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Nice job.
Enjoyed tonight’s ride, tried to keep to 280 watts without spiking to much. The 1 min 30 suits me, was a shame I had the pull on the two ramps, was hard to judge my power so ended up with a small split.
Here’s my intervals....
apologies to team STW tonight, lost internet connection and all other riders on the screen, kept riding hard but by the time everyone reappeard i'd lost about 5 seconds and was tangled in the group behind, pushed hard for a bit but wasn't gaining ground quickly enough, lost connection with phone as well, so was trying to inform you on discord to just push on. As penance i rode the rest around a lonely London as tempo, apart from easing off to let teams past and get away, then saw the next team catching was MORESTW about 35 seconds back so picked up the effort to avoid being caught!!!
@karnali - Sorry we lost you. Presumably that was worse than last week, when you could at least see us ?
Anyway, you're doing it wrong. When riding on your own you draft overtaking teams and then call them weaklings when they can't drop you 😃
That guy was a dick. I think he thought he was on a TT bike so wasn't drafting. Glad he appeared to be on lap 2 so went as we crossed the line.
Just a point from the start last night as we had an issue. With such a long delay the trainer going to sleep is a risk if your not pedaling. To avoid that after the event starts you can open the pairing screen and keep warming up. As long as your in the pairing screen your avatar well not move and you can pedal away.
You lot were really unlucky to attract a clingon with such a long start delay. I'm prone to telling myself that the benefit of long waits is that they get those people well clear. Obviously not (although multi lap doesn't help either).
I am a bit torn about last night. Comms were good - mbs seemed to be able to hear no problems and hopefully it made your contribution easier, you certainly didn't fly of the front or drop of the back.
We seemed to be in sync as well, the right people were on the front at the right time and people seemed to position them selves well as they knew when there turn was coming up.
But...we were 36 seconds slower than when we last did and most of our average powers were down for the same course. I think perhaps we got a bit too comfortable and need to push on a bit if we can. I could certainly do a 90 second pull to help. The 36 seconds could have been lost when the group split slightly on that last little hill and then we had to regroup.
Next week is out and back again - going to be a very tough TTT course. Might be a case of doing pulls until the Volcano then blobbing up and surviving! Hopefully we have a better start time!
https://zwiftinsider.com/route/out-and-back-again/
Robbo, did we not do 300watt pulls previously?
As a top of my head guess 36 seconds overall is about 1.5 seconds per KM, not much in it, but the 300 watts might have helped.
Appreciate that is harder for the other guys though and the ride needs to be enjoyable, not sure fighting for 200 or 250 place is worth burning the team out for.
Just a point from the start last night as we had an issue. With such a long delay the trainer going to sleep is a risk if your not pedaling. To avoid that after the event starts you can open the pairing screen and keep warming up. As long as your in the pairing screen your avatar well not move and you can pedal away.
Yes, that was me. Huge apologies to the team.
I don't have much luck. I was in the pairing screen, and my devices did go to sleep after 10min. However, I succesfully woke them back up and zwift said they were all paired and connected ok. When I went to come out of the pairing screen with about 20 seconds to go Zwift decided that it needed to do some "Searching" despite everything being connected. Nothing I tried could get Zwift to do anything other than endlessly search. So frustrating.
The reason I didn't keep spinning whilst in the pairing screen is I understand the theory that you don't move forwards whilst in the pairing screen, but in the past.... I have. Other than avoiding TTT with huge delays (wouldn't we all like to do that!), I'm not sure what more I could do.
@w00dster yep you are right.
I felt that I could contribute more so could perhaps look at 90 second pulls myself rather than burning out other members of the team. Next week I am going to be more of a limiter on the volcano climb in any case. We need to shelter some riders to save themselves for maximum effort on the volcano.
you definitely don't move in the pairing screen, at least it's never happened to me & I've never seen it verified (it's a very popular trick for this event!)The reason I didn’t keep spinning whilst in the pairing screen is I understand the theory that you don’t move forwards whilst in the pairing screen, but in the past…. I have.
Once I went onto the pairing screen WITHOUT my HRM being paired, it auto-paired and then (presumably sensing it's job was done 😃) the screen timed out automatically without me noticing, I was about 500m up the road before I twigged 🤣
No worries @rj2dj, just one of those things. Very frustrating for you I bet!
You shouldn't move in pairing, mine never has (but then this is zwift and weird bugs are all over the shot). There is a jerk on screen as the event starts as your rider comes off the virtual turbo and puts its foot down.
I don't think I could cope with 18 minutes of doing nothing, legs would go to sleep :D.
It was a good ride for me with MoreSTW in the sense that I managed to pace myself better than usual & avoid any mad peaky power dashes to avoid being dropped or to get back to the front of the group for my pull! Although yes average power for me was down & I had enough left at the end for a sprint (which is unusual!) so I could probably have gone a bit harder (although how much without burning out is the question!) Perhaps we should've upped the pace slightly for the 2nd lap. Enjoyed it though, was a nice change not to be constantly battling against being spat out the back 🤣
Comms were excellent too which was a big improvement - I could hear clearly everything that was said about 99% of the time!
I did a 20 minute TT warm up in the pen using TrainerRoad to control the trainer. Started it at 19:35 and finished it at 19:55. Did it all in the pairing screen with the controllable trainer disconnected. Then closed TR and reconnected the controllable trainer with no issues.
But sometimes it can cause issues so something to be aware off.
Robbo, maybe you and I aim for 300 watt average for 90 seconds on the flat, the other guys continue with 280. The draft should keep us together and if it doesn’t we can always ease back to 280.
Climbs are the big difference, my 280 watts is about 4.2 W/kg, so if I’m doing that up a climb we will get big gaps. I noticed that last night, then it takes time for us to regroup and we lose the impetuous. Might be worth making the call mid ride for someone else to take up each climb? I’m not normally mentally alert enough, I’m just plodding on with my 280 watts until told otherwise!!
Next week will be harder to manage, that's for sure. If it's the same team again, I think @wOOdster, @mbs and I are probably in a stronger position to help on the hills. Maybe two near the front and one sweeping in case people start to drop. However, we still need to go at a sustainable pace to get everyone over the volcano. I think we are starting to better understand each others strengths and weaknesses so I see us getting better/quicker because of this. Agree that comms were good last night.
The pairing screen warm-up thing doesn’t work using an IPad. Unless I’m doing it wrong.
All in, considering we were a 5 man team (for the most part) thought we performed well. Pretty consistent as we finished 199th. Up a place from last week!
it does (or at least did, I used to do it before moving over to ATV about a month ago!)The pairing screen warm-up thing doesn’t work using an IPad. Unless I’m doing it wrong.
Hmm maybe more practice required. Last time I tried it the avatar started moving. Didn’t do it again..don’t want to incur the wrath of Phil
Yeah pairing with the iPad works, that’s what I use.
But you have to select pair, not sit at the screen before it.
It’s cocked up one me once, when I left the pair mode it took an age for anything to happen and then said Leaving xxxx World and returning to Xxxx and plopped me back in the normal zwift place.
Teams are entered for this week. Thursday, 7.40pm, one lap of Out and Back Again.
All welcome - enter category A here: https://www.zwift.com/events/view/1899809
I'll aim to post lineups by Wednesday.
bump
I’m in, don’t mind the volcano, it’s not particularly long or steep! Preferable to a totally flat route IMO, at least you get a tiny rest on the down!
I'm in.
I'm back, lets see what 3 weeks of doing nothing has done for my fitness. I imagine nothing but massive gains.
DS notes for this week.
I'm not looking forward to that volcano. I may have to do a Captain Oates at that point.
I've also got a situation with my 2 year old Neo 2 which may be knocking on deaths door - it lost resistance twice during the second event yesterday, like extended wheel slip for several seconds, causing me to cruise round from about half way. This with a smell of burning is known to be a death knell for Neo's, although I could not smell anything. Some people have rigged up cooling fans, I may have to look into that.
Jacks original Neo which I bought and fixed for £50 is still going strong.
Turbo death is an expensive problem right now @haloric. I'd be rigging up those fans. I'm gonna guess that the burning smell is part an important part of the bad possibility though, so without it there's hope.
Will Garmin help?
What did you have to do to Jack's to fix it?
Sorry savoyad, not me this week - going to finish too late for me to get to an online meeting. Can't say I'm all that disappointed, looking at the route 😬
Garmin may help, but since its out of warranty its expensive, like £700 for a 2nd hand trainer. The Neo group on FB is full of people with burnout issues and different warranty behaviours. I've got all the kit to replace the bearings so may have a go at taking it apart, cleaning and putting back together, as well as a mounted fan to improve airflow.
I got Jacks one of the FB group for £50, Garmin had diagnosed it as 'burn out' and out of warranty to some chap, he forked out for a new Neo 2T. He claimed it worked when pedalled but not via the power brick (which he had replaced) and that was true. I tested the power brick and that was fine, took the Neo apart and soldered in a new power jack socket and its been perfect ever since, either the socket or the cable were flaky, got lucky.
wow! The guy must’ve had more money that sense! That would be the obvious thing to check if it was otherwise 100% working (or get a mate/pay someone to check it!)I tested the power brick and that was fine, took the Neo apart and soldered in a new power jack socket and its been perfect ever since, either the socket or the cable were flaky, got lucky.
My Neo (one of the very first ones) has never “slipped”, have always sometimes got that burning smell but only when putting out big watts... assumed that’s just what they did 🤣 Hopefully got a lot of life left in it, if it did die I’d be very tempted by the Neo Bike tho (not that you can get one right now anyway)
Start delays are:
MoreSTW 9mins
STW 13mins
Delays are not as bad as last week but we will be out on the road for a decent amount of time tonight.
Awaiting team announcement but have a rough idea of plan as follows:
First part through the desert: normal rotations
From the desert to the volcano: rotations done by the stronger climbers, to rest the those who will be setting the pace on the volcano.
Volcano: go at the pace of the slowest climber - this needs to be a sustainable pace for them as there is still a way to go after this.
Top of the volcano: make sure we are all together before the descent
Bottom of the volcano: resume normal rotations
KOM reverse: as above for volcano
Final few kms: Rotations with whoever is still able to pull or shelter in the group if you need to
If we go to fast then we will burn out people on the two climbs and it doesn't look like we will have a full team of 8 so we need to be careful for attrition with the potential for technical difficulties as we need to get 4 across the line.
I would rather get to the top of the volcano with people being (relatively) fresh so we can push on in the second half than having people blowing out of their arse and us struggling to complete.
Any thoughts/opinions welcome 🙂
Hi - I've signed up for this evenings race. I'm happy to do 1 min pulls for up to about 25km. If that coincides with the volcano climb I might be able to push it a bit further - for some reason my power drop off isn't that bad going up hills! After that I suspect I'll be hanging on for dear life. Longer races are not my forte.
@nixie are you playing tonight? or back on your normal team?
cheers @mbs survival is the name of the game tonight! A lot of Zwift racing is around the 40/45 min mark so anything longer tends to be attritional. A slower start could pay dividends in hoovering up spent teams later in the day.
As above, pacing will be the key thing tonight. The hills aren't suited to everyone so can I politely suggest that if you need a breather and it's your turn, don't be afraid to miss one out? It's better to do that and recover than leave it too late and just blow up. I think the different characteristics of us as riders benefits the team and whilst I'm OK going up those hills, I'll be sitting behind the diesel engines on the way back down and on the flat! 🙂
@robbo1234biking I'm going to be coughing my lungs up in an espresso pain train with BRT tonight.
very much this 😂Longer races are not my forte.
yeah we want to avoid burning anyone out if poss! The problem I've had in the past though, is that passes require a bit of a power surge, and late on in the race I often don't have it left in the legs any more 😭A slower start could pay dividends in hoovering up spent teams later in the day.
I wonder if we might try a different passing strategy tonight - should we get to pass anyone.
Our usual approach is fine where there is a largish disparate speed difference, as its easier to make a clean pass, but when we creep up on a similar speed team..
I find that we accelerate too soon and too strong on on the front, and get strung out before the pass, leading to the last few (normally me and my minder) struggling through, and the group wondering if we all got through, and being a reasonable distance away from the last rider.
If we were 'led up' to the acceleration point as usual, but on the 'go' word (say 10m back) we accelerate from the rear of the group, with the rear riders riding through our team as the accelerate, but the passed riders only accelerate as they see they are about to be passed.
This way we should pass as a blob, making it less likely to get caught in the passed team, and not a long line.
This will also lead to the stronger riders being aware of where the slower riders are, because they will be alongside or in front for a short while as we hit the tail of the team in front.
It does require the rear riders to put in the effort first, but it should ultimately result in less split drama and total effort.
Just a thought. If we are on a hill, all bets are off.
this is actually what I thought the plan was anyhow, but I think sometimes when the dogs at the front get the scent it all goes out the window 🤣If we were ‘led up’ to the acceleration point as usual, but on the ‘go’ word (say 10m back) we accelerate from the rear of the group, with the rear riders riding through our team as the accelerate, but the passed riders only accelerate as they see they are about to be passed.
All sounds good - I will try and remember when we come up for an overtake.
It's looking like this - plan accordingly...
STW @phil56, @munkeymadness, @dangeourbrain, @w00dster, @yanboss, @mbs
MoreSTW @slowpuncheur, @robbo1234biking, @drew, @haloric, @zilog6128, Jack
I'm aware I'm violating some people's preferences, but that's how it's falling for now. Any more A's or B's want to jump in and make my life easier? If so, enter Cat A here:
https://www.zwift.com/events/view/1899809