squirrelking - Member
That woman might be politically wise but socially a stoopid woman.
Why do you feel the need to bring gender into it? You could have left it as her being socially stoopid [sic] but no, it's because she's a woman as well.
Arrghhh ... just as a matter of speech like saying "That woman!" (I actually learned this from an old female secretary when she was pissed off with the female manager ... they hate each other btw ... she usually referred to the manager as "that woman!" when talking to me ... so funny. ) I am not referring to all women ... just Merkel.
athgray - Member
Do you not mean Islamic population?
Yes, me mates are Chinese muslims so they look like all Chinese.
Yes I am aware of China's significant muslim population. Every country in the world has at least a muslim minority population, however you are missing my point.
OK, I thought did not know but they are not always minority.
It is possible to place restrictions on travel by citizenship, quite another to place restrictions by religion.
Yes, absolutely and purely based on religion. I am willing to bet all my bikes for your precious tablet if you have one. Israel is banned because of their belief ... we ban Israel as a country and belief etc ...
The Yanks wouldn't know whether to let me in or not. There is no mention of my religion or lack of on any official document, France being a secular state and all that. My passport, birth certificate and marriage certificate are all devoid of any religious reference.
Edukator - Troll
The Yanks wouldn't know whether to let me in or not. There is no mention of my religion or lack of on any official document, France being a secular state and all that. My passport, birth certificate and marriage certificate are all devoid of any religious reference.
Pork crackling test ... 😆
If you eat you pass ... if you don't you are banned.
For vegan you hold the animal skin to ransom by threatening to beat the leather shoe and if the person reacts s/he is a vegan, if not s/he should go for the pork crackling test ...
😆
edit: they can ask you to declare ... if you refuse they ban you. If you lie you get ban for 10 years or forever.
edit edit: did I say I like pork crackling me ...
The stable Europe of the past few decades has run it's course. With Muslims creating so many problems on such a regular basis and the whole scenario being enabled by thick lefty politicians in power, then it's just a matter of time before a proper public backlash occurs. Merkel should be held to blame for this.
Edukator
The Yanks wouldn't know whether to let me in or not. There is no mention of my religion or lack of on any official document, France being a secular state and all that. My passport, birth certificate and marriage certificate are all devoid of any religious reference.
As far as I can tell a passport will contain all the info Trump needs to decide if you are a muslim. Name and photograph. Job done.
That is about all he has to go on although he could go on appearance and facebook background check.
I can imagine American intelligence sifting social media,
"Madjid Hussain was tagged with Sadiq Khan at London Central Mosque 16:13pm Friday 08th Jan."
As far as I can tell a passport will contain all the info Trump needs to decide if you are a muslim. Name and photograph. Job done.
Well they're not waiting for President Trump, they're already preventing Muslims from visiting Disneyland.
DrJ
Well they're not waiting for President Trump, they're already preventing Muslims from visiting Disneyland.
Is this reference to the family that were refused entry from the UK for a holiday to Disneyland?
If so I agree this appears to be a shameful case. It is a big step up to becoming national policy, which Trump is calling for.
the bees
The stable Europe of the past few decades has run it's course. With Muslims creating so many problems on such a regular basis and the whole scenario being enabled by thick lefty politicians in power, then it's just a matter of time before a proper public backlash occurs. Merkel should be held to blame for this.
The largest challenges Europe has faced in the past 20-30 years have far from being the fault of muslims.
The Balkans war, the economic crash, terrorism(far from being the sole preserve of Islam). I feel Europe has never been more stable than it is now.
I suppose being out of it would allow people to turn a blind eye. Boatloads of people turning up at Greece or Italy can be someone else's problem.
terrorism(far from being the sole preserve of Islam)
athgray, really ? Enlighten me. Who is actually carrying out all of this terrorism if not Muslims?
athgray - Member
The largest challenges Europe has faced in the past 20-30 years have far from being the fault of muslims.
I hope next time when you enter the forest (assuming you like camping) you see firewood unless you are blind. 🙄
Trolls are obvious and they live under the bridge ...
The Balkans war, the economic crash, terrorism(far from being the sole preserve of Islam). I feel Europe has never been more stable than it is now.
Ya, might as well say the earth is round. Innit! 😯
thebees
terrorism(far from being the sole preserve of Islam)
athgray, really ? Enlighten me. Who is actually carrying out all of this terrorism if not Muslims?
If you quote me correctly I talk of terrorism in Europe over the past 20-30 years.
Omagh,Manchester,Canary Wharf, Barcelona(1987,2000), Vitoria (2000) Madrid (2001,2002), Oslo (2011).
These are just a few of many. I bet you only remember the muslim ones. 😉
terrorism(far from being the sole preserve of Islam)
athgray, really ? Enlighten me. Who is actually carrying out all of this terrorism if not Muslims?
There's loads of terrorism in America carried out by christian/right-wing nut jobs - many more incidents than Islamic terrorism (though much less effective in terms of body counts). Christians massacre people in Nigeria, there's Buddhist terrorists. The Muslims (ISIS) have got the best social media strategy though.
grum
There's loads of terrorism in America carried out by christian/right-wing nut jobs - many more incidents than Islamic terrorism (though much less effective in terms of body counts). Christians massacre people in Nigeria, there's Buddhist terrorists. The Muslims (ISIS) have got the best social media strategy though.
grum, I was specific regarding Europe, however you do raise a valid point. Social media makes the world a small place, and terrorists that use Islam to justify their action have probably hit the upsurge of this phenomenon. I reckon the likes of Timothy McVeigh and David Koresh could have gained a lot of support if social media existed then.
http://womanstats.org/newmapspage.html
Thought I'd throw this in, just to show how shit things can be for women outside the western world and how we absolutely have an empirically better culture than most of the rest of the world.
I think that it's about time that the west started being less embarrassed of itself and it's colonial past - and become more vocal in voicing and pushing it's cultural ideals.
Tom_1987
Thought I'd throw this in, just to show how shit things can be for women outside the western world and how we absolutely have an empirically better culture than most of the rest of the world.I think that it's about time that the west started being less embarrassed of itself and it's colonial past - and become more vocal in voicing and pushing it's cultural ideals.
By the Western world do you mean Europe and North America? If not please clarify.
I think that it's about time that the west started being less embarrassed of itself and it's colonial past - and become more vocal in voicing and pushing it's cultural ideals.
How do you suggest we do this? Invading/bombing countries perhaps?
Those stats you posted are pretty shocking and I won't disagree that they do show that western societies are in many ways more advanced than others - however, you think it's really all about culture?
I also think you're trolling a bit here TBH.
We could start by refusing to compromise the freedom and equality that we all enjoy and speaking out against those who would try and do so.
I'd be happy to see religious courts outlawed, zero tolerance toward the promotion of racist and homophobic acts, the mutilation of children and the different treatment of the sexes in so called 'faith' schools.
I'd be happy to see religious courts outlawed, zero tolerance toward the promotion of racist and homophobic acts, the mutilation of children and the different treatment of the sexes in so called 'faith' schools.
Yup no problem with any of that, as long as we're not just picking on the muslims.
Pitiful lefty logic being thrown about here. Using IRA bombings as an example of non-muslim terrorist activity just shows the strength of your argument. Get a spine and address the real problem.
How do you suggest we do this? Invading/bombing countries perhaps?
That's a bit of a stretch mate?
different treatment of the sexes in so called 'faith' schools.
Or outlaw them altogether?
If you can point out one single example of Islamophobia in anything I have ever posted on this forum, please do so.
Otherwise, I resent the implication, tbh.
Attempting to promote genuine social democracy is not racist.
It's the exact opposite.
I've no time for 'cultural differences' which undermine the protection we offer to the vulnerable, whatever faith, colour or sexuality they happen to be.
Aimed at me, rusty?
As for thebees, the example of Ni terrorism is as good as any (I can't imagine why this would not be a valid example), and the balkans were certainly related to islam (if not in an extremist sense).
No wrecker, of course not.
No idea where that came from.
If it was aimed at anyone in particular I would say so.
I'm just stating what I believe.
I said the same thing on pages 2 & 3. I really should stop repeating myself.
🙂
The problem I have is that people seem to throw non western beliefs towards the religion of Islam. Tom_W1987's maps are supposed to show the West as better than the rest however I reckon it is put forward as an anti muslim rant.
From the maps I see that sub Saharan Africa, China, India and South America do not do so well from our 'Western' point of view.
No wrecker, of course not.
Cool 😀
Well I'll say it; I'd like to see any educational facility based on religion barred.
A recent visit to NI left me amazed that their schools are still split among sectarian lines. The prod school my cousins attended played rugby (soccer wasn't allowed!!!) I was honestly gobsmacked until someone pointed out that England has Catholic, christian and muslim schools.
Education should be religion free. Space can be made for observance (such a the exams thing), otherwise if it doesn't teach facts; it has no place.
wrecker - Member
No wrecker, of course not.Cool
Well I'll say it; I'd like to see any educational facility based on religion barred.
A recent visit to NI left me amazed that their schools are still split among sectarian lines. The prod school my cousins attended played rugby (soccer wasn't allowed!!!) I was honestly gobsmacked until someone pointed out that England has Catholic, christian and muslim schools.
Soccer presumably not allowed since it's too working class. Nothing to do with religion.
I don't think so jimjam. It's not a private school, and the area is the same one that the local catholic school recruit from. It's certainly not class based.
If you can point out one single example of Islamophobia in anything I have ever posted on this forum, please do so.Otherwise, I resent the implication, tbh.
Attempting to promote genuine social democracy is not racist.
It's the exact opposite.I've no time for 'cultural differences' which undermine the protection we offer to the vulnerable, whatever faith, colour or sexuality they happen to be.
I wasn't suggesting Islamophobia on your part, just on the part of society in general.
That's a bit of a stretch mate?
I was just suggesting that our claims of cultural superiority are somewhat undermined by repeated wars/invasions that are clearly motivated by desire to control resources.
Nothing will happen, I'm afraid. And the most vulnerable in our society will be the ones who suffer.
This from page one, I have younger family in Halifax and they have grown up with attacks from Muslims, thankfully we've managed to get them out now.
May I ask the readers to reject the view that sees sexist acts as always being a response to being brought up in a Muslim society? Does you agree that such an approach risks infantilising the molesters and treating them like children, when the truth is that they are adults who are entirely responsible for what they do? No one forces them to molest innocent people in Cologne. Unless we are clear about that, we will fail even to understand the threat we face, let alone confront it and ultimately overcome it.
DrJ - you are fired.
Very good that
I don't think anyone has done, have they?
If the Germans prosecute someone, they will be prosecuted for their actions, not their beliefs.
Grum.
You can still strive for and believe in equality and democracy without wishing to kill those who disagree and stealing their resources.
Millions of us marched for exactly that principal before Tony's first little jaunt.
Pitiful lefty logic being thrown about here. Using IRA bombings as an example of non-muslim terrorist activity
Ooh another opportunity to post this....
In response to dr j last comments.
You have to consider there religion if you wish to understand why they feel it is ok to treat woman like this.
In Syria do the woman cover up everything bar there face and hands, are they taught to cover up and the men taught that women should cover up, if so are they also taught that it is also ok for woman to not cover up if they wish without it in any way reflecting poorly on them, there virtue or them not being good Muslims or indeed good in general.Would these men tolerate and treat with respect woman in Syria if the were seen walking out dressed as we commonly see women dressed when on a night out in the west.
And when these men find them self in a foreign country do you expect them to abandon the beliefs they are taught from birth with regards to how woman should act which is to guard their modesty and hide there [u]ornaments[/u]
And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their khim?r over their breasts and not display their beauty except to their husband, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husbands' sons, their brothers or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their (Muslim) women, or the slaves whom their right hands possess, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex; and that they should not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments. (Quran 24:31)
In response to dr j last comments.
You have to consider there religion if you wish to understand why they feel it is ok to treat woman like this.
With respect, chip, that was sort of my point, as mt understood.
Glad we cleared that up.
219. They ask you (O Muhammad) concerning "alcoholic drink" and "gambling". Say: "In them is a great damage, and (some) benefit for men, but the sin of them is greater than their benefit." ...So the first rule was: (Regarding alcohol : there is a damage, and a benefit, but the damage is much greater).
** Then Allah sent another verse, making drinking alcohol more strict (4:43):
43. O you who believe! Approach not As-Salat (the prayer) when you are in a drunken state until you know (the meaning) of what you utter, .....So the second rule was: (Never go to Salat (that is Islamic prayer) while you are drunk, because you have to perfectly understand what you are saying).
*** Finally, came the ultimate forbidding of drinking alcohol (5:90):
90. O you who believe! Intoxicants (all kinds of alcoholic drinks), gambling, Al-Ansab , and Al-Azlam (arrows for seeking luck or decision) are an abomination of Shaitan's (Satan) handiwork. So avoid (strictly all) that (abomination) in order that you may be successful.In Arabic, the word (avoid), means (never come even near), so it means (strictly forbidden).
Quran 5:38]The Prophet sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam ( may Allah exalt his mention ) said:
“The hand (of the thief) should be cut off for (the theft of) a quarter of a Dinar or more.” [Al-Bukhari]
The Prophet sallallaahu
alayhi wa sallam ( may Allah exalt his mention ) cursed the thief because he is a corrupt element in society, and if he is left unpunished, his corruption will spread and infect the body of the Ummah (Muslim community). He sallallaahualayhi wa sallam ( may Allah exalt his mention )
Chips, what a load of bollocks. The reports also stated that these men were drunk and high on cannabis as well as stealing from their victims.
Is a good Muslim allowed to cherry pick what's of the Quran they follow or is bugger all to do with religion and these gangs had decided to shit all over the hospitality of their host nation and do as they please regardless of laws, religion or the protest of their victims. Maybe the German authorities should deal with these gangs as per Quran and chop their hands off which would not only stop them stealing again but stop further sexual assaults too.
And when these men find them self in a foreign country do you expect them to abandon the beliefs they are taught from birth with regards to how woman should act which is to guard their modesty and hide there ornaments
So if I understand you correctly (and a similar point to Dr J has made) we hold them to lower standards because we assume their criminal acts are beyond their control. Isnt that racist?
It isn't just the attitude to Western women among some of the refugees which is an issue.
Near where I live a group of Libyans went on a sexual rampage, raping a man as well as a woman in Cambridge. I thought at the time the events were under-reported in the press and many people who live locally haven't even heard about them.
How do you suggest we do this? Invading/bombing countries perhaps?Those stats you posted are pretty shocking and I won't disagree that they do show that western societies are in many ways more advanced than others - however, you think it's really all about culture?
I also think you're trolling a bit here TBH.
It depends, I guess it would be interesting to control for economic status and gender ratio disparities.
I was just suggesting that our claims of cultural superiority are somewhat undermined by repeated wars/invasions that are clearly motivated by desire to control resources.
One war (maybe two if you count gulf war 1 and two as separately), that can tenuously be linked with oil. I believe all of the other invasions we've done since 82 have been police actions/peace keeping. Never mind that the demonstrations that occurred against the war have overshadowed every other major demonstration since and that half the country were against the war.
Chips, what a load of bollocks. The reports also stated that these men were drunk and high on cannabis as well as stealing from their victims.
Is a good Muslim allowed to cherry pick what's of the Quran they follow or is bugger all to do with religion and these gangs had decided to shit all over the hospitality of their host nation and do as they please regardless of laws, religion or the protest of their victims. Maybe the German authorities should deal with these gangs as per Quran and chop their hands off which would not only stop them stealing again but stop further sexual assaults too.
Actually, that's quite often what they do. I know a few lads who drink, who still want good muslim women. I guess it has nothing to do with being devoutly religious itself, as you are right in that case. It does seem to have something to do with the countries general culture though.
So if I understand you correctly (and a similar point to Dr J has made) we hold them to lower standards because we assume their criminal acts are beyond their control. Isnt that racist?
You don't understand me correctly.
Chips, what a load of bollocks. The reports also stated that these men were drunk and high on cannabis as well as stealing from their victims.
Is a good Muslim allowed to cherry pick what's of the Quran they follow or is bugger all to do with religion and these gangs had decided to shit all over the hospitality of their host nation and do as they please regardless of laws, religion or the protest of their victims. Maybe the German authorities should deal with these gangs as per Quran and chop their hands off which would not only stop them stealing again but stop further sexual assaults too.
I did not say they were good Muslims, if they were I would still expect them to treat people with respect or at the very least to just not associate themselves with people who they consider to fly in the face of there beliefs.
Like i said before these are horrible ****s, and the worst kind of horrible ****s religious horrible ****s, as they feel justified in doing what thy do.
A religious person picking and choosing what parts of their religion suits them best, who'd have thunk it.
And as Tom said I know many religious people who despite not sticking to the rules themselves still expect it of those around them.
It does seem to have something to do with the countries general culture though.
This is much more important than the religion imo. Islam is a part of the culture, but you can find pretty bonkers stuff in any religious texts. Lots of these guys will have grown up in a culture where it's OK to treat women this way. Yes, they're adults, and responsible for their actions, but deep-seated beliefs like this take some changing, especially if you're not the thinking type.
It's chicken and egg - what comes first, the religion or the culture?
I think the religion creates the culture for the most part, but there are many other factors which also have an influence.
@grum you are quite right there are extreme views and activity within the US but to try and put those on a similar scale to fhe threat we face from radical Islam makes no sense, it's say 99 vs 1 in terms of threat severity. The threat in the US has to date been as much against Christians like the Church prayer group massacre.
I see Merkel is saying that Germany need to do more to change its laws to allow asylum seeking sex offenders to be deported (currently it would be virtually impossible to deport any Syrian and no one who is sentenced to less than 3 years). Wouldn't it have been smarter to have figured this out before ?
