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Oooh look! A flounce!
This is excellent - perfect revision material
For a masterclass discussion on this sort of thing, HBR has a good offering
http://hbr.org/2010/12/reputation-warfare/ar/1
I've met Alan a couple of times, pleasant enough, I think with him you get what you pay for.
Oh and Fuengorola can be a hoot if you don't (as I did first time down there) die of embarrasment at all the fat Brits on tour.
As my mate from Essex put it - "Theyre awl farkin' Norvern!"
The ride down from the Radio tower above Mijas is tremendous. You dont need uplift.
Yunki - I think you're comments are very unfair to the OP.
He paid money for an holiday that did not meet his expectations or the description of what would be offered. He has every right to warn others of his experience and did so in a balanced and considered manner.
If he'd bought a bike, frame or component and it had not lived up to it's claims, I very much doubt you'd take issue with him letting forum users know. This is no different apart from the fact that S.C. is run by an individual who frequents the forum. Yes, it's more personal but the OP has every right to tell others.
The OP also stated several times that he had raised issues with SC whilst in Spain. Given Alan's somewhat lacklustre response on here, do you really think the OP would have got a different result by complaining to S.C. again once home when you consider that his complaints whilst in Spain seem to have gone unheard?
He has every right to warn others of his experience
I don't agree..
that's my only point
The OP also stated several times that he had raised issues with SC whilst in Spain
that's not what I read here
I've read through the entire thread and commented on it from my point of view..
I'm not about to get drawn into commenting on this point and that point.. I'm not some sort of media pundit FFS
for you to think that I may have missed something valuable is disrespectful
So enough already..
JonR - 'never argue with an idiot' is the clause I'm bringing into play hereCFH - if a frame was unfit for purpose I would contact the manufacturer..
If ALL their frames were always unfit for purpose I would consider damning them..was the holiday fit for purpose..?
who knows..?Alan and Mr MC I guess
ciao..
[img] http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS40xT-WjD2IFM3P787J1XDAn1--x9FZJssBRz5m191_PrkWoM3mg [/img]
that's my only point
It's a very poor point.
reaches into the STW hole
Is that waht they call it nowadays?
It's a very poor point.
in your extraordinary opinion.. but well enough made for the purposes of this thread..
I look forward to offending your sensibilities with other points that differ from your personal perspective in the future..
but now I must go and wash some dishes..
I agree with Yunki
OP: I understand you intended to write a review, however I feel it reads like a complaint. If I have a complaint with something I contact the company directly as soon as possible. I think that it is not the same as if you were to post a positive review and I feel it is unbalanced without a prior right to reply from SC.
llama - exactly.. thankyou
I think it's time this was made a poll
Did Mr Munge do the right thing in posting his review of SC?
1. Yes
2. No
3. I'll ask someone else
4. I didn't realise Santa Cruz were that bad
5. Does anyone know a good dive guide?
If I have a complaint with something I contact the company directly as soon as possible.
Flippin' americanisation of british culture that is....
Anyway without this thread we'd never have got Kiwidave's excellent post 8)
I'll ask someone else I think..
Did they have a bad holiday?
A few points...
1. If the OP's complaints were about the service he had experienced in a bike shop then I'm sure there would be less criticism of him for "whingeing" about it. There seems to be a taboo about saying bad things about MTB holiday companies on public forums, perhaps because people feel churlish if they do so - even if they have had a crap holiday - becuase they have spent time in the host's home, want to be friends with them or perhaps because they fear being shouted down by loyal customers.
2. I've only been on a couple of organised bike holidays, and both have been really enjoyable in spite of a few minor irritations. It sounds like the OP had many more irritations and felt prompted to share them - which I am grateful for.
3. STW is hardly a "baying mob". If anything the default response on here is to tell anybody with a complaint to MTFU and to take the opposite side. Which suggests there is merit to the OP's complaints.
4. Yes the compamny involved is more than one person's livelihood, but a better initial response could have shut this thread down. Instead it was petrol on the flames really.
5. I really don't like the word "legend" in it's current geezer-ish usage, but Kiwidave IS a legend.
Kiwidave IS a legend
+1 for [i]that[/i]
I feel it reads like a complaint
It [b]was[/b] a complaint wasn't it? It was on a forum the SC guy uses himself so he had a right to reply which he used. We can read the complaint and his response and the testimonials added by satified customers and the comments of a previous SC guide and make our own minds up? That's the power of the web isn't it?
Did they have a bad holiday?
yes, yes he did:(
for you to think that I may have missed something valuable is disrespectful
...and for you to assume you haven't is arrogant.
One thing I have learned from all this is [u]not[/u] to go on a guided dive holiday.
fair enough
Where do I book?
Before you do, read this thread: http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/a-shambolic-week-with-sierra-cycling/
Do not open that link, it will generate a worm hole of despair and vitriol into which we will all descend faster than the speed of light. 😯
Hmmmm... if Alan is thinking of ducking out and selling the business then maybe I will step up to the mark and give it a bash!
Jeff...
---Adding fuel to fires and stirring the pot since Noah got his first Hammer---
Oh no...I agree with yunki.
pistonbroke, is that like if you google "google", you break the internet?
A small point of information. Is KiwiDave the same bloke as the 'Dave' in the OP? The reason I ask is that KD seems to have last worked for SC in 2010.
Two different Daves - KiwiDave references t'other Dave in his post.
Do try to keep up 😉
I think the bit where kiwidave says 'I don't know Dave...' gives it away... I might be wrong though...
In case some of you were wondering what some of the people involved in all of this look like, here's kiwidave:
[url= http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2193/3543242303_a4ca05291c_z.jp g" target="_blank">
And here's Jonny:
[url= http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3353/3552594172_577f0a2cd6_z.jp g" target="_blank">
🙂
[Edit]Err, not that either of these guys were guiding during the holiday that triggered this whole thread!
can i just point out that the OP could have bypassed all of this hassle by manning up in the first place and going to the alps instead of spain.
Trailmonkey we have done the Alps 8 out of the last 10 years we were manned up enough 😉
Where is kiwidave from? anybody know
Stoke
daznal - Member
Where is kiwidave from? anybody know
Swindon.
An interesting conundrum now. The thread continues, and seems to be continuing, and it's hardly the best advert. SC can hardly ask for it to be pulled, can they? So, will it just keep running?
I'm more interested in which planet Yunki is from...
An interesting conundrum now. The thread continues, and seems to be continuing, and it's hardly the best advert. SC can hardly ask for it to be pulled, can they? So, will it just keep running?
Odds on final number of pages?
yunki - MemberHe has every right to warn others of his experience
I don't agree..
that's my only point
That's a joke. Is it? Are you serious?
Anyway for balance:
[url= http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/sierra-cycling-spain-any-experience ]These people have no right to warn others of their experience, or is it OK when what they are saying is positive?[/url]
TBH it's not that bad for sc, a good few have said they don't give a damn about the OP's complaints. It's actually an amazing thread. Despite me thinking it was bad news for SC it seems not so bad..
errp.. Al agreeing with me.. 🙁
I must go and scrub til dawn in a scalding hot shower..
I'm glad that it's not panning out too badly though.. considering that SC seems to have a fairly good reputation prior to this, it would seem a shame to me that anyone would want to see a small family business get dragged down due simply to what seems like staffing difficulties and mechanical problems..
I'm sure that we all encounter difficult weeks occasionally..
That seems to be fairly standard fare on here whenever it comes to folk complaining about the poor service they got from small bike shops. I'm still not seeing why Sierra Cycling are a "special case".yunki - Member
it would seem a shame to me that anyone would want to see a small family business get dragged down due simply to what seems like staffing difficulties and mechanical problems..
Me earlier...
[img] 
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Generally if I see a post as long as ‘kiwidave’s’ - I’ll give it a quick glance over and not much more, unless the thread is of particular interest to me.
I’m glad a read it. He clearly expended a fair amount of time and energy in constructing what comes across as an unbiased and critically thought out exposé of life as a MTB guide.
If there was ever a contribution to encourage a forum inspired piece in the magazine - this is it.
Best post in years.
Any pics of mary? Need to put a face to dave's flattering description