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No it’s not Steve, don’t think he is or was sailing a blaze at that time. He used to sail a 300 back in the day, believe he is tossing around in an aero sporadically now? But i have been out of the game for a few years now, excluding a dusting of the old hikers in a solo earlier this year...
Still, small world eh.
Isn’t it ever!
2018 would have been Devon which makes your mate Charlie?
That was some interesting racing, I remember reaching up and down the start looking for a gap in the penultimate race, finding one, then realising the whole fleet was effectively pinned there by the tide! Took about 50 tacks up the beach to reach the windward mark! He did well to do so consistently, the rest of the usual suspects were doing well but for every top three in one race would pick the wrong side and be in the bottom half the next.
For the benefit of the OP we should probably point out that dinghy sailing is very tribal. Pick a class, buy a boat and defend your choice to the death before buying whatever RS is pushing this year and dropping the next, then buy a solo or OK and tell anyone its for the tactical racing. Get bored and buy a moth, musto or 49er, realise they only really work in certain conditions/locations, buy whatever RS is now pushing, buy a 300 or a 600 if you're really brave, sell it and buy a blaze, sell that and buy a 100/D1 because you dont like knee pads and do like something to keep you entertained downwind before finally getting a 12, 400 or Merlin depending on how much you like pies, beer and bits of string.
Its all pointless though as the handicap system makes a 50 year old sideboard/coffin with a handkerchief for a sail (aka a Solo) just as competitive as an Aero. And the need to make money selling the latest and shinyest boats means dinghy parks are stuffed with classes abandoned by Laser, topper and RS over the years means there are more classes out there than sailors. But the Aero (RS's latest boat) will absolutely, definitley take off and become the one design that everyone races for the next 20 years or more, absolutely definitely.
It is Charlie yes, he is an exceptional (multi class champ) but no real surprise, his father is a former POW winner. He has always been very, very good. In fact it was him, who got me back out in July to sail his Solo at an open.
I could talk all day about whats wrong with dinghy sailing. Unfortunately some of the politics, tribalism and questionably corrupt business and Olympic selection processes ruin (for me) what is ultimately an exceptional pass time. I stepped away a few years ago as the nonsense that comes with the sport was ruining the enjoyment. The Moribund sailing clubs and class that litter the country, too fixed in their ways and not willing to change to suit modern lifestyles. Hamstrung because dinghy sailors, by and large are cheap. A second hand market where people believe its their right to make a profit on a used boat. A sport where people find it acceptable to commit insurance fraud to obtain new kit. Obvious gerrymandering of the handicap system by builders. A self policing sport, where everyone is too polite to point out the cheating if it breaks from the club/class pecking order. A sport where its governing body rapes and pillages is long standing class Associations to attend a "Show" in central London with exhibition rates taxing the class coffers, only to be branded a "Dead" class if you cant afford to pay for the stand. Unfortunately i allowed myself to become too entwined with the sport and its infrastructure to see it first hand. I would always urge others to really take time to consider the correct sailing club and equipment for them. But remember one of the purest joys in life is sailing a boat and not to get too bogged down with club racing, national and international racing like I did. Really the sport needs some consolidation...IMO
....So if you are looking at a Laser, please don't waste your life loosing into whats happening with that class from a politics perspective. Just enjoy it for what it was meant to be. A simple, cheap, fun to sail boat.
Well said, my clubs doing OK, but I sent a stropy letter last week as the racing format just doesnt work if you're under 65 anymore. The racing is split arround lunch which basicly wipes out your sunday for 2x 45min races. They could bump them back a couple of hours to a 1pm start and still be off the water by 3 in winter. But no..... the oldies bladders cant take 2 hours in a wetsuit but can give up a whole day.
Next season i think i'll just do open meetings. With a bit of planning between an active class and the sailjuice type events you can still do 20+ weekends a year, and if you discount the class events its probably not that much more than the club fees.
🤪
Same old arguments I see.
Not really encouraging newbies into the sport with the above comments 🤣
Buy something that suits your ability, ask at your local club what people sail and it that suits you, buy one of them.
Then go get wet.
🤷♂️
I'm still having plenty of fun in club' training Picos at the moment. Planning on heading up to the club this pm to tag onto the back of the 'slow racing fleet' race (if that's the right terminology) to see how its done / get in the way !
FWIW I spent some time trying to sail an Aero last year. I just couldn’t. It was 15mins of sailing and 75mins of swimming - mainly down to how light it is. I weigh 90kg, the aero all-up is 30. Just getting back in after a capsize was tremendously difficult for me.
The whole class thing is a minefield. My advice is; pick your club, sail the class they sail, do the opens/national events for that class. The moment you try and run menagerie or racing that requires a PY conversion it loses the point as far as I’m concerned.
I've got an old wooden Phantom sat in the garage at the mo drying out.
Needs a couple of deck panels replacing and a repair round the transom, then a lick of paint and a varnish.
It's going to be a winter project, so hopefully back on the water for the spring.
I used to own a Couple of Phantoms Moff.
Think my original wooden one was 921 - could be wrong, it was very lightly bullied and fast. I put my fist through the side deck in a fit of rage (with myself) it was so lightly built. I purchased a modern epoxy one a few years later and it was a different boat altogether. A real PY bandit. My brother owns a nearly new Ovington built one with the latest CST carbon rig, it’s a brute of a boat and I was always too small for them. I guess my brother is 100kg... phantom is a prime example of where the PY system falls over. Fast development of old classes. But great fleet and a joy to sail. I did Abersoch dinghy week in mine and struggled in the waves. I was just not man enough I guess to work the boat through the chop especially with that deep bow section.
Hey Russyh,
This one's 920, it's a home build inspired by the Claridge design at the time. I've got all the original paperwork, measurement forms, pre-build correspondence etc - this one will have a tin rig.
Many years ago used to borrow one sailing at Bewl, was always too light for it then but it was fun. 85kg now so hopefully just about heavy enough.
The one I always loved was Roger Thomas' from around 1995, had a lovely curved raised floor and early Angel carbon spars.
Here's a distraction from the dinghy politics...
Me, a Pico and a gorgeous sunset last night 😀. First time out solo for 20yrs..was absolutely fine and remembered everything. Wind craft could do with sharpening a bit and my knees are too old for a Pico, but it was still an absolute hoot in the gusts.
👍👍💨☀️
Dinghy sailing, and sailing in general is perhaps one of the best ways to meet people who'll become life long friends. Not only that, but it can give you an 'in' into virtually every country / city. Wherever there is a sailing club, you can visit and have something in common. Such a large 'global' family is awesome whilst travelling. Sailors generally also do loads of interesting stuff too. Like mountain biking, climbing, kiting plus BBQs drinking and making merry.
Sailing is truly a gateway to a fabulous lifestyle if you want to go down that route.
I started sailing with my father in a Merlin Rocket, learned to sail 'properly' in a mirror. Raced a mirror unit about 16/17 then took over my old man's Merlin. Laser IIs, Larks, Fireballs, 505s, various catamarans. Also started racing keelboats, from club to international level (and still do). After a break from dinghy sailing, Ultra 30 for a season then got a Boss followed by a 49er. After campaigning the 49er for 5 years, got to about halfway up the UK fleet and decided that both time, money were precious, plus got to about my talent limit. But, kept racing all sorts of keelboats winning numerous UK and international events.
It's now become work. In 2013, a significant career change had me using sailing skills as engineer on big (superyacht) sailing boats. Currently working on a 128' carbon sloop. Little clip of good weather on last year's ARC
Friends all over the world. Literally. I keep bumping in to people I sailed against or with from years ago.
Sailing = Friendship. Join the family!!
Brilliant 👍
Good to hear some positive stories...
I started in a Sailfish dinghy back in Florida, ended up here in the UK and jumped into Lasers doing the qualifiers just before Ben and Ian tramped us all.. Became good mates with John and Glyn (470’s) sailed all sorts from N12 (still one of my favourite dinghies) Fireflys, jumped into 4 & 5 tonners when the circuits were just awesome, then 800’s then 200’s then 700’s. Did the Melges24 circuits when it was the class to be in, Hyde sponsored (you’ll know who with, no need to post his name) and Dave from Ovington then Mumm30’s/Farr40’s did a couple of worlds on those and all the big boat regattas did very well indeed... loads of RORC stuff. Bounced on the earlier Kerr’s, jumped on Wolf when it was bloody competitive but that didn’t t last long, I couldn’t hold down a decent job and sail too.
Best events for me have been the more friendly ones like Salcombe Week, Fed Week, the N12 fleet and Merlins were so competitive but seriously FUN.
Now, well foiling isn’t really my thing so Moths are out of the question ... and bloody expensive too... so what do I do now? SUP Surfing and Windsurfing... simple, paired down you and the water stuff.
Its been a fantastic few decades, made a ton of mates, been invited to loads of events and gatherings... one mate has asked me to helm in an 800 for the 20th nationals at Eastbourne... 20 bloody years!!! We’ve been out a handful of times in it and given a decent fist of chucking around Chichester Harbour in training...
Yadda yadda.
Fair winds to you all...
Bet we know each other by sight 🤪😎🤯
Im sorry if my posting came across overly negative. I would encourage anyone to give the sport a go. I have certainly made friends for life and even though I am negative to the very worse parts of sailing now, I know that at any point in the future I can pick it back up. It’s not a particularly expensive sport, with a new dinghy costing similar amounts to top end bikes, but with much better residual values.
Hi Jerry
*waves*
300th anniversary of Cork next year mate..... Going to be a quiet affair 😉
Looks like I'm on Impostor for that and the Wave Regatta in Howth as a warm-up event.
My kidneys hurt just thinking about it!!
Mr Sharkbait,
Glad that you’re dusting off the aging rockstar spandex once again. Show the Imposter nippers a think or 7!
Quick pit stop in Howth for a Saturday series race (busman's holiday) on the 14th on CM XVIII.
Next year’ll be mostly a write-off. It’ll be a leisurely trip over the Pacific. Due EnZed in Nov 20, finishing with the AC.
Hopefully back for a short stretch in the autumn. Howz you’re pedalling legs? Get Nipper and Bradders out?
It’s not a particularly expensive sport,
Well it’s not? You can pick up a laser that will win you club races for £1k club membership for the year can be as little as a hundred quid. In a years or two time the laser is still worth the bloody same. Brand new single handed like a D-Zero or RS Aero are about £7-8k which is the same sort of money as a top end MTB (my Mojo is a balmy £7k+ RRP) you can absolutely spend as much as you want, but the cost of entry is not high. Even sailing kit is cheaper than MTB stuff. Second hand stuff is readily available - I set up the Dinghy bits selling page on Facebook with a friend and it’s very active!
Well that was an 'interesting' 2 hours last night. I didn't really get to observe / tag on the back of any racing as I was too occupied trying to keep my boat upright. Felt mentally and physically fried when I came back in ! They cancelled the race after the first lap as it was too windy, which seems strange to me with it being a race for wind powered boats ?? _ Perhaps they felt sorry for the crew that broke their carbon-fibre mast ? Makes me feel a bit better about breaking the tiller extension on 1 of the club boats though.
It varies by club, class and local conditions as to what counts as too much wind. But dont forget youre in the water, if something breaks and you cant bodge it (whilst its flapping over your head with enough force to break bones) then you're either in trouble or going to need rescuing or both.
If it's boat breaking weather then its great fun, right untill youre writing cheques for a new £1500 mast!
Well today our club is starting another 8 week Women-On- Water training initiative. We do this every year post back to school for Women who either want to try or improve their sailing, and get to know more like minded folks. It’s been very well attended over the last few years with 50-60 Women out playing. We have some very inspired Women, and some very well connected Professional Women sailors who come and chat, and give talks etc.
I’m helping out today (as I’ve done previously) should be a giggle and guess which boats we’re using??
RSAeros... obvz is obvz 🤷♂️🤪
any mention the Aero? These guys seem to be getting a bit of a work-out
We have one - I'm no great sailor and it was pretty challenging at first but I am getting to grips with it (a bit) as is my daughter - but the Mrs not so much. I can now sail relatively confidently in 15 knots or so - not 35 knots as in the vid
also I am 95 kg's and have got quite good at getting back in after a capsize (lots of practice.....)
Good video Charlie, which isn't helping with my decision ! - He looks like I felt on Wednesday !
I'm liking his gybing technique at 2.25mins. - looks better than trying to pull loads of sheet in through the blocks like we were taught.
Grab it at the block on the boom, just like laser bouys have been doing for 20+ years... and modern Assy sailors..
Just displaying my beginner credentials bikebouy !
Pulling the sheet through is far safer as it generally means the boom only slams across the last bit. Which also has benefits in high winds, if you keep the boat heading dead downwind then it presents less sail to the wind and keeps things calm. But on a faster boat like the aero the opposite is true, you want to gybe at maximum speed to minimise the apparent wind speed. On the sea youd do it surfing down a wave which might even get the wind to drop to nothing. So the gybe routine is get it planing if it's not already, and get it over quickly, the steer an S shape (i.e. you started on a broad reach, and went right round to the other broad reach to initiate the gybe, then back to a run). This buys you a few seconds to get hiking, get your speed up and the apparent wind down, before you luff up onto a reach again. Going straight from reach to reach tends to result in a capsize as you slow down and suddenly the apparent wind builds up just as you're perpendicular to it.
Or do a granny tack, its still quicker than a capsize in a race!
Just displaying my beginner credentials bikebouy !
Hey, no worries. Just sayin. It’s much easier, since you don’t have to sheet in 5mtrs of main, then go through and try and dump it all again.
And there’s more to grab hold of.
Grab it, go through gybe, flick over and give it a tug as it just goes past DDW so the battens pop and then release gradually as the boat powers back up again.. get comfy, reach off in plumes of spray.
🤪👍💨💨💨💨💨
First race last night since some laser racing in 1996.
Came 3rd..
..Out of 4.
..Narrowly beating a 10yr old who capsized his topper 8 times due to his (lack of) weight..
...I'll take that as a podium still 😀 😀
That vid ^
Sorry but that's not even close to 35 knots.
Typical sailors/fishermen....
Oh yes it was 35+ knots/thiiiis big
I once took the halo rig out in an actual 35knot (gusting 45), the rig did some interesting shapes, the boom was bent like a bow and no ammount of tension would stop the mast inverting. Couldn't even sheet in and at the time i was 115kg!
Managed to reach across the pond and back again a few times barely in control before deciding to come ashore before i broke something 😂
Ohh, and build yourself a hiking bench, it's like turbo training for dinghy sailors, only a lot more painful but you only have to do it for 5-10 minutes a day. Once you've reached a point where you can hike to the point of boredom (ha!) Incorporate kettlebels.
Most club sailors are a lot less fit than they probably should be so a lot of cycling and a hiking bench will get you a long way up the fleet!
The oldest Udder has just told us he wants to sail dinghies rather than play football in his local team, and I'm trying not to skip with joy. There's a wooden Optimist in our garage that I picked up for a song just in case that will get an outing.
I accidentally got into big boats at the age of 17 and didn't keep my dinghy habit going, but it's a heck of a lot more doable as a parent than heading down to Hamble at 5pm on Thursday and returning on Monday morning. I'm going to apply for membership at my old sailing club over the winter.
I've had a go in a borrowed Aero at an open meeting and didn't totally disgrace myself, but I'm not sure I can stretch to buying one, and I'd like to be able to take the Udderlets (7 and 9) out racing at club level so they really get bitten by the bug. Papercourt SC has a Grad fleet, but I've always had a massive soft spot for National 12s, so something like this FF is on the cards, I feel. Should be right in the good weight range for inland, and T foils look interesting...
That’s stunning...
I looked at that one too.
🤪👍👍👍👍
Yeah, it's Teh Sexy but not something I can stretch to at the mo. Maybe if it's still around in the New Year.
To echo what 49er Jerry said up there ^^ it's a brilliant sport for meeting people. I spent pretty much all of my holiday time in my 20s either racing mountain bikes or keelboats.
I'm very jealous of your hours on Mumm 30s, Bikebuoy; I was racing 707s and X35s and the occasional Humphreys 30 out of Royal Southern and the Mumms always looked like hugely fun boats, and just 'right' as well. Brucie Baby can draw some lovely lines, can't he?
It was a wonderful time that’s for sure.
The Mumm30 was just the right mix of big dinghy/keelboat handling, and fairly short number crew so that helped with a “mates” environment.
And the Solent was almost designed for them 🤪
Most enjoyable though were the Melges24’s, great scene, great mates, fantastic close racing, exhilarating downwind in a blow, with just enough offshore about them to be handled in open water in a swell...
Ahhh! Those were the days... 🤗
Was totally unaware of the RS Aero. Blimey, looked like a boat that could have the appeal of some windsurfers for me.
Looks brilliant and responsive to any gusts off wind, and at 30kg it should do so...
Most enjoyable though were the Melges24’s
Meh. J24 was the boat to be in during the 80's and 90's. It attracted the best sailors in the world and the racing was pretty amazing with >100 boats at the major regattas.
I was fairly heavily involved and was lucky enough to be crewing for Laurie Smith when he/we won the Europeans and then got asked by Ken Read (possibly one of the best US sailors ever) to go to the states and crew for him for 6 months (various wins Inc the J24 North Americans which was arguably more important than the World's).
So it's very true that sailing will open doors for you if you want.
It’s all about the size of the mast... or the waves... 🤗
Just on the off chance someone here knows of one for sale.. Im after an RS 500
Well actually Mrs Cloudnine wants one (she's a dinghy instructor.. and wants me as her victim crew.)
HS she posted a wanted ad on the Dinghy and dinghy bits Facebook page? Usually get a good response.
HS she posted a wanted ad on the Dinghy and dinghy bits Facebook page? Usually get a good response.
Yep.. and apollo duck.. annoyingly missed a really nice cheap one about 6 weeks ago that someone bought then re sold on for £1k profit
Most enjoyable though were the Melges24’s
Meh.
Meh indeed 🤷♂️
Can I just drop a proud dad moment in here....
My 10 year old has been out racing this afternoon in a Topper and has pulled off his first proper dry capsize. He is dead chuffed and I'm really proud of how he's developing his skills.
This is his first season sailing solo since doing his Stage 2 during last year. We've been building up the skills and confidence carefully all year and despite his light weight he is sailing the standard 5.3m2 rig (not the little one).
Today the wind was comfortably peaking into f4 and very gusty with some big 20-30 degree shifts on the beat and watching him he just looked so in control and measured (and unlike his dad wasn't OCS at the start 😭).
Oh and if we're doing sportsboats can I give the Bull 7000 an honourable mention? Not the same size of fleet racing of Melges or J's but great fun to sail and enough space to sleep aboard for a few days too.
👏👏 to your son, that’s a very good step forward and builds loads of confidence....
Bull, never sailed one... by the time i’d sort of packed in sports boats the SB3 was well underway, did half the Warsy Spring Series with a guy from the club...
So what’s the Bull like ?
Not a lot to compare the Bull too in sportsboat terms but it was really good fun downwind especially in a blow, lots of volume in the bow and a curvy transitioning to flat shape at the rear. That and the swinging bowsprit that meant you could soak down really deep when the 1720s and Melges were still heading up to fill the kites. Hardest bits were going to windward in a blow (the voluminous bow and higher sides worked against it) and coordinating the swing of the gennaker pole from side to side at the exact moment the kite came over. Just realised it's been well over a decade since I set foot on one! I sailed with a really nice and talented skipper who then bought a cruiser and to my embarrassment I lost touch with him (and a number of others there) a year or two after that as I slipped away from the sport and HISC due to personal circumstances.
I also had a one off trip on a Mumm 30 back in the mid noughties on a very windy Warsash Spring Series day when all the smaller stuff got canceled. I think the core crew were ex European champs in the class and that was a phenomenal day out. Total calm and control aboard on a really brutal day.
Oh and if we’re doing sportsboats can I give the Bull 7000 an honourable mention
.... Not really 😉
Cheeky blighter ^ but seeing some of your former sailing compatriots I'll allow a whiff of class one-upmanship from you.
Adjustable bowsprits (wingwangs) are dead handy. I used one on a proto trailer sailer thing somewhere between a Bull and a Melges in aspiration and performance, and it made a hell of a difference to be able to tack the pole up to windward. It was scratch built by the designer / builder and worked an absolute treat. We ran it in a very light airs Cowes Week one year and the ability to sneak up on our compatriots in our class, all of whom had at least 15 more WL feet on us, while they weren't looking and zip by to windward was giggle inducingly-fun.
Oh, and good on your son, G-D; that must have been a satisfying day for all involved. My dad has somehow acquired a spare Topper for us for peanuts, but both our boys are still a little bit too little for it and it's salted away down in Dartmouth for a bit. The gunwhales are a bit ragged so I need to do a pressure test to see how leaky it is, but it should fix up with a bit of white spirit and some new hardware.
Got me a laser. Nice 2010 boat with road trailer, trolley, 3 sails (including 1 unused genuine laser) and few upgrades. Let the fun begin.
🤠
👍
Good choice... enjoy playing in it...
So what options are there for renting a dingy?
I don't have anywhere to keep one and I'm more interested as a leisure activity than seriously.
I looked at this (a bit) before but it all seemed like you need certification to rent and I really can't be arsed. I was sailing dingies from 7 or 8 to 13-14 and just took out a big Kat with my brother a couple of weeks ago.. and much as I get it might be techy for someone never done it before it was like riding a bike.
My club rents them.. mainly RS Fleets (Zaps/Varios/Fevas/Ventures/Laser2000) for about £40per day.
First race yesterday. A solid 7th out of 7 with probably half a dozen capsizes.
7th out of 7? Congrats on the first step!
I've been sailing for years and years, but not competitively until about 3 years ago. In 3 years I've made steady progress from last in every race to about 2/3rds down the fleet. It's definitely one of those sports that you have to work at to improve. I even bought a Gopro to film myself so I could see where I'm going wrong. Simple stuff like being smoother on tacks make a huge difference - and makes it much less likely to fluff it up that one time (you know - that one time that happens 2 or 3 times a race and costs you 5 places!!)
Keep going - racing is the only way to really improve IMO.
Haha, been there......
Next tips:
1) do not underestimate fitness. The most experienced guy in the club will be going half the speed of a spotty teenager because he isnt hiking as hard.
2) get a decent book on laser sailing and pick one bit of more advanced technique to practice each day. There really isnt a huge ammount of physical stuff to learn, its mostly stringing it together whilst exhausted (see point 1) and making tactical decisions.
First race yesterday. A solid 7th out of 7 with probably half a dozen capsizes.
Whoop 👍🤪🤪
Gybing in a bit of breeze ???
If so, grab the main by the traveller and fling it over your head but don’t let it all the way out.. keep a good arm full for the pump.... then let go.
Awesome 👍
Thanks for the words of encouragement guys. Capsizes weren’t just limited to gybing, I think I got the full set, including what felt like a massive wipeout on a run downwind. Even Managed a few during the day without getting wet. I’m only about 75kgs, and reckon I need to eat some more pies to help balance the boat. I’ve been recommended the boat whisperer Cds ??
Boat whisperer vids are good, but the temptation is to try and do all of the tips at once. It’s best to work on getting something right consistently and then move in IMO.
75Kg is ample for a laser... You just need to work harder.
Basically the harder you hike the fast you'll go!
Wiping out downwind: board up too far or main/vang eased too much. If you let the leach of the sail (at the top) get too far in front of the mast you'll enter death toll territory.... Apply a bit more vang (if you're easing it downwind) or don't sheet out fully.
This is a bit of a mad old long shot, but is anyone or does anyone know anyone interested in crewing a Scorpion at a club in Dunford Bridge (near Sheffield, Manchester and Huddersfield)?
Now I'm in Scotland my dad is left crewless and would like someone who has a bit of an idea about what they're doing to go in the front of the boat for club sailing.