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Saw them at the show and was impressed. I like the idea of cable-less front setup.
Thinking the Race or Toro, for general trail work.
Have you not been on STW for the past 3 years?!
I use a torro, preferred it to the daddy max, as I prefer a tighter beam.
I use a Race. Very good and great to be wire free.
BUT also look at the P7 lights on Deal extreme web site. OK they are from Hong Kong, no back up and I don't know how long they will last. BUT they are really cheap and mine is really good (maybe better than my Race).
I have the Enduro's and can not fault them, I would not want anything that has a cable now.
I had a Maxx D on the bars and a Diablo on the head for Relentless. It was like having a portable sun. No faff with cables. Reliably. Good backup.
New Joystick is the best helmet light I have used for balance of weight and power and burn time. Good quality, but very expensive compared to all the torches
Have you not been on STW for the past 3 years?!
Yesbutnobut .... not reading lights posts though 🙄
I've had a maxx enduro for about 3 years. It gets used for daily commutes as well as off road night rides and is still looks and performs like it did when it first came out of the box. Can't recommend them highly enough.
Joystick here - faultless.
Tried a few others at events and been similarly impressed.
Will wait until my current setup dies before I upgrade.
Like 'em. Reliable, neat and sufficient brightness and burn times for good night riding. The "get you home" mode came in very handy during a recent 14 hour ride.
They have survived utterly abusive weather and performed well in minus conditions.
Have an Enduro, had a Joystick. Joysticks are very very neat little bits of kit and are pretty useful off the bike too. The bigger lights like the Enduro and Maxx-D have been useful to navigate by at night.
Another can't fault them here.
Have been running 2 Enduro Maxx lights both 3 years old next month. Used every week for six months of the year, never missed a beat, and still exceed the 3hr stated run times.
Not cheap, but cable free "all in a can" design is a real bonus for me.
mine have been great too been running them last 18 months
I have a helmet mounted Joystick with a white eye (just because) and an Enduro Maxx2 on the bars.
As sais wire free sold it to me and the ability to use them as torch off the bike is brill.
Also customer support so far for me has been great, at Mayhem they fixed my helmet mount for free after I snapped it.
Can I just ask (naively) what the issue is with cables and batteries?
Doesn't worry me at all - powerful "all in one" units just seem to bulky to me.
I just leave my 601 on the bars (with almost 2000 lumens) and slip the battery unit off to recharge it - simple.
Have had enduro enduro turbo and joystick now have a joystick maxx2 great lights and great customer service. Have a hope vision 4 on the bike now but only as I got it cheap if I were paying full whack I'd have gone for the exposure daddy. That said hope is great as is their customer service
Got one of the older joysticks, had it for about 3 years now. Did have one problem with it, and it was over the warranty (and 2nd hand), but exposure still fixed it for me really quick and for free, and updated it to the newer switch. Its good enough to ride with on its own. I really like the look of the new ones though, with 300 lumens..
I would not want anything that has a cable now.
Um, your bike?
Don't get the coke can on the bars thing myself.
Don't get the coke can on the bars thing myself.
It doesn't exactly have any disadvantages, still lighter then a lot I think. Simpler to mount and dismount, easier to charge, more robust. Once you've tried it I don't think you can go back.
Realman - I have an "all in one" light (Hope 1) and a newer separate battery and light one. I actually find the latter far easier to charge and the light could not be easier to mount - it just clicks on. More robust? Not sure TBH.
I don't like massive light units - for one thing, if you crash, there's a lot of light unit to batter yourself on.
And the new Sixpack looks like a dustbin/baked bean can.
My torch is all in one though (of course!) , more powerful than a joystick, arguably better made and cost almost half the price of the Exposure version. I don't actually need a helmet mounted light as the 601 is so bright but if I do, the Lockblock secures it very well and cost £6.
I'm just not "getting" their pricey offerings.
Got a 2011 maxx d and a 2011 diablo, portable sun.
use them for road and MTB
A previous poster said that the toro was a tighter beam pattern, that may have been but Exposure confirmed that for 2011 the beam pattern on toro and maxx d is the same.
Love mine, very happy with the purchase.
there are some good 2010 deals out there, i have seen the joystick for £100
Get one (or two) you wont be dissapointed
joystick on helmet and d maxx on bars... simply ace 🙂
6pack now looks tempting!
if you crash, there's a lot of light unit to batter yourself on.
Kidding, right?
Can't comment on the hope lights, but exposure couldn't be more simpler. Click on, click off. Plug in to charge.
And the new Sixpack looks like a dustbin/baked bean can.
I've never really liked the look of batteries hanging from stems or top tubes or whatever, it stops bikes looking clean and tidy. But its a light, you use it when its dark. Who cares what it looks like.
When you say torch are you talking about your hope one?
If you are, the hope is considerably heavier, bulkier, and less bright then the current joystick, and less battery life. And I'm assuming you have to take the batteries out to recharge them (and buy them).
Nope - Hope 1 can be helmet mounted but it's too big really.
I mean a Fenix TK 11 R5 (with XPG LED).
Still no idea why "cableless" is favoured by some. My battery unit sits snugly under the bars and is pi55 easy to remove for charging.
So that one is also less bright, heavier, and only has two modes? But yeah, it is cheaper.
I think no matter how hard you look all lights have one disadvantage or the other. Except for exposure.
Except for the price of course, you just have to decide if its worth it to you 😉
Must say have had Hope lights and wouldn't touch again 🙁
had a few off in enduro racing in the night and ripped the cable out of the back of the light leaving me to race the rest of the course without my main light...
exposure solved that problem 🙂 touch wood not had a problem yet!
I tried a Diablo at D2D - not impressed as the mount failed and it swung around and blinded me, then couldn't get it to sit back in properly. Had to bodge it with the neoguard thingy off my forks. Won't be buying one of those. My Joystick however was a great buy and changed my life.
Ive not run with mine, though if you could find a way to fix it to your head without having to wear a helmet theyd be at least as great as they are on the bike.
Hi
Team Salsa have used them since they first came out. I think they are superb. I currently have a 3 year old Enduro Maxx 3 LED and a Joystick for the commuter, plus a Maxx D and a Diabolo for MTB racing. I tries a 6 pack at D2D and it was unbelievably bright - probably overkill for most rides, unless you're a 24hr soloist or do night rides over 3 hours. You can get 10hrs of light of the same quality as the Maxx-D out of one.
They are very durable - I've replaced the bracket and mounting shoe once on the 3 year old light but that's it.
I they do ever go wrong, customer service is excellent. They are based in the south of the uk and deal quickly with returns and the like.
Highly recommended here.
GB
RM - 285 lumens, 2 modes is plenty, its light.
My main light is brighter than anything Exposure offers, probably better made and cost a lot less.
That's why I don't "get" Exposures stuff.
You need some sort of Orbital set up Sam.
Joystick here - great commuting light on its own, great helmet light offroad
The joystick is 300 lumens...?
I don't understand what you basing the probably better made on. Exposure is really great quality kit.
No flashing mode for commuting.
And its over 50% heavier? Its not much, but still.
I've had a 2011 Maxx D for approx 5 days and had three rides on it, had lumicycle lights before with cable to the batteries, and all I can say is that I think wire free is the way to go. The Maxx D is not that big either. I'm just waiting for my Diablo helmet light to come in.
The joystick is 300 lumens...?I don't understand what you basing the probably better made on. Exposure is really great quality kit.
No flashing mode for commuting.
And its over 50% heavier? Its not much, but still
They must have just updated it. It was 240 lumens.
As for quality, the TK series is short for "tank" and used by the cops and miltary. You'll struggle to find better made...
Anyway, the main light is the most important thing..
My joystick is my main light.
And yes, I think it got updated up to 300 lumens a few months ago.
c'mon Mat - read the posts you post on !
😆iainc - Member
fair enough. I deliberated between them both and as I use it as a helmet light on the mtb (with a Hope 4 on the bars) and a bar light on the road, with my usual ride duration being 2-3 hrs I reckoned the new [b]300 lumens Joystick[/b] was best for my own circumstances. First outing last night and very impressed with it - a lot brighter than it's predecessor and a better beam patternPosted 3 days ago #
radirpok - Member
You can read my review on mtbr:
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?p=7394423
at the moment the site seems to be down, let's hope they will fix it soon.Posted 3 days ago # Report-Post
Surf-Mat - Member
Hmm - my Fenix TK11 lasts ages even in full 285 lumens and was under £50. It's not some cheaply made job - the quality is amazing. Makes the Joystick look rather pricey.With the new Luminous 601 I have, I genuinely don't need a helmet light. Brought the torch (and lockblock) just in case last night (16 miles, 95% very very off road!) and simply didn't need it.
Race on the bar.
Joystick on the lid !
QUALITY !
Bought a MaXx D around three weeks ago and very impreseed with it. My only complaint is that the gap from full power to medium power is too much, I'd like the medium setting to be a higher output even if it meant less running time. The reported 1200 lumens is very bright though.
Just sold a joystick which was excellent and awaiting a diablo which I'll use on its own for local rides.
enduro on the bar and joystick on the helmet.
brilliant lights and never let me down
Threads are always better with Pics
[url= http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4128/5073041384_15e887c1da_z.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4083/5073044352_c27c1a61b3_z.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4152/5073046896_a442619562_z.jp g" target="_blank">
[b]2011 Maxx D and Diablo on full[/b][u]
url= http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4090/5073054302_ba55bb399d_z.jp g" target="_blank">
Still no idea why "cableless" is favoured by some
most warranty issues in my group of mates are cable related
Still no idea why "cableless" is favoured by somemost warranty issues in my group of mates are cable related
Swings and round-abouts. My Maxx-D had to go back to Exposure a few times due to the run-times degrading scarily quickly when it was getting daily 2+ hours of use over the winter.
And I wasn't impressed with their service either - 2 and 3 week+ turnarounds (and only then with daily chasing). Got the impression I was being fobbed off too. The last version I got back was okay and held a charge but decided that if I'm going to have £300+ invested in lights I'd rather have the option of an easily swappable battery.
That said - the design is neat enough, easily enough to charge etc and they're well made enough. I just didn't feel that the service was there to back it up and with no option but to commute by bike, being without lights in the winter for any length of time is a serious hassle. Far easier to buy a light with more lumens for the ££ and the option of extra batteries being easily available.
most warranty issues in my group of mates are cable related
At LAST someone gives a potentially valid reason for cableless having advantages rather than just whining about them "just being better."
Sounds like woffle hasn't had much luck with them and has some good reasoning too.
I've had 2 Enduros for the last few years and they work great. Exposure are ace to deal with and fix stuff under warranty right away (both stopped charging and had PCBs replaced).
My bro has a couple of Maxx Ds and I don't know how many Joysticks.
I know others disagree but I still think the mounting system sucks because the lights are too heavy - as everything is contained in the "head". I had a thread on here that got good advice on fitting them but if you need to employ rubber bands or insulating tape when you've paid £300 for a light then something's wrong.
If I was buying lights now it would be DX for both Bike mounted and Head Torch. I'm using a DX headtorch now and it matches my brother's joystick at 1/8th of the price.
I would like to second the service aspect, they have been first class.
If you have an issue you can ring and speak to a real person, issues were sorted straight away
I know others disagree but I still think the mounting system sucks because the lights are too heavy - as everything is contained in the "head". I had a thread on here that got good advice on fitting them but if you need to employ rubber bands or insulating tape when you've paid £300 for a light then something's wrong.
+1 - it's a niggle that I'd agree with. Whilst the QR release is initially impressive in it's simplicity either the mounting plate on the light or the mount itself always seems to get worn (or at least it has on both my Maxx-D's). This inevitably leads to irritating rattles - admittedly solvable with the judicious use of an elastic band. I think the heavier the light the worse this issue is.
I had a replacement free from Exposure but this too developed a rattle after a few months.
If you have an issue you can ring and speak to a real person, issues were sorted straight away
Not my experience at all - two weeks + of daily phone calls and emails was the better / faster of the repairs my lights underwent. They were plenty helpful just couldn't stick to what they said they were going to do. Just got the impression that they were doing their best they couldn't deal with the volume...
Enduro Maxx on the bars here and recently swapped to a Joystick Mk 5 for the helmet.
Advantages of cable free - no top tube 'rubbing', able to remove them in less than 1 second and pocket it off the commuter when I park it up, 5 brackets on 3 bikes (2 mtb, 1 crosser, 1 commuter and wifey's commuter).
(Same bracket for both lights).
Our group has been running Exposure from the start, about 30 lights in the group I guess now. Yes we've had PCB problems (2), 'old' style bracket button problems (it use to pull off, they've modded the design) an LED failure and a battery failure but all as said all have been dealt with super quick with fantastic service.
One of our group dropped his from a height and broke it. Repaired and returned promptly at minimal cost.
Well, I seem to have let the lighting arms race pass me by...
AyUps on bars and lid for me. Simple (crude even), robust, never run out of juice (yet)
Whilst the QR release is initially impressive in it's simplicity either the mounting plate on the light or the mount itself always seems to get worn (or at least it has on both my Maxx-D's). This inevitably leads to irritating rattles -
i've got a enduro light that's 3+ years old. twice on and off the commuter most days and used on night rides once a week, most weeks. no problems at all with the mounting.
Advantages of cable free - no top tube 'rubbing'
Just saw an Exposure ad extolling the virtues of their 'CFD' - cable free design.
At the bottom it shows the remote switch it comes with......priceless.
At the bottom it shows the remote switch it comes with...
Yeah, that's another thing exposure do, which is quite a neat feature. Haven't seen any other light manufacturers do that.
And then they've got the piggy back cells, plus their entire range, so its really easy to get exactly what you want.
get me home function?
whats that about?
When exposure lights run out of battery they switch to the lowest mode. You get so many hours of that mode and the the light just fades to nothing. But you can still turn it up to high.
So you get caught out for a bit longer, instead of the light just dying and having to ride back in the dark, you ride back on low mode, which is fine for road or fire road or even trails taken slowly, and if you do have to do anything where you need the extra light, you can turn it back up for a minute or two.
My torch is all in one though (of course!) , more powerful than a joystick, arguably better made and cost almost half the price of the Exposure version. I don't actually need a helmet mounted light as the 601 is so bright but if I do, the Lockblock secures it very well and cost £6.I'm just not "getting" their pricey offerings.
I was having a chat with my mates about this today, and we decided it's a bit like people are with cars.
The various torches strapped to helmets are like Skodas. Everyone who has one always goes on about how its really a VW and just as good/powerful but cheaper.
The shed built lights are like Caterhams, super powerful, but a bit raw. Their owners will go on about how you don't need the frills of the big brands.
Lights like Exposures are the equivalent of a BMW. No comprimises, they are the best. I guess not everyone apreciates this, but at least theres a choice for everyone.
I have an Exposure....and a Hope....and a BMW....and an Orange 5
I think I am doomed 😆
....but, I wouldn't run the Joystick without the Hope on the bars 'cos I fall off. The BMW is a company car and we own a Ford. I ride my RL 853 more than the 5.
I might be saved ?? 😛
Ooer! the luminous fishy bastids won't appreciate those analogies.
I own a Maxx D, Enduro and a Race along with 3 Joysticks and can't fault any of them. Was out on a night ride with a mate who's just bought a SixPack and it's ****ing bright, a hell of a lot brighter than my Maxx D. When I get the chance the Maxx D will be going to be replaced by a SixPack.
3 joysticks? You'd look like this on the trail..
[img] 
[/img]
The various torches strapped to helmets are like Skodas. Everyone who has one always goes on about how its really a VW and just as good/powerful but cheaper.The shed built lights are like Caterhams, super powerful, but a bit raw. Their owners will go on about how you don't need the frills of the big brands.
Lights like Exposures are the equivalent of a BMW. No comprimises, they are the best. I guess not everyone apreciates this, but at least theres a choice for everyone.
Possibly the most sense anyone has made on STW - well put !
[i]The shed built lights are like Caterhams, super powerful, but a bit raw. Their owners will go on about how you don't need the frills of the big brands[/i]
My lights are not shed built.
😀
I don't have a shed. I assemble lights from the components I've designed, but which have been produced by global companies using up to date, computer controlled, machinery and equipment. Companies who supply markets and different industries all over the world, and they supply to me too.
For example, the company that supplies my housings also supplies the Aerospace industry, the Motorsport industry, the Auto industry, the petro-Chem industry.
They produce the highest quality work, employing some of the best people in the business, and amongst other disciplines, specialize in the machining of specialist materials, super alloys, etc.
As far as supplier credentials go, you can't realy get much better.
Assembly takes place in an electrical workshop, leased commercial premises.
I use High spec components and materials which in some cases probably exceed any other light around, including exposure, Lupine, Hope.
I am a bit bemused, on occassion, by those who pass comment on my lights, but who haven't actually had one in their hands, or better still, used one.
Of course, comments of that nature are just conjecture.
😉
[i]you don't need the frills of the big brands[/i]
Yeah, perhaps you don't. You pays your money, and you makes your choice.
I've always said that.
If someone wants to pay £100 more for a lupine Wilma 5, than they would for a Model 401, then thats their choice and they're welcome to it.
🙂
[i]Lights like Exposures[/i]
Not sure what that means, Exposure are the only ones making those type of lights, aren't they ?, ie, internal batteries.
So therefore.
[i]but at least theres a choice for everyone[/i]
wouldn't seem to be the case, unless you're including lights with external battery packs.
Currently, if you want an internal battery light, powerful enough for off road cycling, you can only go to Exposure.
It won't surprize anyone here that I've been watching this thread, and its clear that there is a variation in what people want and appreciate about certain light designs.
I am indifferent with regard to whether the battery is internally or externally located, as either solution could be considered to have its own [i]advantages[/i].
Leaving us to exercise our preferrances, based either on our own, or the experiences of others.
Cheers
😀
4 year old joystick and newish maxxd.
never had a serious problem. great lights well built. i wasd sent one faulty battery with my joystick and USE exchanged no questions asked so ime fab customer service
only -ve is that spare helmet mounts and bar mounts are fairly expensive.
would highly reccommend otherwise!
I had one of the original Enduros which finally gave up this year (would only hold 50% charge). Me being me, I only checked it a few days before 24/12 but an email and a couple of calls later I picked up a new Toro at the event all charged and ready to go plus got a decent 'trade in' for the old light.
I also had a Hope 2 for a while but that had a couple of issues that were cable/connector related and, whilst Hope's customer service was brilliant, I decided I couldn't be bothered with returning it if it went again and sold it on.
Well put Lum!
And he is right, the quality of the lights he makes is second to none. About as "shed made" as a Eurofighter.
never trust a man without a shed...
Luminous, interesting that you took my comments (which weren't aimed at you BTW) personally. Sorry if they upset you. I'd be pleased to be compared with something that's more interesting and in many ways better than it's competetion.
And I'm surprised at you Surf Mat for agreeing.
After your comments on car threads I thought you'd understand what I meant, you know, how BMWs are the best thing ever. Especially when you get annoyed with people giving opinions about cars they don't own.
You've got Exposure lights to compare your torch with haven't you?
Oh hang on, this is STW, where unfounded opinion is FACT
😉
O.
No offence taken.
🙂
Hence me posting smilies, etc.
[i]Oh hang on, this is STW, where unfounded opinion is FACT[/i]
Yeap !, just as I wrote:
[i]Leaving us to exercise our preferrances, based either on our own, or the experiences of others.[/i]
Ta
😀
O - what rattled your cage?
Yes I have seen and had a good look at Exposure lights - no I don't own one. Yes the 601 is more powerful than any Exposure apart from the six pack which it at least matches for output without being the size of a baked bean can. Yes some BMWs are good. Yes so are some Caterhams. I thought your analogies had some merits actually.
You seem to have taken offense and mine and Lum's post - I cannot see why?
Time of the month or something.
Just forget about it.
Strange - oh and some BMWs are crap 😉
i've got a enduro light that's 3+ years old. twice on and off the commuter most days and used on night rides once a week, most weeks. no problems at all with the mounting.
Likewise my Enduro Maxx is fine, I suspect it's more prevalent with the bigger and heavier Maxx-D given both mine suffered the same problem...
Several Joysticks, alll flawless, though I did manage to lose one on a snowy night ride in the Nidd Valley, doh, and currently a Diablo I with a Piggyback as a helmet light on steroids. Ansolutely superb, great light and beam pattern and never misses a beat. Also run a couple of Red Eyes - the Smart Port stuff is ace for that, though it does mean you can't run a Piggyback simultaneously.
Downsides? The charge times on the larger batteries are long(is), I've seen 12 hours or something quoted for a Six Pack and the Piggyback Triple seems to take for ages. Apparently better for the battery, but slow and hopeless if you're disorganised and forget to put them on charge. And on a really long ride, you can't change the batteries as you can with a remote battery light.
On balance though, mine have been superb. I like the Diablo as it's light enough for your head, but also makes a neat, easily portable bar light for the road etc.
I have recently got one of the new joystick mk5's, its a really great
light pretty much perfect beam for helmet mounting! I also have a "Shed"
made Troute Mini which is superb and the pair were perfect for Relentless at the weekend.
The joystick is way better than the Dx torches and Fenix tk11r2 and ld20 that i also own.
Just picked up this, can't wait to try it out.
[url= http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4045/5080258933_3cae633f1a_b.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfergson/5080258933/ ]Six Pack[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/jamesfergson/ ]james_ferguson[/url], on Flickr
toons - jealous - me want one 😥
do I sell my enduro race maxx2 and joystick and upgrade??????
Toons.
Nice.
How big is it really ?, I can't find dimensions for them, could you run a ruler over it please.
Also, how much and where from.
😉
M2K
115mm length
55mm width
60mm height
It looks just a bit smaller than a can of beans.
My mate sells them in his shop, so got a nice discount 😉
Or you could have the same output using the same XPG LEDs with a light unit about the same size as a Hope 1 for £150 less 😉
It's light wars I tell ya!
I'm leaning towards a Toro Mk2 myself. Can't see myself with a bean can on the bars. Most of the trails I ride in the dark I know really well so I don't need a super-powerful light.
surf-mat
but then you have wires and a battery pack to deal with, combine the size of your batter pack and wires and head unit, and is it smaller than the bean can?!?!?!? i doubt it!
same size if not bigger, only difference bean (hehe) its all in one, which suits a lot of people, me included! i wouldnt need a six pack, i have a maxx daddy 960lumen, and its plenty and then some, and i even have a dx torch of 900 (its not, probably half of that) rated lumens on the helmet, but i dont really need it the 960 is plenty everywhere i ride (peaks etc)
not sure id need 1800 lumens to be honest, though if i was buying again after using my maxx daddy for a year non stop, id buy the latest one with 1200 no questions asked, it would be my first choice, its a perfect size, hardly any weight and its cable free! my mates first night ride with wired connection, and guess what, it broke, wires here there and everywhere are not for me, and not for alot of other people too!
601/Troutie battery pack fitting - secure velcro fixing under the bars or stem. Can vary how you fit it to suit your bars.
601/Troutie light unit fitting - top quality mount with quick release. Solid as a rock, fully adjustable and carrying a unit weighing only 130ish grams and about the size of an RC car motor.
Sixpack fitting - small mount on the bars under massive pressure from the near 500g weight of the unit.
601/Troutie charge time - 3 hours for 2.8mAh, 5-6 for 5.2mAh. Run times are 2hrs max and 3-4 hrs on max.
Six Pack charge time - a month
601/Troutie customer service - call/email, they sort everything out the next day
Six Pack -fairly quick but some have been left in the lurch for 2 weeks
601/Troutie battery issues/wears out - buy a new one from smudge.
Six Pack - ermmm, send it back.
601 remote switch connection - yes
Six Pack - not that I can see.
601/Troutie heat dissipation - covered in heat dissipating fins
Six Pack - where does the heat go?
601/Troutie price - £300ish
Six Pack - £500ish.