[Closed] What's the point in Di2 and eTap

Try it and you won't want to go back to mechanical.
Allows you to fit extra shifters for sprinting or climbing. Same force needed no matter where you are on the block or chainrings?. No cables to get gunged up. Internal cable routing is far easier and can be much more integrated. Gears can be programmed so the shifting can be completely customised. Easier to shift for kids, people with small/weak hands, people with disabilities.

Charging is so infrequent and so quick that it's just not an issue. 45 minutes from empty to full charge and even that only needs doing once every 2500km.

It's quite clever, genuinely lovely to use and shifting doesn't degrade over time like it does with cables. I'm still using cables though as it's way out of my price range 🙂

It is quite amazing. Wasn't convinced and 3000k into a Di2 bike I am disappoint when I go back to cables. Simple, works, easy, better.

Crazy-legs +1

It's just better. It's not life changing, but it's very good indeed. Missing the climbing shifter on my second bike, but no spare ports on the disc STIs. 🙁

What's a climbing shifter?

Surprised no-one mentioned self trimming mech, no more noise or skipping as cable stretches.

Overpriced though, so i'm still in cable land.

Just try it. Do you need it no. I'm not convinced I need it for MTB. Road, yes.

It's no better it's just better.
That's what some one told me and I didn't understand until I got di2 myself. Makes perfect sense now.

What's a climbing shifter?

Remote shifter that goes on the tops.

+1 for it being very nice to use.

It is nice

You know when you've just recabled and indexed your mechanical stuff?
It's like that. All the time. And "magic" front trimming.

And "zzzzzt"

If you swap rear wheels or use a direct drive trainer, does Di2 automatically tweak the gear indexing so it still shifts perfectly? On my cable set up I have to tweak the cable adjusters if I swap wheels or stick it on a direct drive trainer to get perfect shifting.

(road groupset) No, you have to do that "manually" but it's a 1 minute job

The ease of shifting particularly with the front mech is fab. It sounds trivial but when you are rinsed it's a winner. The zzzzzzt too.

It's just so smooth. Going up climbs last year in the Picos. Every time my mate changed on his cable gears, you could hear the normal clunk. Every time I changed, zzzzt. And if anything gets out of line, you can adjust as you are riding. When I came to buy a gravel bike this year it was the one pre-requisite; it had to have Di2.

Climbing shifter:

[img] [/img]

You know those rides where you get so tired and cold that you physically can't shift the front mech without trying to do it with two hands on the lever and risk crashing?

I wish I'd had eTap for those.

As everyone else has said, it's just that little bit better all the time and just works. Plus I can do multiple downshifts while braking with my left hand and indicating right.

New UCI regs for TT bikes have pretty much mandated electronic shifting to remain competitive. The +10cm rule from pads to tip of shifters or top of extensions allows for electronic shifting in a mantis position that you can't do with manual shifters. Similarly, the 75cm is from BB to tip of shifters or extensions, so you can be more stretched out with electronic shifters.

You won't see the pros riding manual shifting TT bikes now.

Is it that the pinnacle.of cable tech has been reached and filtered down to the likes of 105 etc and so the manufacturers needed to try and make something more exclusive?

With di2 or etap is the shifting under load better? Do you have to ease off? Reason I ask is that on my 105 I just cant get a clean upshift when climbing.

With di2 or etap is the shifting under load better?

Miles

are we talking exclusively road bikes here?

I have only gone for it on the road. Price more than anything. Road stuff lasts where as my stuff can meet a premature demise.

It's good, not life changing but then neither are many of the other small improvements as you move up the heirarchy of kit quality. For me it is the constant performance, no cable wear or friction and lightness of touch. However, I know people do prefer the more connected feel of cables.

What I don't understand is why, given the opportunity for miniaturisation, all the electronic stuff so massive and ugly? e.g. Those climb shifters shown above or the junction boxes that you have to have cluttering up your stem.

Also, some of the prices are just ridiculous. The clearest example is SRAM blips which are switches on the end of a bit of wire yet somehow cost £70 a pair.

I'm sure the shifting is brilliant, but for me there's also something about cycling being an entirely human powered and operated endeavour.

The climb shifters are optional (I didn't bother) and you can use the sprint shifters (little dots that go on the drops) if it really bothers you that much. The junction boxes actually do a decent job of keeping the wiring fairly neat too. Without it there would be a lot of flapping around

Also, some of the prices are just ridiculous. The clearest example is SRAM blips which are switches on the end of a bit of wire yet somehow cost £70 a pair.

Di2 charger cable (so litterally, just a wire, but with a proprietary connector...) is £75...

I'm sure the shifting is brilliant, but for me there's also something about cycling being an entirely human powered and operated endeavour.

I assume you have a dynamo light, front and rear?

Fan of the road stuff, not so much the mtb, mainly as I'm running 1x, but also because the shifter feels cheap because of the dead movement before the click of the switch, that doesn't exist with the road stuff. I get why they've done it, but I don't like it.

dead movement before the click of the switch, that doesn't exist with the road stuff. I get why they've done it, but I don't like it

It's not the throw, it's that there is zero resistance, feels like play. Eurgh..

Oh, are you talking about the road stuff?

yeah, road. I think I'd really like a cm or so of throw with a switch at the end of that

It took me about 6 mounts to finally "get" Di2 on one of my road bikes. It's good , very good but I still like mechanical sram red/ force for the feel.

The Di2 bike is usually used when I'm in the mountains or have lots of climbing as it shifts better under load.

Due to this I went for XTR Di2 which is even more impressive than the road version.
I've been a gripshift user for 20 years due to not likeing shimano shifters, but Di2 if brilliant in synchro mode and 1x11.

Yes, the mechs are a bit big and ugly but meh, small price to pay.

What I don't understand is why, given the opportunity for miniaturisation, all the electronic stuff so massive and ugly?

Also, personally, i don't think tiny electronics would stand up too well to the rigours of bad weather/cx use and being thrown down the road occasionally. Or the average LBS "mechanic", who round here don't seem to have the finesse of touch to even do up an octalink crank bolt without damaging something. So a tiny connecter, into a tiny device. Yeah, thats going to end well.

Been riding Di2 on a gravel bike recently, an Arkose with XT 1x11 Di2 driven by sprint shifts on Hylex hydro brake hoods. First time I've used it properly for a while on a bike format I'm familiar with. I really like it, it's just easy. Shifts are smooth, quick and take no movement or effort.

Would I set up my own 'main' bike with it, probably not. But that's just my preference for simple and low costs to replace. If someone else was paying I would, I think there's real advantages - particularly for bikes ridden long distances, when tired or cold etc. It'd be a no for a touring bike abroad though.

I know enough people that do use it all winter to trust the electronics, the only real issue is replacing any damaged parts. I've only written off 3 rear mechs in crashes/ rock crunches in the last dozen years though, not sure it's a major concern - done more expensive and regular damage to fork stanchions.

Yeah I'm not fussed on the MTB, mainly because it's 1x11. That said... I've not used the front mech on my road bike in at least 6 weeks 😕

Yeah I'm not fussed on the MTB, mainly because it's 1x11. That said... I've not used the front mech on my road bike in at least 6 weeks

I do all my riding in the 53T as well.
😉

dood, even Quintana was on a 56 the other day 🙄

I have di2 on my mtb. It's a Niner sir9 which I have as a fully rigid SS in the winter and I thought it would be quicker/easier to have di2 for the change to 1*11. So far I have been impressed with the system, it shifts effortlessly and accurately and the option of holding the shifter down and it shifting quickly across the block is great for race situations. When the time comes to change the roadie I think I'll be going for electronic shifting, too.

I assume you have a dynamo light, front and rear?

Nope. And I have a GPS and power meter on my bike too, but none of those are related to making it go. To my mind, it should be like sailing. You can have electronic gadgets for navigation and performance measurement, but all controls have to be manual.

Tiny tiny buttons might be ok on a phone, but when you are breathing through your arse and have thick gloves on, big buttons are good/better.

The tiny tiny button I embedded into my shifter to act as a remote for my light works just fine even with my thickest winter gloves, has survived three years of year-round use on my commuter so far, and looks a heck of a lot neater than any of the electronic shifting buttons I've seen.

If I was cynical, I'd say the first generation of this stuff was deliberately on the big and bulky side, so there's an incentive to upgrade when some neater stuff comes out. I think I saw recently that Shimano are making a junction box that will fit inside the handlebars.

One feature that I would be interested in is ANT+ buttons on the shifters that I could use to operate my GPS. As I understand it, this is possible but only with Dura Ace shifters. Shame this side of stuff isn't trickling down faster given how cheap the required electronics are.

Shame this side of stuff isn't trickling down faster given how cheap the required electronics are.

Indeed, I appreciate they have to recoup their development costs, but the markup on the electronic parts is crazy considering the minimal cost of the electronics.
It wouldn't surprise me if the internals of an electronic shifter were cheaper to make than a mechanical one.

In 3300km I think I have had one mis-shift with Di2 on the road bike. In terms of maintenance, apart from charging, I trimmed the front mech like an 8th of a turn and that's it. Auto-trimming of front mech is great. It probably prolongs the life of chains and frankly it's almost fit and forget. Apparently, there is a 'limp mode' in the rare event of a battery running down which immobilises the front mech as that uses the most juice. I agree about the progress in cable controlled gears but I'm still enjoying the Di2 more.

Di2 on my race bike (road)... changing gear while sprinting... oh my gosh.
Sram Red on my TT bike... changing gear in both hand positions... swoon.

Can you set the road DI2 up so that it auto shifts the front depending on where you are at the back? I think they brand it as synchro shift on the mtb.

Yes. With the new release of ultegra and DA.

I would love to try di2 gearing but the price is just mind boggling. I have always looked for it on ebay etc for years in the hope of a bargain but it still commands a top price. I thought there were rumours of a 105 di2 system coming out?

Thanks for all the responses. I'm interested to try it.

Would you go for an Ultegra di2 over a dura ace mechanical is now the question? as both groupsets can be had for about £900

100% yes.

Personally I'd wait.

New Ultegra is immanent [url= http://road.cc/content/tech-news/221907-new-shimano-ultegra-groupset ]Shimano 6900?[/url]

[i]May [/i]have an influence on 6800 prices?