[Closed] Road tubeless love/HATE

Hate phase here and I've not even ridden them yet. Wasted a huge amount of time trying to get the bloody things on and seated. Ridiculous really as tubes and tyres have never been a problem for me on the road.

My 1 road tubeless set up has been very easy to set up and maintain. No problems at all.

The various MTB tubless set ups I have had have ranged from similarly easy, to very frustrating. I think it is simply the combination of tyres and rims you are using that reflect the difficulty level.

I think it was described as a solution to a non-problem in another thread?

It's not lower maintenance (I probably get punctures at a lower rate than you're supposed to refill/top up sealant)
it's no lighter (sealant plus heavier tyres with thicker sidewalls offsets loss of inner tube)
it doesn't roll better (see thicker sidewalls)

and I certainly don't want to ride at pressures so low that I risk pinch punctures.

I've owned tubeless-compatible wheels for years and never had the inclination to go down that route, very happy with the performance of my latex tubes and tyre-du-jour.

crashtestmonkey - Member
I think it was described as a solution to a non-problem in another thread?

It's not lower maintenance (I probably get punctures at a lower rate than you're supposed to refill/top up sealant)
it's no lighter (sealant plus heavier tyres with thicker sidewalls offsets loss of inner tube)
it doesn't roll better (see thicker sidewalls)

and I certainly don't want to ride at pressures so low that I risk pinch punctures.

I'd thought that Crashtestmonkey, but someone in another thread pointed out that most road tubeless tyres are the equivalent of MTB tubeless-ready tyres, i.e. thinner sidewalls that require sealant, as opposed to UST.

Either way I wouldn't want tubeless on a road bike for the same reason I wouldn't want discs, they may both offer genuine, bona-fide benefits when they're working, and possibly even less maintenance, but my experience of both is that when it's going wrong it's a total ball-ache.

I'll save it for the MTB when the benefit-to-ball-ache ratio looks a bit higher... 8)

I like it, im using schwalbe pro one tyres on shimano ultegra rims. Tyre go on v easily,no issues so far.

Had a puncture on a recent 100 miler,but didnt notice it until 3 days later when the front tyre was noticably softer than the rear. It had been about 9 months since i put some stans liquid in, so it was beginning to dry out hence not sealing the hole perfectly. So i Just added a bit more liquid and the hole sealed up straight away and holds 105psi no problem.

road bike is tubeless, so is my cx bike and my mtb...

on a shortish road ride the other day i heard a pop-hisssssssss noise and my seat tube was covered in sealant.... i got off the bike and was sure i'd have to throw a tube in there... but about a minute later it'd sealed and i'd lost 20psi... pumped the tyre back up and carried on 8)

never known to have a puncture on the other 2 bike, but maybe i have had one and they've just sealed up again?! ❓

currently in the love phase then (thoug setting the road tyres up tubeless took more time than i care to remember)

I'd thought that Crashtestmonkey, but someone in another thread pointed out that most road tubeless tyres are the equivalent of MTB tubeless-ready tyres, i.e. thinner sidewalls that require sealant, as opposed to UST.

In the hand the Schwalbe Pro One certainly feel less supple than a GP4000 and a hugely less supple than an open tub tyre. I'd be surprised if a latex tube negated that suppleness to that much of a degree.

After 3 days of buggering about with some "road plus" tubeless tyres I'm very much in the hate camp at the moment. I thought I'd sussed it as both stayed inflated overnight and I got back from a ride this morning without incident but the front is now flat (leaking around the valve).

Total PITA to get them off the rim too.

I recently fired a tube in after [b]a valve went[/b] and I couldn't get the tyre to seal. Today the [b]valve.on the tube went[/b], as I was inflating it pre ride

I like road tubleless but "my" roads are flinty and punctures are common
(and the lighter road tubeless aren't really up to it IMO so I use slightly heavier ones - Schwalbe One much better than Schwalbe [b]PRO[/b] One, for example both for initial puncture resistance and for retaining a repair strip)

Thing is it went up easily, I may have even posted up about it.

I think it rides nicer.

Iain I've run BB5 s for 10 years, I'll never go back. Not bothered about hydraulic either

Mixed thoughts. Having used GP4000s and tubes for years I put Pro One's on tubeless when I bought some new DT Spline 23 wheels.

Having run GP4000s for thousands of miles with no punctures, I had a sidewall puncture (small hole too) on my second ride that wouldn't seal and I limped home. Been fine for 10+ rides since.

They do seem to roll and grip better but that's probably more down to the new wheels than the tyres. Running 80psi instead of 100psi is more comfortable.

Ia[s]i[/s]n I've run BB5 s for 10 years, I'll never go back. Not bothered about hydraulic either

Yeah fair enough, I binned the hateful SRAM Levels from my flat bar commuter and fitted some Spyres (with Ultegra flat bar levers 😀 ) and am finally coming back round to the idea of discs, no unbearable screeching so far although I haven't got them properly wet. Anyway, topic for another thread.

Love. Been using road tubeless (on non=specific tyres and rims) for over 2 years. Recently switched to proper tyres on non-specific rims and they've been fabulous.

Lots of love here, not going back!

Lots of love here too, schwalbe pro 1 evo microskin tl easy on superstar arc rims. Easy to mount, held air with negligible loss for several days without sealant and now they've got sealant in they barely lose any.

They ride so nicely even compared to previous high end tyres.

Nothing has convinced me it is worth it. Not the same issues as my MTB where it is.

Had tubeless ready wheels but still on tubes.
Po

25mm Pro Ones on Pacenti SL23 by the way, 80/85psi just massively comfortable

First ride today, Schwalbe Pro Ones on DT RR411, tight, but went on ok, went up easily, leaked a bit, felt alright in use, hardly magic-carpet like, but perfectly ok.

Front still going down slowly, have added more sealant. Rear is perfect.

Jury's still out.

I've found that due to the higher pressures and VERY tight beads Which can move the tape when mounting, I have to use tubeless tape which is wider than the inner rim width to prevent the tape moving and allowing air to escape. I'm on 25mm tape for 17, 20 and 22mm rims.

Feeling the love for them here too at the moment. Schwable pro-ones, s-ones & g-ones all tubeless across the road bikes & cx bikes on a mixture of rim combinations. Overall, I've done about 3000 miles since Christmas & made the switch after a continual run of punctures from potholes, etc. They have yet to let me down.

The g-ones on archetypes were a faff to get sealed, but I used 25mm tape as per Daffy above which sorted it out. Personally I love the ride of tubeless & the lower pressures. I don't think I'd go back to inner tubes unless there was a particular tyre I wanted to run that wasn't available in tubeless variety.

I've found that due to the higher pressures and VERY tight beads Which can move the tape when mounting, I have to use tubeless tape which is wider than the inner rim width to prevent the tape moving and allowing air to escape. I'm on 25mm tape for 17, 20 and 22mm rims.

Interesting that. I've also found with such tight beads I can't use gorilla tape as just the process of mounting and trying to seal tears the tape. Might try some 25mm stans tape and see how that works. Bead is so tight on mine that I can't even get it to seat evenly with a tube in pumped to 120 psi.

3 'incidents' in around 2 and a half years, first two both sealed down to 50 or 60 psi. Plenty enough to get home in one case and enough to finish a race in the points in the other.

Last was a triple pinch flat on an off road section of a RR, two just about sealed and the third needed an anchovy to get back to HQ. Maybe a tube would have faired a little better in terms of confidence getting back, but it was a very heavy hit so maybe not indicative of a regular flat.

I ride 150 miles a week, mixture of commute and leisure, had 1 puncture this year with my tubes.

Wasn't the first gen Schwalbe One close to 300g, and they're still high 200s? Not tried tubeless but remember reading a (positive) mag review where he suggested he had to run really low pressure (like 60psi) to get the Ones to ride nicely due to sidewall stiffness.

I'm ~67kg, riding 25mm tyres (on new school wide rims so they're actually measuring 28mm wide) with latex tubes at 75/80psi. Experimented as low as 60 and they've worked and not punctured but prefer the feel at the slightly higher pressure.

And riding tubeless without sealant - why? You've just sacked off most of the claimed advantage (see "got a puncture and didn't notice" replies).

Schwalbe Pro One TL MS - 291g + sealant 30g + valve 20g = 341g
Conti GP 4S II - 266g + Tube 100g = 366g

My Schwalbes do ride a little firm at equivalent pressures on cold days, but substantially better on warm days. I usually ride with 10-15% less pressure in the SP1s.

My Hutchinson Sector 32s (312g) are the closest things to a tubular tyre that I've ever experienced with a clincher. They ride beautifully at 70Psi on wide carbon rims with 32spokes.

Love phase - G One Speeds are lovely on Ksyrium rims. 30c, roll fast, excellent in the wet.

Want fast and supple? Ride some Corsa Speeds! Just don't ride them on nasty roads or near glass. These are simply amazingly fast (with a noise that has to be heard to be believed), and very fragile. I've been circuit racing them on my HED Jet 6/9 combo at Hillingdon in Vets races (no chance of crashing!). Mounting was simple for both sets of tyres and they are both being run on NON TUBELESS rims.

Partial Hate though - I removed them from my HED Jet Plus disc because they are so tight they pull the HED carbon cover out of shape!

Orange Sealant has been a significant improvement over Stans.

Conti GP 4S II - 266g + Tube 100g = 366g

Not sure where you got those numbers but I happen to have those and a set of scales next to me...

Conti GP 4S II - 222g + Latex Tube 90g = 312g

Rolling resistance of a 4000S with latex tube is also less than the Pro One ([url= http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/road-bike-reviews/compare/continental-grand-prix-4000s-ii-latex-tube-2014-vs-schwalbe-pro-one-tubeless-2016 ]here[/url]).

28mm tyres.

Aha, you were looking at 28s. Ok for 25s on same scales...

Schwalbe Pro One TL MS - 265g + sealant 30g + valve 20g = 315g

You'd likely run it at lower pressure too to get a similar feel so rolling resistance would be higher.

28mm tyres.

[url= http://road.cc/content/review/149583-continental-grand-prix-4000s-ii-28mm-tyres ]Link to Road.[/url]

Love

Schwalbe Pro One TL MS (25mm) on Pacenti rims. Multiple small punctures caused by glass on the rear and a pinch flat when I went over bottle which all sealed up with Orange Seal (Much better than Stans IMO).

Tyres are inflated to 60psi front and 70psi rear. I weigh 62ish kilos and they ride beautifully. Wide as well, 28mm wide due to the width of the rims.

I used a specialized air tool blaster to inflate them and there is no way I am ever going back to tubes. Also run tubeless on my gravel bike with pressures down to 20psi with zero burping or issues, although the rims do get a tough time when its slightly rocky.

For me its about the ride quality and puncture resistance. Its not perfect, well nothing is and it can be faff to set up but I've been really, really impressed up to now. Sidewall cuts are what worries me the most but other than that I can't be happier in the 3 years since I switched to tubeless.

Put a splash more sealant in my front last night and they're now holding air perfectly, so it now does the thing that tubes do. Will see what happens in the next few rides.

(I probably get punctures at a lower rate than you're supposed to refill/top up sealant)

That's what putting me off. Suspect the small volume of sealant means they need topping up more often as well? Would be the same for commuting - using Marathon Plus or Specialized Nimbus I'd go whole years of daily 18mile round trips in all weather before puncturing. The chance of there being any goop left when I needed it would have been pretty low.

(that said, topping up through a valve stem isn't a long job).

Just make it part of your 6/12 month maintenance.

What fluid are you using? I don't really trust Stans after about 3 months.

(just bought some OKO tractor sealant to try)

25mm Schwalbe Pro One's on 27mm wide Hunt 50Aero Carbon's. Sealed first time with 30ml of Schwalbe Blue sealant. Running them 10-15psi lower than the Conti GP 4000s they replaced. Only have to top up pressure once a week.

[url= http://road.cc/content/review/203633-orange-seal-endurance-sealant ]This is the best sealant I've used so far[/url]

Firmly in HATE mode after todays ride. Riding along and noticed the front was almost flat (only tubeless at the front at the moment). Turns out that the bead had unseated and headed down into the bed of the rim, with air and sealant now leaking out between tyre and rim at a light press of the sidewall. Was just after quite a long descent down a fairly poorly surfaced road. Luckily had a CO2 to blow it back onto the rim. Very close to binning the lot and going back to tubes (which I never had any problem with in the first place!)

Anyone fancy one unused and one very lightly used Pro One? 😡

the rear on mine picked up three cuts from glass on the first ride. went down slowly enough for me to ride home, but would never hold air properly again, even with tyre boots.

the front has been OK though.

Turns out that the bead had unseated and headed down into the bed of the rim

Anyone fancy one unused and one very lightly used Pro One?

I'm running pro one tubeless on both road bikes and after initial set up issues I've nailed it 🙂

I originally tried gorilla tape they lost air !

Removed gorilla tape used green scourer on rim bed fitted tesa(stansalike) tape and had no problems at all ..

All love now

Hate camp for me. Ran hunts with Pro ones in 28mm, even with Hunt setting them up for me they kept leaking. Then the rim tape let go and I had to bung a tube in. Have tried numerous times since then to get them up and running tubeless and gave up.

Also not a fan of Pro ones. Wet weather grip is terrible (compared to GP4000s) and I find them a bit 'wooden', feel wise.

I'll stick with tubes. Get a puncture on a tube, you just bang a new tube in and you're off again. Similar on a tubeless setup and you're stood at Lewisham roundabout breaking your thumbs trying to get the tubeless value out whilst wondering why you bother....

Fan here. Had a Pro One split on the sidewall when I clipped a rock, which couldn't be mended.

Otherwise all good. The Pro Ones are definitely more delicate than the older Ones, but they are lighter so you can't really have everything.

Many problems can be traced back to poor initial setup and sealing - not all but most. Once you get these sorted they are usually fine.

For me, road tubeless offers the most value in commuting. My G-One Allrounds have taken a heap of abuse on and offroad and have 'punctured' loads of times but have still got me to work, albeit on a soft tyre.

What is this rim tape nonsense? Just run tubeless on ksyriums and be done with it.

The only issue I have with road tubeless, is that a serious puncture pretty much renders the tyre no longer useful as it won't hold high enough pressure, despite sealing.

But the ride of those Corsa Speeds has to be felt to be believed. Raced them again on Wednesday and the combination of non-tubeless Hed Jet 6/9 is just wonderful. Fastest wheels I've ever ridden. Perhaps not for road racing though (too many triathlete comments ;-))

I've got tubeless ready wheels and tyres but haven't been tempted to try tubeless on the road bike as it does seem to be a solution without a problem for me, as I (touches wood) find punctures on the road bike pretty rare - I've done 3000km this year so far without one.

On the commuter I've taken the alternative approach and used Schwalbe Marathon Pluses (with tubes) and haven't had a puncture with those in God knows how many miles.

I've done 1,000 miles on Schwalbe G-One 30s on Pacenti Forza rims. No problems so far. The rear has a very slow leak, I think it's around the valve as the hole I put in the rim tape was too big.
Getting them to seal takes a bit of effort, but then I'm just using a normal tack pump. I love the snap sound of the bead seating.

On the commuter I've taken the alternative approach and used Schwalbe Marathon Pluses (with tubes) and haven't had a puncture with those in God knows how many miles.

That's fine but they weigh a tonne.

Done a few rides on mine now, rear was inexplicably flat last week when I went to ride home. Pumped it up, had to top it up on the way home. Held air pretty well since, pumped it up last night for this morning's commute and it was flat as a pancake this morning. Pumped it up again, air pissing out everywhere, would guess the tape's torn as no obvious leaks. It was 6am, so I grabbed another wheel and will check it later.

Not overly impressed. Definitely edging back towards tubes.

just taken delivery of some 35c panaracer Gravel Kings to run TL for general mixed surface commuting and riding so am preparing for love / hate / indifference. Rims are archetypes with Stan's tape, but I might try rim strips as well if it proves problematic

would guess the tape's torn as no obvious leaks.... Not overly impressed. Definitely edging back towards tubes.

As I said earlier... many problems can be traced back to poor initial setup and sealing. This is not, per se, a shortcoming of tubeless. Rather you need to set it up well initially, which does take some experience. I've made mistakes with it in the past but there are tips and tricks which help.

Mixed here.

2 sets of Easton tubeless ready wheels - sealed rim beds, no tape needed.
Very easy to set up with Schwalbe Ones/Pro Ones. Tyres went on with just thumbs, inflated with a track pump.

One set of Prime RP38s, with rim tape. Bitch of a job getting them on - couldn't get the tyre on the rim, then took a layer of tape off, got tyre on but had problems sealing, then tape blew. Eventually stretched the tyre a little with a tube in, managed to get them on and sealed. Stay up very well now.

Had two non-sealing punctures, both probably because I'd not topped the sealant up. I carry the genuine innovations road tubeless plugs now.

Overall, veering to the positive but tyre/rim does make a big difference to the usability.

As I said earlier... many problems can be traced back to poor initial setup and sealing. This is not, per se, a shortcoming of tubeless. Rather you need to set it up well initially, which does take some experience. I've made mistakes with it in the past but there are tips and tricks which help.

I've been using tubeless for 16 years on the MTB now, and have set up about 30 sets of wheels over the years, it's quite likely that set up was to blame (not least as I used sub-optimal tape), but that's still a bit shit. Would have been fine with a tube.

Initial set up was fine too, the first 250 miles or so have also been absolutely fine on the rear, for it to suddenly dump all the air out in response to nothing more than being inflated (and not even ridden), I'm not overly impressed.

Also not a fan of Pro ones. Wet weather grip is terrible (compared to GP4000s) and I find them a bit 'wooden', feel wise.

This too.

Yeah I wasn't that keen on Ones (actually found Pro Ones better), never actually had an issue with cornering grip, but I find them a bit 'skippy' when climbing if it's damp, which is enough to discourage too many heroics whilst descending.

This thread isn't filling me with much confidence either...

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/repairing-road-tubeless-tyres

Love love love... It isn't for the feint hearted, it isn't without its learning curve, but once tyres are on the feeling of liberation is pretty palpable. No more pinch flats and any piercing punctures are sealed up with the minimum of fuss (although the initial "please seal please seal" few rotations is never nice IME). I never carry a tube and have only had one ride-ending "event" that would've killed any tyre tubed or not. All the others just sealed and I rode on with no pressure loss.

It seems there are as many experiences as there are users however. I've had a tyre and rim combos ranging from "this is never going to happen" to "on with thumbs" and that's very easy to forget for those who seem to swear blind that someone's got bad technique when it's harder than it's meant to be. If you are unlucky to have one of those ultra-frustratingly tight combos first time out you may well end up being put off for ever which is a real shame. Equally some people seem to get multiple non-sealing punctures which is also going to put you off.

I've rarely recommended road tubeless to riding buddies for the above reasons, just in case they have a nightmare with it. But as long as you go into it with eyes open and accept it can be frustrating, then it's worth it...

No more pinch flats and any piercing punctures are sealed up with the minimum of fuss

Every failure I can recall on the road bikes (at least since going to latex tubes) have been flint cuts. Never get pinch flats of pin hole like punctures. For me it's a PITA solution to a problem that I don't have. Tyre unseating on a ride is probably the nail in the coffin.

Tyre unseating on a ride is probably the nail in the coffin.

Does that happen then? Honest Q, never happened to me in 20,000+ km!

Pierce/cuts, same sort of thing to me really, I'm not suggesting all of the punctures I've had have been down to perfectly oriented thorns or whatever...

Edit: anyway I'm not trying to convince anyone here, stick to whatever you're happy with! I know I am 😉

I've had a couple of big flint cuts that have meant the sealant won't seal the hole. Annoyingly on a tyre that was only a couple of rides old!

I have resorted to patching them up internally with a standard inner tube patch.
Fingers crossed it will hold sealant now and won't affect the ride as there is a definite lump in that area now.

Does that happen then? Honest Q, never happened to me in 20,000+ km!

Did for me.

Hate today too. Wanted to fit in a quick ride. Tyre flat. Pumped up, bit of air seeping from the rim. At least it seemed to be seated. A couple of spins and it was holding air again but really zero confidence that it's going to be ok for duration of ride. Going back to tubes.

Blimey mrblobby you have had a crap run of it!

I do wonder what the ratio of good to bad experiences is. Aside from the pain (sometimes literally) of getting the tyres ONTO the rim in the first place at times, I have had a gold-plated positive experience with road tubeless. I am beginning to wonder if I am the exception rather than the rule!

Chopped two Corsa Speeds: one was over a lot of glass, so needed a tube. The second was a sidewall cut that sealed eventually in a TT. Ride is fantastic, I have confidence in them despite non tubeless rims.

We shall see if they repay that confidence in a 90 mile road race on Sunday (French roads).

Lovvvve!. 30mm S-Ones\Stans Grails\Stans Tape\Orange Seal. 3500+ miles with no flats, no way i'm going back to tubes!.

Went up first time with a track pump, I once had to dump some pressure in when I cut the sidewall on a rock but it sealed up fine. It's great being able to ride all surfaces on the same bike, road, gravel and bridleways without the tyres letting the ride down. They're fast on the road but more comfortable than the 35mm tubed cross tyres I had for offroad.

Tubeless experiment concluded. Back on lovely latex.

Hate/given up stage for me. Proper tubeless with Dura Ace wheels and IRC tyres was ok; tyres would inflate reasonably well with a track pump and rolled nicely.
But converted rims with Hutchinson or IRC tyres were an awesome pain in the arse. Thumb-breakingly tight to mount and then needed a compressor to seat the beads. And a poor record of sealing tyre cuts at high pressure. Maybe worked one time in 10 but usually the Stans would just shoot out of the hole.
I just can't be bothered with it any more. Maybe newer stuff is better.

My opinion of road tubeless is that it works really well on larger tyres. 30s and upwards but smaller road rubber doesn't reseal.

Really happy with schwalbe s-ones in 30. Pro ones in 25 were shite.

So. Back to latex tubes for anything under 28 and tumble less for anything over.

Commuter and road bike both tubeless "road". S-ones on the commuter have been the best value tyres I've ever owned! Pro-ones on the race bike the fastest.

6000km between them since I started tracking things and not a single puncture. There has been one or two nearly-punctures but the sealant did its job. They do require regular air top ups, but you should be checking your pressures even with tubes.

Lower pressures, more comfort, more grip, faster speed, as light if not lighter... don't understand why it's even a debate any more.

Been running tubeless on both road and mtb for last 2 years. Never going back to tubes as in that time I have had 1 puncture in total! The downside, and it's one I experience with mtb wheels much more than road wheels, is the tolerances between rim and tyre are extremely variable. Each combination of tyre and rim demands its own solution to getting to them to inflate easily and stay inflated. I have used 5 (!) layers of rim tape on my superstar wheels to get my HDR2 to stay up although I bought them in the sale as slightly NQP...

With road tyres, I would say if the tyre doesn't start inflating relatively easily then you are likely to have problems soon in terms of leakage. Worth taking the time at initial setup to get the tyres to a point where they will re-inflate with a normal track pump. And using TLR wheels is essential tbh IMO.

YMMV..

Still not tried tubeless on the road but this thread is interesting. I love the idea and while it seems like there's been some progress made with the details, there's still too few users finding road tubeless as reliable as MTB tubeless (from this collection of anecdotes anyway)...
When it works is the ride worth the faff yet?

And also this:

The only issue I have with road tubeless, is that a serious puncture pretty much renders the tyre no longer useful as it won't hold high enough pressure, despite sealing.

I suppose string type plugs are a no go as you'll end up with a bloody great lump to shave/wear down? Are internal patches not a possibility? Some variation on Mushroom type plugs? There must be a way to do it...

But if a tyre really is a total write off after after one significant cut (~6mm-ish?) that's hardly a selling point...

The general repairability of current MTB tubeless tyres (both on the trails or once back at home) is one of their major attractions now...

Love! Hated fitting a Pro-One, the other one was fine! Been tubeless for 2 years+ with ONE single puncture - which sealed in about a minute. And for that reason I ain't going back. Those days of sitting by the side of the road with filthy hands and an upside down bike, getting home half an hour late and missing Pointless, are gone!
Thing is though, do what you want, doesn't matter to me. 🙂

Lower pressures, more comfort, more grip, faster speed, as light if not lighter... don't understand why it's even a debate any more.

I think that's all true if you are running fatter tyres. If you are at 25mm then I think it's debatable. Rolling resistance is no better than the better open tubular with latex tubes. Weight is the same. Feel, IMO is better with tubes, probably as the tubeless tyre is more rigid. I run fairly low pressures with latex tubes. And I hardly ever suffer from punctures that wouldn't trash a tubeless tyre. And in narrower sizes tubeless becomes an increasingly big PITA to fit due to tightness (and mine have unseated mid-ride).

So this...

My opinion of road tubeless is that it works really well on larger tyres. 30s and upwards but smaller road rubber doesn't reseal.

I think Mr B is right here, the very best clinchers with lightest latex tubes are almost as good as the best tubeless road tyres, a lot easier to fit and generally, a little less pfaff. But when chasing that last few watts those Corsa Speeds are as fast as duck. Fabulous on the French roads, too fragile for the UK. Race day specials only. I'll race them again at Hillingdon tomorrow.

For bigger robust tyres, tubeless road offers pretty much the same benefits as off road. My 30c G-One Speed tyres are superb fast tyres run at about 70psi.

But when chasing that last few watts those Corsa Speeds are as fast as duck.

Very little in it, maybe a watt or two either way at most. Looking at the bikerollingresistance tests there's about than 3 watts between the Corsa Speed and a Turbo Cotton, but the Turbo Cotton was tested with a butyl tube which seems to add a couple of watts over a latex tube.

Having found a tubeless road tyre that would fit my rims I had a brief honeymoon period of about a week. Today’s ride, wet, cold and dark, picked up a puncture. Got a quite spectacular fountain of orange seal that lasted until the tyre was flat. Couldn’t get it to seal. Wasted a CO2. Had to put a tube in (which was both really messy and had other problems). Not quite hate yet but seriously unimpressed.

Well on closer inspection in daylight quite a big flint cut and maybe asking a bit much of sealant...

[img] [/img]

Have a tubeless repair kit somewhere, shall dig it out and see if it could have been fixed roadside.

Has made me think about how to fix problems like this. Usually just carry a spare tube, a CO2 and a micro combo pump inflator thing. Could easily waste a CO2 trying to see if a hole will seal, and micro pump isn’t anywhere near potent enough to get a tubeless tyre to seat. Think putting a tube in and not messing with repair kits and trying to get the hole to seal is probably the most efficient way to deal with it.