[Closed] about to order a Trangia Mini...any better options?

More expensive (+ no pot/pans incl) but how about :-

http://tracksterman.tumblr.com/post/2461217083/triad-review

Tracksterman can't be wrong 🙂

Jetboil they're very light and efficient.

hmm cheers. Drac, Jetboil just do gas stoves dont't they?

Clicky linky for a small stove test,

http://ianbarrington.com/

Other than making my own out of a red bull can (I'd like something robust, not sure that qualifies)

Is there a guide for doing this?

LOLs at the bivvi-enthusiasm just now, it's the latest winter-mid-life-crisis activity!

I think there is on the show bivi kit thread recently

Thanks flatfish, useful link. cynic-al, how did you guess I was going through a mid life crisis, is it that obvious? That bivi thread has some info on making your own.

heres the link for the stove.
http://ygingras.net/b/2007/6/a-better-soda-can-stove

I found this pot, cozy, spork and pot grabber in Ellis Brigham a couple of weeks ago and whilst i don't need it i feel the need to buy it every time i drive past.
http://www.gsioutdoors.com/activities/pdp/halulite_minimalist/ultralight_backpacking/

so slightly dearer by a fiver but i reckon better than a trangia.

Bear in mind that with any alcohol burner you've got to carry the fuel, and not only do they use significant amounts of fuel, but you need a robust fuel container which won't be light. If you really want to go light then IMHO it has to be solid fuel. The usual trouble with that is that if you use a normal burner it burns very yellow - ie sooty and not that hot. I've made myself a "chimney" stove for it (alu can bottom, steel can top, as the alu can't take the heat) which directs the airflow in at the bottom and out the top - convection does the rest, creating a strong airflow which allows the fuel to burn properly. The stove and fuel required for a night's bivi weighs less than a typical fuel bottle.

cheers aracer. I've heard that solid fuel tabs are very quick to burn out, hence you need to take a lot of them. problem?

class olshen (sp?) sell a trangia copy with 2 pans, frying pan, burner, stove etc for £10, bargain.

Home built burners are a marginal improvement over the trangia ones, if you want a trangia to burn quicker, chuck some dry grass in the bruner to act as wick.

I like the White Box stove http://www.backpackinglight.co.uk/product230.asp it's a little bit of recycled beauty

I have a mini trangia that doesn't get used much. The burner is very heavy compared to say, a pocket rocket.

My pocket rocket and a small canister are way lighter than the trangia burner and a small 200ml plastic bottle of meths.

I've got a mini Trangia plus a selection of coke-can type meths stoves that I use with a Ti mug. I very rarely use them though as I'll either take a pocket-rocket and the Ti Mug or (most often) a Jetboil.

Making the coke-can stoves was fun though and they do work pretty well.

Mini Trangia's a good option as you can always use the lightish weight pans with other stoves, such as gas, as well as with the Trangia burner. I don't mind the weight penalty of the brass Trangia burner as you can control the flame and screw shut any unused meths inside the burner.

IMO, the main issue with the mini T is the lack of a sufficient wind-break. You either have to make one out of foil, etc. or build one out of rocks. Not a problem with the larger Trangias and you'd need an additional wind break with most other stoves anyway.

As for what's best for what & when. I tend to use a pocket rocket type gas burner for solo one nighters but the Trangia (mini or larger Trangia or both) for longer trips or family overnighters. On the longer trips I find meths more economical and easier to manage/obtain than specialist gas canisters. You can also improvise with the Trangia and burn solid fuel or twigs if your camping companions have necked all the meths after their ridiculously inadequate trendy hipflasks have run dry 😉

Trangias are terrible. I'd rather take small gas cannisters tbh. At least then you can cook stuff.

Can't imagine trying to cook with a tranny for a family! 😯 I have used a coleman two ring burner for that, which was awful (anyone want it?) and a MSR Whisperlite, but I think I want a Camping Gaz two ring + grill. Camping Gaz pretty ubiquitous.

I've heard that solid fuel tabs are very quick to burn out, hence you need to take a lot of them. problem?

Trangias are terrible. I'd rather take small gas cannisters tbh. At least then you can cook stuff.

I've managed to cook

Sausages,
Bacon,
Eggs (fried)
Baked beans
Toast

On a trangia, and finished before the sausages had lost their temperature.

Can't imagine trying to cook with a tranny for a family!

Mini Trangia's a good option as you can always use the lightish weight pans with other stoves

If you want to see some empirical evidence then this web page may be of interest.

It compares different fuels and stoves and shows the trade off between weight and cost versus length of trip. An alcohol stove for a few days use is always going to be lighter than the equivalent weight with a gas stove. Though when you look at carrying more than 5 days fuel a gas stove is lighter.

[url= http://www.bushwalking.org.au/FAQ/FAQ_Efficiency.htm ]Stove Geek Zone Test[/url]

My personal setup is one of these

[url= http://www.traildesigns.com/stoves/caldera-ti-tri ]stove[/url]

Very lightweight and fits in a ti-mug (though mine is the aluminium version which was cheaper though discontinued now).

Teh beauty of a trangia is they just work. I have had trouble with gas ones in windy conditions or when its cold. For me it will be gas when warm, trangia when cold

Hi quality geekery link there jimmers

I've had far more trouble with trannies in the wind than I have gas. Except poorly designed gas ones I suppose, sans windshield.

MSR liquid fuel ones are the best of course but not lightweight compared to either trannies or gas. Trannies do drink meths like a tramp tho.

Why aren't I surprised that you like Trangias TJ? 🙂

The secret to using alcohol stoves is having an effective wind-break. I can get 500ml of water to a near boil (noodles don't need boiling water) with only 20ml of meths.

molgrips - when it gets cold and the can is half empty the gas will not vaporise properly and the gas stove hardly works. Dunno why you have trouble with trangias - they work better wth a bit of wind and you turn the windsheild round to get teh right amount of wind in them

Never seen anyone have an issue with one.

It compares different fuels and stoves and shows the trade off between weight and cost versus length of trip. An alcohol stove for a few days use is always going to be lighter than the equivalent weight with a gas stove. Though when you look at carrying more than 5 days fuel a gas stove is lighter.

Stove Geek Zone Test

what about a Svea?

I used to be a big fan of hexy stoves for that reason. Though got tired of having to clean the soot from the bottom of cookware.

I have heard that if you rub a used tea bag (wet) this cleans pots a treat. Never tried it.

I used to be a big fan of hexy stoves for that reason. Though got tired of having to clean the soot from the bottom of cookware.

The usual trouble with that is that if you use a normal burner it burns very yellow - ie sooty and not that hot. I've made myself a "chimney" stove for it (alu can bottom, steel can top, as the alu can't take the heat) which directs the airflow in at the bottom and out the top - convection does the rest, creating a strong airflow which allows the fuel to burn properly.

Mess tins and hexy blocks also as above wet mud and grass or tea bags to clean and it does work

I've made myself a "chimney" stove for it..steel can top

Isn't that less efficient, how many blocks does it take to boil 500ml for example?

I used to be able to manage with two blocks.

Isn't that less efficient

Or are you misunderstanding the point of the stove - I note your emphasis in the steel top but, which is only steel because the heat gets so intense at the top that an alu can weakens and bends (I tried alu first).

You mean 2 complete tabs (the tabs I have break into 4)? No idea how many mine uses, but I'll bet it's less given my experiments comparing my stove with a normal hex burner showed that. If I'm feeling any better this evening I'll have a go at a side by side test to prove the point.

I think I understand more now. I was thinking of the equivalent of heating a steel plate with a hexy tablet underneath (albeit with a windbrak) and putting the mess tin of top, bit like a smaller version of an arga cooker.

Yeah, 2 complete tablets. That was with the usual army style folding stoves with zero wind. If there is any wind I could easily use double that.

My setup now uses the Caldera windbreak and my Ti-mug sits in the top of the windbreak with no gaps underneath the wind break. I can use solid fuel tablets with that. Might try that to see if hexy tablets work well with it.

when it gets cold and the can is half empty the gas will not vaporise properly and the gas stove hardly works

Yeah, but how cold? I always understood that if it was cold enough to hamper gas stove performance then 99.9% of people wouldn't be camping anyway. I have a pocket rocket type thing (although not MSR) and a Whisperlite, which works in all weathers and burns different fuels etc. Actually, woudl be surprised if that's much heavier than a Trangia plus fuel bottle.

Never seen anyone have an issue with one.

Well now you know one 🙂

I found they either burned your food on high or did nothing on low, and used tons of fuel.

when it gets cold and the can is half empty the gas will not vaporise properly and the gas stove hardly works

I did the SDW a few days after New Year (few years ago) with a couple of mates bivi style over two days. The morning was a little frosty (below freezing). They had to give their gas stoves a rather serious shake to get a semi-decent flame out of them.

I had solid fuel tablets which just worked.

Here's some pics of my hex burner - sorry no action shots, I'm not up to it today.
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We have Trangias, a MRS Whisperlite multifuel, various kerosene stoves, and various gas stoves (primus, MRS pocket rocket etc). on a Bivi, without exception I'd go for the small gas stove (with shield) and cartridge, everytime. They are just loads easier and quicker and more adjustable flame.

when it gets cold and the can is half empty the gas will not vaporise properly and the gas stove hardly works

The ones where you can direct feed the liquid fuel don't have loss of power in cold conditions.

I have had trouble with gas ones in windy conditions or when its cold.

get a wind break (which also retains the heat), get one that can direct feed the liquid fuel.

This is the only foto I've got, but was taken on the Glacier Blanc at 3000m at about midnight, pasta meal for two, it was very cold and we had no probs, direct fed the liquid gas and used the shield.
[IMG] [/IMG]

Shields are the key. I have the larger trangia and as much as I have tried to like it IMO it performs poorly in comparison to the smaller gas models, with fuel its heavier and it is less controllable, as well as being larger.

My setup of choice, all fits into the mug.

[img] [/img]

molgrips - Member

"when it gets cold and the can is half empty the gas will not vaporise properly and the gas stove hardly works"

Yeah, but how cold? I always understood that if it was cold enough to hamper gas stove performance then 99.9% of people wouldn't be camping anyway.

Below about 5 C with a half empty can the issues start IME. NO amount of shaking will help much I found - with a half empty can thd fuel gets colder as it vaporises in the can as so the pressure drops to the point it hardly comes out.

The ones where you can direct feed the liquid fuel don't have loss of power in cold conditions.

Which are? Genuine interest. I have never heard of this? How does it work? YOu have to turn the can upside down?

I have a pocket rocket.

We have a Jetboil and it is fantastic.
Not done a bivi trip, but it should be perfect.

I'm lead to believe that the little cartridges (like in surfers pic above) have less problems with losing power when 2/3rds empty, larger gas cartridges are more prone to this, I think. mini gas cartridges are quite an expensive way of doing it tho, I think.
The gas stoves that can burn liquid gas have the preheater routed into the flame. This is an example, they're a few grammes heavier than a pocket rocket, but the pros outweigh the cons against all the others IME. I've not looked at this stove particularly, it just shows best how the copper gas pipe is fed into the hottest part of the stove to vapourise liquid fuel.
[img] [/img]
Yes, you just tip the cartridge upside down.

Ta BA

I certainly will be looking for a different stove before I go out in potentially cold conditions again.

Horses for courses really ... I was out last night, temps were down to around -4, all the water I was carrying had turned to solid ice by 6.30pm.

I was cooking on a titanium Vargo meths stove, no trouble at all. It was certainly cold enough this morning to have hindered any of my gas canister stoves to some degree. If I'm trying to cook / brew up for more than just me then I'll often take gas ... just so much quicker.

Trangia mini is a top buy,
the burner is exactly the same size and its much smaller in your rucksack
works even better in the wind so cant go wrong!
Lewis

If you want to be 100% cold-weather proof, then the old Primus type is a safe bet, running on paraffin.
I use them exclusively, mainly because they're brass, old, an engineering triumph, and they need a 'procedure' to light. Lovely.

my first camping stove was one of these
[img] http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQpxD3QE5bW3C3SVdfhbF7GmgUQJFeLQGwZsZZ8XhdoeG_X4J7_&t=1 [/img]
I lugged it up Liathach one year, along with a 5L container of parrafin and various other old camping kit.

Those brass Primus type cookers are brilliant (but very smelly in the wrong hands - such as mine)

Here's my old Valor, missing one of the legs due to overly enthusiastic priming....

[img] [/img]

It hasn't seen action for at least fifteen years but I used to use it back in my squatting days when a regular electricity and mains gas supply was intermitent. I've got a load of paraffin in the shed, I must get that broken leg welded back on and give it a whirl this coming summer 🙂

I've recently changed my views on ultra lightweight gas canisters that fit, along with a pocket rocket sized stove, into mugs,and small pans. They're less economical compared with larger canisters and you end up with a load of three-quarter empty canisters that don't have enough fuel left inside them to risk taking on an overnighter. Also, you can easily run out of fuel with a full one if it's providing a couple of meals and several brews for a couple of people. They might come into their own for ultra-lightweight mountain marathons, but even on last years OMM we took a 175g and a 125g canister between us as having plenty to drink and eat was more important to us on the overnight camp than saving a few ounces on the two days running.

A typical 100g canister, such as the one below costs between £2.80 & £3.99. The 175g canister on the right cost me £1.89 at a hardware store (and they're even cheaper if you buy them in bulk) 275ml beer bottle there purely to illustrate size. I always take whisky on the bivi 😉 ....

[img] [/img]

@Slugwash
You'll need the burner inner and outer caps, too. All too easy to lose (as in your case). One of the big advantages of 'roarer' burners (like Banana's Optimus 210)
You're a short step from the wonder of Tilley lamps here, too.

One of the big advantages of 'roarer' burners (like Banana's Optimus 210)

@Slugwash
You'll need the burner inner and outer caps, too.

Hopefully the burner's still with the broken-off leg, in a big box of bike bits in the loft.

Actually, that was just an image I stole that looked most like my stove

Yeah, B.A.Nana's only got one photo in his album 😉

[img] [/img]

Thanks guys, this is all very useful stuff. I'm borrowing a mini Trangia from a chum and I've also ordered a cheap ready made coke can stove with windshield (lazy yes but it was cheap & saves me the hassle just to try it out). I'll put these up against my pocket rocket-a-like (can't recall precisely which one it is I have) and see which I can live with the most. Keep the comments coming though, really interesting reading.

Bear in mind that boil times are not the be all and end all of a stove.
My jetboil takes around 2 minutes to boil 500ml of water and my meths stove takes around 7-8 minuntes, 99% of the time your cooking, your stopped for the night and are 5-6 minutes really THAT important.
Obviously a twenty minute boil is getting silly but you get my point.
My jetboil rarely see's daylight now.

slugwash, I don't do much biving see, I'm more into me white water rafting.
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That's one way to ensure you don't oversleep