[Closed] Bob Crow - May a thousand wasps infest his scrotal area....

Being a union member (FBU) and having in the past withdrawn my labour, i can assure you that what ever is published in the papers will most certainly be inaccurate and misleading. There is always two sides to a story, why don't you go down to one of the picket lines and talk to the strikers and hear their side of the story? You might just be surprised if you bother.

If we make the city's transport unreliable, international visitors will just go elsewhere. We shouldn't underestimate the impact to UK economy of this.

Shame they didn't think of that when it all got privatised, and is now one of the most expensive transport networks in the world to travel on.

You might just be surprised if you bother.

They are not interested in the other side of the story.

ernie_lynch - Member

[s]I like [/s]Bob Crow, [s]in fact he's my hero. Part of the reason I like him is 'cause he[/s] tells it as it is[s]. There's no spin from him, he's a Millwall supporter, [/s]and he doesn't give a toss[s] what you think of him Flashheart[/s]. He's there to fight [s]for his members and his industry[/s]. It's because there [b]are[/b][s]n't more[/s] people like him that we're in the shit.

FTFY. Bob Crow is a thug and a relic of (failed) 80s unionism. Even other unions have been distancing themselves from him for years. He refuses negotiation and withdraws labour at the drop of a hat.

I can see why the STW socialists would be drawn to him as the last bastion of their beliefs.

Both members of staff are off on paid indefinite leave, but would like to return to work. One of them argued with a manager on a picket line, which resulted in a campaign against him that led to where we are now. I believe (and I accept there is a chance this might be a 'simple' explanation) that Bob Crow and the union has accepted that both employees should face some form of disciplinary action, but that the current situation is wholly disproportional. The members would like to continue their work, rather that languish at home on full pay.

In the interests of fairness, Crow did get bitch-whipped a little bit on LBC yesterday morning. I was a bit disappointed...

What the RMT, not the media, say is the reason for the strike:

TUBE UNION RMT announced today that members have voted by almost two to one for strike action in a ballot of all train operator and instructor operator members in the on-going disputes over the victimisation of union activists including two driver members - Eamon Lynch and Arwyn Thomas - over their trade union activities. RMT will now consider the appropriate course of action.

 
Eamon Lynch, RMT Bakerloo Line drivers' health and safety rep, has been sacked by LU and although he remains on full pay following the union's victory on Eamon's behalf at an "interim relief" Employment Tribunal hearing the company has shown total contempt for the Tribunal process and have upheld his sacking. Interim relief is only ever granted by the Employment Tribunal where there is the clearest possible evidence that an employee has been dismissed on the grounds of their trade union activities. RMT is currently awaiting the outcome of Eamon's full tribunal hearing.
 
Arwyn Thomas, a long-standing RMT activist and driver at Morden has been sacked on trumped-up disciplinary charges following unproven allegations made against him by strike breakers. Arwyn has been an RMT/NUR member for over 29 years and has held various positions in the union. Arwyn has also won an interim relief hearing at the Employment Tribunal on the grounds of his victimisation as an RMT activist and has been put back on full pay as a result.
 
RMT General Secretary Bob Crow said:
 
"This massive vote for action by tube drivers shows that they are well aware of the consequences of allowing our activists and safety reps to be picked off while we hear daily reports of breakdowns and failures on the network as a direct result of the very cuts that our members have been fighting.
 
"The attack on Eamon Lynch and Arwyn Thomas is the clearest cut case of victimisation on the grounds of trade union activities that you will ever see and it's no wonder that the Employment Tribunal was swift to see through the management lies and grant both these members "Interim Relief" - an award which requires the strongest possible proof that their sackings were down to their union activities.
 
"Eamon and Arwyn have been victimised for fighting cuts to jobs and services that would turn the tube into a death trap. This vote for action sends out the clearest signal that workers who stand up for tube safety will get the full support of RMT members.

TooTall iin TryingTooHard shocka!

I like also that Bob Crow has annoyed Tootall. 🙂

I can see why the STW socialists would be drawn to him as the last bastion of their beliefs.

Ooh, isn't it Socialist ideologies that have brought us free healthcare, education and stuff like that? Cos they weren't Selfservative ideas, were they? Hmm? No, they weren't.

Why don't you just go and live in America?

No wonder the country is a trllion pounds in debt when we have a system that allows two train drivers and a union rep to hold the Capital to ransome. 🙄

No wonder the country is a trllion pounds in debt when we have a system that allows two train drivers and a union rep to hold the Capital to ransome.

Have you been reading the Standard again?

The capital will get on with business for the days of the strikes. Yes, people will be inconvenienced, but "ransom"? What bollocks right wing rhetoric!

why not rejoice in the death throes of socialism too tall?
PS You may wish to wait till Thatcher has died to measure the extent of socialism in the UK
Goes off to prepare patriotic bunting
[img] http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSNTvO1jNP6FR2sop6wd28JCnzPARAirO93WPo6Gjbve5azWQ7d [/img]

I knew i could get DD to bite from a one liner, good old Londonderry boys.

I knew i could get DD to bite from a one liner, good old Londonderry boys.

Ah right, fair enough. In your hurry to get me to bite, you just wrote a load of bollocks. That's good.

I have no idea what you're going on about with the "londonderry" thing though...or are you just talking bollocks again?

Ho hum and London is such a happy place

Withdrawing your labour is a fundamental right otherwise we will become a 3rd world country

Ops might have missed the last couple of decades long hours poor pay high cost of living for the masses

Can someone explain this please:

"The RMT's announcement follows a 2-1 vote in favour of industrial action by union members in protest at the dismissal of a Northern line driver"

"only 29% of the 1,300 drivers balloted had voted in favour of strike action"

???

"The RMT's announcement follows a 2-1 vote in favour of industrial action by union members in protest at the dismissal of a Northern line driver"

"only 29% of the 1,300 drivers balloted had voted in favour of strike action"

Maybe lots of people didn't respond (as opposed to voting against the action) and they have not included those people in your first quotation?

Though I'm not a huge fan of Bob Crowe (ironic understatement), I do find it laughable that MP's who are elected with the active participation of roughly 30% of the voting population, are demanding that 100% of Trade Unionists turn out for strike ballots...

CPt knows the answer a low turnout like in all elections hence he was able to misrepreprsent the reality of the vote to fuel his anti union stance
For example the London mayoral election got a turnout of 48% which was the highest turnout so far but still less than 50% of the electorate with boris winning with less that the headline figure quoted here by Flashy. It did not make flashy oppose this result nor stop Boris suggesting that Unions should not strike without 50% of the electorate saying yes.
Spinning like this is one of the reasons peole do not enegage iwth politics and it is bad enought o se eit in career politicians without seeing it on a forum as well from the politically interested members of STW ...shamefulll and piss porr and it tirns manty peoel away from politics and acting which is a far biige rissue/problem.
As I said low turnouts is an issue in all politics and too use it to make a political point is glib and shortsighted as it can be used in all directions against all outcomes.
In this case of those who expressed an opinion they voted 2:1 in favour of action but with a low turnout.

TooTall - Member

ernie_lynch - Member

[s] I like[/s] Bob Crow, [s]in fact he's my hero. Part of the reason I like him is 'cause he[/s] tells it as it is. [s]There's no spin from him, he's a Millwall supporter,[/s] and he doesn't give a toss [s]what you think of him Flashheart[/s]. He's there to fight [s]for his members and his industry[/s]. It's because there are[s]n't more[/s] people like him that we're in the shit.

FTFY. Bob Crow is a thug and a relic of (failed) 80s unionism. Even other unions have been distancing themselves from him for years. He refuses negotiation and withdraws labour at the drop of a hat.

I can see why the STW socialists would be drawn to him as the last bastion of their beliefs.
Posted 5 hours ago # Report-Post

Well TooTall you're the second person on this thread who wants to tell me how I think, but I'll stick with my original statement. Mind you, your post did make me smile and amused me, so thanks for that 8)

I particularly like the claim that Britain is in the shit because of people like Bob Crow.........so nothing to do with greedy incompetent bankers then ? 😀 And btw, how many people like Bob Crow do you know ?

I also found your reference to 'failed trade unionism' highly amusing. RMT membership increased by more than a third in the first five years of Bob Crow's leadership. Pretty impressive stuff by any standard, and it reflects his popularity based on the fact that he delivers.

And of course Bob Crow's detractors like yourself are the first to whinge and complain about the favourable wages and conditions which RMT members enjoy......now there's [i]failure[/i] for you ! 😀

And as for claim that he's a "thug", really, look into those baby-blue eyes and say that again

[img] ?w=276&h=183[/img]

The more Bob Crow is despised by greedy selfish money-grabbing Tories who want to shaft and stitch up British workers, and the Tory press, the more I love the guy.

Conshystertives don't like people like Bob Crow cos strong unions mean businesses might actually have to pay workers decent wages and ensure safe working conditions and have proper workers rights and things like that.

I'm sure the likes of Flashy and Tootall would be only too happy if their employers started cutting their wages, increasing their hours, giving them poor working conditions etc...

As usual, we've got a couple of ignorant blinkered right-wingers who don't actually have any idea of the working conditions and situation of the people they feel so vitriolic towards. Because unless something affects them personally, like not being able to get to work on time, they really don't give a stuff about what affects others. Pure selfishness and a complete lack of empathy.

Ironic though how both of them enjoy many rights in their jobs because of the work done by UK trade unions though, innit?

this is why I HATE politics.
even those who talk about politics just act like politicians throwing petty insults at each other and repeating what everyone else has said.
I'd take an interest in these political threads if they didn't just end up with the same people attacking each other, trolling and winding each other up.

Surely Elfin these days workers rights and safe working environments are just as much protected by legislation as the unions.

[b][i]"Britain will remain with the most restrictive trade union laws anywhere in the western world"[/i][/b]
- Tony Blair 1997

Trade unions are the first line of defence against attacks on the rights of workers.

Surely Elfin these days workers rights and safe working environments are just as much protected by legislation as the unions.

Only brought about - by Labour governments, the Tories never have - because of collective union representation
To idly stand by and let it look after itself would be folly

Well, as Labour was in power for a number of years, the volume of health and safety legislation was obviously going to increase, as before with the Tories and some rather important landmark legislation during their stay in office.

Its also interesting that the level and quality of health and safety enforcement fell during Labour's latest stay in office.

Perhaps you'd like to let us know what piece of landmark social legislation the Tories have ever brought in?

clue, it's a very short list indeed

Perhaps you'd like to let us know what piece of landmark social legislation the Tories have ever brought in

the Poll tax?

I was specifically talking about health and safety legislation, but never mind.

Many argue that Crow is a failed relic of militant unionism. Yet he has presided over a significant growth in membership, and has been highly effective in protecting the terms and conditions of his members. Like him or not, that is what he is paid and elected to do.

Its also interesting that the level and quality of health and safety enforcement fell during Labour's latest stay in office.

or do we live in a world of responsibility without accountability?

Judging by the number of senior staff in the banking sector who are still in jobs despite having presided over the wrecking of the global economy, I'd say the evidence pointed strongly to the answer being [i]"yes"[/i]

Junkyard - no FACTS at my fingertips i'm afraid, just ancedotal evidence from myself and my H&S colleagues over the last 20 years.

Yes scamper, as a health and safety professional I'd be VERY interested to hear your opinion.

Go on then

piss porr and it tirns manty peoel

Junkyard, when you go off on one you start speaking lolcat! Awesome!

Train drivers earn £10k on average more than a nurse. Nursing must be a doddle. I suppose that is why they don't strike all the time, too scared of losing their cushy number.

Train drivers earn £10k on average more than a nurse. Nursing must be a doddle. I suppose that is why they don't strike all the time, too scared of losing their cushy number.

I think nurses [u]should[/u] have more militant representation. Politicians are more than happy to pander to public opinion by saying what a marvellous job nurses do and how vital they are - perhaps they should be made to back it up with more cash?

Doesn't mean the train drivers are worth less though.

Actually, as token right winger nutter here - I have no problem at all with RMT's actions in this case - in fact I think that protecting their members statutory employment rights and backing them to the hilt if an employer is breaking those rules (whilst themselves also sticking to the rules) is more than fair, and 100% what a Union should be doing, I'll defend that to the death.

Thats entirely different from a union playing politics and trying to usurp the role of democratically elected governments by militant action, and trying to hold the nation hostage over payrises.

Not so long ago in ther papers it was how little the average squaddie earnt, but i was surprised to find that NHS nurses earn significantly less than HM Forces Nurses.

NHS nurses earn significantly less than HM Forces Nurses

Depends on what you're comparing - some of the nurses in the armed forces will be officers, but then some of the nurses in the NHS will be in management.

I'm sure the likes of Flashy and Tootall would be only too happy if their employers started cutting their wages, increasing their hours, giving them poor working conditions etc...

As usual, we've got a couple of ignorant blinkered right-wingers who don't actually have any idea of the working conditions and situation of the people they feel so vitriolic towards. Because unless something affects them personally, like not being able to get to work on time, they really don't give a stuff about what affects others. Pure selfishness and a complete lack of empathy.

Ironic though how both of them enjoy many rights in their jobs because of the work done by UK trade unions though, innit?

I admit - my wages haven't been cut - just frozen - but as for hours and working conditions - I have and probably will work again in conditions you would point blank refuse to. I am also not right wing - just not left wing - what you see depends on where you are standing and I happen to stand a little closer to the centre than you. Which is fine.
I fully support the worker's right to withdraw labour - in most circumstances / jobs. I don't like that Bob Crowe will go nuclear so quickly and strike - which most of the other unions disagree with as well. I feel no vitriol to the union members at all - their leadership have nothing in their arsenal between 'work' and 'not work', which is a real shame.

I enjoy no rights in my job that come from union activity. Or my previous job.

Scamper - Member

I was specifically talking about health and safety legislation, but never mind.

The Health and Safety at Work Act was introduced by a Labour government, that's an "Old" Labour government btw, under intense pressure from the affiliated unions.

Train drivers earn £10k on average more than a nurse.

So predictable.............Bob Crow gets criticised because train drivers earn a good wage ! 😀

I think you'll that most train drivers are ASLEF members btw.

......and that they earn considerably less than the bankers who screwed the country.

Looking forward to 2012, pre-Olympics to see what reason Mr Crowe will come up with to threaten another shutdown of the tube.

I take your point johnners, but as far as possible like for like.

no FACTS at my fingertips i'm afraid, just ancedotal evidence from myself and my H&S colleagues over the last 20 years.

Elfinsafety - Member

Ooh, isn't it [b]Socialist ideologies[/b] that have brought us free healthcare, education and stuff like that?

No,it wasn't actually.

Yes it was, actually.

😆