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It’s on. Corbyn has confirmed they will support an election.
That can’t be right Tory fan boys and leavers tell us he’s too scared.
Everyone 16 or over can get themselves on the electoral register… if you know anyone not registered yet, give them a nudge today. Just. In. Case.
Bless him. Grandad just wants this nightmare to be over so he can toddle off and spend more time with his aubergines.
Pity it means a hard brexit and 5 years of Boris Johnson for the rest of us...
Do we know why LibDems and SNP are lobbying to not have votes for 16+ included as an amendment to the GE bill going before Parliament?
Bless him. Grandad just wants this nightmare to be over so he can toddle off and spend more time with his aubergines.
I hadn't thought of it that way. 6 more weeks of hell and then he can resign and have best Xmas of his life in total peace. [1]
Of course the poor old chap might win... 🙁
[1] Safe in the knowledge he succeeded in opening the way for a Socialist Britain by getting us out of the evil neo-liberal EU.
Bless him. Grandad just wants this nightmare to be over so he can toddle off and spend more time with his aubergines.
Party says it wants a GE then supports GE? Whatever next!
If a GE is called and Parliament is dissolved then doesn't all current legislation in the process of being debated die with it?
Including the current Withdrawal Agreement Bill in limbo?
For the first time in 100 years, and perhaps for the last time the Libdems could win.
Give over. I'm a LibDem supporter and I don't believe that.
Oh FFS can this get any more ridiculous?
What is a GE going to give prove? Why have the opposition parties agreed to it?
I'm at a complete loss. Did no-one listen to Tony Blair yesterday or is this everyone actively ignoring him?
This will be a right cluster **** of an election, would be interesting to see if all the remainers from the original referendum vote lib dems and any leavers that have changed their minds also do, Libdems could muster 50% of the vote but still fail to win the election due to how our voting systems work, i honestly believe that unfortunately moptop johnson will win and the country will be screwed beyond belief when the brexit deal gets agreed, a real case of careful what you wish for...
I’m a LibDem supporter and I don’t believe that.
Not sure what relevance the fact you're a libdem supporter has? Do you change your estimate of a party's seat Share according to whether you support them or not?
They're neck and neck with Labour in the Polls they have a USP that appeals to 50pc of voters and the Leave vote is split two ways.
Looks good to me.
What is a GE going to give prove?
Hopefully a reduction in Tory seats.
Why have the opposition parties agreed to it?
Labour couldn't hold off forever, a united opposition of all partys could of probably held Johnson in ineffective limbo for a while longer, but LD and SNP saying they were going to give Johnson a way to an election meant that realistically Labour couldn't hold out any more.
I dread to think what kind of campaign we're going to see from the Tory's with Cummings in charge.
Its a given that they're going to employ exactly the same shennanigans as we saw in the referendum campaign. lies, lies, lies and more lies, flag-waving anti-EU xenophobia, dodgy funding, Cambridge Analytica style data abuse and Russian bots
This is going to be really really gutter level stuff
50% for the LDs is not going to happen. If they hit the c20% they have in the polls they will be doing well. The LDs with the SNP may well be kingmakers in the next minority govt but no more.
A productive avenue for Cummings will be to maximise fighting over the same ground for opposition parties - if LDs and Labour are taking chunks out of each other then the Tories will benefit
Not sure what relevance the fact you’re a libdem supporter has?
My comment is made from the point of view of a supporter, not someone out to rubbish them.
They’re neck and neck with Labour in the Polls they have a USP that appeals to 50pc of voters and the Leave vote is split two ways.
I don't think the polls will translate into absolute votes.
I also think some of their 'policies' will cancel out some of that 50pc.
I dread to think what kind of campaign we’re going to see from the Tory’s with Cummings in charge.
“We” aren’t going to see the important parts ‘till after the election, if at all. Targeted online advertising full of conflicting “facts” that wouldn’t survive any kind of open scrutiny will be just as important as it was in 2016 (and when undermining May and during Johnson’s successful leadership campaign).
Oh, and there is Johnson’s best and cheapest weapon… people who claim to oppose him but will spend the next few months banging on about “Swindleson” or “Marxists”, “Centrists” or “Racists”. Time to focus on kicking out Conservative Brexit MPs.
Yep. I am a remainer but I won't be voting Lib Dem.
They’re neck and neck with Labour in the Polls.
Nothing is certain beyond 10 mins but they're not neck and neck.
YOUGOV.CO.UK I wouldn't put too much emphasis on polling until today's news plays through. Even then it hey are all over the place
I am a remainer but I won’t be voting Lib Dem.
Not a very committed remainer and that's the danger. I fear there are vast number of remainders who will only vote for leave or for 50/50 parties.
In contrast the leavers get out and vote.
Anyway we shall see, and I'll be voting libdem this time.
they’re not neck and neck.
Thanks for the correction, I should have said "neck and neck on 20pc last time I looked".
Gosh, a choice of who to vote for, with 3 and a bit years of experience of unfulfilled promises, self appreciation and selfishness as a doctrine to choose from. Does it matter who you vote for, after all, its all lies... right?
Does it matter who you vote for, after all, its all lies… right?
It's probably all lies but we can deduce what parties will do based on their own self interest:
Tories/BP have nailed their flag to Brexit. If you want Brexit vote for one of them.
Lib dems are committed to Remain now. If you want remain they're the flag to rally around.
Yes, I'm sure if they thought there were more votes in another course of action they take that but so what? We know they're committed now, they've alienated one set of voters they can't change sides and lose the other half. Neither side can go back until long after Brexit has happened.
Lib dems
I'm sure they'll do well out of this. I heard Corbyn on the radio earlier actively supporting a referendum but that would mean extending Brexit even further I'm guessing. Unless we stay in of course.
I’m sure they’ll do well out of this.
Although from any realistic viewpoint all the Libdems are offering is a referendum as well.
What is a GE going to give prove?
Potentially nothing but it was bad enough with a minority government, once the majority dropped to -43 an immediate election is inevitable.
The only alternative is that the opposition parties could have formed a temporary government, revoked and called an election. ....but they didn't.
If we want a government that survives a 5 year term then a lot of us have to vote for the same party to provide a majority and in recent elections we've stopped doing that.
I'm hoping remainers will rally round the Libdems and change everything and we'll have a single party with a good enough majority to govern for the first time since Blair's last victory. It could easily end in another government with no workable majority, but an election isn't optional unless you think the UK doesn't need a functioning government.
Although from any realistic viewpoint all the Libdems are offering is a referendum as well.
The Libdems are offering revoke.
What you're saying is them might lose and fail to deliver revoke. That's true of all the parties. The difference is the Lib dems can't move from revoke to leave in a post election deal. They're committed. Plus they gain no advantage from Brexit happening. Yes, they might end up supporting a second vote as a worst case scenario, in which case their worse case scenario is better or equal to every other parties best case scenario!
Plus the two main parties both gain if Brexit happens because it neutralized the Libdems and BP. The Tory's are openly in favour of Leave, Labour can't afford to be so openly in favour of leave but they imposed no sanctions on MPs who voted to Leave a couple of days ago. Labour *could* politically back leave because they're coming from a 50/50 starting point and they have every reason to do so. The Tories are already backing leave.
my guess?
slim conservative majority.
farage still won't get a seat.
Rees-Mogg looses his seat.
my MP (Cox) could do a giant steaming shit in the town square every day from now to election day and he'd still get a thumping majority.
labour collapse. corbyn won't go.
lib dem gains. not enough to be official opposition.
no 2nd referendum, shit WA scrapes through. 5 more years of brexit bickering about trade deals.
The Libdems are offering revoke.
Only in the parallel universe where they win the election.
Not a very committed remainer and that’s the danger.
I am a remainer who just thinks the Lib Dems are shit and I wouldn't want them in power. Of course they will never be in power anyway so voting Lib Dem is a waste of anybodies time.
Added to the fact I live in a seat with a 66% winning Tory who has been there for 20+ years and the Leave vote was in the 60+%.
Jambo -
The last sentence for sure........
FFS @dazh & @dissonance & co.
All parties need to present their policies.
The only party likely to form a majority government are the Tories.
The retort “their polices are fantasies because they can’t form a majority government” would also apply to Green, PC, Brexit and SNP parties. So move on from it. Oh, and at this election, probably also applies to Labour.
Shut the f up about why you currently dislike the LibDems and get convincing people to vote to unseat Tories using tactical voting.
What you’re saying is them might lose and fail to deliver revoke
I prefer not to deal with yellow unicorns. So what is their realistic position?
Shut the f up about why you currently dislike the LibDems and get convincing people to vote to unseat Tories using tactical voting.
ermm it doesnt work that way. If I am going to vote tactically I want to know how their policies will translate in reality. So lets get past the libdem unicorn and find out what they will offer. The problem is given Swinsons hatred of Labour I would have concerns she would choose to do some deal with the tories that would screw us over.
All policy platforms are what that party would do if they could implement their policies without having to reach a compromise with other parties. They are what they will push to happen ideally. Of course they will have to shift in a hung parliament. What would Labour do if they needed SNP support to form a government? The parties state their positions, and have to accept that they will face difficult compromises if they are involved in government, or supporting a government, after a hung result. This is true for all the parties.
tactical voting
hold your nose and vote for the party most likely to defeat Mr Johnson
hold your nose and vote for the party most likely to defeat Mr Johnson
Where, in this case, “defeat” really means denying him a majority. He’s going to have the most MPs at Xmas… short of a seasonal miracle. It’s all about keeping as many seats out of his hands as possible.
hold your nose and vote for the party most likely to defeat Mr Johnson
brexit party then?
Only in the parallel universe where they win the election.
Yep, more likely they enable a slim Tory majority and we end up further away from Remain than we are now.
I won't vote Tory or Labour and now I don't agree with the libdems...
All parties need to present their policies.
We've suffered two years of you and the rest of the 'why don't the labour party just stop brexit' brigade whining on about red unicorns. If the libdems were serious about stopping brexit they would align their policy with the other opposition parties and work with them. But no, they want to go one better and offer a yellow unicorn policy, not because it increases the chances of stopping brexit (it does the direct opposite), but because they hope it will win them votes. It's not 'presenting their policies' it's pure political opportunism and cynical electioneering.
The lib dems are not a serious party who want to be in government to change anything, and they're not a campaigning party like the greens, they're just in it for themselves. They are completely amoral empty vessels who will do anything to get a whiff of power and importance. They can go **** themselves quite frankly.
• copy
• replace all occurrences of ‘LibDem’ with ‘Labour’
• paste
I just hope Labour can convince enough people to support them at this election. I’ll be doing all I can to make the reasonable case for them, and hope I can balance out your attempts to turn people away for voting Labour with your “burn the unbelievers” approach to politics.
All policy platforms are what that party would do if they could implement their policies without having to reach a compromise with other parties
The flaw here is we have been here before with the Libdems. So rather than dealing with yellow unicorns I would like some simple statements about their proposed strategies. We have been told they will refuse to play with others. What does that translate to in reality?
We need the SNP and LibDems to take seats off of Johnson in areas where Labour rarely do well (and have no chance of winning currently). Thrashing around and slagging off and swearing about everyone outside your preferred little bubble is exactly what Johnson needs to get his majority… if you’re in a seat where the choice is between LibDems and Labour, then crack on worrying about them. Otherwise, this election is going be all about taking out Johnson’s support in Parliament one seat at a time… tactical voting or Johnson as PM for 10 years… choose a path.
We have been told they will refuse to play with others. What does that translate to in reality?
[tj]a complete volte-face at the first sniff of a ministerial car?[/tj]