[Closed] car crash!

hope the elderly couple are ok, as for the cretin, I do think the romans were on to something when they crucified criminals alongside roads.

He's bang to rights, his skidmarks start on the wrong side of the road in a straight line. He's now at the scene with 3 officers.
Hope he loses his license for this, suppose a prison sentence is too much to hope for..

now this is the kind of thing you should be getting angry about 😉

Thats not a moment of inattention, or an accident. Its just sheer recklessness. People like this need locked up, or at least never be allowed to drive again.

Didn't actually see the crash itself, just the aftermath. Heard a huge bang and ran outside and dragged a driver from a car. Turned out to be the BMW driver. Got some grief of two young lads because they thought i was the BMW driver!
Its a 30 degree bend on a 40mph road, a pedestrian crossing is right at the summit of the rise. Coming from his direction he would be completely unsighted as to what was in the opposing lane when he started his overtake. Completely reckless, there is no way he could tell whether the lane was clear and yet he still tried to overtake at the summit of the hill and on a bend.
There have been a few incidents here but this is the worst i think,

I do think the romans were on to something when they crucified criminals alongside roads.

Their penchant for straight roads would have been handy in this instance too.

I'm surprised no other vehicles were involved to be honest, the two lads claimed he was racing another car but that seems to have buggered off sharpish, that in itself seems suss, most people would stop wouldn't they?

UK roads are pretty bendy so not sure why people still attempt to overtake. So far I have witnessed so many blind overtakes on a semi-blind bend it's scary. Why people put their lives at risk I have no idea. A matter of time some will be hurt.

I used to drive in the far east and over there you really need to be a defensive driver 100% of the time. A crash means no ambulance will arrive for sometimes and people will be crowding around the person(s) taking mobile pictures of the crash ...

Hope the elderly couples are alright.

It took a good while before one of the ambulances made off, hope they were OK.

most people would stop wouldn't they?

Most people who are happy to race on residential streets would be far happier legging it I would say ?

There's some proper idiots out there.

It took a good while before one of the ambulances made off, hope they were OK.

Sounds like they probably were then.

See this all the time . Cocks in ego chariots who feel the need to make themselves feel better about their cruddy existance by driving like ****s. You da man coz you cut up 2 cars in a queue by nailing it at the lights although you aren't as you are still stuck behind the Tesco lorry , and the other 2 cars are 5 seconds behind you , bruv.

Was there air bag deployment ? Usually helps in head on collisions in avoiding face / steering wheel interface.

Don't know what it is about BMW drivers. Mercedes drivers are pretty bad too.

It's potentially any driver the car has nothing to do with it.

All three airbags deployed, elderly male had facial/scalp bleeding and chest pains. His wife had a broken nose i think, both bleeding fairly badly. Neighbours were on scene with baby wipes, chairs and blankets.

Neighbours were on scene with baby wipes, chairs and blankets.

Bloody hell was there nothing on Tele?

Its Rochdale, we pawned the telly!

Ah hence the excitement.

Bloody hell was there nothing on Tele?

Audi and BMW having a race, there is a surprise!

It's potentially any driver the car has nothing to do with it.

Not sure I agree with that. A high proportion of knobs seem to drive BMWs and Audis.

A high proportion of knobs seem to drive BMWs and Audis.

Brand envy?

Anyone who thinks a particular make of car has drivers worse than any other is either not very observant or they don't drive very often.

Or brand envy as mentioned above.

Car design needs to make the driver feel more vulnerable.
Penalties for aggressive and lousy driving need to be stiffer. Loss of licence for life, loss of car. And when people are found driving whilst banned, jail sentence...

Hope the old couple are ok

Not sure I agree with that. A high proportion of knobs seem to drive BMWs and Audis.

I've not been to RTC involving a Audi or BMW for months if that helps.

brooess - Is this what you had in mind?

[img] [/img]

You have my permission to snap his wing mirror off muddydwarf. Fwiw

Anyone who thinks a particular make of car has drivers worse than any other is either not very observant or they don't drive very often.

Or brand envy as mentioned above.

Or it could be personal experience from someone who does drive quite a lot.

Brand envy - not a fan of cars in general.

Or it could be personal experience from someone who does drive quite a lot.

Mine is based on that and it's any car it has nothing to do with brand.

Or it could be personal experience from someone who does drive quite a lot.

Unlikely.

More likely not that observant, if you say the other two reasons don't apply.

If it makes you feel better though, feel free to exchange "not observant" for "confirmation bias"

The outcome is the same.

Just to interject in between. ''Which car twonks drive"

Hope the old couple are ok. And I hope the twonk gets nailed in court.

Anyway, I think you'll find Vauxhall Insignia drivers are the worst.

Mine is based on that and it's any car it has nothing to do with brand.

It's like Anecdotal Evidence Top Trumps.

I'm googling "Accident Statistics By Brand" - the clearest survey I can find is by confused.com from back in 2006ish. It wasn't looking good for BMW or Audi drivers in their results. My Saturday evenings are just rapt with interesting searches.

Of course, it was done by an insurance company and we all know we can't trust them. 🙂

There is another survey done in 2012 by tiger.co.uk (another damned insurance company). This was their table:

[img] [/img]

So red ones do, in fact, go slower?

I got cut up earlier by a rolls-royce. This means 100% of the rolls drivers I've seen in the last couple of weeks have cut me up. Bastards.

I was coming home from work at 2 this afternoon & slowing down for the roundabout at the top of the Wetherby Road. What make of car overtook me at that point while I was still doing about 45mph?

Yep, BMW. Tit.

Top 10 highest accident rate cars

Alfa Romeo 147
BMW 330i
Mazda MX-5
Seat Leon
Alfa Romeo 156
Audi A6
Mercedes SLK
Audi A4
Porsche Boxster
Audi A3

There was roughly a 300% increase between accident rates for these cars and the one at the bottom of the list, a nova. There was some attempt at explaining why all the cars on the bottom of the list were small ones (not company cars etc.) Also, accidents involving the Alfas frequently involved the unforeseen dissipation of critical mechanical parts, so they could possibly be removed from the list.

Nothing further to add.

😉

Also, accidents involving the Alfas frequently involved the unforeseen dissipation of critical mechanical parts, so they could possibly be removed from the list.

Also, accidents involving the Alfas frequently involved the unforeseen dissipation of critical mechanical parts

😆

In fairness, the table in RichPenny's post is from quite a few years ago. Maybe Alfa have improved since then? *

*I doubt it.

So we're doing insurance databases now then.

So which models had the highest proportion of claims linked to accidents?

We looked at figures from Confused.com’s database over the past 12 months, based on all types of accident claims: this means those where the driver of a particular vehicle was at fault as well as cases where the other party took responsibility, and claims where no blame could be apportioned.

Top of the list was Honda’s FR-V six-seater: between them, 2,529 owners of these vehicles made 466 accident claims in the past year. That’s a claim rate of 18.4 per cent or almost one in five.

Next came Volvo’s XC90: of the 3,886 drivers of this model who bought cover through Confused.com, 619 made claims for accidents – a rate of 15.9 per cent.

The Lexus RX had a claim rate of 15.5 per cent (574 claims out of 3,701 drivers), followed by the Mazda 5 (15.3 per cent, or 373 out of 2,431).

Seems they all vary which is odd as surely they'd all be the same of course it tells us nothing who was to blame or what happened so really is no use what so ever.

Seems they all vary which is odd as surely they'd all be the same of course it tells us nothing who was to blame or what happened so really is no use what so ever.

About as useful as someone's "personal experience".

Seems they all vary which is odd as surely they'd all be the same of course it tells us nothing who was to blame or what happened so really is no use what so ever.

Or relatively small sample sizes?

The last point would average out with a slight tendancy to drag results towards the mean, if one was 3x more likely to crash then yes it drags everything they crash into up, but they'd still come out higher.

About as useful as someone's "personal experience".

Precisely.

Those tables make no sense I'm afraid.

Ford is one of the lowest? They're the most common manufacturers on the road, they should be right at the top. And Porsche, a comparatively rare car to be seen on the roads....

Nope, I'm very sceptical.

and this presumably, is the accident.

[url] http://www.rochdaleonline.co.uk/news-features/2/news-headlines/84163/bad-accident-closes-roch-valley-way [/url]

Those tables make no sense I'm afraid.

Well of course they don't, if you don't want them to.

But, do they make about as much or more sense as someone who, say, dislikes Audi or BMW drivers and imagines he sees more accidents or arseholes driving those brands or say, someone who drives an Audi and imagines he sees less accidents involving those cars because he doesn't want to be associated with being an arsehole behind the wheel. His personal experience is about as useless a piece of evidence as an insurance database table. Or is it? We could suppose that at least the insurance database is not suffering from [i]confirmation bias[/i], or whatever fancy phrase we're using to rebutt forum posters' points today. But is it suffering from brand bias ie does it have more of a certain type of brand of car insured with it? Or is it trying to encourage certain drivers to use it for insurance? Who knows?

A quick google didn't show me a completely independent survey for the UK accident statistics by brand. So how do we decide which brand the arseholes are driving?

Maybe it is Audi and BMW drivers. When does lots of anecdotal evidence become evidence?

There's about 1500 accidents in those three vehicles alone. Even if you're an Ambo driver, I sure as **** don't want to live near you if that matches your personal experience!

Wouldn't insurance companies be quite a good source of evidence, given that their business model depends on them accurately estimating how likely you would be to make a claim?

Wouldn't insurance companies be quite a good source of evidence,

Only if they tell you what you want to hear it seems. 🙂

So, if a BMW and a Daewoo collide, who gets the "accident" attached to their brand of car? Do they both get a "Point" or what?

Certain brands are going to have more numerical accidents due to their commonality, but even in % terms they will still have more accidents as some sorts of cars are driven more distance, (company cars etc).

There are also all sorts of different kinds of accidents, from pushy reps in BMW crashing due to being impatient, to mumsy people carried crashing due to a lack of attention being paid to other users etc.

Pigeon hole brands at your peril, as the best, safest option is to assume that EVERYONE is a nutted unless proved otherwise! 😉

The link posted by samuri shows MsD's car on the right of the accident. We were lucky it didn't involve us - by inches. The old couple are still in hospital by account, hope the complete **** is still in the cells.

Thing that I always hate about things like this is the innocent people get hurt - there was an accident near where I live a few years ago where some kids we're racing & involved in a head on crash with a couple in their 50s or 60s the couple died at the scene.

Those tables make no sense I'm afraid.

Because it weights by colour. How many yellow cars are on the road compared to silver ones?

BMW = Bl**dy Moronic W***ers

Nice to see we're no longer subscribing to the old stereotypes then!

In my experience complete d1cks causing accidents are many and varied, regardless of make of car.

And yes, I drive a BMW

And I work in IT

And I have a bouncy bike with more travel that I have skill

And <insert additional uncomfortable appropriate stereotype>

In my experience complete d1cks causing accidents are many and varied, regardless of make of car.

Mine too.

And I drive one of 4 different vans.
Don't work in IT
Don't drink poncy gourmet coffee or shave with a niche razor
And do at least 4 or 5 X the average mileage every year.

Driving home from a wedding tonight in Clitheroe, driving down a long stretch of straight road that leads down to Salmesbury, I come around a bend and doing the legal 50mph. I see a luton van doing about 30mph and see the road ahead is clear, I can see that I'm quickly approaching this van and make the decision to overtake him. I indicate, get into position and as soon as I do it turns right into a right turn, no indicator, no warning and not even brake lights.

If it wasn't for the fact my car braked so hard and efficiently then I'd have hit him.

my car, BMW 320D.

one thing i've noticed about the statistics above, is a) it's conducted by insurance comparison site, it won't capture industry wide data and will still only be representative of a small portion of the market, only brokers who sign up to it. It won't include data from fleet insurers

There's no mileage factoring. A lot of 'premium german cars' do high miles, so statistically we're more likely to be put in the position of danger. I do 40-45k a year and in 2010 got rammed from behind three times in a month!! One was a polo, one was a Golf and one was a passatt. I'm not generalist enough to slate VW drivers because of this, they were however all driven by women 😀

I wouldn't tar BMW drivers or Audi ones for that matter with the same brush and say they are all twonkers behind the wheel.

My tarring would be more directed to the sportier end of those car manufacturers range and that goes for most other manufacturers too.

So it's not your 318 saloon driver you need to watch out for so much as your 330 coupe driver or the twonk in the A5

German metal is often driven by people with superiority of some level i.e. they perceive that their car has a higher value than yours therefore they are clearly the more successful person and better than you so how dare you get in their way and slow them down. These traits are often associated with higher levels of aggression which is reflected in the manner of their driving. Thing is these 118d, 318d, 320d are so cheap to lease these days that there's no exclusivity to driving one and your average sales/IT support/tax credits jockey can get into a new M5 for £3.5k down and £600 a month.

Never overtake across a junction you never know what the vehicle your overtaking is doing or if in the case of a luton van what small car or motor bike it is tailgating is going to do.

Double post

Driving home from a wedding tonight in Clitheroe, driving down a long stretch of straight road that leads down to Salmesbury, I come around a bend and doing the legal 50mph. I see a luton van doing about 30mph and see the road ahead is clear, I can see that I'm quickly approaching this van and make the decision to overtake him. I indicate, get into position and as soon as I do it turns right into a right turn, no indicator, no warning and not even brake lights.If it wasn't for the fact my car braked so hard and efficiently then I'd have hit him.

my car, BMW 320D.

Needs a Morgan Freeman voiceover.

I have to say geordiemick that kind of situation is where defensive driving comes in. I have a policy of never blasting past anyone at full speed, because a) you never know and b) they won't have had tine to see you coming. Why would a vehicle be moving that slowly? Because he's about to make a manoeuvre most likely.

It might've been his fault, but it's both of you that have to carry the consequences.

[i]Maybe it is Audi and BMW drivers. When does lots of anecdotal evidence become evidence? [/i]

No one is going to have a general problem with ford focus drivers so they'll forget all the focus crashes they see and only anecdotally recall the [car driver they don't like] crashes they see.

My wife drives an Audi. She's the meekest, most careful, law-abiding driver you will ever meet. Her car before that was a Nissan which is at the other end of the table. Has she suddenly become a complete knob on the road since buying the Audi? No.

It makes no sense. Classing someone a crap driver based on the car they drive is silly.

Has she suddenly become a complete knob on the road since buying the Audi? No.

I bet she feels dead superior now too as that's the other reason people buy them. Not because maybe they like them.

I think some cars are more intimidating than others, and I reckon many BMWs and Audis are more intimidating than average. They don't have smiley faces. Perhaps that is part of the reason some people perceive them the way they do?

German metal is often driven by people with superiority of some level i.e. they perceive that their car has a higher value than yours therefore they are clearly the more successful person and better than you so how dare you get in their way and slow them down. These traits are often associated with higher levels of aggression which is reflected in the manner of their driving. Thing is these 118d, 318d, 320d are so cheap to lease these days that there's no exclusivity to driving one and your average sales/IT support/tax credits jockey can get into a new M5 for £3.5k down and £600 a month.

Nothing to do with brands really, but in a general roundabout way, this was proven to be true in some study that was carried out. In that people in more expensive cars perceived themselves to be more important, and people in less expensive cars perceived themselves to be less important and more likely to give way.

I don't know how thorough this study was, but it suggested that there was a very real hierarchy on the road, relating directly to the perceived value of your vehicle.

maybe they like them

Maybe they like them because it'll make them feel superior.

My wife drives an Audi. She's the meekest, most careful, law-abiding driver you will ever meet. Her car before that was a Nissan which is at the other end of the table. Has she suddenly become a complete knob on the road since buying the Audi? No.

I'll add that to the weight of anecdotal evidence.

Maybe they like them because it'll make them feel superior.

**** me you're a dull individual.

**** me you're a dull individual.

Oh dear. 🙁

Forum moderators don't normally abuse the punters 🙂

You're right allthepies, sorry if I've caused you any offence DD it was wrong of me to make such a comment.

[i]I'll add that to the weight of anecdotal evidence. [/i]

Precisely.

Not often you see Drac lash out.

Cup of herbal tea and a cuddle help?

Forum moderators don't normally abuse the punters

Have a look through the Barryboys site, especially the Barry gold stuff.

I posted on another topic of me not drinking much alcohol these days, I think I need something stronger than tea.

I perhaps should have stuck some smileys after mine. I thought we were all basically taking the mick out of the same principle - that nobody drives like an arsehole because of the brand he drives - but because he's an arsehole.

Oh well, I've been having a great day celebrating my lad's first birthday weekend and the last thing I want is an angry moderator on my case so I'll step away from the thread and wash him and put him to bed.

/flounce.

No my fault I missed the humour DD I shouldn't have made the comment.

Your Son is year old? Blimey that's flown by glad you've had a great day.

Oh and Footflaps it's not Swear filter avoidance as you can see it didn't dodge the filter.

[quote=deadlydarcy said]the last thing I want is an angry moderator on my case so I'll step away from the thread and wash him and put him to bed.

Drac ? 😯

😉

Chapeau to Drac for the apology.

Drac ?

Right after he's burped me.