leave that to his parents, Drs and the legal types.
Parents are not generally qualified technically, to make sound judgements of this type. The court appointed guardian who is supposed to bring independant thinking on behalf of the child supported the decision of the medical experts who had agreed that turning the machines off was the right course. The only legal types arguing against were the CLC, with God knows what axe to grind, and a willing mother willing to grind it with them. Even their own appointed medical expert was not in disagreement with the decision (and the manner in which they were appointed at the eleventh hour gave no confidence in them being able to give a good opinion anyway)
For all the rights to a second opinion, and the right to have the facts heard at higher levels than 'just' the medics actually providing the treatment, this was not a difficult decision. It was only made so by the refusal to accept that sometimes black IS black and white IS white.
But we did this ad nauseum at the time. My point stands that at the time blame was being pointed at the wrong people. We don't yet know who is to blame, or indeed if it was a tragic accident / misadventure. The coroner will decide that.
For anyone who hasn't yet read it I recommend Fake Law. Just reading it myself, digitally, courtesy of my local library. I'm pretty sure it's already been mentioned that it covers exactly this scenario well.
Did you not see any coverage of the mother or her back story!
Yes, IIRC she used to be a stripper? Does that make her less of a person?
That what the doctors had said. This is very clear. its not a grey area and not a matter of opinion. Its fact.
This x 100%. There is no informed debate to be had over the medical facts, and this was quite clear from very early.
Yes, IIRC she used to be a stripper? Does that make her less of a person?
The bit I thought most relevant was when she managed to get in the Daily Mail when she complained that her son had tripped over a paving slab or cut his foot on some glass (or something) & was blaming the council. It implied to me that she wasn't averse to using her children to get herself into the spotlight.
For anyone who hasn’t yet read it I recommend Fake Law.
Absolutely this, fantastic book.
It implied to me that she wasn’t averse to using her children to get herself into the spotlight.
I used to say that money was the most popular reason people would compromise their values for. These days I 50/50 it with fame/social media clout. Quite sad.
Parents are not generally qualified technically, to make sound judgements of this type.
And you are?
This thread is repulsive, some people on here are so busy puffing up their egos and not thinking of the feelings of people who love this kid.
I'm sorry but this should be closed.
The problem is 5plus8 is that you have not grasped the detail of this case
Your point has validity in edge cases or when the medical condition is not clear. In this case the childs medical condition is clear. He was dead and had been for months. No ambiguity, no doubt
He had "coned" that means he was dead.
I have fought for the right of people to have futile treatment when their odds of survival are minimal and I knew the treatment futile because that is their right and I knew that is what they wanted. That is different from this because they were not dead and being animated by machinery.
In this case it had long gone beyond the point at which there was any chance or any sort of recovery or any point in continuing treatment. Its not a case of vegetative state or minimally conscious state.
There are a few of us on here who have worked with cases like this and understand the implications and have tried to explain them to you
And you are?
No, but thankfully that's why there are panels of medical experts, judges, and lawyers to look at all sides of the argument and decide.
Did you read the judgements? I would recommend.
Incredible care and attention given by the people that are qualified to decide. Including listening to the parents, no matter how well or badly 'behaved' they were to the teams providing treatment.
some people on here are so busy puffing up their egos and not thinking of the feelings of people who love this kid.
You really haven't grasped this at all have you as TJ says.
Key points
1. Medically the kid was dead, end of, medical fact.
2. Whether the parents loved the kid is also an interresting assumption to make. The mother in particularly has come over as an attention loving, gritting and thoroughly unpleasent human being who used her child as a social media tool. Look up some of the MMA stuff. It's also becoming more apparent this was actually a suicide.
3. There are many other people's feeling to consider here, first the medical staff put through hell here, tending a corpse, getting abuse in the press and online for trying to do their job compassionately. Then there's the other patients whose treatment was delayed because staff and beds weren't available. Then there's their relatives.
You're looking at this very one dimensionally and frankly the abuse you're directing towards people posting on this thread is unwarranted. You want the thread closed because you're losing the argument? If you think the thread truly inappropriate use the report button to alert the mods.
Nothing wrong with being a stripper, it was all the other stuff that she and other family members did to grift a load of money off gullible people. How they shut down anyone who disagreed with them. She is not a nice person and used her kid as a lifestyle accessory to publicise on social media. The fact it’s now looking likely he took his own life gives even more weight to how she was as a mother and person.
Indeed.
I do wonder why the media were holding her up as the pinnacle of concerned motherhood when they undoubtedly had access to the same information the rest of us did.
The cynic in me says that they knew that we like nothing better than a women who turns out to not be perfect, and in this particular case a very nasty person. I wonder if they played with our sympathies knowing that all the information was going to come out and the general public was going to lap up the inevitable exposes that will start being published as soon as it becomes clear her child killed himself.
