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I give it a day or so before it’s leaked that during this ‘isolation’ period he’s actually taking lots of meeting, begging for some support.
That ships already sailed. According to the Guardian that's exactly what he spent yesterday doing.
I now really hope he brazens it out and stays in place as any remaining support ebbs away. The perfect scenario would be a leadership challenge, with all associated blood-letting, which just fails to get the numbers to remove him, so he's 'safe' for another year. A year sat impotently on his thrown to watch over a Tory civil war, backbench rebellions over everything and hopefully a general election
Its already being leaked she will find some minor issues but the underlings will get most of the blame.
Jacob Rees-Mogg has said; civil servants who went to Boris Johnson's party should be sacked but Johnson stay in power, because: "Civil servants are subject to HR. HR does not apply to ministers because they have to retain confidence of the British people!"
Part of the Civil Service code is to support the government of the day so I am not wildly optimistic about the report.
I think this is the end for the toffs. They've managed to cast a spell over the nation for the last decade but the mask has truly slipped now.
I saw Isabel Oakshot on QT last night as well and we saw another example of how the gulf between the hard right brexiters and the posh mob has widened to a chasm.
What really did it for them was Jacob Lynch Mobb refering to the Scottish MSP leader as "lightweight" on Newsnight the previous evening.
Benny Hill and chums thought they could use the plebs to get what they wanted. In the end it was the 'plebs' who used Boris to get what they wanted, Brexit and turning the Nation into little Britain. Johnson only wanted power, and his chums were only interested in the profit.
Be the usual "we do not recognise the findings of this report" some junior civil servant will be sacked and Tories will stick two fingers up to the rest of us.
I'm wondering if, just before the enquiry is released, it'll get referred to the met for another long, period of, ("It wouldn't be appropriate to comment while there's an ongoing") inquiry.
Which will of course eventually find no evidence.
Hiya,
The longer he stays in the more damage he does to his party and the more the lies of the last 5 years will be exposed. I think their will be a Tory civil war for sure Boris sacked the moderates for the UKIP and those that were simply hangers on. Sadly there is no one of any talent of skill left in the Conservative-UKIP party, so the infighting will get worse and they will simply self destruct. I'm hoping the whole political landscape changes and something for the better. Sadly it will be a year of turmoil so hold on tight is what I will say...
JeZ
Sunak is looking like the only real alternative, Im not convinced a billionaire ex hedge fund manager is going to work that well.
He makes Starmer look charismatic
The Tory poll collapse is still being driven by 'don't knows', yougov latest has 7% tory vote switching to Labour but 25% to don't know
(REFUK still not making an impact)
The right replacement for Johnson could claw them back, but who that replacement will be?
yougov latest has 7% tory vote switching to Labour but 25% to don’t know
The Conservatives have lost 32% support in the polls? That can’t be right, can it?
32% of their polling so 32% of 40% ie 14 points off
Over what period?
Numberwang.
There must be a lot of churn… in the last few months, Labour up, LibDems up, Conservatives down, Green down.
Billionaire Rishi Sunak isn't the answer for the Tories but he might be for the rest of us. Although I think the electorate is probably suffering from charisma fatigue I think you're right Kimbers, he will make Starmer look more charismatic and certainly more relatable.
New Labour 2.0 will get the job done at the next election. That's the direction Starmer is taking the party only without the charismatic messiah bullshit that Blair traded on (which is a goòd thing surely?).
Labour's deputy leader is playing the Prescot role pretty well too, only she's smarter and sharper than two jabs ever was, and probably the best figure to try and reconnect with the red wall deserters.
Betfair offering 7/1 that Johnson resigns by end of the week.
Theres no way on earth he's going to resign
He is ALWAYS sacked
tjagain
Full Member
32% of their polling so 32% of 40% ie 14 points off
Sorry its actually
13% to Labour
11 to REFUK
4 to LD
1 to Green
1 to 'Other'
The Tory poll collapse is still being driven by ‘don’t knows’, yougov latest has 7% tory vote switching to Labour but 25% to don’t know
I had a very candid conversation with a Tory MP a few weeks ago. One of the questions I asked was, "What does Labour have to do to win the next election?"
The answer given was essentially that years of Labour calling Tory voters scum makes it much harder for Tory voters to swing to Labour. If Labour wants to win the next election they must start embracing and charming Tory voters. I thought it was an interesting point.
The answer given was essentially that years of Labour calling Tory voters scum
Citation needed.
Ah... this again... the defence of the con artists... call them out and they will claim you are besmirching the good name of those they have conned. Johnson is a nasty piece of work. Not even sure if that can be said to be just an opinion now. But I in no way think the same of family members and friends who voted for him and his party. Rayner never called people who voted for this mob "scum"... she called the actual politicians scum. And apologised. Probably wishes she hadn't given all that's panned out since then. In a similar fashion, when Labour MPs point out all of Johnson's lies... they are not calling voters liars.
I don't believe either of the main parties can really sway diehard voters to them, it's more like they get more people would vote for them, to do so, and demoralise people who'd who for the other guys to stay at home or vote for their second choice, the Libs, the Greens or the National Parties. The Red Wall turning Blue for Brexit might be an exception, but I doubt they'd ever hope to keep it next GE.
I thought it was an interesting point.
Quite possibly deliberately inaccurate though with the confusing about comments about politicians and tory voters in general. Something the tories are quite fond of doing.
But I in no way think the same of family members and friends who voted for him and his party.
I'm not sure I could be so charitable.
Is the behaviour of Johnson and the mob he assembled around him a surprise to you? No, me neither. Did Trump's behaviour when president come out of the blue - nope, entirely as expected. Trump and Johnson might be the problem once in power, but the real problem are those people without the wherewithal to foresee what they will be like when given it who voted for them.
I will not visit the states for the foreseeable not because I might bump into Donald Trump, but because 3 out of 10 people you meet walking the streets have such poor taste/judgment/values that they saw him as leadership material after witnessing 4 years of his presidency. I don't see any reason to let those who gave them power off the hook.
I can recommend Ed Balls' documentary about Trump voters. Don't assume you know people just because you know who they voted for. I'd go to the USA in a shot. I wouldn't avoid anyone just for voting for Johnson or Trump... obviously there are people to avoid everywhere... but don't label anyone simply on who they have voted for (or in many cases, who they have voted against).
I will not visit the states for the foreseeable not because I might bump into Donald Trump, but because 3 out of 10 people you meet walking the streets have such poor taste/judgment/values that they saw him as leadership material after witnessing 4 years of his presidency. I don’t see any reason to let those who gave them power off the hook.
The downside being that you're in the UK where 3/10 people you meet walking the streets have such poor taste/judgment/values that they voted for Boris / Brexit. Although there's a significantly lower possibility of them being armed so I guess it's still a net positive.
I can recommend Ed Balls’ documentary about Trump voters.
Might be a good watch - what channel?
I'm doubtful though - the only people I know who have voted for Farage I would not voluntarily spend time with. Or I would, but might end up with a criminal record.
The downside being that you’re in the UK where 3/10 people you meet walking the streets have such poor taste/judgment/values that they voted for Boris / Brexit. Although there’s a significantly lower possibility of them being armed so I guess it’s still a net positive.
I'm shielded a bit by living where I do. I guess the same could be said for certain states - maybe I need to highlight heavy democrat, low gun ownership states for future travels. Or those where their cousin is not also their mother which probably boils down to the same.
If Labour wants to win the next election they must start embracing and charming Tory voters.
More chance of Lib Dems doing that. The Tories I know would never, ever vote Labour no matter what a mess the Tory party is.
Would be the same as me voting Tory because I think the Labour party has lost it's way. I simply cannot comprehend voting Tory even in the extremist scenarios.
Part of the Civil Service code is to support the government of the day so I am not wildly optimistic about the report.
Er, no its not. Have a proper read.
Might be a good watch – what channel?
It was BBC... but in today's world that means it's available just about everywhere expect iPlayer...
🤷🏻
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0bdpvh5
I will not visit the states for the foreseeable not because I might bump into Donald Trump, but because 3 out of 10 people you meet walking the streets have such poor taste/judgment/values that they saw him as leadership material after witnessing 4 years of his presidency.
It's not just that. It's the socio-political landscape that led to that happening. It's far more of a problem IMO.
It’s not just that. It’s the socio-political landscape that led to that happening. It’s far more of a problem IMO.
Very true. I was over simplifying. I envisage USA as a septic/toxic nation I just can't imagine wanting to voluntarily place myself in. Even so - stuck in a lift with a group of Trump voters...shudder.
the real problem are those people without the wherewithal to foresee what they will be like when given it who voted for them.
The problem is people like my parents who knew it would happen, didn't want it to happen, but "anyone but Labour"
I envisage USA as a septic/toxic nation
Only because of the way that SM amplifies certain voices. Most of the US population are (like most western Europeans) pretty liberal/left leaning in their world outlook. They want universal healthcare, they want help those more disadvantaged than themselves, they support women's rights, they're not racist, they don't want to live in world filled to the brim with personal weaponry.
Those voices are drowned out.
Billionaire Rishi Sunak isn’t the answer for the Tories but he might be for the rest of us.
The rest of us?
Mate, I've these magic beans, want to buy one?
Betfair offering 7/1 that Johnson resigns by end of the week.
Not going to happen.
Theres no way on earth he’s going to resign
He is ALWAYS sacked
I fear this time he's going to refuse to leave until they kick him out and that won't happen for a while. He's basically there until he's taking the whole lot down with him which will destroy the country at the worst possible time. I know he's not the one pulling the strings but without him as a figurehead while they elect a replacement there will be all sorts of unimaginable stuff happening in the background that will damage the country for a generation or more. I want him to go but I'm scared what will happen when he does!
They want universal healthcare, they want help those more disadvantaged than themselves, they support women’s rights, they’re not racist
I have to say I disagree with this. There are many such people but I don't even think they are in the majority.
I've been working for US companies for 25yrs and met an awful lot of people from there. It's a generalisation but California and the wider NY-Boston-Washington area are the more liberal areas with ideas more aligned to us Europeans. The rest varies from cowboy to redneck to racist to farmers. You really have to view it as 50 different countries with some similarities.
I have to say I disagree with this. There are many such people but I don’t even think they are in the majority.
I would echo this. Just go and read Obama's book. Not him just getting issues such as 'Obamacare' past congress and senate but the issues potential members of either congress or senate would have with the voters if they stated their favour for any of the above to the US electorate in many states.
But we digress - this thread is about Johnson and we are not exactly short of material to discuss on topic!!!
[img] https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FJER6c0XsAEcdY3?format=jpg [/img]
On the other hand though, they have finally proven that they ARE capable of organising a piss-up! Maybe not in a brewery - perhaps that's the next step along the road to competence...
On some factual points:
It is an investigation by Cabinet Office - not an Inquiry (or an enquiry either)
A key aspect of the Civil Service Code is neutrality, they cannot be political. They support the government in power in that they do all the admin required to put government policy into practice.
The Sue Gray inquiry is leaking like a sieve
https://twitter.com/HarryYorke1/status/1482014927577624583?t=xReJzq5Ertp45am3vjpeBg&s=19
Again, not an inquiry!
Kate Josephs has issued a statement only because she was approached by a journo who said - we have a story...
The Sue Gray inquiry is leaking like a sieve
Surely this is just a Cummings slow drip (I feel dirty typing that).
We could have a sweep by picking a date and see tomorrow's news when the next party was reported to have taken place.
Jebus, it's be quicker to list the dates when the incumbents of No. 10 WEREN'T on the piss!
Why / who holds the police responsible for investigating and prosecuting clear breaches of law?
This sums up how public breaches were handled, yet our politicians, civil servants, journalists and more on the No10 gravy train remain un-investigated...
Jebus, it’s be quicker to list the dates when the incumbents of No. 10 WEREN’T on the piss!
The NHS got applauded but it does feel like the hardest public sector workers through all this were the No. 10 caterers. They've put in an epic shift, running solidly for the last 2 years it seems.
This sums up how public breaches were handled, yet our politicians, civil servants, journalists and more on the No10 gravy train remain un-investigated…
While a fair point, plenty of parties and events weren't prosecuted round here either.
Downing Street also denied this for months
They explicitly said at the time you couldn't go to second homes
https://twitter.com/lara_spirit/status/1482001541284384768?t=HGI7JNZzie3ovnvOrBuXOQ&s=19
While a fair point, plenty of parties and events weren’t prosecuted round here either.
Possibly, however if I were to be caught breaking the law and it was all over the media, I'd expect to get my collar felt.
Or perhaps I could use the Moggy excuse that maybe the rules were a bit too strict, for whatever law I happen to be breaking.
No way he will resign. If Labour start appealing directly to voters instead of arguing with an idiot, they will win the next GE easily.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-downing-street-partygate-b1993433.html
Boris Johnson is drawing up a list of officials to offer resignations over partygate in a bid to salvage his premiership, The Independent has learned.
Dubbed “Operation Save Big Dog” by the prime minister himself, the blueprint includes a drive to work out which heads should roll
My work is boring
https://twitter.com/PippaCrerar/status/1482080975358242825?t=dBECXmumyRidTWGsmzrDrg&s=19
I don't want him to resign. I don't want him to have the dignity of resignation. Imagine the speeches, the sycophancy from Dorries, Rees-Mogg, Raab, etc. No, I want him humiliated, ruined, and expelled from the House of ****. I'd like to say arrested but there is **** all chance of that with the Met in charge.
I just want him to stay in now
How low can the tory vote sink?
https://twitter.com/electpoliticsuk/status/1482085046186131456?t=b_xEK4inqjWdqVLMnDkfmg&s=19
the tories have pinned their flag to the mast of the titanic, they deserve everything they get.
Is there any legal means to have him executed for coming up with a plan in which he refers to himself as 'big dog' - a term I last heard used by Tim Westwood. The narcissism is off the scale.
BJ needs to stay. At the moment he's dragging the Tories down, if they replace him with Sunak or Hunt or anyone else then all of a sudden they'll be back to being the sensible party that's destined to govern.
https://twitter.com/flying_rodent/status/1482105228795260936?t=1F3U6pNoZARNjkKh3SO7vA&s=19
kimbers
Full Member
I just want him to stay in
Yep its making the Tories look terrible, the Met is looking pretty bad also.
ffs last chance saloon, groundhog day.
Apparently the expectation is that Sue Gray will let him off the hook
I'm not so sure that blindsided Sue will be so obliging
https://twitter.com/benrileysmith/status/1482105991789518848?t=53nJLFOsfZAxAYAypUWR1Q&s=19
Operation save big dog - johnsons words, apparently.
F me sideways; he truly is a deluded, egocentric, arrogant, misguided pile of excrescence.
A steaming turd of the highest order.
Any attempt to throw civil servants under the bus will rebound badly as no-one has any loyalty to him.
He is more toxic than anthrax.
Operation save big dog – johnsons words, apparently
Or a canary trap. Although by this point I'm not sure there'd be any point lol.
Need to keep Big knob dog in office...
He will **** up again and again.
Posted in Starmer thread but it crosses streams to a large degree.
Will this grain traction or be lost in the no10 noise?
Noise.
Old picture old story. It was a late night Labour zoom call. They had dinner whilst working & he had a beer.
Operation Save Big Dog?
Dear god! He’s now gone full Gareth Cheeseman… you’re a tiger. GGGRRRRRRR!!!
Is there any legal means to have him executed for coming up with a plan in which he refers to himself as ‘big dog’
Leave him alone he's trying his best
The great thing about being in the Last Chance Saloon is they're licensed to serve alcohol so you don't need to bring your own fridge.
Even the cave dwellers on a motorbike forum that I used to frequent think Dumbojo is a prick.
Once you've lost the arseholes you are in trouble.
How long until the hard of thinking realise the entire brexit campaign was bullshit?
But Andrew Bridgen, Conservative MP for North West Leicestershire, said: "I don't need to see what Sue Gray says to know that for me Boris Johnson has lost the moral authority to lead the country.
"If there's another emergency where he has to call on the public to make sacrifices, he doesn't have that authority. That makes his position in my book, as prime minister, completely untenable."
Well there you go I never thought I would agree with the likes of Andrew Bridgen, just shows how precarious his position is.
My MP (Jenkinson) is pushing the 'got Brexit done' line hard and it's all a remoaner (sic) plot.
It'll be interesting to see if that will work - it might in this area (Workington).
Binning plan B early would probably be a good populist move amongst the mouth breathers.
OT - the hateful bastard Jenkinson is also tweeting anti-trans shite this morning 'its not possible to be born in wrong body' (!). That'll probably play well to his core voters ☹️