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Keep adding to the collection until you have too many bikes to justify and then get rid of them all and go back to 2. Repeat the process.
That's my method.
It's less N+1 and more the proper number for N.
- everyone needs a hardtail.
- 170mm enduro bikes are brilliant fun, can climb and there's lots* of places where having those geo/travel is a very good thing.
- Trail bikes are awesome the rest of the time.
- Gravel/Cross bike. See HT, everyone needs one.
- eBike flat bar stealth MAHLE hub geared car replacement. 1000km ish per year of non driving enjoyment.
- and a Zwift mule. But that doesn't count.
That would seem to be a minimum value of N. I'd quite like another one, but as others have said space is a problem. Esp as I have three other bikes that are not mine in the big shed. I keep looking at the floor and thinking 'mmm BatCave' 🙂
*esp if you're lucky enough to ride alps/pyrenees/etc. Yes I know you can do it on a 'lesser' bike, but why would you?
I find myself wondering about a short travel full sus for a bit more comfort on all day rides. Those Epic Evos at Certini look like a bargain…
Get a short-travel full sus like this and you've no need for a hardtail, so it's N=N really.
With the current new bike deals and low used prices, it's the perfect time to be doing N+1 though.
Shame I was wanting to go N-1 🙁
N+2
It’s less N+1 and more the proper number for N
that's my thinking also, and over the past few years my N has settled to 5 (plus a wattbike) :
road bike
fast road orientated gravel bike
mtb oriented gravel bike (topstone Lefty 650b)
FS light Ebike (levo SL)
eroad bike (Creo SL)
Not. Helping.
@kramer - I think we are helping. You just need to be in the mindset to be helped 'in the right way' 🙂
Get a short-travel full sus like this and you’ve no need for a hardtail,
@chakaping - Not buying that 😉 Hardtails just make all your FS feel that much more special, are perfect for slogging through a FoD winter and are continually astonishing in terms of what you can ride on them. My short travel FS is sat in the rafters for that reason (and the fact it has TEN pivots. Not sure what I was thinking when I bought that!)
@Alex I agree, full sus are mainly summer bikes, it has to be a very special muddy ride to be worth the faff of cleaning them afterwards.
Hardtails just get hosed down.
I could do with going N-1.
Only have 4 bikes, but only really need 2/3
Last nights group ride made me realise I still NEED my ebike and why I bought it in the first place. Even with the level of bike fitness I'd get to going out regularly without a motor, last night I would have struggled and not enjoyed it. The e-bike is 180mm and weighs a ton, but suits a lot of the technical rock fests we ride and on the more sedate stuff, doesn't matter as it just breezes along. I use full power at times, so no real desire for an SL, but I would like to try one
The other three - my old steel Kona (pub bike), newly built Ragley 29" aggro beast and then that leaves the PP Shan (26'er). The Ragley was my +1, as the Shan, albeit fun, just felt so small these days (felt absolutely fine when I built it). What to do with it, as I'll never go on an MTB ride on it now I have the Ragley. It could become my pub bike, as it's arguably nicer to ride than the Kona, but then that leaves the Kona redundant, as I'll never get rid of it.
So, ebike for 90% of the time, HT for a once a week ride to gain some bike fitness and pub bike.
Don't really see the want for a short travel FS, but that would be the natural choice if I got tired of riding the HT, but for now, no more bikes desired and could do with the space that the spare is taking up
Hardtails just get hosed down
@kramer - agreed. Unless it's 11 PM. In which case they get thrown in the shed and left 🙂
As associated N+1, I've also upgraded my 'bike infrastructure' over the years. Things I would not go without (esp in winter)
- heated shed
- warm water hose
- cheap workstand that lives outside
- compressor for quick drying of drivetrain
- industrial vacuum 😉
On my home automation, I have a rule set up that checks the temp in the shed, checks if it's a weekday night, that I'm in the geofence 'pub' zone. If it meets those criteria, it turns on the shed heater up to 18 degrees so it's nice and toasty when I get back from having a post ride pint.
@chakaping – Not buying that 😉 Hardtails just make all your FS feel that much more special, are perfect for slogging through a FoD winter and are continually astonishing in terms of what you can ride on them. My short travel FS is sat in the rafters for that reason (and the fact it has TEN pivots. Not sure what I was thinking when I bought that!)
It's very location-specific, granted.
I'd probably ride a hardtail more than FS if I still lived in Hertfordshire, but up north a short-travel FS is so much more versatile. Mainly 'cos of the rocks.
Just one pivot on my Orange obvs. Quick and easy to hose down.
Not. Helping.
He does that. I love @Alex like a brother, but do not under any circumstances listen to any of his advice on bike buying.
I have two bikes and they overlap a bit, A Yeti ARC and a Spesh Enduro. I gave my commuter and my roadie to local bike charity (I hadn't made anything like enough donations this year and it felt like this made up for it)
Concentrate on the riding that brings you joy, and do that. Personally having too much stuff gives me itch (I recognise that it's my problem and is not a commentary on how other's organise their lives) so having two bikes allows me the indulgence to buy the things I want for them - If I want XO1 components or BikeYoke droppers etc, and either one can do the sorts of riding that I love. It works for me. I think its a mental thing, even if I won the Euro-jackpot I'd probably still only have a couple of bikes, but they'd be dripping in all sorts of Gucci kit.
@chakaping - yep that's fair. It can be pretty horrible here for three months at least. And while we do have some rocks, they are primarily limestone so I'd take a grippier tyre than a sprung back end!
@kramer - Nick is right. I've bought so many bikes, my advice is not based on any rationale/sanity. I have slowed down a bit, but that's like saying "I use to smoke 50 a day, but I've put in a massive effort and am down to 48" 🙂
full sus are mainly summer bikes, it has to be a very special muddy ride to be worth the faff of cleaning them afterwards.
Really? It’s just a bike that 98% the same with a few more bearings 🤔
Just hose it down & put it away. Brush the dry mud off.
I’ve made the mistake of riding my other half’s HT on the odd occasion. What a crap experience it is, if that was my choice, I probably wouldn’t ride 😆
FS ebike will be ridden all winter and gets hosed down, or just shoved straight in the shed and dealt with later.
HT for me is for fitness/fun, not a winter bike
@HobNob may I suggest you've not tried the 'right' hardtail?
I have the opposite problem. I never have more than 1 bike at a time and just use it for all sorts of riding whether it is good for that or not (it isn't the majority of the time!)
I don't however have a strategy, it is more a mental state where I keep my life as simple as possible.
@HobNob who are you trying to convince?
No-one? I just find it a bit odd to not ride a bike because its a bit muddy out?
@HobNob may I suggest you’ve not tried the ‘right’ hardtail?
Possibly? I have ridden a fair few though over the years & still haven’t found anything that does anything as well (or even close to, to be fair) as a decent, modern, DC bike.
TheArtistFormerlyKnownAsSTRFull Member<br />I could do with going N-1.
Only have 4 bikes, but only really need 2/3
Bike cleaning day. Yes, I know about the patio - scraped the leaves off it the other day
Three(ish) decades of hardtails (and an eeb) - '97 Kona, '12 PP Shan, '23 Big Al.
It's going to have to be the Shan that goes, as I can't see a use for it now. Dunno what to do with it though
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I’ve also upgraded my ‘bike infrastructure’ over the years.
Same, gone from a bucket outside the kitchen door and bikes behind the sofa on an old piece of carpet and socks on the handlebars. To having a temporary space in the spare bedroom and a shed and now have cleaning racks, plumbed in cold water line to the wash place, compressor, workstands, full workshop, wall racking for 8 bikes (which i keep having to N-1 to fit all the working bikes on to) exterior hot water tap is on next years plan.
I've currently got 8, 11, 12 or 15 bikes depending on how you count.
8 working and available
11 including those which are in storage but fully functional
12 including the extra, almost functional one (it needs wheels)
15 including frames that i actually have a complete set of hardware for (missing 1.5 sets of wheels)
then 3 more just frame and fork.
I think.
I might have missed one.
Having a wife that rides as well & an insulated double garage does not help, at least it doesn't extend to motorbikes... yet 🙄
Was a time I was exceedingly happy with just my Trek 950 in a shed.
A few years ago, a few in our group mulled over one MTB to do it all, we did it for a bit. Ended up on Trek Fuels, Transition smugglers and a pair of wheels with XC tyres and a pair with trail tyres. Did that for about a year and then started riding more steep stuff so the enduro bike got more use at the weekend.
I've almost given up avoiding N+1 nowdays, but the three mtb's I have now I'm unlikely to change for the forseable.
MTB's
-Stumpjumper, used a lot, ride it to work, midweek xc
-Kenevo SL, primarily used at the weekend
-Geometron G1, once a month, less and less mates ride normally aspirated nowdays
Road Bikes (Which I thought I'd never do)
-Aethos (ridden a lot over summer)
-Crux (Will be ridden over winter, ride to work)
I’ve made the mistake of riding my other half’s HT on the odd occasion. What a crap experience it is, if that was my choice, I probably wouldn’t ride
Last time I rode a hardtail, I got concussion, never again will I own a hardtail.
I don't think there is a way. I had a new bike itch in the summer but decided I'd put a stop to it by fitting a new mech, wheels and tyres to my perfectly good Cotic Flare, wheels and tyres both lighter/racier than previous. New mech sorted the previously horrible shifting, and it feels faster with the lighter setup. Also got some new decals, swapped the stem and treated it to some new bearings, mission accomplished.
Then in the autumn I bought a discounted Cotic Cascade frame anyway and built it up as a flat bar pootle machine with some wheels off eBay, online bargains and a few bits from my parts bin.
I also have a drop bar gravel bike. I keep thinking that I ought to cut down to two bikes now, but the only logical way would be to convert the Cascade to drop bar, then I worry that it'll be too slow to keep up with my other half on her carbon road bike in the summer. And so it continues... I too keep looking at those Epic Evo's, I could do all my MTB'ing on one, but I never get the same feeling from a big brand bike that I have from my Cotic's over the years.
Last time I rode a hardtail, I got concussion, never again will I own a hardtail.
Surely you got concussion falling off the hardtail, either that or you've been doing something *very* wrong.
Surely you got concussion falling off the hardtail, either that or you’ve been doing something *very* wrong.
Got bucked off it on a section of trail, lost the back, wen't out the front door and smacked a tree. Wouldn't of happened on a full sus!
I used to think Steve Jones was a bit of a fanny for saying in Dirt that hardtails were pointless.
But now I'm with him (and Sir HC), I find my short-travel shred sled is so much better.
I find my short-travel shred sled is so much better.
Shhh, not helping.
Even MrsF who isn't a cyclist, has two bikes. OK the second was a crazy bargain from a 'small' friend (the bike is an XS) and how could you turn down a Full Sus BMC XC bike, with SLX and XT, including a brand new Reverb thrown in for just £300.
Five does me. Old MTB for commute (partially off road), super fancy road bike, fancy road bike, full sus trail bike, and latest was a CX bike for mucking about.
My advice (from experience) is:
- don’t increase your storage space [1]
- don’t replace social media with eBay (but obviously replace it with something) [2]
- try to avoid accumulating a spares pile that turns out to be 90% of a new bike [3]
- accumulate at least a dozen bikes and realise you can’t move and you’re going to have to do something about it [4]
Footnotes:
1. When I lived in a tiny 1-bed flat I had 5 bikes, so this is horseshit
2. You’re going to replace it with something bike-related which will make you want more bikes, so this is horseshit
3. I’m far from alone in having started with a hub or a nicely-coloured trinket and ended up building a bike around it—it’s like finding a shred of DNA in the wreckage of a Mondoshawan spaceship and realising you can rebuild the Supreme Being from it—so this is horseshit
4. This one works, though it’s only going to get me down to four*, which is more than you’ve got now.
* plus the town commuter—which, as noted earlier in the thread, doesn’t count
Got bucked off it on a section of trail, lost the back, wen’t out the front door and smacked a tree. Wouldn’t of happened on a full sus!
bad driving I'm afraid!
I've got three
Anthem, Ti456 and a singlespeed road bike.
Also got my brothers road bike in the shed but don't ride it very often as it's slightly too big.
The whole "N+1 bikes" thing is pointless to me if there's too much overlap. I've only ever had 1 MTB at a time because they all do the same job. In an ideal world I'd have a road bike and maybe a BMX or DJ to go with it, but money is too tight at the minute.
I have 1 indoor and 1 outdoor. I still don't get the need for more.
My road sections are just a means to an end, if I do a road ride it's just to get some exercise, I don't time it. I can't ride full on DH so that doesn't matter. So I've got 1 bike for outdoors that covers every base from bpw to sdw
The whole “N+1 bikes” thing is pointless to me if there’s too much overlap. I’ve only ever had 1 MTB at a time because they all do the same job
Same job, maybe, but different jobs? Sold my Capra when I got my Kenevo (E) as they were too similar (the Capra sans motor obvs) and couldn't see me riding the Capra over the Kenevo. That's the reason I have a HT though - same trails, but different.
I have 1 indoor and 1 outdoor. I still don’t get the need for more.
Yet every other post you're telling us about riding your Mrs's bike???
Yet every other post you’re telling us about riding your Mrs’s bike???
4 times this year, twice at Hopton, once at FoD and once to go shopping.
I’ve got a pump track bike built up on the cheap and a modern geo HT. I think the only thing I’ll add is an ebike at some point. Probably 160mm to cover all the big bike duties (BPW, Alpes, etc) and then replace the HT with something fancier one day. I hate owning bikes that never get ridden (it’s like they’re not achieving their destiny) as it seems wasteful. <br />Actually I have a road bike somewhere (bro-in-law’s house I think) no I come to think about it, but not ridden it in several years so not sure if that counts. <br />And an Air Assault bike in the home gym (but that doesn’t count either as you can’t have fun on it).
Only tend to get thoughts about new bikes when current bikes are getting on, and then it's just a case of it becoming an eventuality as that thought will not leave my brain. Although I'm pretty set in what i ride so only have the HT, EMTB and enduro bike. no interest in road or gravel although I have been there.
Luckily the mrs has a horse so i can get away with buying whatever.
Luckily the mrs has a horse so i can get away with buying whatever.
<Sigh> That does seem to be the dream.
I really should have thought before writing that. It's an expensive headache that costs the equivalent of a mortgage and steals my time
Luckily the mrs has a horse so i can get away with buying whatever.
Luckily my Mrs is sound and let's me buy wtf I want. Coincidentally, she doesn't have a horse and spends sod all. Winner winner 🤣
Luckily my Mrs is sound and let’s me buy wtf I want. Coincidentally, she doesn’t have a horse and spends sod all. Winner winner
What's your secret oh wise one?
What’s your secret oh wise one?
I really don't know 🤣 she's fit too. Just blessed I guess 🤷
I have 1 indoor and 1 outdoor. I still don’t get the need for more.
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