[Closed] Sigh... why do I keep doing it? LBS minor sad...

burn down the shop, how dare they have to make a living!!

I spent almost £100 at Tescos a couple of weeks back. When I popped in for a sandwich later that week, they had the gall to charge me for it.

Them that can't do, pay.

Oh I know... but c'mon, £10 for this job, when I've just committed to spending £2000 (and probably more??)... now, I've walked away feeling a little unhappy, may well end up deciding not to buy my wheels or fork through them, 'tis poor customer service don't you think?

Labour is labour.

Do [i]you[/i] work for nowt?

Do you work for nowt?

In some ways... I'm a travel agent, so get plenty of people spending lots of time with me, often for no actual sale...

whoops... double post...

if it was to go onto this mojo then maybe at a push, but its a job you want them to do for you for free just because you spend some money in their shop??!

😆

didn't want or ask them to... just kind of hoped they would... I paid up without a blink, but just thought it might've been done gratis in this instance (being a small quick job and all...) I'll be quiet now, STW obviously isn't with me on this one 😆

So if you'd picked up a pair of £10 grips instead and they had charged you, would have been dissapointed aswell?Why is labour seen as being worthless to people?
I spend thousands in tesco every year but don't get any free stuff (club card points don't count as they are buying information cheap)....poor customer service that is.

In some ways... I'm a travel agent, so get plenty of people spending lots of time with me, often for no actual sale...

If I come in and book a £2000 holiday with you and on the way out say "Oh, I'm off to Paris next weekend, can you convert me some Euros" would you do that with no commission at the official rates or would you say yes and charge me the standard rate?

A shop in Norf Larndan, perhaps?

If I come in and book a £2000 holiday with you and on the way out say "Oh, I'm off to Paris next weekend, can you convert me some Euros" would you do that with no commission at the official rates or would you say yes and charge me the standard rate?

We don't do forex... but, if you'd booked a £2k holiday with me, quite often I'll throw in an arrival transfer, or a free guide book or something... cost's me next to nothing and means that next time they go to book a holiday , hopefully they'll remember my good service and 'generosity' and come in to book with me again, IMO it's all about long term relationship building, something this particular LBS doesn't seem that good on (in my experience over the past 4 years...)

A shop in Norf Larndan, perhaps?

Indeed it is Flashy, you know which one I use... 🙂

Get a refund on your deposit then. Plenty of other places to go buy the frame if you don't like the service, its a buyers market.

not this particular frame there isn't... plus, they owed me a decent discount as mentioned...

Indeed it is Flashy, you know which one I use...

tbh, I'm not sure why you keep going back, after your experiences there. I know some people like that shop, some don't, but I don't go back to shops I dislike, unless it's forced upon me.

Shame you've already paid the deposit, when I bought my Mojo I had absolutely top service elsewhere, should have given you the recommendation. 😕

I wouldnt shop anywhere that dented my bike. shows how they care about customers and their belongings. This was proved by them charging you for the crown race to be removed.

Most shops would do It for free and probally wouldn't dent your bike either

Should've gone in with a packet of biscuits. More valuable than money jaffacakes.

tbh, I'm not sure why you keep going back, after your experiences there. I know some people like that shop, some don't, but I don't go back to shops I dislike, unless it's forced upon me.

Agreed.

They're 5 minutes from my door, so convenient... I keep hoping/wishing I can repair/rebuild the relationship, maybe I should take a tray of doughnuts in or something...

Shame you've already paid the deposit, when I bought my Mojo I had absolutely top service elsewhere, should have given you the recommendation.

Saved around 15% off RRP by going through them, so not a bad result really... in their defence, they've been really good about the dented Yeti, it happened almost 3 years ago and they still remembered it today and looked after me in that regard 🙂

This is my first big purchase through them, hopefully we'll get on better from now on, now I've spent some decent bucks with them!

psychle, there are many other bike shops not that far away. OK, so to get to a good one might mean heading as far as E1 or SE1, but really, is it that far?

First dibbs on the frame when it's up for sale shortly.

You should have just been cheeky and said "no, howay man Ive just given you 2 grand...." You get nowt if you dont ask.

First dibbs on the frame when it's up for sale shortly.

Good luck... I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you! 🙂

I'm with you on this psychle. 5 minute job which effectively cost the shop nothing but has left you with a bad taste and presumably less keen to shop there in the future.

Not a clever way to treat a customer who has just committed to spending a couple of grand.

Good luck... I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you!

C,mon, admit it- they're in such short supply you'll be flicking it on at a profit before you even get it. 🙂

C,mon, admit it- they're in such short supply you'll be flicking it on at a profit before you even get it 🙂

never... really looking forward to this bike, I shall be dreaming of Vitamin P for the next few winter months!

We don't do forex... but, if you'd booked a £2k holiday with me, quite often I'll throw in an arrival transfer, or a free guide book or something... cost's me next to nothing and means that next time they go to book a holiday , hopefully they'll remember my good service and 'generosity' and come in to book with me again, IMO it's all about long term relationship building, something this particular LBS doesn't seem that good on (in my experience over the past 4 years...)

I keep hoping/wishing I can repair/rebuild the relationship, maybe I should take a tray of doughnuts in or something...

Why? Have you knobbed them about or messed them around before? If not, what are you trying to repair?

Why? Have you knobbed them about or messed them around before? If not, what are you trying to repair?

Not at all, it's just that for some reason we've never 'gelled', not sure why (or even, why I feel that we should have! they're just a business after all...)

I would expect something like that to be a fiver at most, and that they might have at least charged you with a bit of an apologetic look. I suppose the workshop needs to show a profit though. Think of it as sponsoring the mechanic.

oliverd1981 - Member
Think of it as[b] paying[/b] the mechanic.

I would have baulked at that as well tbh, that aint good customer service imo.

Fair enough, would it not be easier jut to find a shop albiet a bit further away where you 'gelled', and then support them with your not inconsiderable purchases? Some shops would treat you nicely for that sort of custom, or do you just like them playing all hard to get 😉

Get the new bike then find another shop, it's what I did. As stated above labour is labour and that can be bought anywhere.

Sandwich - Member
Get the new bike then find another shop, it's what I did. As stated above labour is labour and that can be bought anywhere.

not always Druidh... just in this instance, it would've been nice... in the past, they've charged my £10 to remove a cassette (fine, can live with that), £40 to connect braided hoses (needed a vice to crimp the swages, I don't have one in my 1 bed flat) this didn't include setup/bleeding btw, £25 for fitting a headset (have now bought my own tool)... a few other things, but it illustrates that their labour charges are a tad high (I think you'd agree?), but I've been relatively OK with that as it's been convenient. In this case, I've just spent a not inconsiderable sum, and potentially might be spending more (wheels, fork other bits), then they go and charge £10 for a 5 minute (or less?) job?... poor form IMO...

Ah. You'll be happy to pay full RRP for all that stuff then?

Who in their right mind pays full RRP for anything nowadays? Isn't it just a starting point for negotiations?

A happy customer is a spending customer
A unhappy customer won`t bother coming back
I always ask how much first then you dont get a surprise when going back.I asked a shop the same thing on some nice Fox Floats i didnt want to bodge it with a screwdriver and wreck the paint.Went back to pick them up they had used a screwdriver and it looked a ****ing mess.This and a few other things started me doing a lot of my own fixing stuff.

Think of it as [b]paying[/b] the mechanic.

I reckon it's a bit of a dilemma - if a bike mechanic was really up to my expectations, I reckon he'd be bright/skilled could find a better paying job. I can only imagine they do it for the love.

I reckon it's a bit of a dilemma - if a bike mechanic was really up to my expectations, I reckon he'd be bright/skilled could find a better paying job. I can only imagine they do it for the love.

What are you trying to say? bike mechanics are ill-educated and don't deserve payment because they don't have degree's?

I tend to side with the shop in this kind of thread, but in this case I might have thought they'd done it for nowt as a bit of goodwill.

i have an opinion here.
the workshop might have benefited from informing you of the job cost before commencing the work and that is where the poor customer service lies not in the charging for work done.
a tool to remove and fit a race costs money, this plus the mechanics time costs money. at some workshops i have visited the shop is seperate to the workshop therefore the time needs to be audited by business through the till.

There's the old story about the plumber solving a boiler problem by hitting it with a hammer and charging £100. £5 for the hammer and the call out, £95 for knowing where to hit the boiler.

FWIW I often do stuff for free, especially when people are spending a lot of money but often even when they're not. One of the nice things about being self employed.

http://www.madison.co.uk/productinfo.aspx?vertical=Cycling&catref=QKCRP1

http://www.madison.co.uk/productinfo.aspx?vertical=Cycling&catref=QKCRS1

+ mechanic time + wear and tear on the tool (the 1st tool requires new jaws/blades often)

What am I missing here? Cause the way I see it you negociated a discount on a frame off of the retail price and then STILL expected them to do a job for free.
Is that right?
I would imagine most shops would, quite reasonably, give you one of those but not both.

suprising how many people argue over lbs wrench charges..
if you gave the shop an inner tube would expect them to change the puncture for free? 🙂

For the sake of a tenner, this customer is sent away feeling like shite.

Not wise.

Especially given what they previously did to the bike.

Vote with your feet imo.

psychle - have you come across these guys?

http://www.jazzcycle.com/

I've used them for some relatively simple stuff that I haven't had the tools for ie. headset fitted for £10. Best thing about them is they are open till 10pm every night which is rather handy.

Threads like these which include workshop costs are always a bit of an eye opener to me. I appreciate that shops are not charities and need to make a profit but ten quid to change a cassette is a bit salty - that is a two minute job.

Shirley bike mechanics are paid in biscuits and beer?

TBH - I think the LBS in question missed a trick, but it's their business so ???

As for something only being a 2 minute job - nah, no business could survive breaking their time down into minutes like that
Given what I know about retail workshops [not a lot] - I can't imagine ever quoting & invoicing less that 1/2hr labour for any job

my LBS don't charge me to build new bike up and service it if I've bought all the parts from them and they'll price match too but it might take up to a month to build the bike as it's fitted around other work.

Now if I want it straight away,it gets booked in and I pay.

To the OP,why didn't you take it up with the shop? and how much profit would the shop make on that frame? it would appear the shop don't understand the idea of goodwill and are happpy to lose future profit

My local LBS when I started riding again were such a bunch of miserable
gits I managed to avoid buying ooh about 10 bikes off them in the last 17yrs

I'm with pyschle with this one. I understand that a bike shop is a business and can't do stuff for free but for a bit of good will I would have thought that the bike shop would have sorted this out as pyschle is a big ticket customer. I often do things for free in my business for a good customer and these customers keep coming back, go figure.
I have used this bike shop in the past and through my experiences they wont get any of my business again. As others have said, vote with your feet.

I can see both sides of the argument here, of course lbs need to make money or they would go broke, but sometimes doing small things for free will in the long run be more profitable. For example i had a similar problem a couple of years ago and needed the crown race off of a set of forks in a hurry and the screw driver wasn't working, took it to my lbs who said "£10" he must have seen the look on my face because he then said "Well where else are you going to go on a Saturday afternoon?" and he had a point, i begrudgingly paid but never went back (well they went bust soon after anyway).
On another occasion i had a similar problem and took it into my local branch of Evans they sorted it and when i offered to pay they said "Don't worry, it only took 2 minutes" and they have done this with a couple of bits for me, so i go back and have spent alot more money with them than i did with the other shop that is no bankrupt, so it would seem alot of other people did too!

(well they went bust soon after anyway).

Maybe because of all the freebies he did?

...and don't forget Evans is a big chain so can probably absorb these costs, whereas a small outfit might not be able to.

Just playing devils advocate like......

No they went bust because the bloke who owned/ran it was a to$$er!(not just my opinion btw) I see your point with Evans but i don't think that it's company policy, more local manager decision, and in fact one job was done for me by the mechanic in his lunch break, but i remember these things as most people would and they are probably aware that this can lead to an increase in overall business.

I'm with the OP too. They could have 'hidden' the cost of the crown race in the bigger order and would have had a happier customer who would have spent more in the long run. Now they've got a slightly disgruntled customer who'll be more likely to buy online in the future.

Shirley bike mechanics are paid in biscuits and beer?
Shirley is in Southampton isn't it? they may barter in Hampshire but here in Somerset they expect Cash

I begrudgingly paid but never went back

How much business do LBS's lose like that? Depending on their size they will spend hundreds, if not thousands a year on advertising but for the sake of a tenner in the boss's pocket on the day they have lost a customer for good. And that customer will tell their mates................................

Some LBS's understand the meaning and value of customer service, the ones who don't won't be around for much longer.

psychle - I agree with you 100% - its all about having and using a little bit of common sense!! It seems my LBS is the same, spend quiet a bit in there and refer lots of mate etc, went in the other day to press a bearing in and had exactly the same response. It took them about 30 seconds and I had to leave it with them......£10...

I used to live in Shirley. No not Shirley Bassey but Shirley Sothampton.

this is not meant to be an attack on you psychle, just an observation - you seem to spunk quite a bit of cash (100s and 1000s) on expensive bikes and parts, but then get peeved when you have to stump up a tenner for a convenience or if you don't get enough for what you're selling or if P&P is too high or something.
.
I've been in the bike shop in question, mainly just to oggle the bikes, but have bought a few bits in there - the staff give the impression that they're doing you a favour by letting you breathe the air in the shop.
.
if you want good customer service, try Micycle on Barnsbury St. - they're new and friendly and even have a workshop that you can use yourself 😀

I think there's a lot of people who confuse customer service with taking advantage of people. TBH some of you guys would still complain about the service if you got it done for free and also had a blow job behind the counter.

Nobody who comes into our shop complains about that.....

customer service is key - for me its the difference.. Don't think i'd take up the behind the counter thing mind. I don't know one fit bike mechanic - ???

Nobody who comes into our shop complains about that.....

Do you have a high staff turnover ?

B@rney - Member
customer service is key - for me its the difference

You are equating "customer service" as "doing stuff for free"?

I'm quite prepared to pay a decent price to get a decent job, I don't expect things for free but if someone chooses to offer that then I'm very grateful, and make sure that they know that.
I'd really, really hate to have some of you guys as customers (unless, of course, as might be the case - you're not actually quite the same in the flesh? Maybe?)

druidh - in context of ordering the Ibis, a job like swapping a crown race for a tenner is poor.

If you are a high roller in a las vegas casino you don't get charged for drinks/food etc. This is not out of charity. The casino knows that the way to maximise the money it can make out of you is to make you feel valued, keep you spending on their tables, stop you going next door.

The OP sounds like the kind of customer any bike shop would want, and want to keep. He is blowing thousands on a new frame, that will then need new components, new forks and probably be replaced if/when a new Ibis is launched. It's bad business to jeopardise all that potential income on high margin products in order to make a quick £10 from 5 minutes work.

If you have a choice of LBS Psychle find somewhere a bit less shortsighted.

It's a fine line this customer service/making a profit lark.

Having been on both sides (not bikes), I certainly don't believe the old adage 'the customer is always right' - some customers are complete @rses and really aren't worth the trouble. By anyones standards psychle must be a very good and profitable customer and the shop should be doing everything they can to keep him happy.

Take B@rney ^^ for instance (very different scenario to psychle BTW) - did he just turn up with a bearing (bought elsewhere?) expecting it to be pressed in for nothing? I wouldn't expect that to be free and I seriously doubt fitting time of 30 seconds for a bearing of any type??? But.......... he is a good customer who brings business into the shop - is that worth £10? I would think keeping his business is worth considerably more than that.

The very busy garage next door to where I work is a good example of how it works. They serviced my car a few months ago and I've been back with a couple of minor problems since, which they have rectified FOC. Probably took a mechanic 10-20 minutes each time and I was fully expecting a bill and didn't get one so I'm happy and know of at least two people who have had work done there on my recommendation. The owner also knows that he will get my car next time it needs something and he will get that money/mechanic time back. He knows this, I know this and he knows that I know, and as long as he doesn't take the piss we'll all be happy and his business will continue to expand.

Edit: Wot Lactic just said is a better and shorter example than mine 😳

Woody - well put. btw my bearing was from the frame that I bought from the shop so yeah.

Why do people expect the bike industry to be run as some sort of charity? It may be your passion, but it's their business. And if you don't like the way you're treated, go somewhere else. Or fit your own crown race, it's not exactly rocket science.

If the shop had done the work and said it's usually a £10 job, but as you've just placed a large order, we've done it for cost at £5, would this thread exist?

It shouldn't have been done free, but the lbs should have been a bit cleverer in extracting the cash from Psychle, whilst at the same time making him feel like a valued customer.

I've have just said - Are you having a larrrrf,I've just ordered a 2k bike off you & now you want to charge me for this little job ?
I'd have made it jokey sounding but also let them know I wasn't happy about it.TBH £10 for that little job is a bit much anyway,fiver would have been about right imo....

I can't understand why the OP has gone back to a shop that has treated him badly and damaged his bike. Personally, I would have got a replacement frame from them, to compensate for the damage, and I'd never have dealt with them again. I'd also have slagged them off to anyone I could.

We had this recently, about the need for bike shops to keep their customers happy. Seems that even spending loads of money, and contributing in some way to the survival of the business, doesn't warrant respect from the shop. Piss poor imo.

Mind you, Psychle needs to have a word with himself for continuing to put money in these shysters' pockets. In a competitive area of business, going the extra for customers is surely the difference between having a satisfied loyal customer base, and people who won't be particularly impressed.