However there is also the old adage ” Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.”
There's a huge danger that labour will be seen as enjoying all this. It's not time to be sitting back and enjoying the ride, it's time to be going for the jugular and demonstrating the same level of outrage and anger that the public feel. At PMQs last week Starmer and Rayner looked like they were having a ball.
They will, but just reply telling them it’s because we don’t have a functioning constitution that he’s both in place and still here.
There have been two recent examples from a country thats keen on their written constitution of a government being quite happy to ignore it when it suits them.
There’s a huge danger that labour will be seen as enjoying all this.
Folks have realised that this is all the problem of the Tories and Johnson. The occasional upwards bump in the Tories polling doesn't hide the fact that everyone now thinks of Johnsons as some-one who is untrustworthy and deceitful. Something like 60% of the voting population thinks he should resign, the cops are investigating possible crimes and it turns out the Grey report won't need to be delayed after all. it's just a matter of when now.
Time and time again attacking incompetence doesn't stick unless you're attacking Labour.
It's up to Starmer as per DazH to start using politics as a means of attack.
Right back to the start of the pandemic Starmer has been weak and he's paid the price.
Labour aren't offering anything anywhere near good enough with ideological conviction.
There have been two recent examples from a country thats keen on their written constitution of a government being quite happy to ignore it when it suits them.
This is an important point. A written constitution in itself is a guarantee of nothing.
Your point on the seeming impossibility of changing the system is valid though.
The change we need is PR. Currently, millions of potential protest votes against the government or any party are simply ignored because of how the system currently works.
The change we need is PR. Currently, millions of potential protest votes against the government or any party are simply ignored because of how the system currently works.
But when we had a referendum on it we said no. It was quite recently politically speaking. & no I don't remember it either.
https://www.politics.co.uk/reference/proportional-representation/
But when we had a referendum on it we said no
Also, don't look to Labour either, the Unions are completely against it. and killed it deader than dead thing at the last conference
But when we had a referendum on it we said no.
It wasn't really PR we were offered. It was a dogs dinner of a half way house
The Labour party, if it was in any way sane, would be championing PR, but unfortunately the unions who fund them are a bunch of dinosaurs stuck firmly in the 1970's and still entertain the fantasy of some grand landslide victory under FPTP
You cannot blame this upon the unions Binners - the whole PLP are against any form of PR because they know under PR they will lose. Look to Scotland. Now while the collapse of labour in Scotland is not just down to PR its a significant part of it because it allows other parties to gain fair representation
the fact that it means we would never have a tory government again is lost on them.
But when we had a referendum on it we said no.
No, we have referendum on AV. Where Cummings proved he could run a good referendum campaign... which he damn well can... ultimately leading to Britain being in the mess we are now.
You cannot blame this upon the unions Binners
> checks the conference vote on PR ... I think he can <
Not solely on the unions then. The PLP are solidly against it for the simple reason they would never get sole power again either and they look to Scotland and see that PR works against them as well. turkeys do not vote for Christmas
Off the top of my head, Clive Lewis and David Lammy have spoken strongly about the need for Labour to back PR. I've no idea if your "solidly" is just a guess, or if you've read something that backs it up as regards where all the MPs stand on this.
Numerous statements on it over the years and the actions of labour during the debate on AV both before and after the bill was published
AV isn't PR. Many people voted against and campaigned against AV precisely because what was proposed wasn't a proportional system.
Don't assume today's MPs share the same views as MPs from a decade ago anyway, or that those still in the commons from those days haven't changed their minds.
I have no idea what that balance is in the PLP right now as regards supporting PR. Do you?
I have no idea what that balance is in the PLP right now as regards supporting PR. Do you?
Starmer refused to back it at their most recent party conference. I suspect it's a bit too democratic for his tastes.
That’s one. I’m sure there are many more. Is that the PLP being “solidly” against? Or is it 50:50? Slight majority against? In favour? If they are listening to their CLPs, I’d hope more and more are at least considering PR. This should all be in another thread though, sorry.
A while back I got roundly slagged off for saying that burning down tory constituency offices wouldn’t necessarily be a bad thing. I’m even more of that opinion now.
Let us know when you start 🙄
Anyway, Crispin Blunt defending Johnson on PM tonight. Lots of talk about 'perspective', how these things aren't really important, and how in the end it's just a fpn. 'i mean, you wouldn't expect a PM to resign for a speeding ticket, would you?'
Gloriously out of touch! 🤣 Keep going!
The change we need is PR. Currently, millions of potential protest votes against the government or any party are simply ignored because of how the system currently works.
But when we had a referendum on it we said no. It was quite recently politically speaking. & no I don’t remember it either.
That was when we had a Prime Minister who liked the idea of using referendums as a way of making ideas he didn't like go away 🙂
I don’t know about you, but that sounds like it could have been a zoom meeting. You know, like everyone else was having to have at that point.
Happens all the time at my workplace. Pop into a room expecting a high-level strategy meeting and instead find that there's a birthday party going on with cake and people singing.
Its very noticeable that the senior cabinet ministers are not backing him publicly anymore. All in hiding? its left to the 4th rate ones to go on telly to defend him.
It must be awful for Johnson personally - ( good ) but how much longer will he tolerate the torture? I am sure of his total unwillingness to resign as that would mean admitting he has done wrong but on the other hand the temptation to run away must be huge
PMQs tomorrow should be fun. Maybe he will resign once he gets the Grey report so he does not have to face the ordeal of being openly mocked again. It must have hurt him last week
turkeys do not vote for Christmas
Brexit and an 80 seat Tory majority says they do. Often.
I can see him staying in place ‘till the next election now. For him, another Tory winning the next election means nothing to him, he doesn’t care. Whereas a shot at another 5 years, with a smirking “you know I’m a lying self serving waste of space, but vote for me anyway, we’ll show them”, even if there is only the outside chance of being successful… hell, probably partly because everyone thinks he is unlikely to win… I can see him eyeing that up and going for it, and being amused to test and see just how much he can get away with.
Why would his MPs put up with that? Well, he purged the party of MPs who wouldn’t back him. Any MP who turns on now him is admitting that they made a mistake… and I’m sceptical about enough doing that only two years down the line. And if they were wrong about Johnson… how else has their judgment failed them in recent years…?
It would mean divorce and pushing the wife and kids under the bus though.
https://twitter.com/channel4news/status/1486053103078154241?s=21
AMBUSHED WITH A CAKE
UK politics.
He’s our leader. I support him.
And that… is all the matters.
That’s one.
The leader. Remind me who spoke in favour of the motion?
We can't know what MPs may think privately, but I suggest that "solidly against" is a pretty good description of what they will choose to do.
My 13y/o & his mates are even discussing this! They were joking about the government’s favourite tv show & came up with Pointless & I’m an immigrant- get him out of here!!
I added Would I lie to you? And 8 out of 10 ****s!!
I am sure of his total unwillingness to resign as that would mean admitting he has done wrong
There are lots of things that have always been apparent about Boris - one is his arrogance but the another is his cowardice. His 'people' in both his leadership and election campaigns were well aware of this and kept him out of situations were he'd say something stupid or deal with a situation that he's scared of - like having to answer a questions. One thing they can't do for him is resign - he's on his own with that. His arrogance is what got him into this predicament but its his cowardice thats keeping him in it - he just doesn't have the balls to resign
AMBUSHED WITH A CAKE
Oh please oh please oh please
Previous cake ambushes…
EDIT: forgot that David Amess was one of those fooled about Cake. I’m not deleting the video though, I think it shows that he genuinely wanted to help people, even if he was taken in by Morris’ ambush.
AMBUSHED WITH A CAKE
All the political comedians must have collapsed in tears on hearing that. I mean how can they top that?
Disappointed they haven't gone for the Portal approach yet.
PROTECT CAKE
All the political comedians must have collapsed in tears on hearing that. I mean how can they top that?
That would be the icing on the cake
But what about filthy foreign cake, like Black Forest gâteau and Madeira cake?
Let's face it, he's being desserted by all those around him.
Let’s face it, he’s being desserted by all those around him.
Hahaha, that's briliant 😀
Hopefully he’ll be seeing the custardy sergeant soon
There's a joke about clowns and custard pies in here somewhere... but i'm juggling.
EDIT, i spoke too soon
colp
Full MemberHopefully he’ll be seeing the custardy sergeant soon
Hahaha, that’s briliant
Every dog has their day!😁
On topic though, you can see in the interviews that Johnson is suffering from the constant attacks. His eyes are noticeably glazed over.
His eyes are noticeably glazed over.
After effects of all those parties.
