Forum menu
You do know that pigs are the easiest to rear in high intensity units, don't you?? Not the best of animals to choose to farm on your moral high-groundAnd RSPCA pork has had a "better" life than the minimum legal requirement, but it doesn't mean it's had a great life or is free range / lives outside / does natural piggy stuff!
Yes, I know, which is why we try to buy free range/outdoor/organic stuff where possible and only buy RSPCA- if we can't get either we don't buy meat. I did acknowledge that it's still not as kind to the animal as not eating it, but you didn't choose to quote [i]that[/i] bit, just the bit you could preach about 😆
Let me get this straight in my head, OP. You eat dead animals and are quite happy for someone else to rear, kill and butcher them for you, but you're really concerned about their welfare, but only when there's a religious aspect that you don't fully understand?
What other aspects of the meat industry do you find uncomfortable?
I would take living a nice life for a few years over spending a bad time dying for 10 minutes.
Assuming all the people who are against some of the killing methods are going out of their way to ensure the meat they are eating is produced by the absolute best farming methods (Where do you source your meat from Turnerguy?)
If not then maybe concentrate on that first...
The solution....?
[img] 
[/img]
😆
I'll happily criticise Islam, and Christianity and other religious groups
Especially those radicalised budhist f***ers
Yes. Just add racist...or anti semite to the end of my post. It very much still stands.You do know that despite the OPs deliberately provocative/islamophobic title that it's a halal & kosher petition?
So that’s happened to Badger.
but only when there's a religious aspect that you don't fully understand?
To be fair to the OP, when I hear halal I don't knowingly think of it in any religious or cultural context, it's just a word to describe the murder of animals by slitting their throats and letting them bleed to death. Maybe they should remove "halal" and "kosher" from the petition and just call the process what it is.
I notice that the BVA article does this, just calls it "slaughter without stunning".
but you're really concerned about their welfare
Well at least the OP is thinking about some aspects of animal welfare. Hopefully it's the first step.
Thread highlights, so far...
Not the best of animals to choose to farm on your moral high-ground
It's their own fault at the end of the day, they shouldn't be so tasty.
🙂
I would take living a nice life for a few years over spending a bad time dying for 10 minutes.
Odds are you'll probably spend more than 10 minutes dying badly as a human. Are you human?
So that’s happened to Badger.
Where's Bodger?
[img] 
[/img]
I would take living a nice life for a few years
Most of the meat available is from animals that were less than a year old when slaughtered. If you want beef that's from older beasts then Highland and some other rare breeds take longer to bulk up than the more modern stuff.
The pig club pigs here are no more than 8 months old when they go for slaughter. Boar weaners aren't kept too long as the meat taints when the testosterone kicks in.
Surely giraffe burgers should be on some kind of baguette?
The neck looks to be quite thin so could be sliced horizontally to give a pre-shaped burger type of thing that fits in a bap quite nicely.
I would've thought...
Late edit : Burger on the bone!
Tbf; I’ve seen a few different ways of dying (human variety) and I don’t think bleeding to death is that bad on the scale of ‘ways to go’. I should imagine that when done properly and both carotids are severed, the creature is rendered unconscious almost immediately, and with very little pain, so long as the blade is sufficiently sharp. Stunning can go horribly wrong as well; voltages can be insufficient to render unconsciousness, bolt guns can miss brain stems. I’d take a razor sharp blade over electrocution any day, having experienced non fatal incidents of both, by accident.
Whether the animal is killed by a bolt in the head, electric shock or having its throat slit, the end result is the same, dead animal,
pigs are gassed in Nitrogen, as a method it has advocates as a method for death penalty countries and euthanasia http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7183957.stm
My understanding is that most halal slaughter is pre-stunned. Can someone explain what difference there is for the animal, compared with non-halal slaughter?
Who'd have thought that badger & giraffe have the same calorific value!?
Who'd have thought that badger & giraffe have the same calorific value!?
You'd think giraffe would be much higher.
According to: [url= https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/may/08/what-does-halal-method-animal-slaughter-involve ]This[/url]
88% of halal animals are stunned prior to slaughter.
I am against any sort of exception for animal rights legislation for religious reasons but equally don't believe it should be banned if those rights are respected.
I am also concerned with how an animal has lived - you can be certain that the majority of people who froth about accidentally eating halal were not worried that their chicken might have been kept for its miserable 40 day existence in a packed, dark shed.
I beat an owl to death once.
True story.
I beat an owl to death once.Twoo story.
Twit 😉
I was in Africa once, during Eid, the guesthouse we were staying at had a goat that they had reared specially for that years celebrations. I witnessed the slaughter, done to strict halal standards. It was the quickest, cleanest death i'd seen, the goat never saw it coming and died almost instantly.
Thats a sweet story...but its just one goat...the reality of a Halal/neck slitting slaughterhouse can be seen here:
https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=703_1309045039
Some highlights (for those that dont want to see it) include animals queuing for their death like in a conventional slaughterhouse, whining and groaning as they bleed to death, tracheas/windpipes flapping around in the gaping neck wounnd as they gasp for breath while bleeding out, some pre-stunning going on but not all the time, live (unstunned) goats, sheep and cows hanging upside down by one leg while they too wait for the neck slitting...watching the video no it isnt 'instant' like a lot of deluded people on here claim.
With an increasing demand for Halal meat do people really think an individual animal is raised with care and then magnificently executed by some kind of artisan in the craft?!...lol, watch the video, Halal is big business and with that comes 'efficiency'...they run just like a non-Halal slaughterhouse, a conveyer belt setup, animals queuing, blood everywhere, time concerns above animal welfare etc...the lengths some will go to in order to defend outdated religious practices is gobsmacking....in the style of whataboutery can we do female genital mutilation next?...i'm sure some idiot on here will bend over backwards to defend that too.
So is animal cruelty only a bad thing when it provides a convenient excuse to stick it to the foreigners?
No one should be allowed to eat any animal they haven't killed themselves. That should sort it.
Deviant.
A video of some pretty piss poor slaughtering is not an argument for banning all halal slaughter. It is an argument for banning piss poor animal slaughter, or animal slaughter full stop.
Do you want me to find and then post on here some videos of piss poor non-halal slaughter?
.in the style of whataboutery can we do female genital mutilation next?.
what about eunuchs?
sexist.
some abattoirs are bad, some of those will be halal. In Britain we have comparatively high welfare standards and all slaughterhouses should meet (ideally exceed) those standards. It makes no difference if the person wielding the knife whispers a prayer in the lamb's ear first.
On only eating what you kill, [url= https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ethical-Carnivore-Year-Killing-Eat/dp/1472938399 ]this[/url] was quite good
Do you want me to find and then post on here some videos of piss poor non-halal slaughter?
Easy enough to find i'm sure, there have been plenty of documentaries over the years about crap slaughterhouses...your quaint story about an African guesthouse gave an inaccurate idea that Halal slaughter is done to individual animals in a quick manner with no suffering...i merely pointed out that across europe and in this country Halal meat is now big business and with that has come the ways of conventional slaughterhouses...queues of animals, belt fed animals, hanging animals etc...i'm more than happy for camera crews to go into any slaughterhouse and shut them down for poor practices...religion doesnt come into this, some on here really arent getting it...find the most humane way to kill said animals, speak to vets, scientists, animal welfare officers etc to come up with the method and do that...its simple really, religion and/or tradition shouldnt come into it.
Re. the suggestion that people should have to kill animals by their own hand for meat, agree totally...my father for one freely admits he'd go vegetarian if he had to kill the animal and i think lots of others would too.
No one should be allowed to eat any animal they haven't killed themselves. That should sort it.
Only if vegetarians are only allowed to eat what they grow themselves.
Fair's fair.
Forced Rhubarb is just wrong.
End rhubarb slavery.
This place has turned very right-wing of late.
[img] 
[/img]
#prayforthevegetables.
Deviant, it wasn't a quaint story, it was used to illustrate my point (too subtly, obviously) that halal isn't the problem, mass slaughter is the problem, whether halal or not.
Halal meat is now big business and with that has come the ways of conventional slaughterhouses...queues of animals, belt fed animals, hanging animals etc..
Your response suggests you agree with me...
[url= http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/perhaps-your-concern-could-extend-to-not-eating-us-say-chickens-2014050786319 ]Mash.[/url]
RM.
Some actual science, from a friend, sorry to interrupt the middle class flouncing
https://fluffysciences.wordpress.com/2014/02/25/ritual-slaughter/
Oddly enough the animals who seem to enjoy the pleasantest lives (apart from the last 30 minutes) are fighting bulls.
People get all up in arms about how animals are killed, but pay absolutely no mind to how those animals live.
Believe it or not many of us carnivores and even farmers are very keen that animals treated humanely when alive.
I would advocate a return to small local abattoirs or even the mobile units which experimented with some years ago to reduce stress to animals. Sadly that's too expensive for the mass meat market.
As for halal, it stems from a "too literal" reading of an ancient text. I believe the ruling is to "use your sharpest knife" - the reason being that was the quickest, least stressful way to slaughter an animal. Other methods are now available and I don't think slitting throats on religious grounds is supportable these days.
Re. the suggestion that people should have to kill animals by their own hand for meat, agree totally...
Would I have to do it every time, I'm very busy? Could I do it once and get a permit or something? Tremendously useful if I could just buy dead animals chopped up and ready to cook. Or even cooked as it arrived. On a pizza.
Well if you are not killing to eat yourself then to get a pass to eat meat, time spent doing the slaughterhouse killing should be mandertary.
Like a sort of National Service? 😆
"Dinner Service"
Yes.... then you have to go to a sweatshop in Thailand and make your own trainers
[img] 
[/img]
Just my opinion, like.