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great bit of marketing stuff that Kashima
Except its not just marketing. If you bothered to research it before waffling on you could actually talk facts instead of crap.
Sorry flow can tell you are a real serious guy and a true Fox fan and read all the tech stuff...cool 😉
Except its not just marketing.
😆 😆 😆
I'd say it's very good marketing myself.
The molecular makeup of Kashima give its very slippery properties....apparently
got both
2012's are darker with a logo
2011's lighter with no logo
both second hand and until this thread i was thinking i might have been ripped off (remember those gold marker pens?)
I turned down the option of having a kashima coated shock on my new frame as I said ''I wasn't fussed''.
unless your obsessed about having all the latest and greatless hype of which you fall to the kness to have.
I'd say it's very good marketing myself.
So you're backing up the fact its just marketing with no facts.
Clever, not.
[url= http://www.kashima-coat.com/pdf/English_pamphlet.pdf ]Some facts[/url] from Miyaki Co
The Japs coming up with a "clever coating", what a stupid thought 🙄
I have no need to back anything up as i couldn't give two chuffs what you send your money on. 😀
Amusing to see you get a bit touch about it though. 😉
I have no need to post pointless comments about things I know nothing about
Aye, you're right there mate.
Flow - mtb is marketted to death
can you please list a full spec of your bike so us "paupers" 😆 can find more to poke fun about?
Flow I think the 20 odd years i spend racing MX and enduro might have given me a small insight into the workings of suspension.
But don't let that stop you reading some marketing hype and thinking you know it all. 😉
So if this Kashima stuff is so wonderful, why do you still have to service the forks every 5 mins to stop it wearing off? Every other manufacturer specifies at least a 50 hour service or in some cases (Marzocchi) the warranty is 3 years with no service restriction.
20 years racing MX and Enduro! Well I take it back oh wise one, you must know what you are on about
😆
Paupers be gone. Go and start your own thread and leave us alone.
Munkyboy have you noticed any difference in performance between the 2 forks?
To be honest the smal bump response from both is pretty poor - talas forks? I am not a good enough rider to notice any difference (if there even is one)
I think everyone has noticed the difference (except the paupers of course)
Silky smooth and stiction free.
Talas suck, no wonder you didn't.
Talas..... More seals to
I think the cheapest and possibly the best way of keeping fork sanctions in good fettle is to use a fender bender. I can't see dirt getting in on mine... use this with Enduro seals and you'll be laughing all the way to the service centre only once every other year, perhaps?
It's worked for me anyhow.
cashinyawallet is probably the biggest difference... 🙂 at least for the sane amongst us
Poverty must be a difficult thing. Please excuse my plush, slippery, gold stanchions, I didn't mean for them to offend you.
[url= http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6219/6329902484_352c1aa3a7_b.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/61104469@N02/6329902484/ ]Kashima Fox 32 RLC[/url]
You'd think Fox could at least get both of the stanchions on a fork [i]roughly[/i] the same colour.
You'd think Fox could at least get both of the stanchions on a fork roughly the same colour.
I think you will find thats the light 🙄
I recently had my non Kashima FIT RLC120 forks back from a warranty issue fitted with the new skf seals and a note a about new internal seals for the air cartridge. They are now significantly plusher and require more pressure for the same sag, as some have experienced and put down to the new slippery coating. As I originally guessed, Kashima is just a visual change to make the internal changes have a more obvious marketable value. It's the seals that make the big difference.
So the coating is irrelevant you think?! Good to see people agree!
Next question then...
Do the new seals provide less friction for the same job as the old seals, or do they just 'seal' less?
Oh it must be oh so sweet to live in the world of flow where you can buy 1 orange five without kashima coated shocks, and then 1 with kashima coated shocks to make a informed conclusion.
The SKF seals, are better 'sealing'( sealisity 😕 😯 )
and have lower frictional properties as well due to the seal compound,
can definatly feel the difference on my standard coat forks that have these fitted 😀
Flow, you really seem to be biting at the minute (here and CCDB on lapierre thread?). I'm not a Fox hater or an RS fanboi but the massive weight of evidence would suggest Fox [i]are[/i] the more fragile (corroborated by their shorter service intervals). Yes some people can trash any fork, and people like you and I who maintain kit will get years out of stuff, but it appears Fox have poor dust seals, the dust gets into the foam wipers, which act as abrading pads on the stanchions. Hopefully the new SKF (or Enduro which I've got in my parts box waiting for the next service on our Fox) are a tighter, better fit and prevent dirt getting thru, and the subsequent wear.
The molecular makeup of Kashima give its very slippery properties....apparently
aluminium oxide (eg. anodized alloy surfaces) is porous. Putting a dye in during the process fills the pores and adds kool anodized colours. Kashima add molybdenum disulphide (like the black moly grease you can buy from halfords) during the process, along with gold pigment. Moly disulphide works like graphite in being a solid with low shear strength between molecular layers, so works as a lubricant as layers move against each other. Putting it in pores on load-bearing or working surfaces is one of those clever "why didnt they think of that before" ideas.
I'd rather be happy my stanchion pores were properly filled with useful lubricating agent than useless but pretty pigment (and I am a tart enough to like gold stanchions and to resent the fact my Marz 55RC3Tis have ghetto nickel-plated stanchions 😀 😳
Poverty must be a difficult thing. Please excuse my plush, slippery, gold stanchions, I didn't mean for them to offend you.
love it!
Flow - Enjoy your Kashimas, I ****ing love mine, they feel amazing and look the nuts!
Enjoy yours too fellow wealthy one, and let the paupers drool at what they cannot afford 😉
Never mind the poor economic climate - this is Stanchion Envy!!!
<all in jest>
I just stroked mine. They purred at me and whispered, "ride me".
I think a lot of people who've come across kashima before judge it harshly, because it's been a total snakeoil product for ages in motorbike use- lots of dodgy suspension tuners offering to coat your fork uppers and shock bodies etc, ie, nonfriction parts, and promising performance improvements. (then, people got back their newly rebuilt part and said Wow! Must be the coating! instead of "Hey, newly serviced shocks are better than shagged out old ones")
Think there's probably an element of this in the pushbikes too- people compare new forks with old, or newly serviced forks with tired ones, or forks with the new seals with forks without. But that's not going to stop me getting my RP kashima'd I think.
Well NW, as you know I had two Fives here, one with a kashima RP23 and one without. The one without was only just serviced, and uses the same seals as the new ones (I think). The kashima RP23 is definitely a lot plusher, practically zero stiction, and thats not just me imagining it.
They also had to increase the compression tune of the shocks ([url=
Mojo say[/url]) due to the decreased stiction.
If it definately used the new seals, that's a great comparison, cheers.
(I've a sneaking suspicion that you could charge a lot of people £150 and write "Kashima" on the can with a gold marker pen, and some people would feel a huge difference 😉 )
I wouldn't be too sure, even my bro was shocked at the difference.
Let me know when you get it done, I will welcome you into the upper class 😉
Nah, think you miss my point- I'm not saying there's no difference (I've no experience myself), just that in general some people want to be impressed by a new part or change, particularily when it was expensive.
Frinstance, I once changed the rear caliper on a mate's motorbike and at the same time, gave the front once a wee cosmetic clean and polished the logos back up just because they looked silly with the new rear. He was well impressed with the increase in front braking 😉
Incidentally, in the class war, what wins- PUSH or Kashima?
Ahhh, I get ya.
Actually, surely my PUSHd Kashima shock will mark me out as your new ruler since you'll just have a scaffy standard shock, which you probably found in a bin while looking for dinner?
Jesus its Kashimas Wars
Well no, mine is a 2012 one with adaptive logic, making you still inferior 😉
Flow is Kashimas'd up, must say the Kashima RP23 adaptive logic look the nuts
flow - MemberWell no, mine is a 2012 one with adaptive logic, making you still inferior
Isn't that all just about slightly changing how the propedal lever works?
What bike you got at the mo SBrock?
Nice suspension Flow, its a pity you couldn't afford a decent bike to attach it to.