My wife is moving from XC racing to a more Enduro type of riding and is looking for a pedal system to suit her tiny size 5 feet.
We have found a really nice pair of Northwave shoes and she likes the look of the new DMR V-Twin pedals but they are absolutely massive in comparison to her shoes.
I've tried her on my XT Trails but she wants a bigger base for non-clipped in technical sections.
Any opinions?
I'm sure you can get them anodised pink if needs be...
Mallet enduro are good but narrower
With size 5 feet I'd be thinking of looking at children size pedals. Will wait for a thread titled "why no child specific pedals".
I can see your point though!
Crank Bros double shot or various Time pedals. Alternatively, some kids flat pedals.
Unclipping for technical bits is a really bad idea.
Unclipping for technical bits is a really bad idea.
+100
Bigger platforms are to support your foot and help guide it back to clip in and yes they are better than nothing if you can't clip in but you shouldn't plan on trying to ride like that...
She's been racing xc with Shimano pedals for nearly 25 years but is just a little nervous when doing big rock gardens on black runs and clearing doubles.
She has also won more races than most of you guys put together!
Kids pedals?!? Really???
Also PINK?????
WTF guys, come on!
Kirkstart idea?
I'm surprised there isn't one especially as they do 29er specific saddles!
I'd have thought any excuse to charge us more money.
cookeaa - Member
I'm sure you can get them anodised pink if needs be...
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OP, as mentioned above, try Time MX6. Platform clipless, but smaller overall than many of the huge DH oriented ones out there. Also, Time, so they're bombproof.
I'd have thought the Mallet E would have been perfect for her.
Yep, looking at the Mallet E's though she tried the Crank Bros pedals when they first appeared and didn't get on with float but maybe with the pins they'd be better.
If she's not keen on being clipped in then get some flats. Good for technique although she might get a bit annoyed to start with if she is used to pedaling clipped in. Unclipped on spds is the worst of both worlds
when doing big rock gardens on black runs and clearing doubles
Seriously, think about why unclipping in these situations is a bad move.
bobsproket - Member
She's been racing xc with Shimano pedals for nearly 25 years but is just a little nervous when doing big rock gardens on black runs and clearing doubles.
She has also won more races than most of you guys put together!
Regardless, if she's moving to more gravity orientated riding it's something she really wants to try and get rid of. Things like rock gardens are a place where being clipped in is a benefit rather than a hinderance
Mallet E is probably the answer to the question though. Times are very good but the bars are like ice when not clipped in
Give flats a go. She may really like them and I think a far better idea than riding unclipped over tricky bits
You can reduce the float by swapping the cleats over and you can buy 0 degree cleats.bobsproket - Member
Yep, looking at the Mallet E's though she tried the Crank Bros pedals when they first appeared and didn't get on with float but maybe with the pins they'd be better.
you don't really need to with the gravity CB's when you put pressure through them the pins lock you in, the float appears when you need it/want it slightly unweighted.
The upside of the mallet design is that when you do unclip on the pedal with good flat soled shoes you can still ride relatively well. I've done it a bit last weekend in the hideous mud conditions and a few other places.
What others said, trying to ride spd 'platform' pedals whilst not clipped in just doesn't work. Regardless of how many races shes won it's a stupid idea,it's like trying to get your cofidence up ice skating by doing it in trainers.
Some positive useful comments but others not so much.
If riding whilst not clipped in is such a bad idea then why do pedals like the V-twin and the Mallet DH exist?
What is the difference between riding unclipped with these pedals and flats with five-tens?
You're telling me you absolutely never ever unclip from getting on your bike to getting off?
It's for time when you fail to clip back in between that corner and the next feature as a back up and to provide grip and support whilst clipped in.
What wiggles says, think of it as an emergency feature. it is not to give the rider another option.
You're telling me you absolutely never ever unclip from getting on your bike to getting off?
When riding clips that's exactly the idea yeah (other than emergency dabs)
Bigger platforms are to support your foot and help guide it back to clip in and yes they are better than nothing if you can't clip in but you shouldn't plan on trying to ride like that
Having once turned up without my SPDs I was amazed how grippy my platform times were and I did not slip off them
Not sure i would recomend it tbh but it was certainly dooable [quote=legend ]bobsproket - Member
Times are very good but the bars are like ice when not clipped in
The platforms were TIME so again not my experience
I agree with what everyone says wear clips or use flats as the half way house she wants does not exist - I suspect it will be hard to get a grippy SPD shoe that works well when not clipped in
I assume - years since used- that flats are more grippy than an spd unclipped or they woudl design flats like SPD pedalsWhat is the difference between riding unclipped with these pedals and flats with five-tens?
that is the point of clips you are clipped inYou're telling me you absolutely never ever unclip from getting on your bike to getting off?
I think you are looking for th ebest of bith options
I dont think it exists
Emergency dabs is exactly what she's after.
An emergency dab is when a wheel slides out and you shove out a foot then immediately clip back in. Not deliberately unclipping when approaching something you don't like
What you want is pedals for small feet - some women have bigger feet than some men. And then they don't have to be pink 😀
As mentioned there are kids flats about and some of the spd pedals i've seen look pretty small/narrow - just not he DMR ones your wife likes. V8s are fairly small and there's bound to be others
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PD-A530 from Shimano
What is the difference between riding unclipped with these pedals and flats with five-tens?
Personal experience time (sure I'm wrong 😉 )
done a lot of this over the years, I could use the smaller shimano SPD and candies for a bit in the gap between the front and back tread on Spec XC type shoes, it works if you make it.
On Mallets with proper flat style shoes (comparing to Teva's on flats) it's different but enough to get through that section if you are out of the pedal, could manage plenty of steep sections by using the right technique though the clip does stop a clean contact with the shoe.
Real part is can you be comfortable like that. I can.
Bigger platforms are to support your foot and help guide it back to clip in and yes they are better than nothing if you can't clip in but you shouldn't plan on trying to ride like that...
A comment I hear a lot about shimano pedals - that would be why they are not used that much at the pointy end I guess (event he shimano sponsored DH riders seem to be in CB these days) The mallets give more than support and guidance. It's always been very different to the DX style pedals which is what has made them popular
I think this might be the only time "shrink it" (and pink it) might work as we're only talking size, but in reality she's after smaller flats.
I'd have a look at the DMR V6, V8, V12 range - as other pedals have gotten bigger and bigger I think they're the same now as they've always been. They were originally BMX pedals so they're not massive. Any colour you fancy.
We have found a really nice pair of Northwave shoes and she likes the look of the new DMR V-Twin pedals but they are absolutely massive in comparison to her shoes.
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[/img]P-Jay - Member
I think this might be the only time "shrink it" (and pink it) might work as we're only talking size, but in reality she's after smaller flats.
not flats...
Ah sorry, I'm off my face today.
If riding whilst not clipped in is such a bad idea then why do pedals like the V-twin and the Mallet DH exist?
What is the difference between riding unclipped with these pedals and flats with five-tens?
You're telling me you absolutely never ever unclip from getting on your bike to getting off?
If she's been racing (and winning races) for that long, then she should probably know unclipping to try and ride a fast technical section or clear a jump in an SPD shoe on a clipped pedal, regardless of whether it's got a platform on not, is a total sh*t show. It will end in tears of pain.
The afore mentioned platform style clipped pedal is a (very) poor substitute to s decent set of flats & 5-10's. The platform is there to provide more support for the shoe/foot when clipped in and also when dabbing & not being able to clip back in so you at least have something of a reasonably size to aim your foot at & have a chance of riding a section out.
In short, it's nothing like riding flats & 5-10's.
It's more akin (with similar grip levels) to riding a set of plastic pedals from a £99.99 Asda bike with some worn our Nike running shoes.
I.e. Total crap.
Sounds like she needs a set of flats and decent shoes to start with, and learn to ride some tech.
then she should probably know unclipping to try and ride a fast technical section or clear a jump in an SPD shoe on a clipped pedal, regardless of whether it's got a platform on not, is a total sh*t show. It will end in tears of pain.
Sounds like she needs a set of flats and decent shoes to start with, and learn to ride some tech.
Maybe it's you that are lacking in the skills?
The platform on these pedals does way more than that if you know how to use it properly. Of course it won't be like 5-10's and flats but it's not useless.
Sounds like she needs a set of flats and decent shoes to start with, and learn to ride some tech.
This is how she'll deal with the fear - not by compromising herself when something scary presents itself.
https://totalwomenscycling.com/road-cycling/complete-guide-cyclo-cross-shoes-pedals
Not enduro reviews, but smallish pedals nonetheless.
Maybe it's you that are lacking in the skills?
The platform on these pedals does way more than that if you know how to use it properly. Of course it won't be like 5-10's and flats but it's not useless.
I'm quote happy with my skill level, thanks - perfectly competant through racing enough DH & Enduro over the years both clipped in and on flats (have won & podium'd races on both) to know that comparing it to a decent set of of flats, yes, it can accurately be described as useless.
Fair enough, they are still there and still work a lot better than being unclipped on a pure XC pedal (or the pure support platforms) and with decent technique can work well - obviously my personal experience there. Don't think anyone was expecting them to work like a full on flat with proper shoes but IMHO much better than useless as in I'm still on the bike leaving the technical section and in particular with the mallet forward or backward clipping action back in and clipped with a slight release of pressure and roll of the foot.
Shimano M424
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Shimano M545
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Shimano M647
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Shimano MT50*
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* These are Clickr version - lower release tension than normal SPD which may/may not be good.
You're telling me you absolutely never ever unclip from getting on your bike to getting off?
only when I stop or fall off (sometimes stay clipped even then lol )
being unclipped with spds and XC shoes is such a stupid plan. I have time MX6 pedals and have pretty much no grip unless I'm clipped in.
alternative is to get some flat pedals like mentioned above or maybe get some dual DH pedals and a pair of 5:10 clippless shoes that have a better sole for riding unclipped. However, my advice would be to ride rock gardens clipped in which would save time.
my son (size 4) rides with 5:10s and saint pedals with no issue. only reason I'd like to get him smaller pedals is to make sure he positions his foot properly but that's a lack of experience not down to shoe size.
Fair enough, they are still there and still work a lot better than being unclipped on a pure XC pedal (or the pure support platforms) and with decent technique can work well - obviously my personal experience there. Don't think anyone was expecting them to work like a full on flat with proper shoes but IMHO much better than useless as in I'm still on the bike leaving the technical section and in particular with the mallet forward or backward clipping action back in and clipped with a slight release of pressure and roll of the foot.
It is "useless", because you would have far more controll and be far less likely to crash if clipped in or just riding flats. Flats have their uses, spd's have their uses, these pedals are just worse than both and therefore useless.
The point is that crashing hurts, but being clipped in doesnt make you crash. Watch any 'fail' compilation on youtube from an enduro/DH race and 90% of it is made up of people tripoding down technical sections half clipped in (often whilst someone clipped in breezes past).
Either get over the fear of crashing in clips (the trails arent littered with the torn off legs of bikes who couldnt unclip), or ride flats, either way maybe a skills course might help? If she knows she can ride big doubles with someone like Jedi, then snaller ones on the trail will be less intimidating.
You're telling me you absolutely never ever unclip from getting on your bike to getting off?
Getting off, crashing, stomping out an over cooked corner to keep the bike up right but straight back in after.
What scenario would there be when you would want to unclip in a technical situation aside from because you don't have the confidence to stick it out?
Develop the confidence on flats then come back to SPDs.
XC racing and gravity are obviously very difference beasts.
Enduro racing against the clock and those dual sided pedals will be a hinderance, she'll forever be having to look down to see which side is up and inevitably that'll result in more confidence issues.
Also PINK?????
WTF guys, come on!
Well you asked the stupid question, female specific pedals?
really guy, come on... 😉
My sarcastic answer was in the same vein as WS lids with flowers painted on or lilac gloves, women specific kit is a mostly ridiculous concept...
Sensibleish answer...
I am a size 10 and use the M424 shown above, they're a reasonable balance of cage size vs weight Vs cost (IMO) the more recent 'trail' pedals shimano have started making seem to fall a bit short in terms of actual support...
IMO large platforms on SPDs are a little useful if you miss the binding but don't add a great deal once you are actually clipped in and a fair bit depends on the shoes you use with them...
she could opt for Mallets, bigger Platform and many prefer the way the mechanism works...
Ultimately it's all personal, maybe just let her choose what she likes, would a pair being labeled 'Female specific' (girly colour or not) really sway her choice?
PD-A530 from Shimano
Not in a million years. No. Never.
To the OP why do you actually want women specific pedals? What's wrong with a larger platform? Ignoring all the "commit to SPDs or flats" thing, which I wholly agree with!
What's wrong with a larger platform?
I was thinking this. Is it really that shoe/foot size specific?
I was also thinking about platforms last weekend. First 'proper' mtb ride for a year going around Whites Level at Afan a couple of times after a layoff for a hip op with a decided skills and fitness shortage. I was persuaded to ride clipped rather than flats as it was a bit pedally but on the climb there was more than my fair share of dabbing. Getting going again in tricky steep terrain and re-engaging with a little eggbeater with a pair of hard soled not very grippy xc shoes on is not always easy. But a candy is hardy any better. So then it's a fuller mallet style platform and I'm not convinced, as above, that's not the worst of both worlds.
Of course the solution is to recover your skills and not ride uphill like an unfit clown 😳
well the solution is never more crank brothers pedals... 😉
Funny thread.
I raced XC for years too, and have size 5 feet.
I hit the same problem when I tried Enduro, it is hard to drop the XC pedals as they give you so much on hills and pedally sections, and you are used to riding clipped, thats how you move the bike around. If you do take a foot out on a technical section on the descent you are screwed, as you can't ride with it flopping around everywhere, and you need to get back on board fast.
DHers I know who ride clipped in (mostly older guys) use five ten style shoes with cleats in them, and quite a wide platform.
Or she could just ride flats. I decided against it, if you ride flats you have to wear shin pads, or scrape up your calves/shins. If you wear pads you have to wear baggies, which also slow you down. And I could never get used to having to push down on the pedals to stay on.
It was all just starting to get a bit too equipment heavy for me.
You're telling me you absolutely never ever unclip from getting on your bike to getting off?
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Or she could just ride flats. I decided against it, if you ride flats you have to wear shin pads, or scrape up your calves/shins.
This was me when I first went to flats after a lifetime of clips. Then a session with Jedi and a change to my brake lever angle and never been a problem since. It's funny how a tiny change to your wrist angle makes a world of difference to your feet. I now feel so much more secure and 'loose' whether clipped or unclipped.
Women's specific stuff is a nightmare to get in bikes, shoes, bodyarmour. Mrs Marin has size 3 feet! Try shopping for them. Says she'd have pink pedals if they were in a sale though.
hels - Member
Funny thread.
I raced XC for years too, and have size 5 feet.
I hit the same problem when I tried Enduro, it is hard to drop the XC pedals as they give you so much on hills and pedally sections, and you are used to riding clipped, thats how you move the bike around. If you do take a foot out on a technical section on the descent you are screwed, as you can't ride with it flopping around everywhere, and you need to get back on board fast.
DHers I know who ride clipped in (mostly older guys) use five ten style shoes with cleats in them, and quite a wide platform.
Or she could just ride flats. I decided against it, if you ride flats you have to wear shin pads, or scrape up your calves/shins. If you wear pads you have to wear baggies, which also slow you down. And I could never get used to having to push down on the pedals to stay on.
It was all just starting to get a bit too equipment heavy for me.
Thanks hels, Mrs Bobsproket says you've hit the nail on the head!
Changing to Woman's Northwave Enduro shoes have given her much more confidence as opposed to carbon soled XC disco slippers.
Shimano XT M8020 seem pretty decent compromise to me as I ride clipped in unless DH day. You can easily rest foot on platform if you think you may not make the section and get the fear and can still peddle. Mrs has them on her bike with her tiny Hobbit feet. Sure someone will be along to tell me I'm wrong!
Or she could just ride flats. I decided against it, if you ride flats you have to wear shin pads, or scrape up your calves/shins.
You don't have to wear pads. If you're scraping your shins you are doing it wrong!
If you wear pads you have to wear baggies, which also slow you down.
What sort of clown shorts are you wearing that slow you down??
And I could never get used to having to push down on the pedals to stay on.
Again, you're doing it wrong if you are having to push down.
To the OP. I think using some flats for a while will help. Flats are good and SPD are good but if you can ride both well it'll improve skills both ways. Why? If you learn to ride flats (e.g. Bunny hops, jumps, corners etc) then you can use SPD pedals with platforms much better - i.e. You won't be dependant on being clipped in to handle the bike with confidence. You'll also be able to do stuff clipped in more naturally - flats help with doing things the right way rather than using the fact you are clipped in the move the bike up and around. Then when back in clips the panic when unclipped might be reduced.
I guess you need a clipless/platform combo pedal manufacturer that does pedal sizing, and I don't think there is one yet.
Spank, Syntace and Crank Bros all do flat pedals with S/L or S/M/L sized platforms, but those are the only ones I know.