thinking out load here BTW
Seems that the prorogation court case is uncovering some interesting nuggets:
https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1168827437226106880
Ahh… the Greece Squirrel. Probably the most popular/regular diversion in this (over)long running thread.
The thing we have to remember about Greece though, right, is that pre-referendum precisely no-one in the UK gave two shits about it. It only became an issue when someone realised that they could weaponise it as a "yes but Greece" anti-EU argument. Few people actually, really, care still but it's a handy stick.
the Greek debt is unsustainable, and the only way to actually help is to write it off. But this was politically impossible for Merkel, so they impose more pain.
So it was domestic German politics that forced the EU's hand, not the EU being shits?
Ok got it. It's almost as if it's more complicated than it first appears.. who'd have thought?
So it was domestic German politics that forced the EU’s hand
Just like the German car lobby will save brexit.
I don't think Boris wants Brexit - he is an intelligent man (or he has intelligent advisors...) he's looking to shift blame to anyone but him.
I don’t think Boris wants Brexit
It's not about Brexit, it's about being in power for the next 5 years. If that means dead bodies in the streets, he'll take it.
Boris, Farage, JRM and many more benefit financially from Brexit, Boris also has a chance of it helping him stay in power if he can blame the resulting carnage on the EU/remainers. He absolutely wants Brexit - to the extent he doesn't care whether it's with a deal or not.
I'm all confused now ...we were definitely heading towards no deal because that was what Boris wanted last week, and previously.
It's almost as if we can't reach consensus.
Anybody else liking the (irony?) that this last ditch attempt to save democracy from a Tory Junta is happening exactly eighty years after we went to war in defence of another European nation's liberty?
Perhaps Poland could invade, and save us from ourselves.
It’s not about Brexit, it’s about being in power for the next 5 years. If that means dead bodies in the streets, he’ll take it.
Precisely - a no deal might keep him in power, but it'll be a lot of work to stay on top of the results of that...
Although to be fair apparently it's on of the questions on the Eton entry exam...
https://twitter.com/alanferrier/status/1168184926895820801
Corbyn to make announcement at 6pm regarding a ‘change’ in Labour policy
No doubt he’s about to do exactly what Cummings wants him to do. Fall into the elephant trap with all the big neon flashing lights and the massive sign saying ‘ELEPHANT TRAP’
Well, Blair warned him not to do that, therefore he has too, doesn’t he?
Perhaps Poland could invade, and save us from ourselves.
Maybe they are...
https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/military-id-tags-what-who-has-my-niece-found/
Corbyn to make announcement at 6pm regarding a ‘change’ in Labour policy
"Despite our previous insistence all options remain on the table we've taken the decision to take both any tory deal and no deal off the table. As I'm Surrey can appreciate this is a seismic shift in our policy, our membership has made clear that these options aren't acceptable and we have listened. To be clear this means we support a labour negotiated deal as any such deal will absolutely ensure a fairer, better Britain outside the EU, and, if we can't have that, we'll support a few other things we can't deliver too, including but not limited too another referendum with remain as an option"
The court case in Scotland is where the action is.
Yes they have, but the EU are not entirely innocent ... and the merciless treatment of the Greeks ... The tories, Trump, The EU, Corporations, Civil Servants, and the media are all different sides to same coin in the eyes of ordinary people.
Firstly, Greece has nothing to do with the UK. They are cited a lot, but what happened to Greece doesn't even apply to us as we're not part of the eurozone. If the best example of us being shafted by the EU is an imaginary scenario that hasn't even happened yet, or even likely to happen, then I'm personally not too worried about it.
Secondly. The entire situation was caused by the Greek government, when they lied (which they later admitted to) about their economic figures so that they would qualify to enter the eurozone. It wasn't sustainable from the start and they placed the EU into an impossible position.
Thirdly... They still remain in the EU. They know that even with austerity, they are better with than without.
Our austerity is entirely down to our own government, and given all the measures they introduced when they came into power it is no surprise we find ourselves where we do now. Brexit has already costs tens of billions; huge amounts of money that will shake the economy for years to come even if it ends tomorrow. And yet people fear labour getting into power because they'd supposedly spend money we don't have. Yes, there's a feeling of discontent amongst many people, and it's not about Brexit. It's not about Brexit at all. Brexit was a creation, used to take advantage of that discontent, latched onto by the media and privately funded social media campaigns. The distortion of truth and spread of misinformation throughout is a huge concern, not just for current political questions, but the future of politics entirely.
And this is stuff we know. It's obvious. Right there clear as day. By focusing on Brexit, we're focusing on the wrong problem. Whichever way we go on Brexit now there will be discontent, and way more so than we started with. There are no easy answers to the misinformation and subsequent distrust. But the extremist nut-jobs currently in No. 10 are really not helping by repeatedly spouting lies and holding no accountability for them.
Meanwhile, throughout all of this, the EU have always been welcoming, rational, and constructive. They've been the only sane voice for the past 3 years.
I feel completely and utterly perplexed as to why people don't see that.
It's a question of integrity.
And we have none left.
No doubt he’s about to do exactly what Cummings wants him to do. Fall into the elephant trap with all the big neon flashing lights and the massive sign saying ‘ELEPHANT TRAP’
I think you are miles off the mark @binners - all the opposition parties seem to be singing from the same hymn sheet at last - and I fully expect Corbyn to be behind sorting an A50 extension to avoid a No Deal exit (at least for now) before enabling a General Election.
The likes of Juncker blocking measures to prevent corporate tax avoidance, and the merciless treatment of
You do know that wasn’t the EU right? The EU was trying to clamp down on tax avoidance, whilst Juncker was acting in his own parties interest as PM of Luxembourg.
Btw, austerity was voted for by the working classes.
There has never been any democratic deficit whereby the working classes are not represented.
It’s just that the Turkeys consistently vote for Christmas.
I don’t think Boris wants Brexit
I genuinely don't think he cares that much either way but, unlike May, Johnson sees Brexit as an opportunity rather than a problem. Not an opportunity to improve the country or to lead us to "sunlit uplands" but an opportunity to seize power.
Johnson isn't daft, sure he's not the erudite Classical scholar he sometimes like to potray but nor is the bumbling tousled toff either. He is mendacious and ruthless and with Brexit he identified there is potentially a solid constituency of voters willing to blindly back him to get Brexit over the line. He just needs to triangulate his rhetoric to capture enough votes. Brexity enough to win over some of the loons from the Brexit party, not mad enough to scare off traditional Conservative voters.
Once Brexit is done the outcome is of almost no importance as far as Johnson is concerned. If its a complete and utter shitshow, well its not his fault, it was the will of the people and those nasty people in the EU didn't play fair. If its any better than the worse predictions then that is obviously a huge victory for Britain's plucky Dunkirk spirit and one in the eye for Project Fear and all the Remoaners.
Whichever way we go on Brexit now there will be discontent, and way more so than we started with.
Heartbreakingly true.
There are no easy answers to the misinformation and subsequent distrust.
And any hard answers will never gain any traction while those in politics in powerful positions ignore the problem (because the misinformation is working for them, and they know the distrust will be aimed at their political opponents just as much as at them).
Rebel Tory MP Philip Lee has dramatically defected to the Liberal Democrats – depriving Boris Johnson of his Commons majority.
The pro-EU former minister walked across the Commons chamber, to sit with Jo Swinson’s party, meaning the prime minister now leads a minority government.
Messy lol!
I was wrong about defections…
What a way to defect! In the middle of Johnsons speech.
Brexit keeps on bringing the theatre doesn't it?
So off went the Emperor in procession under his splendid canopy. Everyone in the streets and the windows said, "Oh, how fine are the Emperor's new clothes! Don't they fit him to perfection? And see his long train!" Nobody would confess that he couldn't see anything, for that would prove him either unfit for his position, or a fool. No costume the Emperor had worn before was ever such a complete success.
"But he hasn't got anything on," a little child said.
"Did you ever hear such innocent prattle?" said its father. And one person whispered to another what the child had said, "He hasn't anything on. A child says he hasn't anything on."
"But he hasn't got anything on!" the whole town cried out at last.
The Emperor shivered, for he suspected they were right. But he thought, "This procession has got to go on." So he walked more proudly than ever, as his noblemen held high the train that wasn't there at all.
Brilliant lol.
Centerists doing what Corbyn couldn’t do, removing the Tories majority. Now if Corbyn is clever, he won’t agree to a GE.
What a way to defect! In the middle of Johnsons speech
I wonder if I can post him a beer to his commons office
Holy crap!
the prime minister now leads a minority government.
So... what happens next? Does that, like, trigger anything?
At last, some good news.
Christ, that entire thread is worth reading. Quite, quite remarkable.
So… what happens next? Does that, like, trigger anything?
Well I imagine JC just made a bit of a mess if that's what you mean but effectively no, he's now held to ransom by Parliament, he's unable to pass legislation without cross party support, he can't prevent the opposing parties ammending any legislation he puts forward if they can agree amongst themselves.
Essentially, if he's not granted a GE he's parliament's petulant little puppet. They can have a VoNC he's unlikely to survive but why bother. Just pull his strings for three years.
(it's sort of the best of all worlds if you're not a fan of JC either. Neither of them is now able to do any significant damage without the agreement of either the SNP or Lib Dems, so that's the two ardently remain parties in Parliament. Shame.)
Christ, that entire thread is worth reading.
Lots of good little jokes… but this quite dry bit has properly cheered me up…
https://twitter.com/iandunt/status/1168900181217153024?s=21
Johnson will be many more seats short of a majority when he follows through with his threat to withdraw and expel Tory rebels tonight
I “think” the threat is to stop them standing in the next election… not sure he or his (not actually Conservative) people making these threats can actually kick them out of the party. They have no reason to support him in any way from here on in anyway…
Can Boris call a vote of no confidence in himself?
I have no confidence in his ability to do that!
Blackford always hits the right note… it’s like a bonus PMQs…
https://twitter.com/iandunt/status/1168903835055734785?s=21
Please, please, please, please, please don’t let Jeremy Corbyn **** this up now by being stupid enough to call for a general election?
for me in to hell with the torys