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Will one be able to ride the downhill course once the Olympics has finished i wonder?
looks an interesting to me.
Do you mean the world cup in Fort William, there isn't an Olympic DH event.
The olympic XC course is supposed to be open afterwards, although sound like they're going to take the difficult bits out.
The fort william course is open all summer.
err, downhill isn't an Olympic sport, do you mean the cross country course? I think there is a plan to tone it down and open it to the public about a year after
You didn't really expect anyone to do something dangerous and exciting at the summer Olympics did you?
You didn't really expect anyone to do something dangerous and exciting at the summer Olympics did you?
DH, dangerous and exciting? sorry i find DH incredibly dull, there might be a bit of danger granted, but it isn't very fast, certainly not ski speeds. Although to be honest i find all TT's boring to watch.
If you want cycle sport to look good, you need more than one rider on the course, be it BMX, Kerin, or even a road race.
Yeah, boring!
Don't get me wrong, I love downhill skiing, but it's not like their course is three feet wide is it? And they never go into the trees!
Take it you like 4x then? Dual slalom?
to watch they are far better, basically anything where you have riders on the course at the same time makes far better viewing.
So Danny hart's win in the mud last year was boring?
Each to their own, but the majority of mtb'ers like watching DH.
but the majority of mtb'ers like watching DH.
Do they? yes i know a few but most mtbers i know find watching bike racing boring. Sport is for doing not watching.
i thought the Olympic course was downhill? it certainly looks the part
as for watching downhill,i find it exhilarating myself,i recently watched the Mega Steel City downhill,and am aiming oneself to compete in it next year.
How is dh boring? watching xc isn't exactly gripping is it?
I love how no one pays him any attention after if crashes.
Where has anyone said otherwise?! I find DH pretty interesting, but I don't think you can say that most mountain bikers feel the same.
Mrmo - obviously by your comments you don't ride downhill or never have!
Considering the technical difficulty of the courses they ride believe me they are going as fast as they can.
Question for you - what bike do you ride.....Penny farthing by chance?
Mountainbiking simply does not make a great spectator sport. It always looks slow and dull.
This thread reminds me of a quote by my favourite climber, Andy Kirkpatrick. He said " climbing is like masturbation, its great fun to do, but no one particularly wants to watch you do it!"
It tickled me 🙂
TJ, make sure you watch Val Di Sole today. Hopefully that'll alter your opinion a bit
TJ - in your eyes what is a great spectator sport?
Another great quote TJ just like Foxes don't kill Chickens!
bren2709, i am perfectly aware of how they are riding, but i have to agree with TJ on this, MTB XC or DH is too slow in general, it just doesn't work as a spectator sport.
To me, you need more than one competitor on the course at the same time so you can see something happen. Take a road race/track kerin/BMX/etc, lots of riders clear ability to see who is doing well etc.
Time trials are dull, be it on road or downhill.
I have watched a few DH races - even to someone interested in it it simply does not make a great spectacle - although DH is better than XC for sure.
A great spectator sport? Something with lots of things to look at and complex tactics going on, speed and excitement, something where you can see the whole thing - for me Rugby union
I have to agree, i would rather watch road racing than mtb'ing but would prbably rather watch track and the big Hoymister power his way past someone at 40mph.
Funny i do like watching the big climbs on the tour, just watch in amazment at the speed they are going up 1 in 5 hills, very humbelling.
Yeah watching rugby union is fantastic, twenty mins or so every game watching fat blokes have a cuddle, fall down and then get up and do it again three or four times before the ref gives up and gives a free kick or whatever it's called.
I have really enjoyed following the DH World Cups since the webcasting and camera work improved. But I have to say that I prefer to watch 4X. The men's final world championship run last season was pure drama.
Ok then can you explain how the World Cup at Fort William attracts 10k+ spectators for a dull boring sport?
Don't think you can compare DH to Rugby Union can you!
[i]Ok then can you explain how the World Cup at Fort William attracts 10k+ spectators for a dull boring sport?[/i]
10k spectators at the highest level of competition in the sport (other than the World Champs)? roughly the same as Bradford City got in the fourth division of football. not much of a crowd is it?
Ok then can you explain how the World Cup at Fort William attracts 10k+ spectators for a dull boring sport?
10k spectators at the highest level of competition in the sport (other than the World Champs)? roughly the same as Bradford City got in the fourth division of football. not much of a crowd is it?
A better measure would be comparing the number of fans at fort bill compared to the total number of fans available. Downhill is a pretty niche sport compared to football so a 10k crowd is pretty massive.
Is not that niche as, apparently, the majority of MTBers like watching it 🙄whatnobeer - Member
Downhill is a pretty niche sport compared to football so a 10k crowd is pretty massive.
Sorry - I just don't get the whole thing about watching sport (of any sort). I'd rather be out doing something myself.
Pretty stupid to compare cycling to the country's most popular sport.
Parkin Brothers videos on Dirt for the Val Di Sol round at the moment are stunning.
I tried to watch supercross on tv with a mate who was a football superfan and he couldn't see why anyone would want to watch it, found it mind numbing while I found it thrilling. Turns out people take different things from sport.
I enjoy DH but if you don't know who anyone is and haven't got any allegiances it can get a bit repetitive, especially if its a bad course.
But the football analogy doesn't really work. I wonder how many people would turn out to watch Bradford City if they had to travel 6 hours each way to do it.
even to someone interested in it it simply does not make a great spectacle
Your breath smells strangely of bum.
I'll be watching as much as I can this afternoon. What I can see on the live stream, I'll hunt down some highlights / reruns.
on tv... xc is unwatchable, dh is at best repetitive, 4x or bmx can/could be exciting but the sport lacks the depth required. most road racing is dull except the well edited/presented TdF but the cameras and crews have had 30yrs to deliver something 'watchable' and the race itself cannot be beat for history/size. Some of the track cycling can be as thrilling as athletics track events..... It will get viewers for the olympics but other than that you have to be interested, or the UK have to be doing very well for the average man on the street to care.
i hope the olympics xc course, can deliver something watchable, but im not holding my breath.
everything changes when you watch an event in situ, i would rather see the repetitive DH than sit by the roadside for two days to see 45secs of peleton go past - each to their own tho eh
[i]Pretty stupid to compare cycling to the country's most popular sport. [/i]
uh uh.
I agree it doesn't make a good spectator sport- I enjoy it, but only because I love bikes and riding. How many non-cyclists tune into the downhill? How many casual cyclists?
In the flesh it's very different, because you get the true impression of speed and closeness, and the noise, (and sometimes the ground shaking as they pass...) but the flipside is there's quite a lot of nothing at all.
More importantly, why are they going to "tone down" the XC course after the olympics? It's not as if it is soooo hard core that only olympic level riders will be able to manage it is it really ??
(besides, they are going to be doing it as fast as possible on racy bikes, so i'm pretty sure the average 150mm FS AM bike isn't going to struggle too much?)
After all, you can fall off your bike and hurt yourself anywhere, toning down the course smacks of H&S b*ll*cks to me !
The trouble is, it's a race course so it's designed as a wide gravel path with occasional features. Take out the features and you don't get left with an easier mtb course, you get left with nothing much at all.
But I can see why they would want to remove the hard lines, they're a pretty big deal for an XC course and also, the difficulty of the route is so inconsistent- you don't want something that's 99% easy and 1% hard, it lulls people into a false sense of security/competence.
It does seem stupid to remove the obtacles. On the other hand being the olympic course it will a magnet for the have a go crowd. The same features 5 miles from the visitor centre in Wales would probably be OK as the people reaching it are likely to be more experienced...
Having watceg Graham bell fall off on a "B" line I expect some of it will quite tricky
xc is unwatchable
It's a matter of opinion surely. Some people find road riding dull. I find cricket as interesting as watching paint drying and can't stand boxing yet I have close friends who love both. Conversely, I like watching baseball but most people outside the US hate it.
Horses for courses (I find that dull too) innit.
More importantly, why are they going to "tone down" the XC course after the olympics? It's not as if it is soooo hard core that only olympic level riders will be able to manage it is it really ??(besides, they are going to be doing it as fast as possible on racy bikes, so i'm pretty sure the average 150mm FS AM bike isn't going to struggle too much?)
After all, you can fall off your bike and hurt yourself anywhere, toning down the course smacks of H&S b*ll*cks to me !
Trust me, 90% of "normal riders" wouldn't get round the Olympic XC course unscathed, 150mm AM bike or not, it's too full on.
Being there watching the racing was ace (I was at the test event), good atmosphere, the place is a natural amphitheatre so you can see loads of action at various parts of the course from one vantage point but would it look good on TV? Not sure. The course is brilliant though and really tough.
That video of the 4X World Champs is unwatchable due to Rob Warner "commentating" (I use that word in the loosest possible sense) and in the same way the Tour Series (city centre criterium racing) on ITV4 is very good but occasionally has some truly horrendous commentary gaffes.
You need the combination of good footage and good commentary and it can work, regardless of the course. Track cycling works in spite of the fact that the "course" is very much secondary to the action happening on it but it's also dead easy to film because it's such a controlled environment.
Spot on ^
Ok, so why not just build in some "chicken" lines around the tough stuff, that way each rider can decide what they want to do, rather than just sanitise the whole thing??
Ok, so why not just build in some "chicken" lines around the tough stuff, that way each rider can decide what they want to do, rather than just sanitise the whole thing??
i guess, because people are stupid, and bravado will mean riders land up in hospital, The choice is sanitise or scrap.
That skiercross (4x on skis) in the last Olympics was the best sport I've ever seen on TV, the format, the crashes and didn't last too long.
Dirt have a slightly different view of the track...
Dirt speaks the truth.
and what did dirt, a DH biased mag, have to say about an XC race course, and out of curiosity given there target readership why should we care what their opinion is?
Pretty stupid to compare cycling to the country's most popular sport.
Who mentioned fishing?
I don't understand those who say "I don't watch my favorite sports I 'do' them".
Surely if you're passionate about something and you're not the best in the world (as I'm presuming there are no world champions posting on here) then you want to see how the best in the world get on?
To me, cycling isn't a sport, it's a pastime. What folk doing it as a sport do holds little or no interest for me.
I should start an argument here this being STW but fair enough each to their own. World would be boring if we were all the same and all that.
No argument. If you do DH riding and want to improve at it enough to compete, then maybe you can pick up some tips from watching it. For me, it's no more relevant than watching football or swimming.
I don't want to compete but I watch DH because I think I understand what it takes to ride at Greg Minaars level and I'm impressed by it so when a guy comes down and beats that by 8 seconds over 3 minutes I'm very impressed.
I'll probably not be applying much of what I saw to my riding.
why should we care what their opinion is?
There must be something in their opinion - it was the organisers that invited them to ride it!
Is that my troll-dar I hear beeping? Fairhurst, who iirc was saying the steel city dh wasnt 'dh' enough, now he is saying the Olympic xc trail is good enough for dh and he was inspired by steel city?
Might be wrong but I call shenanigans....
Trust me, 90% of "normal riders" wouldn't get round the Olympic XC course unscathed, 150mm AM bike or not, it's too full on.
Full on I hear you say
Its an effing joke!
Strangely that video misses the most technical bits. Lets Ignore that though, its much easier to criticise without having the full picture! Again though Greeble, you need to remember its only designed for professional athletes, not the Gods of STW.
The olympic xc course is utter shite. All the awesome biking terrain the uk has, and they go and custom build something in a field.
At least at the commwealth games they used some stuff around rivington I seem to remember.
As for all the comments about dh racing being dull and unwatchable videos because of the warner, you lot really are taking getting old hard aren't you?
Not sure what level the folks in that test event to be are (i am sure they are really fit) but they don't seem to be able to corner where there are roots or ride downhill switchbacks either. Sure puts Danny Harts Champery run in the shade though.....
For those that like to do, I find I have a few hours spare in a day to Watch the worlds best.
Guessing you lot are just out 24/7
The olympic xc course is utter shite. All the awesome biking terrain the uk has, and they go and custom build something in a field.
FFS, do we really have to keep doing this?! There is nothing existing that would have worked, there is a very unique set of criteria that requires a custom built course. It's not DH, it's not a trail centre, it will give good racing, there's plenty of climbing, room for overtaking, and some good downhill features with up to 3 different lines.
FFS, do we really have to keep doing this?
Are you new here?
there is a very unique set of criteria that requires a custom built course
This is where the problem is people don't understand the specs for an XC course
As for using after would be good to leave as is and sign it well. If not the it will just get overgrown and unused.
Trouble is that even as is it's very short, there'll be a raft of 'wtf I travelled to ride the Olympic course on my 6" skills compensator and it took 20 minutes' posts!
6" skills compensator
Speak for yourself
There will though, naive to think otherwise, it's the 'default' bike these days, not a bad thing in the least, but it's not what the course has been designed for.
dasnut, if you want to watch dh videos feel free, for me they are boring, yes there is skill but there is no sense of competition, watching a clock ticking doesn't do anything for me. Did you watch the BMX worlds? skill, crashes and fairly obvious who is winning, much more interesting.
as it seems we are going to have to do this again, the Olympics are the london olympics, the course is in the UK and has to be usable in all weathers, spectators, trucks, etc all have to be able to get to the venue and not get bogged down to their axles. It is a race so overtaking might be helpful, if it was single track for the whole course it would be crap for spectators.
The olympic xc course is utter shite. All the awesome biking terrain the uk has, and they go and custom build something in a field.
That's funny cos all the riders I've heard talk about it and seen interviewed really like it.
So I conclude that either you've raced/ridden on the course but no-one has interviewed you yet or you haven't got the faintest clue what you're on about and are talking shite...
Oh and what njee20 said +1
As for all the comments about dh racing being dull and unwatchable videos because of the warner, you lot really are taking getting old hard aren't you?
I watched the DH world cup yesterday. It was good up until about the fourth rider, then I just found it repetetive and fairly boring.
It doesnt really work on TV since its not a race, its a Time Trial. If you want excitement then you need head to head racing hence why 4x or xc or road cycling is more watchable.
Although the commentators for these events wont get the middle aged men frothing at the mouth "OMG, did you just hear Warners comment about Danny Harts balls?!?! Funniest thing Ive ever heard, what a legend!!!"
I think what we have here is a split between the "cyclists" and the "folk what ride bikes". The former seem to define themselves by everything to do with their hobby. They know all the characters, can quote bike geometries and tyre compounds, have various bike-part based tattoos and think that a cartoon about a sheep is the high water mark of 20th century culture. Watching cycling in their non-riding time would be the logical thing for them to do.
I just happen to ride bike sometimes - probably further than 90% of "cyclists" though.
Put your willy away Druid...
I am not sure I have anything else to add other than yesterday's Val di Sole viewing was ace. Watching a rider you want to do well is very exciting, Sam Hill, Gee, Rachel and Danny Hart yesterday for example. And then to see them blown out the water by the final rider. Really enjoyed it.
I can get sucked in to darts or curling though
I think what we have here is a split between the "cyclists" and the "folk what ride bikes".
True, and nothing wrong with either in my book, it's the same with many past times, although would have to say their is a fair amount of irony that you are posting this on a bike forum, a place that you seem to hang out in a fair amount for someone that just rides a bike! 😉
I like watching cycling on TV no matter what type it is, sometimes it's good to watch sometimes not, but what I don't get is why people feel the need to tell others it's boring? I find football immensely boring and frustrating to watch and can't understand why anyone would want to watch it but wouldn't go on a football forum and post how dull it is, as it's just my feelings.
As for the Olympic course, a rather done to death topic, I do side a bit with those who feel that it was a waste to build a new track, but then they built a new shooting range for the olympics, because the world class venue (not sure the name, sorry) was just a tiny, tiny bit far out and they wanted it to be as close to london as possible to promote the sport...Shooting not something that needs to be encouraged in london, maybe!?! 😉
But as for it's technical content, I think as an XCO track it looks good, a bit man made but then a lot of terrain "we" ride these days is and don't have a massive problem with that. And in response to the it looks easy comments, 1, riding technical terrain after sprinting up the hill at full gas is very different to riding up the hill at a reasonable pace, stopping at the top to fiddle with saddle height and gloves e.c.t and then setting off. 2, xc race courses are not always the most fun to ride but conversely the best courses to ride don't always make great race courses. I remember years ago doing a race that was 90% single track and had some great technical elements, it was fun on the practice lap, in the race it was RUBBISH. You were constantly held up and then could never get enough speed to ride the technical sections and then when it started to rain it just got worse.
And in terms of comparing it to the commonwealth xc track xco have moved on a lot since then in terms of course design. Yes it's maybe not the most interesting thing to ride on a 140mm free ride bike but then I hardly think Glentress really warrants a bike like that for most of the time and no one seems to have an issue there. Plus if you live around the olympic xc course area, by the looks of it what are you doing with a bike like that! 🙂
In short it's a specific track built for a specific purpose, maybe not the best use of public money but then neither is the stupid opening ceremony, at least there will be something left after the olympic mtb race more than ticker tape and left over fireworks.
as it's just my feelings
You're being far too reasonable there cows.
**** it, it's not worth saying.
Live and let live.
Ski Sunday has been a massive part of the BBC schedule for about 30years. It's not a race but a time trial but the BBC must get a lot of viewers otherwise why bother. So apart from the camera numbers issue how different is it from DH?
Any sport can be popular and have a following if it's in the media and promoted.
I think mrmo just likes to argue, bless him.
Oh and its not slow with the right course. You didn't watch round 1 did you. Courses in the 90's were fast uand looked great on eurosport.
Ski Sunday has been a massive part of the BBC schedule for about 30years. It's not a race but a time trial but the BBC must get a lot of viewers otherwise why bother. So apart from the camera numbers issue how different is it from DH?
DH Skiing is *way* faster than DH Mtbing and much more fun to watch on television.
Remember kiddies, if it's any sort of "time trial" it's not a [i]real[/i] race.
druidh - Member
Remember kiddies, if it's any sort of "time trial" it's not a real race.
What?!!?! 😕
Like the race of truth?
Why more fun? Please explain....
Depends what your looking for I guess. To me DH skiing gets pretty boring after a couple of runs. To my untrained eye the lines that they take are all pretty much the same and the differences in times are pretty small.
With DH biking you can instantly see the differences in lines and riding styles which is what I really enjoy about it.
I think the main thing is, if you don't like watching cycling on TV, be that xc, road, track, DH, 4X, XCE or all of the aforementioned don't watch it! It's really quite simple! Then there's no need to moan?!? I do the same with football, I don't watch it so it doesn't effect me...although cycling is easier to escape than football.