Oh and on the right to vote. As the rich have corrupted every one of the people you're entitled to vote for there is no longer any point - so out on the streets you go.
What about people on very very modest incomes having to pay a stupid amount of council tax?
I have a very small flat in the city by small I mean the size of an average double bedroom. I am currently working in a year’s internship on a very low salary. Not only do I get the small amount of my salary that is over the none taxable amount taxed at 20% I also get screwed over on council tax.
I am entitled to no kind of government aid and have to borrow a small amount off my parents each month to afford to eat and occasionally go out. I see Mr Jonny Glasgow smack head with a free house, free booze and fag money and a nice BMW.
I am trying to improve my future; I feel my low income job will be worth it in the long run as it gives me experience and an opportunity to get my foot in the door. Hopefully it will pay for itself in the long run.
So people who argue for this unfair tax, do you think it is fair that I subsidies people who are clearly not helping society or themselves when I have to borrow to pay for accommodation, food and pay all my own taxes?
I am trying to improve my future.....
Is there any particular reason why you're not doing it like Mr Jonny Glasgow smack head ?
After all, being subsidised and provided with a free house, free booze and fag money and a nice BMW sounds like an extremely good deal to me.
Go for it - big house instead of a very small flat, and a nice BMW.
Ernie, are you advocating criminality?
I'm not unsympathetic to a few of the issues folk have mentioned but the thread seem to have more than a few 'persecuted middle-class' self improvers conjuring this paranoid fantasy that they are suffering purely due to millions of dole-scroungers living the high life.
The dream society you want to live in always seems to involve 'market forces' at every level (especially where they let you, personally, get ahead).
Surely then the Council tax is ideal?- as market forces decide where your level can live. Cant afford your current dwelling- move somewhere cheaper, the market will sort things out.
Plenty of people on low incomes with little hope of having aspirational lives have to live by these rules.
No of course not Flash. The free house, free booze and fag money and a nice BMW is all perfectly legal. It's paid for through the subsidies from the likes of alwyn.
I'm serious alwyn, I can't for the life of me figure out why you don't do it - you don't like paying council tax, and Mr Jonny Glasgow doesn't pay any, you live in a tiny flat, and he's got a house, I don't know what you drive, but I'm sure you'd like a free 'nice' BMW.
You're trying to better yourself - so go for it.
Good luck.
The uncomfortable truth is, that we in the UK live relatively affluent lifestyles because of the exploitation of people, resources and labour in the Third World. They struggle to survive, so that we can enjoy nice cars and 52" plasma TVs. Why are people starving? Because they are denied the same basic 'rights' that we in the West take for granted; clean water, adequate shelter, nutrition and basic health care. Why are they denied these things? Because some greedy c- decides lining their own pockets is more important than people.
There's a finite amount of wealth in the World. if it were to be distributed even slightly more evenly, then many more folk Worldwide would enjoy a decent standard of living. I'm sick of hearing people bleat and whine about how they 'work so hard' etc. Many people have no idea what real poverty is. Poverty is real; it doesn't just exist on TV.
So stop ****ing moaning, and count your blessings. Miserable greedy bastards.
I'm not saying its legal money. I'm not even saying it's a nice BMW, but there are a lot of people in this city who seem to have a huge amount more than they have contributed. You may think this is fair and expectable, people suffer for bad upbringings and low self esteem. This needs to be tackled, along with the way educational establishments often forget or discard people from these backgrounds and preventing social mobility from an early age.
I do think the currents system is very unfair on people who have very little, look at students and very low income earners. You have to live somewhere and I am in a lowish council tax band, but it is still unfair that I have to borrow to survive. Why work for low salaries when you are better off doing nothing? That is a very good question and possibly one of the reasons people who would be on a low income are now doing nothing at all. Maybe council tax should be measured on net wealth not the size of property? I agree people who earn more should pay more, but I think a proportion of that should subsidise people on a low income which in turn will help social mobility and the culture of long term unemployment.
I'm not saying its legal money.
Oh I'm sorry, I thought you were saying that it was all legal because that's how the system works.
So what's your point then ?
So stop ****ing moaning, and count your blessings. Miserable greedy bastards.
Basically this.
My point is that the system does not help people on a low wage; this increases the amount of people on long term unemployment rather than having a low income job. With council tax, 20% tax on low earners and a loss of benefits in kind you are better off doing nothing than taking a job with a lower income. Not only does this mean people often subsidies there benefits with undeclared work it is also a disincentive to get a job, hence landing us in the situation Britain is in today. If more was done to help lower income earners, like getting rid of council tax on people earning less than £15k then it would encourage the long term unemployed to work and help people who are just entering the jobs market.
Your argument against that is that may rich people have no income so they don’t have to pay. For someone who seems to be socially liberal you seem to think it is perfectly alright for people to do nothing, instead of encouraging them to take up work and possibly increasing social mobility for themselves and their family.
Why work for low salaries when you are better off doing nothing?
well as you do why ?
and a loss of benefits in kind you are better off doing nothing than taking a job with a lower income
I know those greedy rich people [entrpreneurs[spell?] /risk takers I think the right call them] offering low wages to staff so they can make even more money from their labour just boils my piss that that a person is better off not working than accepting there derisory low wages that the capitalist system offers them. Slightly toungue in cheek but why not get angry at the low wages rather than the person trapped in this position?
So how about the extremely low paid who get to keep a scant 4p out of every pound once they've paid out for food, housing and utilities?
They might get benefits, but the heavy taxes on consumption (both direct and indirect) see to it that they stay poor.
Much as long term unemployment is obviously undesirable, Alwyn, the reason Britain is in 'such a state' has (comparitively) little to do with the unemployed and more to do with borrowing at all levels of society up to government levels, together with a collapse in manufacturing and export.
The unemployed, the asylum seekers, and the rest of the folk the Daily mail winges about, are just scapegoats.
hence landing us in the situation Britain is in today.
So more serious than I thought then 😐
Mind you, I never totally convinced that it was the bankers that landed us in the situation Britain is in today.
I mean, these people worked very hard at making lots of money.
.
BTW, I like :
[i]"getting rid of council tax on people earning less than £15k"[/i]
I think there should be a penalty for people earning too much money. So penalising people for earning more than £15k sounds like a good idea to me.
I think there should be a penalty for people earning too much money
Hurrah for jealousy! Hurrah for doing down achievement! Hurrah for stopping development of an economy! etc.
So penalising people for earning more than £15k sounds like a good idea to me.
£15k? That's someone working in a bike shop That's someone working in McDonald's. That's someone working in a supermarket.
So, let's penalise them! Excellent!
I do so hope your post was in jest, Ernie....
I do so hope your post was in jest, Ernie....
What's the matter with you Flash ........I'm trying to agree with the geezer - am I expected to [i]always[/i] argue ? 😕
It was alwyn's idea that only people earning over £15k should pay council tax - anyone earning less than that should get it for free.
I wonder what category he would fall in ? 😕
And btw Flash, why would it have anything to do with "jealousy" ???
I earn more than £15k. It's just that I'm OK with subsidising the likes of alwyn.
........I'm just that kinda guy 8)
I'd be happy to pay more tax if it helps make the lives of the less fortunate a little easier. Because of course whether we 'succeed' or 'fail' in life is ultimately just down to dumb luck (or fate/karma/divine will - delete according to belief).
Well, speaking as someone who has always been relatively low paid and spent all my working life in the engineering/manufacturing trade i can relate to this thread.
I was made redundant (after 23yrs) and spent 7 months on the dole. Because i was bright enough to take out insurance my mortgage was paid and i received benefits for Council Tax etc.
I've recently taken agency work at around 15% less than i was earning before, i'm still paying all my bills/mortgage/Council Tax though.
I've paid my way these last 20yrs, i've paid comparitively more than those people earning £30'000+ so to those who whinge about their tax levels...
**** you.
There aren't any veery rich people on this forum yet some of you are moaning about the rates,
How do you know? Are 10k bikes the preserve of the poor?
Btw, cheers El Bent. That was the very one. Every time I hear Flash and his likes whinging about jealousy and doing down ambition and success, that's the quote that comes to mind.
£15k? That's someone working in a bike shop That's someone working in McDonald's. That's someone working in a supermarket.
Have you become a man of the common people like call me dave all of a sudden some sort of epiphany happen over easter led to a spiritual awakening?
From each according to their means to those according to their needs.
Did you know, council tax is only about 4.5% of govt's receipts?
[i]CaptJon - Member
From each according to their means to those according to their needs.
Did you know, council tax is only about 4.5% of govt's receipts?[/i]
And the rest comes from here . . . . lol
“Airplane Tax”
Air Passenger Duty
UK Passenger Service Charge
Insurance and Security surcharge
Fuel surcharge
Airport Tax
Corporation Tax
Fuel Tax
Income Tax
Inheritance Tax
Insurance Tax
Stamp Duty Land Tax
Up to £125,000 0%
Over £125,000 to £250,000 1%
Over £250,000 to £500,000 3%
Over £500,000 4%
VAT (Std Rate) 17.5%
VAT (Reduced Rate) 5 %
Vehicle Tax