Many people, me included, would have no idea she was mixed race without being told as she has the same skin tone as many other white American actresses.
I find this mind blowing she is clearly mixed race.
I did not recognise her as mixed race before the press started on about it. Now maybe I had not looked closely but I was suprised.
I suspect TV and associated makeup/lighting doesn’t help.
The funny thing is, this very subject was brought up in "Suits".
I can't remember it word for word, apart from her answer, but it was something like . . .
Meghan Markles character, Rachel Zane, was talking to one of the other young guys at the office and said "I'm not loking forward to going up against such-and-such a legal firm because it's my fathers firm". The youngster says "you're Robert Zanes daughter?? But he's black?" and she replies "yes, my father is black, my mother is white . . . . where did you think I got this year round tan from??"
I did not recognise her as mixed race before the press started on about it. Now maybe I had not looked closely but I was suprised.
I find that crazy. It's really interesting that your experiences and background have lead you unable to see she's clearly mix raced before its been pointed out.
I am not sure why. Perhaps its because its unimportant to me ( both her race and her status) and perhaps its in part because I never really looked at her but until the press mentioned it I never noticed. Not unable to see but simply not noticed
Which ones mixed race? do yo see why with an uninterested glance I could not tell? Ok photoshop and such but even so
She didn’t fib, she said the precedent was set elsewhere, and her concern was of the removal of security protection of her an her children due to the resulting status change. She then said that she’s never received an answer as to why the precedent didn’t apply to her or her kids yet it did for others.
and I quote:
Meghan: Separate from that, and what was happening behind closed doors was, you know, we knew I was pregnant. We now know it’s Archie, and it was a boy. We didn’t know any of that at the time. We can just talk about it as Archie now. And that was when they were saying they didn’t want him to be a prince or a princess — not knowing what the gender would be, which would be different from protocol — and that he wasn’t going to receive security.
Let's not forget this "fact" is being made much of by the ex-royal couple.
This protocol is available through google, amongst other commonly searchable sources
A decree issued by King George V — the Queen's grandfather — in 1917 limits the titles of prince and princess to the children of the monarch, children of the monarch's sons and "the eldest living son of the eldest son of the Prince of Wales".
Modified in 2012 by Queenie:
Using Letters Patent, a method by which the sovereign can give orders without the involvement of Parliament, the Queen decided that from now on "all the children of the eldest son of the Prince of Wales" should be given the title of Royal Highness "with the titular dignity of Prince or Princess prefixed to their Christian names"
This is literally five minutes of google. Not getting that right, and misusing that as a basis of claim of how she was treated, on what is one extremely widely watched TV interview, is a special kind of media savvy management of her fans (for want of a better word).
More critical thinking please, hmm?
I am not sure why. Perhaps its because its unimportant to me ( both her race and her status) and perhaps its in part because I never really looked at her but until the press mentioned it I never noticed. Not unable to see but simply not noticed
Which ones mixed race? do yo see why with an uninterested glance I could not tell? Ok photoshop and such but even so
Im not getting into it dude, we could go round and round talking about how its your privilege to not see race and so on but its not going to get us anywhere. You said you didn't notice she was mix raced and I simply commented because that comment from you and the initial one I found absurd, because shes clearly (well to me any way) mixed race.
You're in the minority for not noticing, for sure. Don't know if that's significant to the general discourse though.
Anyway, is it time to post the song from Avenue Q yet?
More critical thinking please, hmm?
When William ascends the throne, Archie should be offered a title (under the current Patent as devised by the Queen in 2012)...Perhaps that's what the row is about?
No Royal Family = No unseemly media circus dependent on it.
Just saying, like....
Maybe.
As it hasn't (correct me if I'm wrong) been explicitly caveated by either ex-royal that the claim of non-princeyness is expedited by some future succession event, I'd have to go with "no", though.
I thought Archie has a title, he’s an Earl and will become a Duke?
he’s an Earl and will become a Duke?
But not Prince...That's the row. @Mrmonkfinger I think trying to explain the frankly labyrinthine rules to British folk without a working knowledge of recent history and a pencil and paper is a tough ask...to any other country's citizens it probably seems impenetrable …
I'd wouldn't be at all surprised by this lot if the idea of a largely Americanised mixed-race child bought up mostly in the states (ie away from influence of the Firm) being somehow given an HRH may have filled some of the "less modernised" members with some horror...
Fair enough joepud. I am not someone who claims to be "colourblind". I just had not looked with any interest at her just a glance in passing and did not notice.
Funnily enough (and if I remember exactly the scene)in Suits, Mike(main character) doesn’t realise Rachel(Meghan Markle)is mixed race until he meets the father, leading to a joke about a “year round tan” from Rachel.
Well until it was pointed out to me, I didn't realise Meghan Markle was mixed race. To be honest I'd only ever seen her if I caught a glimpse of a tv screen or magazine front cover or whatever, but I would say it is not immediately apparent.
On the flipside of this, the tendency for anyone on US TV in particular, and in the UK 'celebrity' sphere to look like they've just survived a particularly violent blast at the Cuprinol* factory makes it even harder to tell (not that it really should be considered necessary to be able to tell).
*Other brands of outdoor wood preparation are available.
@tjagain - I also never realised that Meghan Markle was mixed race until Danny Baker was sacked for the racist tweet regarding her baby.
I think the point here is that to most of us, we probably can't see the problem. For a group of people who's very "specialness" (according to them) is being able to trace their families heritage all the way back to the The Bastard's invasion in 1066, the notion of mixed race (and I'll happily take money from anyone if we're going to open a book on "do you think they noticed" ) probably brings on a fainting fit.
If your answer to that is an automatic "But Nick, it's 2021" then, with respect, you've not being paying sufficient attention to who these folk actually are, and how they think.
Edit: Don't forget that it wasn't that long ago they considered Diana Lady Spencer a "normal citizen", and her marriage to the Prince of Wales was somewhat controversial. I don't know about you, but my idea of "Normal" doesn't include a Dukedom, a coat of arms, and several thousand acres of Northamptonshire and Norfolk
There’s more to race than skin colour, those that can’t see it are not aware or not used to seeing it. With Megan in the pics TJ provides: hair texture, nose, eye shape and colour, to say the least.
Interesting though TJ you should choose a woman with history of racial prejudice to compare Megan with, is this you trying to be subtle? Because in the context is pretty inappropriate.
hair texture, nose, eye shape and colour, to say the least.
Sorry still can't see it. Its becoming quite normal to see mixed race people on TV, particularly if you watch the American TV imports, seeing people of different ethnic backgrounds is fairly normalised now and that's good, so sorry (in the Pritti Patel sense) if me not immediately seeing her and labelling her this race or another is a bad thing, to me she's just another American actress I'd never heard of. As someone who avoids all the papers I didn't have to view who she is through the lens of her parents ethnic origins. Shame a few more people couldn't do it.
I thought she looked latino, there are a few that look like her in American soaps shown here. Sky news soon put me right. Clearly it matters because the media think it matters and it's become an issue which is very sad. (Edit: though I will admit to laughing out loud at some of the interview (mainly Harry), that perhaps makes me a bad person but I can't take anything to do with royalty too seriously)
She came across as genuinely shocked by the treatment she'd got from UK media. It reminds me of Josephine Baker, who had got used to life in France where she was free to walk the streets and use any service she wanted, and then paid a visit to her native US. She suddenly had to deal with institutionalised racism and couldn't walk the streets of New York unaccompanied.
Today's America isn't perfect, but Meghan clearly wasn't used to being treated like shit because of her skin colour and background, she is after all a star in her world over there. So the way she was treated/reported was something unexpected.
I find it all quite revealing of attitudes, and I thank the pair of them for that. Not the kind of people I'd wish to spend time with, but I wish them well and thank them for holding up a mirror for the people around them to see themselves in.
but Meghan clearly wasn’t used to being treated like shit because of her skin colour and background
But was that specifically related to her skin colour and background. I would guess any high profile American woman would probably have been treated the same, as an outsider, and expected to conform to the rigid protocols of the Royal Family.
high profile American woman
She’s not very high profile according to my US work colleagues. Remembering the size of the country, and the diversity, number of and regionalism of the US TV stations they tell me less than 10% likely know who she is, which was evidenced during the US airing of the program.
I would guess any high profile American woman would probably have been treated the same
We'll have to differ on that one. Meryl Streep doesn't have her choice of breakfast analysed and slagged off by the British press.
Hasn't this all raised the popularity of the Rf in general ?.
Might find that an odd statement, but for , maybe up until last year, maybe the year before all the main tabloid comments sections were full of comments about how much the RF costs, and many many comments calling them scroungers and a waste of tax payers money. Thus far there's not been a peep about that.
Might be to do with everyone now taking sides, but I find it odd all the same.
What a fickle lot the great unwashed truly are 😕
Interesting though TJ you should choose a woman with history of racial prejudice to compare Megan with, is this you trying to be subtle? Because in the context is pretty inappropriate.
NOpe - I just picked a permatanned female seleb!
'I was only dressing up. Honest.'
analysed and slagged off by the British press.
I was refering to her alleged treatment by the Royal Family. I didn't mention the press, I can't really comment I dont read any of the papers. I imagine if Meryl Streep swanned into the Royal Family and expected it to flex to her expectations she'd be disappointed as well. And before you jump on me for that it's not defending the Royals, it's just how they are and if you want to join you bend not them.
Not very often but I’m agreeing with TJ on this. Makeup and lighting makes a huge difference. Here’s my wedding photo, as mentioned my wife is mixed race. We had actually spent 3 months prior to the wedding in either Australia or Florida so we were both tanned. But I look at this photo and can see the difference between my wife’s normal appearance. I don’t think it’s blatantly obvious to someone who doesn’t know her that she is mixed race.
However in this photo, very little make up and just after a bike ride to the pub, I think it’s pretty clear even in sun glasses. Mrs W is very proud of her families African heritage (Tanzanian and Ugandan), she absolutely classed herself as mixed race.
Also, would my daughters be classed as mixed race? The dark haired older daughter looks very much like her mum, whereas the Blonde one is more like me in appearance.
The photos are on facebook and the likes so don’t think they’ll mind me posting here....and I’m drunk!!
We’ll have to differ on that one. Meryl Streep doesn’t have her choice of breakfast analysed and slagged off by the British press.
Not yet but if she married Andy, or better yet, Anne, I bet it would be a whole lot more than breakfast.
Might find that an odd statement, but for , maybe up until last year, maybe the year before all the main tabloid comments sections were full of comments about how much the RF costs, and many many comments calling them scroungers and a waste of tax payers money.
This - in fact there was loads of content in non tabloids, and probably even a thread here that if H&M going to states then uk shouldn’t pick up there security bill. All sounded very reasonable and no mention of race at that point.
I think we may all have missed the pachyderm in the room. The last divorced American in involved in the 'firm' left a bit of a mark too. Maybe that more than the colour was a factor at the start.
Good job Great Grandma Bowes-Lyon wasn't alive when La Markle was brought home for the first time.
I was refering to her alleged treatment by the Royal Family. I didn’t mention the press, I can’t really comment I dont read any of the papers. I imagine if Meryl Streep swanned into the Royal Family and expected it to flex to her expectations she’d be disappointed as well. And before you jump on me for that it’s not defending the Royals, it’s just how they are and if you want to join you bend not them.
I think the two (RF and press) are inextricably linked - H&M's treatment at the hands of the press has been utterly disgusting, I saw a tweet yesterday where someone compared headlines between Kate and Meghan ("Kate's avocado morning sickness panacea" vs "Meghan's environment-destroying avocado habit", "Kate lovingly tends baby bump" vs "Why can't Meghan keep her hands off her bump?", "Kate's bouquet follows royal code" vs "Meghan's bouquet puts Princess Charlotte at risk" (same flowers), "Kate hires experienced nanny" vs "Meghan's nanny could break royal code" (same nanny), "Kate dazzles in white gown" vs "Meghan breaks royal protocol again in vulgar move" (both wearing off the shoulder dresses), "Duke and duchess set up company to protect their brand (just like the Bechams)" vs "a right royal cash in!", etc etc etc etc etc, there are very, very many more. I think what they needed was ptoection and support from the RF, and I don't think they got it, sounds like some of the family were sympathetic in private, some were less so and some of the "firm" were borderline hostile.
I guess my point is that, in isolation,one or the other were bearable but both (press and RF) were not.
I had no idea she was mixed race until i was told either, may i dont look for it or its because im stupid or just not bothered either way so dont notice.
I have a friend who based on one of the descriptions above must be mixed race, howver shes not..so best not base anything on looks id say..more so why do people need it noticed if we are all equal anyway
more so why do people need it noticed if we are all equal anyway
"colourblindness" can led to inadvertant discrimination and other issues
for me its just that at a superficial glance I did not realise. Not interested enough to take more than that superficial glance. therefore I did not realise until I saw it in the press
Well i did notice the skin tone/colour but did not link sed tone/colour to race....
Not sure what that says about me..
W00dster has the first garden I’ve ever seen on STW that passes the “Your garden could do with.....” test.
for me its just that at a superficial glance I did not realise. Not interested enough to take more than that superficial glance. therefore I did not realise until I saw it in the press
Yet you admitted to deliberately posting a - and I quote - "permatanned" person here to support your argument when any other caucasian person would have done. Not sure what that says about you TBH, but you certainly manipulated evidence for your own benefit.
FFS Kryton - I don't know how to try to explain it further
I am no racist as you seem to imply. I was out demonstrating with the Anti nazi league in the 70s. I have fought discrimination all my life. I have got into serious trouble from school days on because of my commitment to fight discrimination.. I have stood up for staff who were being discriminated against
Permattanned referrers to the habit of fake tanning all year round. thats all
IIRC you have a mixed race wife and have suffered discrimination? I understand that would lead you to be very sensitive around these issues but try to not look for the worst in what I posted
Edit:
the use of that pic was simply to try to show why I did not notice Merkles skin tone as its not far from the fake tanned caucasian seleb! thats all
Philip's comment about 'fuzzy wuzzies' seems to have disappeared from the dialogue. Can't think why.
FFS Kryton – I don’t know how to try to explain it further
Just stop. I'm willing to admit perhaps its just me, but you didn't conduct yourself well in the first exchanges, and everything posted thereafter just seems to be a flawed desperate defence which IMHO makes it worse. Comparing a picture of a fake tanned person to compare with a mixed race person then claiming you can't tell the difference seems somewhat flawed no?
IIRC you have a mixed race wife
She's black Caribbean, and my sensitivity of racial discrimanation is far from the point, I'm trying to help you see that there's more than the colour of peoples skin that determines their race, where within context is seems that where it subtly leads to is that it was OK for Megan to be abused by the Royal institution, because - hey who knew she was mixed race eh?
