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[i]Remind me not to buy a Litespeed.[/i]
Why, how many other manufacturers' frames would last 10 years?
I've had a Lynskey Ti frame for 3 years now, and tbh even if it fails after just 5 years I'd be happy when I look at the sheer number of (off-road) miles its done - especially compared to the little use most MTB's on here seem to get.
You've three choices; take the repair offer, buy a new discounted one or go to a different manufacturer - for me it would be a new frame.
I read the whole thread just waiting for a post like that. Nearly made it to the end all happy with STW. b r ruined my day.
b r - That's not the point - they advertised a Lifetime warranty - so they should honour it.
Never mind the cats in parallel universes mentioned earlier, we have three pages of responses, none of which disagree vehemently with the OP.
Is this STW in a parallel universe?!
The problem comes with welds where there can be micro stresses and edges that produce loads above the fatigue limit.
Therefore failure due to a manufactuing error and hence covered by the warranty. Fatigue failure can take an awfully long time to occur.
Which pretty much sums up what cookeaa has just written an essay on. 🙂
Stick it to the man! Get in touch with citizen's advice bureau for legal advice. Obviously tricky since you're dealing with a foreign company but they may be able to point you in the right direction.
Why, how many other manufacturers' frames would last 10 years?
Many others, at much lower prices.
Would any of the other Ti bike builders care to comment on the "5 year" issue?
[i]Why, how many other manufacturers' frames would last 10 years?[/i]
Err, my Fleet custom steel HT, built in 1992?
Ti-dying is getting quite popular again. Bloody hippies.
Just thought I'd chime in with a clarification on our "Lifetime" warranty we offer.
Because of the historically ambiguous use of the term "lifetime" and whether it applies to the lifespan of the owner or the frame, we supply all our frames with a small mammal (most often a gerbil). Our "lifetime" warranty applies to the lifespan of the mammal, not the owner or the frame.
This makes warranty claims completely transparent. We *WILL NOT* honour any warranty claims unless the claim is submitted with the original small mammal in good working (not dead) condition.
Hope this clears up some of the confusion.
Steven
'Why, how many other manufacturers' frames would last 10 years?'
My 1992 Merlin? Mind you that wasn't made by Litespeed 😉
Steven - is it possible to fit a modified hamster wheel to the cranks in order to make the gerbil contribute to his keep?
is it possible to fit a modified hamster wheel to the cranks in order to make the gerbil contribute to his keep?
Not in the Northern hemisphere, they run the wrong way here. It would work in Australia though.
Because of the historically ambiguous use of the term "lifetime" and whether it applies to the lifespan of the owner or the frame, we supply all our frames with a small mammal (most often a gerbil). Our "lifetime" warranty applies to the lifespan of the mammal, not the owner or the frame.
A gerbils lifespan is only 2-3 years. That's OK for a cheap aluminium frame but for a high end ti frame I reckon you should supply a horse or a whale.
My thoughts exactly, especially if the Litespeed Warranty is for 'original owner only'.Do they expect more than a handful of people to be returning frames 10+ years old? of course not, so why not just take those costs on the chin
The OP has every right to very very cheesed off and hopefully the damage done to Litespeeds reputation, in failing to honour the terms of their warranty, will hit the money grabbing gits where it hurts most ie. future sales.
should supply a horse or a whale.
That might impact the sales, though as who is going to want to go for a ride with a whale strapped to the top tube.
Also I suspect that the new frame weight of circa 200003.5 pounds might put people off as well.
You're being silly now, Rich.
Nobody would take a whale riding with them - you'd leave it in the bath.
😀 @ shandcycles
Fair enough, shandcycles gerbil warranty lifetime is still 1/3rd longer than Cove's warranty, which is why I stopped buying Cove's.
Perhaps I should have worded my annoyance with there short warranty as only 2/3rd's of a gerbil's lifetime.
[url= https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=litespeed+lifetemi+warranty&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=biN&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&sa=X&ei=KkS2T_KBCobs8QP7mYzICg&ved=0CBIQvwUoAA&q=litespeed+lifetime+warranty&spell=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=5af2b362263a1430&biw=1280&bih=914 ]5th, 6th and 7th in google :)[/url]
VOLVO FOR SALE is back! 😀
I know who started that...
Only read the first page, but this sucks and would put me off from EVER buying a litespeed frame.
A lifetime warranty for the life of the original owner should be just that.
Manufacturing defects fall into more categories than shoddy welding, poor material selection that affects the long term durability or work-hardening properties of the item that may take years to occur are part of the overall durability and quality of the item, and therefore fitness for purpose.
I would make it my personal mission to drive away every single Litespeed customer I could until this warranty was resolved in a satisfactory manner. Slippery marketing speak has no place in warranty terms.
I wonder how many more Litespeed lifetime warranty posts it takes to move it up?
At least they haven't called the Police and accused you of harrassment yet http://americanbicyclegroup.wordpress.com/
Litespeed lifetime warranty
A genuine Ratner moment. Not only in terms of customer service, but their views on the premium (sic) branding and qualities of Ti. How to kill your brand in one easy move. And to think I was contemplating a Litespeed Tri bike. Thanks but no thanks.
Thanks for posting the warning on Litespeed lifetime warranties and low life expectancy of Ti frames.
I agree with all the disappointment expressed here, but unfortunately according to my mate who is a Trading Standards officer (who are generally very pro-consumer), 'lifetime warranty' does not actually mean your lifetime. Instead it means 'reasonably expected' lifetime of the item in question.
Except when they specifically state 'lifetime of the original owner' as opposed to just 'lifetime' though surely? I think if you were to pursue this far enough they would have to back down, but them being in a foreign country makes it a bit tricky.
BTW I'm sure I've read on here of Specialized giving replacements on ~10 year old frames on their lifetime warranty before.
Very poor from Litespeed - their lifetime warranty is effectively meaningless (litespeed lifetime warranty litespeed lifetime warranty litespeed lifetime warranty litespeed lifetime warranty) 🙂
Probably not the sort of bike you're looking for, but CDale were always superb with their warranty claims
NJee:
I've heard the opposite, they were awful, and were very well known for saying "the lifetime of the frame has ended, therefore your lifetime warranty is over".
That's not correct. Cannondale's guarantee specifically states "[i]lifetime of the original owner[/i]". Of course, that doesn't necessarily mean it would be easy to get a new frame out of them! On the whole they seem pretty good though (maybe a bit slow!)
http://forums.mtbr.com/cannondale/cannondale-lifetime-warranty-experiences-facts-680245.html
Warranty is P82:
Sad news for the OP though. I have read this same issue several times with Litespeed on the US forums. Not good enough for a ti frame of that price. Didn't somebody buy LS a few years ago? Suspect their standards have dropped. At any rate they are losing their reputation over these issues. Not good. It takes an awful lot of work to build up a good name.
They've got a Facebook page. 😉
When I had trouble getting any help from Jack at Lynskey over my broken frame, I posted on Lynskey's Facebook page and Don there sorted it out pretty quick.
I know I was dealing with one awkward individual within a company, whereas you're dealing with company policy, so it's not quite the same, but I wonder what would happen if Litespeed got several innocent requests via Facebook from potential customers asking for clarification of their warranty cover before making a purchase ?
I do find it odd that litespeed lifetime warrant means they have a set time frame for what that means in terms of the years of use you will get from the frame and it is not your lifetime
In my opinion this would appear to be an attempt to imply it is greater than it really it is
At least they haven't called the Police and accused you of harrassment yet http://americanbicyclegroup.wordpress.com/
They called the police for starting a couple of threads? WTF????
how is it harrassment to say what they have done accurately reported?
shandcycles - Member
Just thought I'd chime in with a clarification on our "Lifetime" warranty we offer.Because of the historically ambiguous use of the term "lifetime" and whether it applies to the lifespan of the owner or the frame, we supply all our frames with a small mammal (most often a gerbil). Our "lifetime" warranty applies to the lifespan of the mammal, not the owner or the frame.
This makes warranty claims completely transparent. We *WILL NOT* honour any warranty claims unless the claim is submitted with the original small mammal in good working (not dead) condition.
Hope this clears up some of the confusion.
Steven
Can I just ask, before a plan comes together, do you microchip the gerbils?
Wandering off topic a bit here, but this is probably the main reason I won't be renewing my STW subscription.*
Wouldn't it be good if magazines carried well researched investigative articles on maunufacturer's warranties instead of just copy & pasting their press releases.
*Not in a Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells "I'm not buying this rubbish" sort of way, more a sort of disappointed "There's not much in here that really interests me" way.
No mag is going to pulicize negative warranty experiences - advertising revenue & trust would disappear.
yes why dont mags annoy the sponsors ...perhaps stw could then do a Premier posters who annoy us on the forum section with excerpts of our stupidity /pointless posts.
they let us do this what more can they do within the commercial restraints of their industry?
Wow, thats one brand off of my future wishlist.
I'm confused. Does the gerbil technically own the frame then? Do you have to have its permission to modify it then, does it get a say in the build spec?
What tyres do gerbils like?
Hora I am pretty sure any frame would last the lifetime of your ownership 😛
That's not correct. Cannondale's guarantee specifically states "lifetime of the original owner". Of course, that doesn't necessarily mean it would be easy to get a new frame out of them! On the whole they seem pretty good though (maybe a bit slow!)http://forums.mtbr.com/cannondale/cannondale-lifetime-warranty-experiences-facts-680245.html
Warranty is P82:
I'm afraid that CSG take the 5 years is all that you can reasonably expect line. So if you are on a 5 year old alloy frame they essentially expect it to fail soon
They do give some margin for light use over the period but proving that on a mtb is nigh on impossible.
And that's on the 2004 warranty which is better alledgedly.
to get them to assess it you need to send the whole bike back so don't strip it down when it fails
Litespeed lifetime warranty?
Why, how many other manufacturers' frames would last 10 years?
13 year old steel Dekerf over here.
Lots of good stuff on the web about how keen he is to repair any damage to frames and get them back out there being ridden.
('cept shipping to and from Canada would be much more expensive than paying Dave Yates to do it)
MidlandTrailquestsGraham - MemberWandering off topic a bit here, but this is probably the main reason I won't be renewing my STW subscription.*
Wouldn't it be good if magazines carried well researched investigative articles on maunufacturer's warranties instead of just copy & pasting their press releases.
that's called journalism, it involves a lot of hard work, doesn't involve riding with your mates and may mean that when they take out for dinner it's pizza hut rather than the rather good restaurant you usually get, you may not get the all expenses paid trip to the product launch either
would you do it?
I'm looking forward to the "grinder" review of the tyres that Benji used around Penmachno the other day 😉
That wasn't meant to be quite the dig at STW as it might read.
After all, I don't buy magazines on Land Rovers, motorbikes, running, wildlife or any of the other things I'm interested in either.
It is a pretty sad state of affairs, though, when it's assumed STW would lose most of their advertising revenue if they upset all the dodgy companies. It makes it sound like substandard products and worthless warranties are the norm.
I dunno, I'm just wishfully rambling really, but Which and Money Saving Expert, for example, seem to survive OK on unbiased reporting. It's a shame there isn't a mountain bike equivelent.
Note to self: avoid American Bicycle Group brands.
Junkyard - Member
they let us do this what more can they do within the commercial restraints of their industry?
probably more to do with the parents being out of the office and the kids enjoying a long lunch in the Stubbing Wharf 😉