[Closed] Drugs!

I remain unconvinced that drug legalisation is a worthwhile thing to society as awhole or the individual.

Then quite frankly, you're an idiot.

Every example of prohibition in history is proof of this.

Careful on your bike; it's easy to have an accident when you have your eyes shut tight to the world.

cheekyboy - Member

poor old Junkyard has become too fatigued to continue.

I can assure you he hasn't, when they shut the internet down the last post will be JY responding to a thousand page thread, we all salute his indefatiguability. If he's stopped talking it's because your posts have, incredibly, become beneath his contempt. I didn't think that was possible, congratulations.

[img] [/img]

"Harm caused by drugs" chart.

What a ****ing joke.

Pinched the graphic from the first page because it's been used to demonstrate that our current drug laws aren't right - the balance of legality and harm are wrong.

It's being used to support a possible argument for looking into the decriminalisation of some drugs. If this argument applies, then it certainly supports an alternative argument for stronger prohibition of alcohol.
Earlier, someone put forwards the idea that prohibition doesn't work. From the graphic, it looks like legalisation is the thing that doesn't work.

It's very simple.
Before the "war on drugs" started, drugs weren't really a big problem.

Alcohol is for sale where ever we walk, where ever we shop, where ever we eat, where ever we dance, where ever we watch a film, where ever we stop for petrol. Hence why its top of that skewered chart. Everywhere = more affected by it/using it.

Its a right of passage to try and drink alcohol.

I can't remember the last time I was offered Skunk or weed etc.

Skunk, psychosis and mental illness. Hmmm. Theres one thing I really wouldn't want to become socially acceptable.

Everyone who takes drugs seems to think it makes them interesting, different and funny. Its a ****s game.

Yes alcohol is bad. BAD. [u]However why add another product available everywhere in the same places as another product to **** a wider audiences life up even more?[/u]

Leave it as it is. The preserve of teenagers and middle-aged middle-class types who are in denial that they are 18 anymore.

I can assure you he hasn't, when they shut the internet down the last post will be JY responding to a thousand page thread, we all salute his indefatiguability. If he's stopped talking it's because your posts have, incredibly, become beneath his contempt. I didn't think that was possible, congratulations.

I would like to disagree but I could only do it through my laughter and a lack of self awareness 😉

Chapeau

Everyone who takes drugs seems to think it makes them interesting, different and funny. Its a **** game.

Excellent, we're now into sweeping stereotypes. The type of statement made by people who don't have any evidence to back up their claims.

Skunk, psychosis and mental illness. Hmmm. Theres one thing I really wouldn't want to become socially acceptable.

is smoking socially acceptable these days? No, it's stigmatised as it's bad for you. Even if drugs were legalised I doubt they'd become socially acceptable in the long run as they'd be subject to all the education, awareness campaigns and restrictions that are currently applied to smoking.

The preserve of teenagers and middle-aged middle-class types who are in denial that they are 18 anymore.

Yes, lets do that. Continue letting young people be punished by the criminal justice system, possibly ruining their future careers for having some fun when they're young. Great plan.

middle-aged middle-class types who are in denial that they are 18 anymore.

Yes, lets do that. Continue letting young people be punished by the criminal justice system, possibly ruining their future careers for having some fun when they're young. Great plan.

Correct me if I'm wrong theres no charge etc if you are found with a small amount/personal consumption. Plus if its illegal- its not rocket science is it? You know you dont have to do it. Unless of course you are addicted to it.

Excellent, we're now into sweeping stereotypes. The type of statement made by people who don't have any evidence to back up their claims.

Coke is a ****s 's drug.

Correct me if I'm wrong theres no charge etc if you are found with a small amount/personal consumption

You're wrong.

Plus if its illegal- its not rocket science is it?

That's sort of the point, isn't. Being illegal isn't stopping people from doing it, so why try? Prohibition doesn't work.

Coke is a **** 's drug.

Thanks for that well reasoned statement.

Correct me if I'm wrong theres no charge etc if you are found with a small amount/personal consumption. Plus if its illegal- its not rocket science is it? You know you dont have to do it. Unless of course you are addicted to it.

Charge is to the discretion of the Procurator fiscal, varies widly from area to area, And yeah you're very right…I don't have to do it…but altered states are bloody good fun and often very affirming/rewarding not to mention that for our entire existence as a species we have been experimenting with substances to aid the changing of our perception. It is our current societal treatment of so called drugs and drug users that are the underlying problem, not the drugs themselves, perhaps we also need to take a step back from the issue and examine how our society has evolved over the past 50 years at such a rapid technological and wealth led pace but at the expense of a true and genuine social inclusion model that seems to be discussed as an afterthought.

Perhaps it would help you understand the current legalisation issue and why our current model of drug legalisation is flawed if you read some of the many Social and Anthropological/Ethnobotanical studies that have been published with regard to historical use of plants and substances to induce altered states, many are online and if you genuinely wish to broaden your understanding of the issues then there is hope for the rest of us who do not hold your polarised view of the world.

I could give incidental information on deaths of most drug but it's incidental so no use what so ever, sorry DazH but that's all your providing and secondhand too.

Err, that was sort of my point. Anecdotal evidence works both ways, which is why I was saying it shouldn't be used to formulate policy. It's heartening to see that this thread has supported my original point though. Most people these days do seem to support legalisation in some form (I rarely meet anyone who doesn't!), and those who don't tend to be the irrational, reactionary and wilfully ignorant types who can't accept that they might be wrong. Hopefully it's only a matter of time before the world sees sense.

And for those asking how it could be done, have a look at Uruguay: [url= http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/22/uruguay-legal-cannabis-1-dollar-gram ]http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/22/uruguay-legal-cannabis-1-dollar-gram[/url]

And for those asking how it could be done, have a look at Uruguay:

No, Uruguay!

Won't happen here. With THC spray selling at £150 a pop there is just too much money to lose.
Very sad for those that could get almost free pain relief but are denied due to legislation and cost.

Thanks for that well reasoned statement.

Shrugs, it is.

People harp on about crime etc yet happily take and ingest drugs grown on murder and misery from the start to our shores.

Now you'll counter me saying 'yeah but if we legalise it we can legalise the supply chain'. Maybe weed but Coke never will be legal.

So people will still love getting off their faces whinging about being burgled etc yet people in foreign countries are being shot etc etc in the process of growing narcotics.

Here - weed growers/sellers aren't exactly nice folk but it'll never be legalised here so those people who see themselves as good citizens put money into non-taxpaying, benefit-loving scumbags.

Abit of generalisation but hey.

And people say doing drugs afect your ability to think coherently and make well reasoned points

It just needed more rANDom CapS L0Cks for the full effect

Yeah thats right. So your saying its ok to turn a blind-eye then?

People who live civilised lives but like the 'edgy-stuff' turn a blindeye to the crime behind their recreational drugs.

Hypocrisy?

civilised lives

What's that then? Sitting on the verandah sipping red wine in your smoking jacket?

It's probably going to never happen, but if a shed load of countries did legalise cocaine then the process of making the stuff wouldn't be as deadly and immoral as it currently is. That's almost definitely a pipe dream though.

Its probably best to not going down the line of accusing people of being hypocrites though. The number of people who'll walk around wearing clothing from sweatshops or using electronics that have been made in appalling conditions wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

Here - weed growers/sellers aren't exactly nice folk but it'll never be legalised here so those people who see themselves as good citizens put money into non-taxpaying, benefit-loving scumbags.

You should probably stop now Hora, you're just showing up your prejudices as well as your lack of forward thinking.

turn a blindeye to the crime behind their recreational drugs.

Hypocrisy?

I am sure many users would be delighted to buy organic fair traded drugs - could you suggest a supply route currently?

It is obvious the only way to make it nice[r] is to legalise it.

PS you really could do with chillin 8)

you really could do with chillin

I'm confused.. I haven't really taken any illegal drugs for years and years now, bar the occasional drunken line at a festival or a sneaky toke on a spliff at a gig.. I certainly haven't bought any drugs in over a decade..

I do however enjoy munching pharmaceuticals like smarties, especially benzodiazepine tranquilizers.. Do we have any opinions on this behaviour?

Do we have any opinions on this behaviour?

Everything in moderation, young yunki.

(Including moderation, to finish the quote.)

I do however enjoy munching pharmaceuticals like smarties, especially benzodiazepine tranquilizers.. Do we have any opinions on this behaviour?

It's just grown-up drug taking. Whenever I go to visit the folks, I can't leave without first raiding my mum's drawer full of prescription painkillers that she has been given for various ailments (she never takes them BTW, before I get accused of causing any suffering).

The trouble with weed being illegal is that now I'm over 40 and look sensible I find it virtually impossible to get hold of. I do like a nice fatty on a Friday before I watch a film or kip in the van. If this makes me evil then so be it.

My GF has gone back to smoking weed to help her through the final year of her university design degree, or so she tells me! I have to say that I've definitely notice a difference in her general attitude to life, as well as obvious signs (to me, at least) of mild paranoia in the mornings.

[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-26672422 ]BBC link - cheap £6 gets you "stairway to heaven"[/url]

🙄

Your point, caller?

whatnobeer - Member

Your point, caller?

Guns should be legalised if drugs are to be legalised. Simple.

Say whatever you want regarding guns but guns never kill.

🙄

Guns should be legalised if drugs are to be legalised. Simple.

Yeah, you tried that one before. Didn't work very well. If pure, legal heroin was available to those users in that article I suspect many of them wouldn't be in the situation they're in. And just because something is legal doesn't mean that its consumption is encouraged or condoned.

Dear Oldboy -

Tell her to make some edibles - much less crashy. Best eaten in moderation on an empty stomach an hour before dinner.

Signed

A final year Design student.

EDIT
[IMG] [/IMG]
Shit - where's the tupperware?

whatnobeer - Member

Yeah, you tried that one before. Didn't work very well. If pure, legal heroin was available to those users in that article I suspect many of them wouldn't be in the situation they're in. And just because something is legal doesn't mean that its consumption is encouraged or condoned.

Yes, I know it did not work well when guns are mentioned.
People are simply too afraid of guns because of the assumption that we will start killing each other en masse. Guns are protection as they keep everyone at bay, I mean it is the equalizer. e.g. others have to think twice before they do the nasty to you.

The assumption that pure heroin is less harmful is just an assumption. If a person is an addict then s/he is an addict regardless of the purity of the drugs. S/he will not be able to function with out a fix and will be totally under its influence. Addiction first the rest of the family second. There bound to be families that got worst because of legalisation.

Also the fact that some people who try to "get away" from life problems will seek comfort in drugs (not all as some use other means) and if they are poor then the problem will escalate.

chewkw: would you start taking drugs if they were legal?

I do however enjoy munching pharmaceuticals like smarties, especially benzodiazepine tranquilizers.. Do we have any opinions on this behaviour?

Not an opinion, an observation, the worries you talk about on here match some of the listed side effects.

Positive and negative effects have to be considered with prescription meds as well as illegal ones. Only the user and the people (s)he's with can decide if the net result of using the drug is positive or negative for the them, and society has to decide if the increased accident rate and lost work days can be tolerated with some. I enjoy a couple of glasses of wine but rarely drink more as I don't like groggy days.

I'm confused.. I haven't really taken any illegal drugs for years and years now, bar the occasional drunken line at a festival or a sneaky toke on a spliff at a gig.. I certainly haven't bought any drugs in over a decade..

I do however enjoy munching pharmaceuticals like smarties, especially benzodiazepine tranquilizers.. Do we have any opinions on this behaviour?

It's simple; if you are prescribed them by your doctor, then you are clearly a good honest taxpayer/consumer. If you didn't, you're nothing but an evil criminal junky scumbag.

😉

On a serious note, be careful with benzo's. If you get addicted to them the withdrawals can be horrific.

Tell her to make some edibles - much less crashy. Best eaten in moderation on an empty stomach an hour before dinner

Thanks, gofasterstripes, my GF smiled when I showed her your post. I did make her promise that she wouldn't mix any of it in my food, though - I have enough problems without that! 🙂

sbob - Member

chewkw: would you start taking drugs if they were legal?

No. That does not mean everyone thinks like me.

For example, if pubs were to rely on me as customer they will go bankrupt rather quickly as I only drink one small bottle every few months. On the other hand, drinking and drug (whatever they are using) cultures are rather prominent amongst the youth here so the possibility of getting addicted is high. Would you let your children get addicted to alcohol let alone class A stuff?

I do agree that it is individual choice but then if you were to legalise drugs then there are many things that should be legalised too. Where do you draw the line? 🙄

if you were to legalise drugs then there are many things that should be legalised too.

Why?
Because it weakens your extremely poor argument if you can't use reductio ad absurdum?

No. That does not mean everyone thinks like me.

True, but you have a sample of one and still choose to ignore the outcome.

Most people try drugs a few times and then jack them in.
Legality of a substance has no bearing on that whatsoever.
It does have a bearing on the wider picture; encouraging criminality et cetera.