No way would I accept that its looks awful. I only paid £100 for my invisiframe to be done by invisiframe themselves and that was through my LBS who drove it 20 miles there and drove back to fetch it. The finish was perfect too. Not a single blemish, bubble or any other imperfection. Its 2 years old now and still looks as good as the day it was put on.
Take it back and ask them to take it off and get your money back.
I think I'd be asking for that to be redone.
Invisiframe fitting is a PITA, I've just done this myself with a freshly repainted gloss frame straight from the paintshop. I've had to cheat in places by gently inserting a pin sideways into a couple of small bubbles to remove.
If you're paying £50 for your bike shop to do the job, then it's reasonable to expect it to be done to a high standard.
Photos are not displaying for me.
I guess that to make fitting Invisiframe worthwhile for a bike shop, they need to do a lot of them on a fairly frequent basis to build up and maintain the skill, eficiency and speed. Doing just the odd occasional one is probably going to result either in mistakes and sloppy workmanship, or in it taking so long that the shop loses money on the fitting.
Agree, when I asked my LBS, they said they don't do the fitting as it takes so long (because it's not a service they normally offer) that they'd have to charge around £400 to fit one, so they just say no.
Yes. [b]15 years ago[/b] the Halfords i worked in (along with most LBS) charged £40 an hour for unspecified jobs. 90mins (plus) doesn't sound unreasonable
Plus the prices you would think may have gone up a bit in that 15 years. Hats off to anyone that can fit a full kit properly in 1 hour.
Wouldn't be happy with paying £130 for that myself, seems a big cost for what you've got.
Misleading thread title is misleading (as you fully well know).If I was Lee at Invisiframe I'd be fully pissed off with you right now.
It implies Invisiframe have charged you £130 for applying their kit.Where as in reality a 3rd party has fitted an Invisiframe kit and charged you [b]£58[/b] labour.It would have cost you £72 even if you fitted it yourself.
Fitting them is a time consuming PITA unless you have done a lot and have a unridden frame.
Lee at Invisiframe does such a marvellous job (even on a fully assembled bike) that I won't get it done by anyone else.
And there's some great riding nearby, or it's on the way to Wales to drop-off/collect later.
Fair play that's not intentional!
I will update the first post if I can't update the title.
It's UBYK who did it.
To the OP - you've probably got the worst conditions for an 'invisible' fit : matt black frame and matt tape but it still looks poor to me. As mentioned in your first post, I did my frame and forks myself and it looks better than that - though it was box-fresh. If the labour charge was £50 it suggests they probably took 2-3 hours tops which would be do-able if you were an expert at this but otherwise suggests a rush job.
As Rorschach says you should be clear about the difference between the product and the fitter and who is at fault.
Hmmmmm can't change it :/
K..... THIS POST IN NOW WAY REFLECTS THE INVISIFRAME COMPANY! IT WAS FITTED BY A BIKE SHOP
I will contact singletrack and see if I can get the title changed as I agree it doesn't read right and I like the product, just not the fitting by the bike shop.
Right, messaged singletrack as I don't want to slag the company off!
So, took it in and they are trying to say might be paint imperfections? But they will take a look and lift it.
I would have noticed all those bumps in the paintwork.... Like I don't know my bike.
Had it a year, but had an injury so actually haven't ridden it very much.
Rorschach - You have made a big assumption.... Why would I want to do that? I have no vendetta against invisiframe and am not seeking attention. I just feel let down by the job that was done. I strive, in my field as a developer, to do the best I can. When I pay good money I expect the same service.
Just wish I had the time to do it myself as this is why I usually do stuff myself :/
I didn't read the title that way myself.
Took fitting to be the key word.
BTW, epic Single Track 🙂 Updated the title 🙂 Cheers guys 🙂
Now back on point 😉
130 nicker?
wow... surely there are better things to spend 130 on.... and despite having two kids i'm sure you could find the time with a bottle of red and do it yourself.
i worked as a guide a few years back on Gran Canaria. i managed to injure my leg so my days were spent sitting in the sun heli-taping new frames. a 25mm roll, a 50mm roll and a scapel. finish was good, better than your results and that was cutting pieces to fit. got it down to about an hour, but never let the boss know that.
Experience... I'm wondering if they get them in few and far between.
I'm not having a go at the guy that did it, but you've just shown me it's all down to experience. Just like my job 😉 Like I could write regular expressions when I first started. Looked like voodoo.....
Hopefully will get this sorted. Think the guy in the shop knew it wasn't really up to scratch once he saw all the bits. If it had that many bits on the paintwork I would have sent it by to YT!
Thanks for everyones input though as this is what single tracks forum is all about.... 🙂
Not sure how you want them to resolve this. If it were me, I'd be looking for a refund on the labour cost and then go ride my bike. I wouldn't be having them redo it with the risk that it comes back no better. More time in July without your bike.
As an experienced vinyl fitter, it looks like a dust management problem. If they wet applied the vinyl dust can still travel under the vinyl. Easily done but easily sorted if spotted during the install. It could be the odd bump in your paintwork. That shows as the same but would need to see first hand to be sure.
Yeah, if it had been a couple of bits I'd have rolled with it. It's just so many it's not possible as on the seat tube I put a scratch in it a week earlier and had a cry 😉 So I know the rest was spot on. There's shit all over it.
But yeah, easy at install. Rushed job as some of the edges weren't even pushed down. I did it with my thumb.... How can they not use their thumbs? So was a bit worse when I initially got it back. Was just all the crap underneath that takes the piss. I could have done that in front of my tv on my carpet on the rug !
I've done 3 YT invisi kits. Took hours and you don't need to strip the bike at all.
A business charging just £130 wont make money unless they rush it. Quite possibly they underestimated the faff and time involved.
To echo what a few people have said above - I wouldn't be happy if I'd been quoted £130 to fit an invisiframe kit to my bike and the result looked like that.
Unless they state at the outset that it will have bubbles and loose edges, I don't think you're being unreasonable in asking for the to remove and refund. If that's the best they can do then they should just stop offering that service.
As to whether it's worth the hassle / do they make money on it / is it cheap / is it a waste of money... all that is by the by, they offered a service and the result is not what I'd expect from a professional job.
Si
To echo what a few people have said above - I wouldn't be happy if I'd been quoted £130 to fit an invisiframe kit to my bike and the result looked like that.
To reiterate, he paid £58.
I'd not be happy with that at all - I've fitted three kits now, two of which I modified because they don't do one for the Ti Stantons and all look a lot better than that, including the first one on a bike that I'd ridden.
Ask for a complete/partial refund or whatever you think is appropriate compensation and get on with riding it.
I did my first ever invisiframe on my Slackline myself, didn't do a very good job, bubbles all over the place...then ran a front derailleur which messed up the seatpost portion and had to stick it down with a spare patch which came with the kit.
I care less and less each time I get it out of the shed, its doing a job of protecting the frame from the worst..
ride it
Lee @ Inivisiframe did my FlareMax including making a kit for it as it was the first one he'd done. Brilliant job, still looks perfect nearly a year later and he threw in some extra patches as a free kit for my forks when I collected it. He's a lovely fellas as well, couldn't be more helpful. Think it was £45
Bird (probably Ben!) did my Aeris and again a top job that's stood the test of time well over two years. My mate did my Mojo3 and it's good but not as good as Lee or Bird. I'm happy to pay someone to do it because when it's done well, it looks great and works great and lasts for ages.
Pics from the OP look more like a home-fit job.
The reason you pay £70+ for invisiframe is you dont see it and the frame looks as good as new for a long time. If you just wanted to protect it youd get some heli-tape and put up with lifting and peeling and dirty edges and then replace the tape after a year. Ive done 4 or 5 and where ive sold the bike its meant it pristine, making it much easier to sell and get a better price, in most cases enough to cover the cost of the tape.
The 'not stuck down' images are where the tape has been peeled off a dry surface and re-stuck down (some of mine look like that where i rushed it). The surface should have been wet or the installer good enough to get it down in one go.
Little raised bits or creases should have been hit with a heat gun to soften them and get them to stick.
Tiny bubbles on the Capra decals, well ive no idea as the slightly raised graphics means even with heat its hard to get the tape to deal with the defined edge. I guess with a lot of water and some serious pressure you could do it but it risks the tape moving out of place, id only expect that level of quality from Invisframe himself.
So you had the frame for a year, then got it taped. I'm sorry fella its a shoddy job but a good as I guess many can d after a years use. You would never get it clean enough without stripping all back to basic parts soaking then drying with a lint free cloth before alcohol wiping. I do blame he bike shop as they obviously under charged for the job. It would take a LONG time to get a well used frame properly done. IME
If you just wanted to protect it youd get some heli-tape and put up with lifting and peeling and dirty edges
Heli-tape is just shorthand for 3M's polyurathane protective tape (normally 8672). Invisiframe claim to use 3M tape too. I would be amazed if the actual film is any different to generic 3M - you are paying extra for it being precut not the actual film. I guess precut section will fit better and are therefore less inclined to be fitted poorly and peel.
I think weighing it all up I would go for a discount rather than them fitting another kit.
I suspect you will still not get it fitted much better.
With a sizable discount I would be ok with it to be honest (with a bit of messing around at home to improve the worst bits if possible).
At £130 I would be a bit miffed though!
Heli-tape is just shorthand for 3M's polyurathane protective tape (normally 8672). Invisiframe claim to use 3M tape too. I would be amazed if the actual film is any different to generic 3M - you are paying extra for it being precut not the actual film. I guess precut section will fit better and are therefore less inclined to be fitted poorly and peel.
Ive bought a ton of different stuff reccomended here and elsewhere. None of it has ever been as good as the Invisiframe stuff, most of it has been downright crap. The stuff Invisframe use is (if you find the right code) actually quite expensive (and almost impossible to buy online). Thats not to say the 'heli tape' you or anyone else has bought is not good, just ive not found stuff thats as good.
How did I pay 58? Have you any idea about retail? As a shop you don't pay RRP!
They will have paid at most half of that.... so it's more like 90 quid profit.
The guy wants to take some off to see if it's the frame. Like I wouldn't have noticed all those bumps all over. I would have sent it back to YT saying they have messed up the paint work. Guess they're giving themselves breathing room.
If you cant do the job, don't offer the service! Simples...
How did I pay 58? Have you any idea about retail? As a shop you don't pay RRP!
They will have paid at most half of that.... so it's more like 90 quid profit.
The guy wants to take some off to see if it's the frame. Like I wouldn't have noticed all those bumps all over. I would have sent it back to YT saying they have messed up the paint work. Guess they're giving themselves breathing room.
If you cant do the job, don't offer the service! Simples...
Ive bought a ton of different stuff reccomended here and elsewhere. None of it has ever been as good as the Invisiframe stuff, most of it has been downright crap.
The 150 micron tape from Demon tweeks seems to be the same or pretty much indistinguishable from the invisiframe stuff. Most of the other available tapes are 300 micron, which provides better impact protection for say downtube but is harder to work around compound curves than the 150 micron tape.
How did I pay 58? Have you any idea about retail? As a shop you don't pay RRP!They will have paid at most half of that.... so it's more like 90 quid profit.
If you bought a rear mech at the same shop and asked the shop to fit it for you would you expect to pay trade for it rather than rrp because you were also paying a fitting fee? This is no different. Unless you have a mate's rate deal with the shop you paid £72 for the kit. You then paid £58 for it to be fitted.
How did I pay 58? Have you any idea about retail? As a shop you don't pay RRP!
To be fair I only ran LBS workshops for 13 years.
If you buy a £20,000 car and pay £100 for it to be delivered to you house but they screw it up and deliver it to your work, would you be complaining about a £20,100 delivery? What was the cost of the invisi without fitting? Take that amount away from what you paid for the all in cost, that's what you paid for the service.
It's the service that's in question here, not the product. But as others have said, I reckon that's as good as it could have been given the materials they had to work with. By which I mean your pre used/ridden bike, that's had all sorts of detritus stuck to it, and the tape has magnified it.
Thats rubbish quite frankly, I've done it myself once, took 3 hours at a good pace and there are no bubbles or edges. It is not hard to do at all. looks like the bike wasn't cleaned and degreased properly before they started which is key.
I work in a store that offers this service at £100 fitted it's a ball ache to do I wouldn't bother. Mtb are meant to be ridden and trail marks add to their character, you can still keep your steed clean and look after her with out it being shrink wrapped . Matt frames are harder to get spot on , just get out and ride instead of preaning
Tom Howard - That's crap.... I haven't ridden it much due to an injury last year. Been in the shed. Where there are tiny knocks the kit looks spot on! It's dodgy on random parts of the frame that are faultless.
Only reason it has any knocks is from blasting down the south downs recently. That's on the bottom tube where the kit is pretty much faultless! Unless the kit somehow looks worse offset from the tiny damage then that makes no sense.
I'm not a tool. If it didn't look good on the bits that had taken very minor cosmetic damage this post wouldn't exist. They have got crap on the decals where the frame is faultless.... that's not good enough.
BTW, you paid full price for goods for bikes? Blimey. I run an online toy shop. Wouldn't get very fair paying full tilt! I'd have a word with the MD and get a better deal.
daver27 - Yeah... I cleaned all the crap off so there was no crud. They said they would then properly clean the rest with the proper stuff. If it was bad surely they would have called me and said this is a no go! It's not like it's a shit job at the back where all the grease ends up.... It's more or less tidy back there.
Again.... this magic offset that some people think happens... If there's grease by the rear mech, you get contamination near the head tube? Sorry, I don't get that. Don't care how long you've been running a lbs!
My job is logic.... I deal in logic.... Lets do logic 🙂
BTW, you paid full price for goods for bikes? Blimey.
No, you just paid full price for the product. They made their usual retail margin just as if you'd bought it and walked out of the shop with it in your hand. Then you paid a fitting fee. It might have been wrapped up as a single cost but that is the reality of how the cost was calculated.
Exactly mate, and I get that....
It was the 58 quid that was BS as they make their margin. Not going to do that job for 58 brick! By the time you've paid your staff etc. You guys seen the UBYK showroom.... very nice.
But to be fair, I'm going to let them come back with it and see what they do.... If they sort me out then nothing beats customer service. Just hope they see me right and I will sing their praises.
Shit happens sometimes, but as long as they sort it I will go back as that's when the real service kicks in 🙂
Cross fingers 🙂
I'd imagine Lee from Invisiframe will be mortified with that install!
It was the 58 quid that was BS as they make their margin.
You still don't get it. You can't compound the retail margin with the service margin. For the pain in the arse of fitting the stuff they made £58 minus overheads. If they made a margin on selling you the component is immaterial - they would have made that without the hassle of doing the work and the come back of an unhappy punter.
I love threads where an opinion is sought, then anyone who disagrees with the OP is told they are wrong, by the OP.
I'm not a tool.
Ok precious.
