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Aye, that'd be well worth 3hours pushing up, eh
Must have been able to ride some of it though, not all of the path is that hard ?
There's no shame in admitting a stretch is too technical/damaged/wet and walking the odd 10 metres, or is there?
dont really know what the dude was going on about on your flickr vid about wrong for riding that bit - however - well done looks fab - my hubby has doneben lomond a couple times and riden all aparently v tricky !
TJ - give over. I doubt he had much choice where exactly to go given how steep/tricky it is there - and how do you think that bit got eroded? I doubt it was mountain bikers.
Does [i]every[/i] thread have to turn into a silly argument these days?
Grum. Sorry but he did have a choice and this is exactly the sort of behaviour we should be questioning. In Scotland access is a qualified right that comes with duties - and one of the duties is not to cause unnecessary erosion. Riding off the sides of the paths clearly is against both the spirit and the letter of the code.
I know that mountain well - erosion is a real issue on it.
I still don't understand why the OP is suggesting the unrideable has been ridden - the rider clearly avoided the tricky steps and just used a chicken run.
(agree with the above about erosion, too)
Kinda wishing i hadnt started this thread now. Was intended to show there was a way down/ around/ whatever the granny trap. Bike may have gone off the man madepath bit think any possible erosion was at a minimum given the damage caused by walkers, weather and animals! I'm going to go back and cement the bits we rode on to stop and further damage and ill plant a tree to adjust for any co2 I breathe out
I still don't understand why the OP is suggesting the unrideable has been ridden - the rider clearly avoided the tricky steps and just used a chicken run.
Although the vid doesn't really show the hardest bit - I'd like to see you ride the 'chicken run'. I don't claim to be an amazing technical rider but I have ridden some fairly steep techy stuff here and in the Alps and it's beyond what I would think of doing. Adstick off here is a pretty handy rider and was on his SX Trail and he didn't do it either.
Video makes it look stupidly easy.
that's fair enough grum it might have been very tricky to even do that but surely to 'clean' the section the steps would have to be ridden as well?
How hard it is is irrelevant - he rode off the path deliberately which is a clear breach of the access code. Nothing else matters.
that path was built to combat erosion. By going off the side of it you are undermining it and it will collapse sooner than if peope stick to the path
To say "well others have done so" does not make it right. Two wrongs do not make a right!
wwaswas - I dunno about 'cleaning' it but all he said was it's rideable.
How hard it is is irrelevant - he rode off the path deliberately which is a clear breach of the access code. Nothing else matters.
How do you know he did it deliberately? I don't know about you but riding very steep tricky stuff I often can't pick exactly where I'm going to go. Why have you gone off paths 'usually' accidentally?
Is it because you weren't riding in proper control ON A PUBLIC PATH? [b]HOW VERY DARE YOU!!!?[/b] Riding out of control is also more likely to cause skidding and further erosion - probably another breach of the access code eh? 🙄
What he did is probably not ideal but please try and develop a teensy little sense of perspective.
What he did is probably not ideal but please try and develop a teensy little sense of perspective.
... and don't post about it on t'interweb 🙄
Come off it grum - its clearly deliberate and the poster originally attempted to defend it as being OK
Its bad practice and should be challenged Its up to us to do this otherwise it people think its acceptable to ride like that.
I would challenge anyone I saw walking or riding doing that.
In 40 years since I first climbed Lomond I hae seen it erode, a armoured path be put n in places and the path then be eroded away
there use to be a sign reminding yo to keep to teh path to prevent erosion..
your right it was deliberate. We intentionally went out to try and inflame the moral high ground in alot of replies on here. Guess we shouldnt have had that who can get the longest skid contest all the way down!
I would challenge anyone I saw walking or riding doing that.
At the risk of repeating myself.....
Did you challenge yourself when you did it (apparently several times and only 'usually accidentally')? And surely you were out of control if you did it accidentally?
Bit hypocritical no? Something you are normally very keen to point out in other people.
Grum - its not the same thing. One is a deliberate action and the other is inadvertent. No hypocrisy involved.
If I were you I'd stop digging. those of us who respect the mountains and the access code are obvious on this thread. With rights come responsibilities.
Grum - its not the same thing. One is a deliberate action and the other is inadvertent.
Has exactly the same end result though doesn't it. In fact you could argue doing it deliberately is less likely to cause erosion.
And you didn't answer the point about being out of control which I believe violates the access code.
Have you ever read the access code?
Yes
Use common sense to avoid accidents—show care and consideration and make sure your speed doesn’t alarm or endanger others
If you have gone off the path (many times) (mostly) accidentally surely you were going too fast for your abilities.
If going off-trail, especially in winter, avoid wet, boggy or soft ground and don’t churn up the surface
Didn't see any wet, boggy or soft ground there - or churning up the surface.
Also
It is advisable to wear a helmet at all times for your own protection
OMG!!!!!!!!!
Phew! It's getting hot in here with pent up access rage. Fair play to anyone for getting round the sharp right hander. I've tried it several times and once managed that far while packing my pants but couldn't get a line down the steps. I can't share the outrage about going off the steps that others have posted. My only disappointment is that I was expecting to see the steps ridden down too. It's seriously nasty looking when you are above it. I wonder will the world end because of this video? Er, no! Having ridden the route several times, I rather suspect that walkers who witnessed it would be more gob smacked than angry and more likely to applaud than criticize. I used to sit on an Access Forum and to be honest, this would not be an issue of concern to us.
Cheers
Sanny
Ps get a better video recording device for next time!
well its a very odd interpretation that says deliberately riding on eroded ground is Ok but inadvertently running off the path is not ok
really - stop digging. You are attempting to defend the indefensible
[b]Help protect trails from erosion[/b]; don’t skid, especially on loose
surfaces and try not to lock your wheels when going downhill.
Remember, [b]you may not be the only cyclists using the route—
consider the cumulative effect[/b]
I'm with TJ: Access code or not, I think we should all be responsible enough to stick to marked trails otherwise we might all end up confined to trail centres forever and ever...
If we are seen to ruin the great outdoors we'll soon be told we're not welcome.
If we are [s]seen[/s] [i]perceived[/i] to ruin the great outdoors we'll soon be told we're not welcome.
nail on the head
Yep well said Mintman
[img] 
[/img]
You are attempting to defend the indefensible
Get a grip.
We're talking about cycling, not rape or genocide.
well its a very odd interpretation that says deliberately riding on eroded ground is Ok but inadvertently running off the path is not ok
Not really seeing as it is has exactly the same effect on erosion - the ground doesn't care what your intentions were does it. But one shows a lack of control, the other doesn't.
From the bit you quoted, all it says is 'don't skid or lock your wheels', which I don't think the guy in the video was. You probably were when you accidentally went off the path.
If going off-trail, especially in winter, avoid wet, boggy or soft ground and don’t churn up the surface
So why does the government's own advice refer to going off-trail on a bike, if you are NEVER meant to do that?
Grum - stop showing your ignorance. Its a clear breach of mountain etiquette and the access code and you should know it. What anyone else does inadvertently or not is irrelevant
If you don't understand the difference between deliberate and inadvertent you are even stupider than I thought Look at the number of folk who agree with me.
Its a great shame you don't respect the hills nor understand the ethos.
ditch_jockey - Member
Yeah, Jeremy, if people start riding off the edge of paths that mountain won't be there in a couple of years.
I'm doing Ben Lomond if I go to Scotland this year.Please do us all a favour and take your childish attitude somewhere else and leave Scotland for the grown ups who understand "responsible access".
Jump off your high horse and take a rest, Mildred. Where have I said I was going to blatantly ignore any pathways? My point was in reference to the predictable gathering of hypocritical, sanctimonious old maids who are almost as excited as they would be if someone received a speeding fine on here.
That section's probably well out of my skill level, but I'm not jealous enough to criticise the rider or poster, because that would just be pathetic.
Nothing to do with jealousy. Everything to do with showing respect for the mountains and the access code.
TJ - why don't you actually answer my questions instead of hysterically bleating?
Lots of people agree with David Cameron - does that mean he is right too?
Again, why does the government give advice about going off-trail specifically if it's such a no-no? And what about where it advises wearing a helmet at all times?
You are confusing your own petty prejudices with the access code and 'respect for the mountains' - I have plenty of respect for the mountains and often pick up bits of litter etc. I also generally (but not always) stick to paths and man-made steps - same as you apparently.
Get a ****ing grip. If you really care that much about erosion never ride your bike or go for a walk ever again.
Partly to do with jealousy. Mostly to do with showing my prejudices and my own made up version of the access code.
Fixed.
Grum I have answered everything you asked where it made any sort of sense.
You don't understand the issues - its a pity but there it is.
It is not acceptable to ride off the side of paths deliberately and if you had any understanding or respect you would know that instead of trying to defend the OP. You clearly don't understand what the code is.
The helmet wearing thing you quote is not a part of it. Teh code is not Government advice.
its not the biggest environmental crime by a long way. However its bad practice and should not go unchallenged
You childish attitude does you no favours.
Just to clear a few points up.
The intended target was the steps, he missed them.
All the hard braking and turning was done on solid natural rock and the off path section was just used as an unintentional run out WITH NO SKIDDING!
Much litter was removed from the hill.
The alternative line is a 10 foot huck to rock garden then flat turn. Which would make a mess of the path and the rider.
I shall also plant a tree!
When the NTS is short on funds and wants to save money on footpath repairs it wouldn't surprise me if they restrict access to MTBs citing the fact that They deliberately disregard the access code.
This would be unfortunate for the vast majority of bikers who use these footpaths responsibly.
Well, since we now know he didn't mean to ride that bit anyway, might well be time for both sides to shut up really. Though does make you wonder why the video was posted in the first place, "Look it's perfectly rideable except where it isn't".
*has a quiet s**** at northwind*
I've decided arbitrarily taking one side or another doesn't work so I'm going to fight both sides.
as an exercise in willy waving it really merits the response [i]"it's like a penis, only much smaller"[/i]
It is not acceptable to ride off the side of paths deliberately and if you had any understanding or respect you would know that instead of trying to defend the OP.
All the hard braking and turning was done on solid natural rock and the off path section was just used as an [b]unintentional[/b] run out WITH NO SKIDDING!
So presumably now you are going to admit that you were wrong and take back all your ridiculous hysterical whining of the last few hours?
Oh wait.....
😉
I make no apologies for challenging bad practice The OP stated it was intended and that is what it looked like
may I remind you
Grum
"Use common sense to avoid accidents—show care and consideration and make sure your speed doesn’t alarm or endanger others"If you have gone off the path (many times) (mostly) accidentally surely you were going too fast for your abilities.
grumIs it because you weren't riding in proper control ON A PUBLIC PATH? HOW VERY DARE YOU!!!? Riding out of control is also more likely to cause skidding and further erosion - probably another breach of the access code eh?
Hoist by your own petard?
I was merely taking the piss out of your hypocrisy - if there's no walkers to scare (which seeing as there was a guy below filming they knew there wasn't) and no skidding then what's the problem again?
Are peoples' menstrual cycles synchronizing or something?
Hmmm after what someone above has said whose judgement I trust I'd like to take back the bit I said about mincing please. I'd probably fail miserably and break myself if I tried to ride what appears to be "the line".
I still think you need to go back up and do it again, but this time down the steps, though. And get better photos to make it look as gnarlcore as it is.
cynic-al - Member
Are peoples' menstrual cycles synchronizing or something?
Synchronized cycling? That could be a new olympic "sport".
Lots of Olympian hopefuls on here 😀
What about if you intentionally ride an eroded alternative to a main path knowing fine well about the existence of the marked path yet intentionally choosing to ignore it? Where does the code stand with that?