[Closed] Car mechanics - diesel won't start

You'll likely need to presurise (and possibly now bleed the air from)the fuel system before the car will start. Modern diesels run high pressure (140bar) fuel injection systems, if there's air in the system, the pressure won't be high enough and the pump will stop, registering a fault code with the cars ECU.

I know that's the case with my 2001 Peugeot HDI.

Blocked fuel filter ?

My Ford/Mazda?? engine has a plunger type pumpy thing on top of the fuel filter - no idea if yours will though, sorry.

Well, once a diesel is running it doesn't need electrics to keep it going so my money is on one of two things

Fuel cut off solonoid failure
Blocked filter.

When did you last have it serviced...?

If you're keeping a can if fuel in the back it sounds to me like you regularly run it low? Could have sucked all sorts of crap out of the tank if you do that, blocking the filter. ESPECIALLY if it's ever been run on anything other than clean pump fuel!!!!

check for smoke coming out of exhaust on crank.usually a good sign if fuel is getting into engine.what kind of engine is it.common rail?? or old school pump.if old style pump check cut off solenoid for power and operation.also worth a spray of easy start see if engine will fire up.some diesels can be a nightmare to start if you have ran them out of fuel.check for glo plug and engine man light good sign of electric fault if missing.

I have known dirty diesel kill a fuel pump (sounds like yours is fine) on an old CAT loading shovel. Diesels live and die on their filters....

If it is anything like the engine in my saab (2.2Tid) then there is no fuel pump in the tank (gm engine originally designed and built by Isuzu).

Try getting a tow and lift the clutch in gear to draw the fuel through. It's a common problem, at least my mechanic told me after he re started mine.

My money is on PPs suggestion - try taking the 'plunger' out of the fuel cut off solenoid - warning if this works -you will have to stall the car to make it stop- ie the key won't kill it.

As others have said, check if there is a lift pump before the high pressure pump. Could be built in to the tank sender or could be separate, on the fuel line from tank.

My van suffered from this...it started and stalled three times in succession, I thought it was because I was towing a heavy trailer over some frozen puddles. The nice AA man laid in the mud and located the pump, gave it a few taps whilst I turned the ignition on, and it hummed into life. Over £100 for a new one in my case (parts only).

I have heard rumours that the 2.5 is the same engine as fitted to 2nd gen Iveco's, if you think this is true you could try a post on an Iveco forum I set up, http://www.ivecoforums.com I have a later model so not familiar with this engine but there are others on the forum that are.

Fuel pumpo has a pushy down thing on top. That is how i managed to tell fuel was passing through.

not electric as it is 2001, mechanical fuel pump, no ecu.

Could be dirty fuel as this is the first time it has run dry. Sort of why I was asking for other suggestions as it cut out quickly rather than spluttering.

PP - Serviced? you are taking the pee, this is my truck 😉

Will check fuel filters and hit any pumps i find with a hammer.

It's also worth checking the fuel pipes where they come out of and return to the tank. Both my Discovery and Shogun suffered with air in the fuel lines through a tiny pin hole of rust.

this "sucking all sorts of crap out of the tank when nearly empty" thing - is it founded in truth ? DO they scavenge the dregs form a different (lower) outlet or something ?

Just because there is fuel at the pump doesnt mean there is not an airlock in injector circuit.

With my lr after changing the fuel lift pump i had to crack each injector union at the block and turn it over till diesel came through

But it is much lower psi injectors

Pp unless is entirely mechanical ie ancient. modern diesels do need electricity to run.

I used to have a Cavalier that had a 1.7 Isuzu TD engine (1995, mechanical injection, overhead cam and the valves ran directly on the cam), a couple of times during it's life it got to a point where it wouldn't start. It turned out to be wear on the inlet valve seats which were causing the valves to be held slightly open when the engine was cold. The symptoms sounded like fuel starvation but actually was a lack of compression. It's worth removing the camshaft cover and giving the clearances a quick check before doing anything more invasive with the fuel system.

crack injectors one at a time.crank till fuel coming out.repeat all four.sorted.
if not get the easy start out.

May be obvious, but does the glowplug light go out as it should a few seconds after you turn the ignition to the first click..?

If doesn't even fire a tiny bit, just turns and turns but was previously fine then it's highly likely to be the fuel cutoff solenoid. A mechanical pump will continue to supply fuel to the cylinders as long as it's turning over, so without a solenoid to shut off fuel flow it'd never be able to stop.

There'll be a plug on the fuel pump - make sure everything's plugged in nice and tight and there are no damaged wires. You could even check the signal to the solenoid with a multimeter. Also fuses I guess, maybe.

Be extremely careful doing anything with injectors out of the engine. The spray is such high pressure if it sprays on your skin it can force diesel under your skin and into your blood which can kill you. Seriously. However you can't just take them out of the cylinder and look at them very well because the hoses are rigid.

I had those symptoms on a BMW 525d. Turned out the main fuel pump had packed up. 🙁

Mol - Yeah, agreed on the solonoid but the only odd thing is that they usually IME (twice!!!) stop where they were left. i.e. if its running you can't stop it, if it's not you can't start it, if ya get me? 🙂

this "sucking all sorts of crap out of the tank when nearly empty" thing - is it founded in truth ? DO they scavenge the dregs form a different (lower) outlet or something ?

If you can find the solonoid then have a play. But I'd be VERY tempted to put a new fuel filter on it and open the tank up and have a gander inside. There's usually a fairly easy to find inspection plate on the top of the tank where the swirl pot or fuel sender is.

Had it happen on a car. I recon it'd had dirty, possibly red, diesel in it. The tank was lined with a film of thin black sludge

Mol - Yeah, agreed on the solonoid but the only odd thing is that they usually IME (twice!!!) stop where they were left. i.e. if its running you can't stop it, if it's not you can't start it, if ya get me?

Hmm, that would be a poor design, since if it failed or you had an electrical fault you'd be unable to stop the engine. I'm pretty sure that I unplugged it on my old car whilst it was running to check it was the solenoid, and it stopped. Also the people to whom I passed it on had a breakdown whilst driving where the connector fell off.

Maybe yours was sticky or something 🙂

Could be all manner of things, but as It's you: are you sure you haven't put jam in the cylinders and tipped cement in the fuel tank??

DrP

DrP +1

Pick-up truck won't start you say ?

Have you checked that your wife and dog haven't left you ??

at least it's not doing this;

WCA when are you back up 'north?

Hmm, that would be a poor design, since if it failed or you had an electrical fault you'd be unable to stop the engine.

It's just the way they work mate! It's a physical stop, a tap if you like, that cuts the fuel. It can stick either open or shut. Mine were a Ford Escort van and a Land Rover. Stalling a Land Rover is an violent process!

Changed the filter in my transit and couldn't get the damm thing bled ended up with some easy start to get things away

It's an old style indirect injection diesel with mechanical pump?

If so then yup, no or little electronics (there will be a little bit for stop solenoid, immobiliser, temps etc even on the most basic). Also the really high injector pressures (we are talking 15,000 PSI'ish) are on the newer common rail engines. These you can stall with taking the key out as they need the injectors to fire.

First thing I would check is the battery - I know it turns over but sometimes it is just lacking that last bit of oomph to get the engine to fire - glow plugs (especially old and faulty ones) can make the problem worse by not heating up or sapping battery power.

Then check the fuel filter

These are the two most common problems I find (except running out of fuel!). Next would be things like perished fuel lines or primer bulbs letting air in so check for this too.

Then you can get a bit more involved with cracking off injector lines a bit - wear glasses as fuel in the eye hurts and it always seems to get you right in the eye. The pressure shouldn't be any more than 150psi but that is still high enough to be dangerous if careless.

Depending on that you could then look at stop solenoids, immobiliser etc etc. Are you using the same key as normal?

As for stopping a mechanical diesel - if you have an easily accessible rubber fuel line then just crimp it. Best way to close off any flexible pipe without damaging it is with a couple of round bars about the diameter of a pencil and clamp them onto the pipe.

I'm surprised only two people have suggested cracking the injector pipes loose while cranking the engine.
This is standard practice for an old diesel engine with a rotary pump that's run out of fuel. It's the first thing I'd do before checking filters, solenoids and pipes.

This is a lot easier with two people, one in the cab and one under the bonnet;
Loosen all the injector pipes about two turns at the injector end.
Crank the engine.
Wait until you see fuel spurting out around the nuts.
Tighten the nuts.

It's just the way they work mate!

Some of them!

did you ever resolve this WCA ?

ive an isuzu engine that i parked up on sunday night - left an interior light on and the battery went flat over night

charged it up and now its turning over and over.

Have not had time to investigate as it was 6am this morning.

Suspect immobilizer but knew id seen someone whos isuzu engine wouldnt start somewhere.

My old Diesel Corsa developed a rust hole in the fuel injection system, fuel would drain back and it would need turning over for 20 seconds to build up enough pressure to start, but then ran fine until it sat over night and the air leaked back in again.

aye nick emailed me , basically perished rubber was the cause.

might just order me some leak off silicon piping now in preparation for what i find .... i know the leak offs look terrible anyway.

might even take a jerry can of diesel back with me tonight as im not believing the gauge - it says quarter , although i know it was down in the red when i got it so it does work - but so did the speedo......

isnt bangernomics great :d

Diesel leak offs are shagged

So no doubt the fuels ran back to the tank

Will see if the tank can be dropped ( rust) and do them as well as they are notorious.

Which isuzu engine is it TR? You can trick some of the them into giving you diagnostics codes.

Its the 2.2 dti as fitted to a vauxhall frontera - big isuzu casting in the side.

Theres no eml light coming on which according to the frontera forums it would if here was an issue that i could read a code for. Didnt even bother plugging my u340 into it.

Going to change the leak offs and see , seemingly a common issue , when i say mines are shagged - number 4 is saturated in diesel.annoyingly although i have fuel line in the garage this engine has no primer , you need to use a special pump ( on its way ) to prime it or you can/will knacker the fuel pump.

There are bodges but need 2 folk to do em , just easier to pay 9.99 for the priming pump

Fairy nuff. Was curious as my 1.7dti the ECU was saying has leak off problems but the cause was actually bad solder in the EDU. (a secondary cause was the ECU was full of diesel 🙂 )

With the 1.7 you can get the engine management light to flash the codes

Shame really as i was just starting to tolerate it as well......( its the mrs motor)

Leakoffs replaced, bulb fitted into return line , primed fuel pump

Hit the key , cough cough - roaaaar

Very happy , means i dont have a shagged fuel pump ( 600 quid for a recon !! )

you sir are mental for going ahead with the car repairs today, did the snow/sleet stop at any point whilst you were doing the fronty?

Shortly after it soaked through my buffalo.

After i dried out i tidied the garage so i can at least nose it in for dropping the oil and doing the filters when they arrive.