Struggling to find any info on google about when the full loop might reopen again. Anyone heard any rumours? Or anyone have a glass ball they can look into? 😉
Won't be for a while, they haven't finished felling the trees yet! The trees from just below Giant's car park up to the top fireroad are gone and cleaned up, you can see the trail from the Cafall. Looks in good condition but I'm presuming the actual surface is trashed. The rest is still being worked on.
The main concern is that the whole Twrch will need rebuilding as the remaining descent is not being used enough to keep it fully rideable. It's only open from Castle Valley onwards (after the concrete hill) so no-one's making the trudge up a bit of hike-a-bike to the fireroad diversion to use the top of the second half. Went up there two weeks ago and it was covered in dead leaves and snapped small branches, all the surface was covered in a leafy slime. Not nice to ride on! The descent from the Troll Bridge down is fine though as people are doing that as a tag-on to the Cafall. The fate of the DH track is unknown as it's far into the working zone so out of view, rarely see the CwmDown bus running anymore although they are servicing the new track AFAIK.
My gut feeling is it'll be a long time before anything is done with it. Forest Drive is trashed with crumbling tarmac from all the heavy machinery moving around and washed-out banks from the run-off with no trees to hold the soil together.
Yeah like Milky said it's in a shit state - I took a lap in a few weeks ago because I was short on time and wish I hadn't bothered.
The diversion starts virtually from the car park now, it's a hikeabike from the bridge drop on the DH up through the woods (too steep to ride, very slippery too) up to a fireroad, a couple of miles of fire road to where Milky explains - and my experience was exactly the same, it's slowly returning to nature which is fine, but it's slower, more technical and less flowly - more like a 'natural' trail, which I know some people will profess to prefer, but we're hardly short of that in South Wales, there's plenty of it in Cwmcarn alone. Final descent is okay - but this is a personal thing - they've moved the gate from up in the trees to down just before the fireroad you need to cross to start the "troll bridge" section - means no more million mile an hour starts - played havoc with my Strava times 😉
As for updates, I've asked Bob the Ranger twice, once on FB and once on Twitter and had no reply - I suspect that like Penhydd whilst the trails are still there the surface will be destroyed by the machinery which will mean a long rebuild, if they've got the budget for it, so probably a new climb from the ranger station up, the 'freeride' will probably be untouched as it doesn't have any trees on it, Odin and all that will be new and hopefully they don't have to harvest the rest of it.
I suspect that like Penhydd whilst the trails are still there the surface will be destroyed by the machinery which will mean a long rebuild, if they've got the budget for it.
That's my fear, rebuilding it correctly will cost a lot of money. Really enjoyed that climb but replacing it with something similar to the machine-built stuff they put in on Penhydd would be a travesty. I did a few dig days on the original Twrch so would be up for doing the same again if it does get rebuilt. Closer to the time I'll probably make enquiries at PS Cycles about what's hapenning.
The diversion starts virtually from the car park now, it's a hikeabike from the bridge drop on the DH up through the woods (too steep to ride, very slippery too) up to a fireroad.
If you want to do the final descent you can walk (please, do walk!) up the footpath that starts by the end point next to the ticket machine, cuts out the slimy scramble. Worth doing if you're there doing the Cafall anyway.
Cheers Milky, typically at the end of Cafal instead of doing that bit after it crosses Forrest Drive we ride back up to the ranger hut and the wrong way up forest drive to the road for the final.
I understand that most trail centres are based in working forests etc,but decisions like this seem spectacularly short sighted. Why bother allowing all the cost and effort of developing new trails and infrastructure just to essentially destroy the place a year or two later. Bike Park Wales must be loving it though!!
Why bother allowing all the cost and effort of developing new trails and infrastructure just to essentially destroy the place a year or two later
They didn't really have much choice, once the trees were infected there was only one option - cut the ****ers down and look to the future.
If I was BPW I'd be more worried about the disease spreading.
I rode whats left of it along with Cafal a few weeks ago. Bit of a slog with the walk / hike a bike at the start, and not a huge amount of excitement on the downhill.
I understand that most trail centres are based in working forests etc,but decisions like this seem spectacularly short sighted. Why bother allowing all the cost and effort of developing new trails and infrastructure just to essentially destroy the place a year or two later.
Fair point. Does seem a bit mad. Cwmcarn no longer really has enough riding to make the effort of going there (60 min car journey), which is a shame.
lucky7500 - MemberI understand that most trail centres are based in working forests etc,but decisions like this seem spectacularly short sighted. Why bother allowing all the cost and effort of developing new trails and infrastructure just to essentially destroy the place a year or two later. Bike Park Wales must be loving it though!!
What Bombjack said, plus the Twrch trail has been around for years, certainly more than 10 years, the new trails on the other side of the valley are unaffected.
With 20-20 hindsight their initial response was probably too low-key, when it was found at Afan they didn't close Penhydd (where they first found it I think) for months - just installed a bike wash and asked forest users to clean bikes, boots etc but it didn't take long to turn up down the road at the other Afan Centre, then Wentwood and Cwmcarn.
As for the Twrch, to the best of my knowledge it started being diverted about 6-8 months ago? it wasn't said at the time but the harvesting work is scheduled to take 18 months to 2 years - again they might have to rebuild the trail afterwards.
What worries me is that they closed Penhydd in March 2010, they said it would be closed for "about a year" in actual fact it took 2 years to complete the work, BackOnTrack started rebuilding the trail in April 2013 and it reopened Oct/Nov ish 2013, so "about a year" became 2 and a half years.
Fair point. Does seem a bit mad. Cwmcarn no longer really has enough riding to make the effort of going there (60 min car journey), which is a shame.
It's really lucky they actually built the Pedalhounds and Cafal trails. towards the end of the Cognation Project they actually scraped them, it was only a petition lead by Cwmdown and PS Cycles who got them built.
I personally think Cognation didn't want their halo project, BPW to potentially have competition from Cwmcarn just down the road, in fact if you look at the original Cognation plans from 2010 the whole project was greatly scaled down.
Forest Drive is trashed with crumbling tarmac from all the heavy machinery moving around and washed-out banks from the run-off with no trees to hold the soil together.
Not all bad news then, at least we get a new trail 🙂
Fair point. Does seem a bit mad. Cwmcarn no longer really has enough riding to make the effort of going there (60 min car journey), which is a shame.
It's really lucky they actually built the Pedalhounds and Cafal trails. towards the end of the Cognation Project they actually scraped them, it was only a petition lead by Cwmdown and PS Cycles who got them built.I personally think Cognation didn't want their halo project, BPW to potentially have competition from Cwmcarn just down the road, in fact if you look at the original Cognation plans from 2010 the whole project was greatly scaled down.
This was pretty much what I was attempting to say. I find it a shame that it now isn't worth travelling to (80 min or so journey) and therefore spending money locally and is unlikely to be for a good few years, if ever. However, I can drive 20-25 mins further and be at BPW.
That's my fear, rebuilding it correctly will cost a lot of money. Really enjoyed that climb but replacing it with something similar to the machine-built stuff they put in on Penhydd would be a travesty.
I'd sooner they didn't bother at all than build something like that. It's dreadful. As cafell is the only trail going at the moment, cwm is off the radar for me. Loved the Twrch, can't stand that new thing.
I can drive 20-25 mins further and be at BPW.
Can't wait to see what the flyup417 is like. Maybe no more bridge tolls!
Crazy thing is cwmcarn is the closest decent trail centre to London, they should have been capitalising on that instead of just sitting with one DH and one xc trail for decades while Afan, BPw etc all developed
Unfortunately Caerphilly county council have not yet realised what a potential gold mine they are sat on whereas Neath Porttalbot and Mythyr are (a little) more enlightened. Sports development in Caerphilly can't get past traditional team sports such as rugby, hockey and wendyball.
Why bother allowing all the cost and effort of developing new trails and infrastructure just to essentially destroy the place a year or two later. Bike Park Wales must be loving it though!!
Simple, they got caught out!
The original plan was to open Cafall (it wasn't named or designed at this stage, they just knew a red-grade trail was going in on the other side of the valley) then close the Twrch and do a managed felling, thinning stuff out to control everything without destroying the trail. When it all kicked off at Afan funds got diverted to there so the building of Cafall was postponed until Afan was under control. Afan then got messy so Cwmcarn got no funding for ages. When Afan was finally felled and back on plan (although years late) Cwmcarn got a new car park and the Twrch got a few upgrades. Then the disease was found to be rife in Cwmcarn so all the plans were put on hold again. While they were dithering the new shower block and shop was built as the final phase of the car park project. They then awarded the shop lease to PS Cycles but then said they were shutting all the trails down! PS didn't move in for nearly a year leaving the place in limbo with the Twrch wearing out and no future. Cafall was finally given the green light but was opened a bit early meaning it was a quagmire for the first few weeks. PS then opened the shop and all was fine for a few weeks then the felling on the Twrch side started and the stories of Cwmcarn closing kept people away. The locals then kicked off about Forest Drive closing, Caerphilly Council panicked and said it may not reopen and we end up with a semi-derelict trail centre. From then on the place has not really had any concrete plan, they're concentrating on getting the trees out then see what's left as far as I can fathom.
It's really lucky they actually built the Pedalhounds and Cafall trails.
No luck at all, PS and CwmDown fought for them to keep their businesses alive. If they hadn't done so Cwmcarn could well have disappeared as a trail centre. It would be easy to say that Afan would cater for the trail riders where BPW would cater for the gravity crowd. BPW arguably caters for the demographic in between what Cwmcarn offered, too bike parkey for the XC crowd and not full-on DH enough for the Gravity crowd. BPW has now gone more DH with a new black so I don't see how Cwmcarn can recover if they open the DH track again.
The people I feel sorry for are the owners of PS Cycles and CwmDown as they've been royally messed about. Even now you can ask 3 different people there and get 3 different answers as to what is going on.
It's 20 minutes away from me, so perfect for a quick blast after work etc, so all that info is from talking to the people there as it was happening. I really want the place to be great again but I'm not holding out much hope. Without a plan post-felling it will wither away.
Just read that back, got a bit off my chest there 😳 Might have got a few bits in the wrong order but you get the idea. Been frustrating watching it all unfold TBH.
kimbers and gearfreak - you're spot on, used to see a few Londoners there regularly and at FOD. Now they make a beeline for Afan and BPW.
@milky I know where you're coming from - Cwmdown especially seems to have really suffered in the last few years, the sick thing is with Darrell setting up all those years ago and working so hard to grow it was instrumental in creating a lot of the 'scene' and he's probably suffering the most from what it's grown into.
Milky, P-Jay, thanks for all of that, I hadn't entirely realised quite how bad things had got!!
I reckon there would be room for a more natural and xc-ish version of Afan. Never got to cwmcarn, kept meaning to and now will have to wait a while!
I really enjoyed the Cafall trail when I was there in October. I thought it was ace fun, probably more so than the old trail.
Wil be a real shame if they let it die.
I hope Cwmcarn survives - it's been one of my favourites for years....
The trails felt far more natural in nature than pretty much any other centres I've ridden. I've really fond memories of sweating my way up the Twrch climb. I feel for the folks who've put so much effort into the place.
I'll really miss if it closes down......
Ps it was my first stop down to the rest of s Wales from london
Probably ought not admit this..... but I made it up to the top of the freeride section of Twrch and it is ****ed!! The free ride was badly maintained anyway, but they have felled lots of trees across it presumably to stop people like me riding it!
Beyond that, the trail has been used as access by the diggers and is totally churned up. Basically, needs rebuilding!
Can't wait to see what the flyup417 is like. Maybe no more bridge tolls!
Too right!!!
Amd great post milky. Didn't realise all the extra stuff that was going on! Not ideal for the bike shop though.
Caerphilly Council simply don't want it there. The Forest Drive costs them too much to run. Very convenient that the felling machinery is destroying the road. I'd put money on it not re-opening.
I do fear Cwmdown are going to go bye bye and the DH trails with it, along with Twrch and leaving us with very little.
When I heard about the felling planned I'd also heard this was a many year task. As above, probably like Penhydd.
It may be only when the bike park fad is over that venues like this will recover (and don't get me wrong, I like bike park places, but I feel it's much like the craze with trail centres).
milky1980 - Memberkimbers and gearfreak - you're spot on, used to see a few Londoners there regularly and at FOD. [b]Now they make a beeline for Afan and BPW[/b].
Haven't ridden at BPW yet but I've done Cwmcarn and Afan. Cwmcarn is awesome IMO.
Only ever ridden the Cafall trail, whilst I can only remember bits of the trail, I can remember enjoying every second of the descent (I hate uphills regardless of where they are). I loved getting all the climbing done and then being 'allowed' to enjoy the fruits of that labour, similar to Innerleithen.
Afan was, well, Afan. I remember enjoying Penhydd. W2 however seemed like a lot of effort when I should have be smiling. Not in a rush to go back to.
goyawave - I've been up to the freeride section too, although I accessed it from the moor behind it so I haven't been up the old trail sections. Made me sick seeing as it had new trees that were just starting to take hold again and had recently been made good prior to shutting. Was on the cusp of becoming a blast though the trees again, which would have also made it safer (no wind across the jumps) and helped keep the surface in good shape rather than the loose gravel it had become. Still mourning the loss of the 360' tunnel loop.
Caerphilly Council simply don't want it there. The Forest Drive costs them too much to run. Very convenient that the felling machinery is destroying the road. I'd put money on it not re-opening.
That's my fear. I'm hoping the bikers and the local community as a whole will try and stop them abandoning it altogether.
I reckon there would be room for a more natural and xc-ish version of Afan.
That's what it was. Afan had gone down the groomed trail route as a whole while Cwmcarn stuck to it's old-school origins, more by default rather than design but it was different. The amount of people who would do a weekend at Afan or Brechfa then call in at Cwmcarn on the way home (or the way there) to make a full weekend trip was more than you'd think. It just seems a pointless waste when they have put in a bike shop, shower block, the bike wash is back, the car park has been expanded and a new trail has gone in.
You could always expand your Cafall Loop by taking in the scenic climb either up the Gwyddon valley to the gas works and onto the moor or take the climb up through Abercarn up the side of the quarry and again up to the gas works and onto the moors.
There are so many more trails in the area within ten minutes of Cwmcarn.
Afan had gone down the groomed trail route as a whole while Cwmcarn stuck to it's old-school origins, more by default rather than design but it was different.
I wish they'd stuck with that idea for the cafell trail. It's far more groomed than the afan trails (except Penhydd). As for XC-ish, that's exactly what Cafell is. Reminds me a little bit of Verderers but with more elevation.
Maybe it would be worth someone (PS maybe if their business relies on it?) putting together route plans/gpx files that show some of the natural stuff. Even if it's all legitimate stuff being able to add natural extensions to the man made stuff without having to do much work would perhaps encourage more people to use the facilities and give a stronger argument to keeping it.
My worry would be that the decline in use is a perfect excuse for the council not to invest. The backwards logic of that is often the way councils work...
Im not a fan of Twrch but that doesnt matter really, places like these should be kept open for all.
The last thing the MTB ranger has said about it is...
Fully open is going to be a while yet I am afraid. However I hope to have more idear about rought dates in teh next few weeks. Will keep everyone posted.
And
Yeh we're trying to get it open as soon as we can but the felling work is going to take some time. Hopefully we will all be riding it again soon!
So in other words, no clue when its open.
I hope they can get it running but with some nice tweaks as it was looking a little tired last goin off, plus its awesome doing it backwards in the dark.
Gah! My sister lives in Bristol so virtually every visit was accompanied by an early morning trip to Cwmcarn. I love it there. One of my favourite trail centres and I'm gutted to hear that it has ended up in this state....fingers crossed it gets re-built.
I've ridden Cwmcarn a few times and always enjoyed it, especially as it's the first trail centre after the bridge if you're coming from the south east. I was planning on meeting a mate there for some riding in a couple of weeks, but hadn't realised it was in such a mess. I think it's a good idea for a local bike shop (or whoever) to come up with some natural loops to add on or as alternatives. If the routes were easy to find and follow, and well publicised, it might help retain mtb visitors. I'd certainly like to try some of the natural trails nearby...any locals have any recommendations?
Be aware there's tons of natural riding around there, both cheeky and non, so you can easily pad out a lap of Cafall with as many hours of natural riding as you can handle.
Wylie valley is where you want to look for natural stuff, also there other side of the masts from Machen and along the valley towards Caerphilly.
It'll all be on strava so I don't feel like I'm giving anything away.
Lived 10 mins from Cwmcarn for 10 year until 10 month ago.
I think it's a good idea for a local bike shop (or whoever) to come up with some natural loops to add on or as alternatives. If the routes were easy to find and follow, and well publicised, it might help retain mtb visitors
I'd be well up for that! Any GPX file or whatever. Cafall is just too short when driving an hour to get there.
LoCo - Member
Lived 10 mins from Cwmcarn for 10 year until 10 month ago.
Annoyingly, I used to live other side of the hill but this was 20 years ago and I never even knew what a mountain bike was back then. Though I guess there wouldn't have been any trails either.
Just a quick update on this:
There's a new sign (worryingly permanent-looking) appeared up by the hut at the split of Cafall and the Twrch with a plaque detailing what's going on, the familiar 'tree disease' info etc. It states that they closed the trails in November 2014 and planned work is for 2 years. Doesn't paint a good picture as I last rode the full loop back in July and it makes no mention of the future plans. What's more concerning is that the bits of the Twrch that are left currently are essentially abandoned as no-one is riding them so there's now trees and branches lying all over it with a thick layer of leaves and dirt covering the rocks. Even the easily accessible final descent is turning natural.
As for the shop giving out natural rides, they do offer guided rides. Presumably this takes in the off-piste stuff. Guess they'd frown on someone dishing out the GPX file of it but might be worth asking in there if you're up for exploring.
Just wanted to update this to cheer up all the pessimism regarding the Twrch's partial closure / diversion.
I have it on very good authority that the Twrch will almost certainly re-open pretty much completely before Christmas (this year!). If not then, early in the new year.
Cool, thanks.
Very much doubt it, there's whole chunks of trail missing! Add in all the remaining trees that have fallen over and it'll be a lot of work. Plus I very much doubt they'd let bikes cross the remains of Forest Drive while timber lorries thunder along. Confused by that sign now, has a map on it showing the whole area of the Twrch being out of bounds for a while 😕
Would be delighted to be proved wrong though 
Was at CC earlier this week, riding the Cafal.
Looking over the valley to the climb of the Twrch it looks pretty unmolested - I'm told it's too steep for machinery so they've been felling 'by hand' - you can't see the trail but there's nothing to suggest it's damaged really.
The Freeride is probably okay as it was bare anyway - from there to the cross roads will be knackered though I guess, from there down its untouched (so far) bar the killjoy gate just before the fireroad crossing to the very last bit.
Speaking to Darrell who runs Cwmdown it seems they've done most of thier work on that side and they're hoping to reopen most of the trail soon on the weekends only - the biggest problem at the moment being trucks on the road and bikes needing to bypass Odin etc on the same road.
Bad news though: once this work is completed they need to go over the valley to the Cafal / Pedalhounds side, one of the very few official trails left in SWales that's actually got tree cover.
Worse than that, Darrell, at least that day, was thinking of calling it a day in the new year, I don't know how long Cwmdown had been running, but it must be a decade or so now 🙁 can't have been easy with BPW opening up the road and the combined efforts of the tree rot and the local council to run down CC seem to have killed it over the last couple of years. Sad times.
Was at CC earlier this week, riding the Cafal.
Looking over the valley to the climb of the Twrch it looks pretty unmolested - I'm told it's too steep for machinery so they've been felling 'by hand' - you can't see the trail but there's nothing to suggest it's damaged really.
The Freeride is probably okay as it was bare anyway - from there to the cross roads will be knackered though I guess, from there down its untouched (so far) bar the killjoy gate just before the fireroad crossing to the very last bit.
Speaking to Darrell who runs Cwmdown it seems they've done most of thier work on that side and they're hoping to reopen most of the trail soon on the weekends only - the biggest problem at the moment being trucks on the road and bikes needing to bypass Odin etc on the same road.
Bad news though: once this work is completed they need to go over the valley to the Cafal / Pedalhounds side, one of the very few official trails left in SWales that's actually got tree cover.
Worse than that, Darrell, at least that day, was thinking of calling it a day in the new year, I don't know how long Cwmdown had been running, but it must be a decade or so now 🙁 can't have been easy with BPW opening up the road and the combined efforts of the tree rot and the local council to run down CC seem to have killed it over the last couple of years. Sad times.
Gutted for Darrell
Pioneering accessible uplift in the UK
I'll be genuinely sad to see CC go, if it does. One of the better trail centres IMO.
When the Twrch does reopen I'll be up there ASAP to see if it has survived 😀 Despite my pessimism I really do hope the whole place gets a rebirth after all this work is complete.
You can't see the trail but there's nothing to suggest it's damaged really.
I'm just praying that with no trees the deluge of rain hasn't washed away the surface, it was always a constant battle to stop the rain running down the top fireroad and turning left down the last bit of climb (Giant's Finger).
Bad news though: once this work is completed they need to go over the valley to the Cafal / Pedalhounds side, one of the very few official trails left in SWales that's actually got tree cover.
Was always going to happen. Hopefully the trails will survive that side too, although there's more native trees over that side so less felling should be required.
If Darrell does stop running Cwmdown it'll be a very sad day. Having the buses constantly nipping through the car park and rattling up the road as you climbed really added to the warmth of the place. Will have a big effect on PS Cycles in the shop too.
Only down 10% ?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-35402358
Only down 10% ?
Someone's telling porkies I reckon!
Rode up the Tarmac on Saturday to the concrete slab to ride the final descent.
It's not looking good at least 3 sections have been wiped out.
No way its 10%, its way more than that.
I was thinking the same, the car park is still brisk at the weekends, but it's not nearly as busy as it was, coupled with no one going up Forrest Drive I'd guess it's 40% down.
Funny enough MBWales were on FB today asking people to tell everyone they know that it's still open and figures are only down because people think it's closed which is frankly insulting - so I told them as much on FB, so did a few others - all asking for an update, and just like if you try to ask the MTB Ranger for CC about it - you don't get a response.
I'm not sure who decides what gets built where with MTB centes, but given whoever decides, didn't want to build Pedalhounds or Cafall (after they took all the Cognation money to transform the free car park into the bigger pay car par) I fear they might just pull the plug on Twrch in it's old format, either stick with the current crap diversion or pull the plug on it altogether.
the-muffin-man - MemberAren't the current models based off old Rover models and just a stop-gap until the 'proper' models are developed?
I assume you're talking about everywhere between the end of the old freeride the the slab?
Have all the trees gone from there now? If so there shouldn't be much to stop them rebuilding those sections, or at least starting now?
😀
Cwmdown
Yesterday at 21:24 ·
UPDATE... Felling is progressing well at Cwmcarn, NRW are working to repair and reinstate any trail damage. Although the Y Mynydd DH track won't be opening on a permanent basis until the end of the year, I've been told I will be able to run the uplift on it at specified weekends this year, not sure when yet, I'm waiting for them to get back to me with some dates, but I'm hoping to get a few weekends by Spring. I will post those dates up here as soon as I know, so you know what you are booking for. With regards to the Twrch trail, I'm waiting for an update, but I think it will be open fairly soon. Until then, Cafall and Pedalhounds are open and running as normal, plenty of space on the uplift too
That would be outstanding news! I hated Carfell with a passion (although it did try to kill me so I may be biased) but loved the Twrch. Fingers crossed.
Oh please make it rocky. Please please please.
Twrch To reopen this weekend according to fb
https://m.facebook.com/Mtb-Ranger-South-Wales-804574009622582/#!/story.php?story_fbid=961966827216632&substory_index=0&id=804574009622582&refid=17&_ft_=top_level_post_id.961966827216632%3Atl_objid.961966827216632&__tn__=%2As
Mtb Ranger South Wales
3 hrs ·
Good news! We will be reopening the Twrch trail at Cwmcarn on Saturday 13th Feb with a bit of luck with the weather! Please make sure you keep to the waymarked trail as it is still in the 'work site' and failure to do this could result in it being closed again so please help us keep it open. We will also still have spots to repair as it gets 'ridden in' however its good to be able to get it finally open again with some new views, happy riding! ?#?mtbtrailupdate? ?#?trailupdate? ?#?cognation?
Great news,one of my favourite trails and less than an hour away too.