[Closed] Bad day at the Clairvoyant.

two things Randi prize for proof of psychic power

Hudoni left his family wiht a secret word saying he would say this at a seance - he claimed if anyone could escape death it was him- no one ever said the word when they "found " him.
On balance i would go for it being untrue- I dont know why i said on balance it is clearly drivel to suggest or belief that nonsense

“I almost had a psychic girlfriend but she left me before we met.”

Steven Wright

I sit firmly on the fence in these types of debate and point and laugh at anyone who uses current sciencific fact to rubbish these claims or who believes wholeheartedly in them.

That's nothing to brag about.

You can't form an opinion so you think the best thing to do would be to mock anyone that has, regardless of what their opinion is ?

Is there some sort of difference between "fact" and "scientific fact"?

Un-surprisingly stupid people will believe stupid things.

They will also be incapable of realising this.

That's nothing to brag about.
You can't form an opinion so you think the best thing to do would be to mock anyone that has, regardless of what their opinion is ?

Who's bragging? People advancing an absolute position on something that ultimately is currently unprovable either way makes me laugh. My opinion is that most people stick religiously to a preconceived set of beliefs (sometimes known as common sense I reckon) and will use whatever limited resources they have to defend that position. Most of them aren't religious either.

Why is it unproveable?

People advancing an absolute position on something that ultimately is currently unprovable either way makes me laugh.

Good for you. A science fan, then...

If all of these people are floating around somewhere it must be bloody crowded.

A fan of enquiry.

Why is it unproveable?

Because currently there are no reliable methods of measuring the phenomenon.

By all means have an open mind, but give it a little filtration.

I like that, I shall make it mine.

People advancing an absolute position on something that ultimately is currently unprovable either way makes me laugh.

So because no one can absolutely prove 100% that pigeons don't turn luminous green and break dance at night (but only when not being recorded or watched), it must be plausible?

Really?

So because no one can absolutely prove 100% that pigeons don't turn luminous green and break dance at night (but only when not being recorded or watched), it must be plausible?

That actually happens. I saw a bloke once who told me so (cost me fifty quid mind).

What "phenomenon"? Gulling the credulous? Did you read any of the item that I linked?

Because currently there are no reliable methods of measuring the phenomenon.

It's fairly readily provable; the fact that no-one's managed it so far says more about the practitioners than the testing methods.

There is actually an established, and well-used scale for measuring the gulling of the credulous Wopster. Honestly there is. It was Charles Darwens lesser known work, and is referred to as the political manifesto scale 😉

Well if it were untrue, then the arrest of that woman who announced the deaths of all those sailors on the battleship Hood before the Admiralty even knew about it, was pretty unnecessary then.

It is more often the ignorant and stupid that attempt to mock that which they cannot or will not accept or understand.

We had a little chat again at lunchtime, Mrs Goodman and I, since our world has been a little unsettled by this and she admitted and apologised for introducing this woman, I don't normally do spiritualists, given those that went before probably couldn't help me when they were alive so why they should suddenly transform in death, I don't accept.
My preference is for the clear sighted, those that without reference to anything other than maybe your palm or their crystal or the Tarot, will give you an enlightened view not only of yourself in a similar way to psychometric testing, then enlarge with a view of your likely future.
So in all it was a mistake and feelings suffered for it, I don't view it as a confidence trick, and genuinely feel she believed everything she iterated, a large percentage of which was bang on, there is no-one more sceptical than I in real life, my naivety necessitates that and distrust. So accept it as just a report of one persons experience, nothing more, nothing less and the opinion of that person that the gift some of these people possess is genuine and real, but as with everything to greater and lessor degree and wielded in equal human measure with greater and lessor integrity.

this is weird, watched boarding bobs link above http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2187084/derren_brown_secrets_revealed/
about derren brown convincing simon pegg he really wants a bmx, what pops up later down the page but an advert for a bmx... even the internet is psychic...

Isn't it amazing how, time after time, evidence of the hucksterism and chicanery of the con artists of the "psychic" world is presented and yet not one jot of evidence is offered by those who seek to support it, the "yossarians" of this world claim that there is "no evidence either way".

Perhaps I should be posting this on the "Things that don't make sense" thread, eh?

So, for "yossarian" and "whitegoodman" I'll do it again. Perhaps you might both care to digest this before you make another ill-informed pronouncement in an attempt to defend the indefensible, just because you WANT it to be true...

http://www.skepdic.com/skeptimedia/skeptimedia127.html

It is more often the ignorant and stupid that attempt to mock that which they cannot or will not accept or understand

[url= http://www.future-forcast.co.uk/helen-duncan ]As near proof as you'll ever get.[/url]

Which naturally begs the question: Why do you want it to be true?

Helen Duncan is said to have materialized a sailor

I rest my case.

Mr Woppit - Member
Which naturally begs the question: Why do you want it to be true?

Are you asking this question of me or the junkyard guy?

I didn't set out on this course wishing it to be true or not, I know it's true, have spent a lifetime in the company of various bits of my family who to greater or lessor degree have this gift. My Gran, she never used it other than amongst us light heartedly with the tea leaves until one time when she went very pale and two days later my Grandad died, but like lots of folk who have it they do not do anything with it and thus do not raise the Witch burning lynch mob such that is present here this very day.

What "phenomenon"? Gulling the credulous? Did you read any of the item that I linked?

No I didn't. You have some of the most entrenched and intolerant views on this forum, I'd go so far as to label you a fundamentalist. Plus you made an racist dig at a former poster on here that surprised and disappointed me. I tend to ignore you now.

Mr Woppit - Member
Helen Duncan is said to have materialized a sailor
I rest my case.

Aha... a link to some random, completely unverified, but no doubt impartial, balanced and informed website

That'll do for me. I'm now fully convinced

binners - Member
Aha... a link to some random, completely unverified, but no doubt impartial, balanced and informed website

That'll do for me. I'm now fully convinced

yossarian - Member

What "phenomenon"? Gulling the credulous? Did you read any of the item that I linked?

No I didn't.

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see...

Plus you made an racist dig at a former poster on here that surprised and disappointed me.

That's a strong allegation. Care to substantiate it?

Tea leaves. You've gone and done it now....

As near proof as you'll ever get.

The problem there is all that 'proof' is conveniently sealed as military secrets, and what we're left with is largely word of mouth. Far as I can gather, her 'apparitions' talked about on your site there were Duncan herself with a sheet over her head.

Ask yourself this though, what's more likely; that she had The Gift and this seventy year old tale is [i]the best proof we're ever likely to see,[/i] or she was posing as a ghost and was unlucky enough to attract attention with a couple of lucky guesses.

I like the way that all 'real' psychics are completely altruistic seeing as not one has decided to use their 'real' powers to get the million dollar prize for demonstrating their 'gift'.

But then if they really were altruistic they should use their power to win the million then use it for good causes.

Here you go,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_Duncan

Two lieutenants were among her audience at a séance on 14 January 1944 and this was followed up on 19 January, when police arrested her at another séance as a white-shrouded manifestation appeared. This proved to be Duncan herself, in a white cloth which she attempted to conceal when discovered, and she was arrested. She was also found to be in possession of a mocked-up HMS Barham hat-band. This apparently related to an alleged manifestation of the spirit of a dead sailor on HMS Barham, although Duncan appeared unaware that after 1939 sailors did not wear hat-bands identifying their ship. She was initially arrested under section 4 of the Vagrancy Act 1824, a minor offence tried by magistrates. However, the authorities regarded the case as more serious, and eventually discovered section 4 of the Witchcraft Act 1735, covering fraudulent "spiritual" activity, which was triable before a jury.
...
The prosecution may be explained by the mood of suspicion prevailing at the time: the authorities were afraid that she could continue to reveal classified information, whatever her source was. There were also concerns that she was exploiting the recently bereaved, as the Recorder noted when passing sentence.

They suspected her of listening to German radio broadcasts, but never managed to prove it.

Right here woppit

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/respect-for-the-departed/page/5

There is nothing racist in that thread from me whatsoever. Withdraw your accusation.

I like the way that all 'real' psychics are completely altruistic seeing as not one has decided to use their 'real' powers to get the million dollar prize for demonstrating their 'gift'.

You can draw some massive parallels with religion there, the other global con.

Mr Woppit - Member
Is it just me, or is Ahmed's "Alternative STW Forum" beginning to gain traction?
POSTED 3 WEEKS AGO # REPORT-POST

Now unless I'm very much mistaken you were talking about an ex poster on here. The only reason I can see for you to call him Ahmed when that isn't his name is a derogatory one. One based on race. Do please correct me if I'm wrong.

I called him Ahmed because that is what I thought his real name is.

Unfortunately, I had mis-remembered it from bullheart's old "Just Giving" page. His real name is actually "Aziz".

However, whether or not I had got his name right, I fail to see how calling someone by their name can be construed as racist.

Apologise.

I know it's true, have spent a lifetime in the company of various bits of my family who to greater or lessor degree have this gift. My Gran, she never used it other than amongst us light heartedly with the tea leaves until one time when she went very pale and two days later my Grandad died, but like lots of folk who have it they do not do anything with it and thus do not raise the Witch burning lynch mob such that is present here this very day.

I'm not sure if you're having a laugh or you're serious. If it's the later, that's freaking worrying, what with this being 2013 and all. Or are you contacting us from the dead? You're not Napoleon are you?

The only reason I can see for you to call him Ahmed when that isn't his name is a derogatory one. One based on race.

Ah. I've called Woppit on this before. He asserts that's his real name; my understanding is different, but I've no proof either way. Ironically.

EDIT - based on his intermediate edit, it would seem this is a mistake. Again, I've no way of verifying this, so it's difficult to call from a Moderatorial perspective.

Do me a favour and don't do it again?

"Aziz" is how he refers to himself, according to Mark Alker. Again, and this is also for "Cougar" - how on earth is it racist to refer to someone by their name?

Both of you need a reality check, in my opinion.

And I still want an apology.

yossarian, I feel you've misunderstood racism entirely. I call my local corner shop owner Mr.Patel (Or Apu)to others, because for the life of me I can never remember his real (and complicated) surname. I go out of my way to use his shop, so it's certainly not through racism. It's a jovial colloquialism. Racism must have INTENT.

Like a car crash, this thread...

That's what happens when you get falsely accused in public.

Both of you need a reality check, in my opinion.

And you need an attitude check, in mine. Guess we'll have to agree to differ, hey?

I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, in case you missed it.

I say a fortune teller many years ago.

After 1.5 hours, I went to pay her - basically she cost all the notes in my wallet. She saw that, and said 'I' should 'NEVER' have no money on me and she didn't charge me at all! We are probably talking £100 in today's money that she didn't take from me for what she believed.

whitegoodman - thanks for sharing

I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, in case you missed it.

That's big of you, but I really don't care. I am massively offended. How dare you.

I called him Ahmed because that is what I thought his real name is.
Unfortunately, I had mis-remembered it from bullheart's old "Just Giving" page. His real name is actually "Aziz".
However, whether or not I had got his name right, I fail to see how calling someone by their name can be construed as racist.
Apologise.

Hmm...if you [b]genuinely[/b] made a mistake then I acknowledge your error and mine. You did come across as a bit of an old racist at the time though and you didn't correct it at the time. Which struck me as odd.

Weasel words. Drivel. I did not make any mistake - I referred to someone by their name. That is clear.

Apologise.

as a bit of an old racist at the time

You really are beneath contempt.

Hold on there woppit, you know full well what his real name is, you used it when you contacted him on stwargue. I called you out at the time on the thread that yossarian linked to, but you didn't respond.

Oh, I've really had enough of this.