[Closed] What's the point in Di2 and eTap

Mark Beaumont uses Di2 on his mega rides

I do all my riding in the 53T as well.

Wasn't a humble brag, actually a bit of a realisation more than anything, no hills in London, which is basically where I've been doing all my riding lately. Clearly I need Di2 on the MTB if that's my sole justification to myself!

Would you go for an Ultegra di2 over a dura ace mechanical is now the question?

Di2 all day long personally.

I've had Di2 XTR on my Dune for just over 18months. It's been hammered everywhere from the Alps to Swinley, and it's still working fine. Probably only had to charge it 6 or 8 times i'd guess in all that time. It also waved the rear mech when i clouted it against a large rock in Les Arcs last year, 1 button press, system reset, and off i rode again (with a std mech at the least i would have had to re-adjust the cable and probably bent the mech / hanger)

Can DI2 be fitted to a normal bike with iternal cable routing?

I ask as my Canyon frame was sold in DI2 and mechanical versions

Of course Sram Red would alleviate this issue..but a bit more pricey

45 minutes from empty to full charge and even that only needs doing once every 2500km.

Can't believe you lot are surprised by the pricing - have you looked at how much bikes/parts cost these days? Its a hand over fist money fest, and we are the mugs that buy it.
It's not like they can charge less for Di2 than mechanical Ultegra/Dura-Ace is it?.. marketing guys would have a heart attack, poor sods.

Its a hand over fist money fest, and we are the mugs that buy it.

There is always the choice not to hand over money unless you feel its good value. Just need to flex the willpower muscle a bit.

I can see the point of it if you are using a 2x set up. The idea that you can ride with 1 shifter and it take care of when to change chainrings, trim the front mech etc is appealing. Im less convinced on a 1x set up.

Can DI2 be fitted to a normal bike with iternal cable routing?

It depends. You can always fit it somehow, but the elegance of the solution depends on the design of the frame. I've just fitted Di2 to a frame which had internal routing, but was designed for the external Di2 battery. I wrapped the battery in pipe lagging and crammed it down the seat tube, then had very little space around the BB shell for the junction box. All went in eventually though, and shouldn't really need to come back out again.

Worst case would be cables that were completely 'guided' through the frame, then you'd not be able to get the wires in the right place easily. You really do need access around the BB shell - up the seat tube, downtube and RH chainstay ideally.

Would you go for an Ultegra di2 over a dura ace mechanical is now the question? as both groupsets can be had for about £900

I've had Ultegra Di2 for a few years on my Giant Defy and do like it but bought a 2nd hand Giant TCR with mechanical Di2 more recently and mostly ride that happily enough so I wouldn't choose to pay more for Di2 and would get Dura Ace given the choice.

Giant TCR with mechanical Di2

Mechanical Dura Ace presumably...?

Would you go for an Ultegra di2 over a dura ace mechanical is now the question

Dura Ace every time. DA9000 is sublime. The pinnacle of mechanical shifting. And it is shiny 😀

I'd choose Di2 for my next TT bike for position gains - in fact I like eTAP as it is wire free, but for normal road, I love my DA9000 - which to be honest, shifts not very different to my Ultegra 6800. But it is shiny.

Mechanical Dura Ace presumably...?

Ha ha, I was concentrating on work...I meant Ultegra.

Ha ha, I was concentrating on work

I'm intrigued to try it on the MTB even though its a 1x. Spoken to a few Ultra riders, and at length to 1, and he spec'd DI2 for his TCR bike last year expecting nerve damage and loss of function in his hands. You can always find the power/ function to press a button, but moving a shifter is more problematic.

I'd like to try it, I get a lot of hand pain from an old injury, but I guess if I can make RS crappy reverb button to work I can handle a shifter.

Like the OP when I first read about it I laughed, "what's the point?" swap a simple cable operated thing for a couple of motors, batteries and all that headache and how long before it needs charging eh? The day I say "sorry boys, can't make it today, I've forgotten to charge my gears" I'd die a little inside and why? to make a little lever a bit easier to push.

But I've learned, that's not really the point, it's a *perfect* shift, millimetre perfect every time, a smoothness you can't get from mechanical and it can do cool things like trim mechs for perfect smoothness and all that.

Ultimately though, I wouldn't buy one - the cost for one, it's food out of the kids mouth for something I don't need, but more importantly than that, I work all day staring at a couple of monitors, my life revolves around a 5" mini computer we still laughably call a 'phone' I'm fairly certain 9-5 it's made the leap and now it works me not the other way around - getting out on my bike is a mechanical respite, I know d12 doesn't have e-mail access or bluetooth and it's not like all that stuff just because it's got a couple of CPUs in it, but you need to employ mechanical sympathy on a bike, you have to consider the way things work, not just press this and expect that - my Son struggles, he puts it in 2nd and expects 2nd gear, I try to explain you can't shift unless you're pedalling, you have to ease it in sometimes or it will skip or sometimes you have to shift a bit far to get it to engage and then take it a gnat's back let it sit sweet - you can tell it's doesn't compute for a Lad used to the digital age, it makes no sense to him at all.

Nice sentiment. I like that.

You should get an mgb gt to drive at the weekends 🙂

I know d12 doesn't have e-mail access or bluetooth

It's got bluetooth now 🙂

How does SRAM eTap compare to Shimano Di2 and Campagnolo EPS?

I see the full SRAM eTap gruppo is about £1,000 cheaper than Di2 and EPS...?

How does SRAM eTap compare to Shimano Di2

I've got both, eTap and 9170 - only issue i had switching between the two was the shifter layout, prefer the eTap, right down, left up, but 5 minutes with the eTube app and i sorted out the Shimano buttons

Shimano shifts better on the front

I've only used eTap but my riding buddy on Di2 has knocked his shifters a couple of times and pulled the wires out. I've seen cables break for one other person and heard that some pre-built bike don't have much slack in the cables.

So, clearly eTap with no cables is much better! 🙂

Honest answer, I'm sure they are both great.

my riding buddy on Di2 has knocked his shifters a couple of times and pulled the wires out.

Genuinely not sure how prone they are to being pulled out. I know on the bike I was using (hire bike) I was ever so careful at first as the idea of snagging a cable and popping it out of the rear mech was terrifying (especially as it wasn't my bike and I had no real idea of how to put it back and reprogram the gears!)

Fortunately it all seemed pretty robust and the system has been used for long enough by the pros in road and CX that I doubt it's too much of an issue.

The day I say "sorry boys, can't make it today, I've forgotten to charge my gears" I'd die a little inside and why

To be fair, it charges enough for a ride in 2 minutes!

Want to try Di2 on my 1x11 MTB, but can't see a kit to buy on any of the websites? Do you just buy Derailleur, shifter and display unit?
[url= http://bike.shimano.com/content/sac-bike/en/home/components11/mountain/xtr-di2/rd-m9050.html ]Derailleur[/url]
[url= http://bike.shimano.com/content/sac-bike/en/home/components11/mountain/xtr-di2/sw-m9050.html ]Shifter[/url]
[url= http://bike.shimano.com/content/sac-bike/en/home/components11/mountain/xtr-di2/sc-m9050.html ]Display unit[/url]

Google has about 10 from where i'm sitting.

https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/shimano-xtr-di2-9050-kit-internal-gs-version-1x11-speed-443743

And you'll need battery bits and a wiring harness to suit.

No, you also need:

- battery
- charger
- wires
- junction box

Edit: beaten by 15 seconds, that'll do the job. Looks to be lacking a junction B box which you'll need with an internal battery though.

Thanks