No, but they get time back in lieu when they work late (sorry I didn’t make that bit clear).

Then they are taking the pee’.

I used to work at a place where official hours were 9.00-5.30 but I’d come in at 7.45ish partly to avoid being squashed by London traffic on my bike but also I got to work flat out without disruption. I’d leave at 5.40ish. Almost everyone else came in at 9, ‘tube problems’ (9.15-25 was more the norm TBH) was regular and they’d stay till 6.30 before hitting the bars. I know for a fact that post-5.30 they’d just be there chatting mainly. However the boss used to rock in at 9.30 and leave at 6 and to her it looked like I was out of the door-type and they were committed.

Mental as I was the one doing BETTER than everyone else at the job yet that was overlooked as I wasn’t a culture fit.

It’s amazing sometimes how ‘Job And Knock’ can improve productivity – eg snow is expected, or there’s a big footie match on, and everyone is told they can go home when the work is all done

I often wonder if every day should be run on that basis 8)

There are also little things that can help too, like when we shifted *everything* forward an hour to 7.45-1600 for all but a few who couldn’t do it – overnight it halved commuting time for most of us, and gave everyone much better family time in the evenings etc.

My current company has an interesting way of dealing with this. The accepted office hours are 8:30am to 5:30pm but contractually we are on 8am to 6pm. What this means in practise is that everyone gets used to working 8:30am to 5:30pm and when asked to stay late they play the “I’m not paid for this and am going home card”, the smug look on managements face when they can respond “yes you are, and technically you owe us 20 hours this month” is something to behold.

if you work for free youre a muppp. sorry to say but thats my opinion. its your life not theirs.

the hardest thing is managing the expectation of your manager. If they are people who work for free they probably expect you to. If you’re over 30 you have a job not a career… cant recall who said that but in hindsight its pretty much right.

Flexibility is a two way street.

I work my hours because I’m paid crap, there is no reason to work more. I do my job well. When I was in science there wasn’t working hours per se but you had to do the work. However, I like working in the lab and did ‘t have an issue doing long hours to get the work done. If you don’t do the work you don’t get published and you don’t get better jobs. you have benifits though as it is a lot more flexable than an office job.

I won’t work for free

Flexibility is a two way street

This. And if it isn’t on either side, both sides could/should remove the privelege.

Most of the year I work roughly 40 hours a week. There are always a few weeks in the year however when the workload means I need to work 60-70 hours a week to get everything done on time. I do not mind this as I am rewarded with bonuses and can finish early when needed. I would not work for a company where unpaid overtime was expected every week.

The place I work at now is a breath of fresh air to be honest compared to other places. There is a lot of work to do, but I never feel pressured to stay late and get it done.
Generally if things need finishing off, then I will stay and get stuff done – I generally get in early as well to beat the traffic so easily do more than my contracted hours.
It’s very much give & take – there’s no issues with time off for medical appointments or nipping off a bit early on certain days and making the time up in the rest of the week.

The last place I worked was very strict in terms of working hours and any time off required lots of questions and justification.
I frequently used to work late, but if I came in 10 mins late there would be questions.
There was a real split as well between the engineers and other departments. The MD had a soft spot for the chemistry side of the business, as well as marketing. They would regularly waft in late & there were never any questions asked. Most of them lived very local and I found it very frustrating that they got away with it, given that I had an 80min commute.
I asked if it was possible to change my hours and leave at 4pm to get home at a reasonable time but was told no, you had to do 9-5. Nightmare place to work, to be honest.

The time before that, it was expected to be in work early & if you were leaving around 5pm nothing was ever said explicitly but there were always snide comments from the management about ‘part-timers’. My boss also had a habit of asking late on a Friday afternoon if it was possible for me to come on at the weekend and help production, applying some real pressure and not really understanding that I might have other plans and that leaving it so late to ask might not be the best idea. I did help out when I could, but knocked it on the head after the boss called me from the 9th tee and wanted a progress update. We were always told that any weekend working would be paid back with time in lieu but we never received it.

I frequently used to work late, but if I came in 10 mins late there would be questions.

A long time ago I was docked an hour’s pay because I arrived late for work by about 10 minutes (due to an accident on the way to work blocking the road).

So I basically worked to rule after that – I recall one lunchtime when my boss came up and asked me to do something so I just told him I would start it at 1.30pm when my lunch hour finished. If I got to work early I would just sit at the desk doing nothing until the stroke of 9am and I was out of the door bang on 5.30 every night.

I didn’t last long 🙂

It will still be there tomorrow and I value my mental health.

I think it’s worth restating this.

I’ve been there. Worked in a place that was an hour’s commute on a good day and normally considerably longer. Contracted hours were 8:30 till 5 but due to the volume of work and insanity of the roads at that time I was routinely there until 6 or 7pm. Coming in the next morning, I’d get in at 8:35 due to traffic and get a kicking for being five minutes late. The only way I could guarantee to be in for 8:30 – and even then there might be exceptions, it once took me over 3 hours due to a big smash on the M6 – is to aim to get in for 7:30. Effectively working an 11-hour day.

Whilst at work I was doing the job of, well, basically “IT department” as I was the only one left. I was slammed constantly from the moment I walked through the door, and if I had 20 jobs to do that day and managed 19 I’d get a massive bollocking for the one I hadn’t done.

It ended up making me ill. I wasn’t sleeping, getting regular migraines, and driving home on Friday night thinking “Christ, only two days and I’ve got to go back again.” I didn’t even get peace at weekends; staff would think nothing of ringing me at home on a Sunday morning because their home computer wasn’t working.

Ultimately, for all my efforts, I was fired over a bunch of trumped-up ‘charges’ that management had made up because they wanted to replace me with someone who’d do what I was doing only for considerably less money. He’d spent weeks compiling a dossier of broadly fictitious ‘misdemeanours;’ it was a witch hunt, and when I had answers for 99% of them they offered me a few grand to just go away quietly. In hindsight I probably should have sued them but at the time I was just eternally grateful to be out of there.

It was at least six months before I worked again, maybe longer. My head was up my arse, I was in bits.

After that I vowed, never again. I now carry a work mobile which I can switch off when I’m not in work, I work sensible hours, I force myself to actually take a proper lunch break rather than grabbing a sandwich and eating at my desk whilst carrying on working, I’ll work back if needed now but it’s on my terms rather than because it’s expected.

Life’s too short to be miserable at work, and it’s certainly too short to be ill because of it. Quoth the raven.

I’ve not had an hourly paid job since I was a teenager so perhaps not directly relevant to the original question. But FWIW I have generally worked 10-12 hours a day out of choice plus 1.25 hours each way commute. It simple terms that’s the norm and “what it takes”. Has this made me sick, no. Would I have had a better quality of life if I had a less intense job, yes. I made a choice though so it’s my responsibility.

Life’s too short to be miserable at work, and it’s certainly too short to be ill because of it.

totally agree. I’m on my second round of anti-biotics in the last few weeks. Partly because I’m soo run down with work. I’ve already stopped checking work emails outside of office hours- as there is always something thats pings up then you spend the WHOLE weekend thinking about it (not what you’ve done wrong, just another thing that hasn’t gone right and needs a refocus etc on Monday am). So the outside work/phone has STOPPED.

Work now starts when I get in and leaves sharp when I leave. Long after a montly payment has gone your health needs to still be there and there will always be work in the future…IF your health is there.

I’ve already stopped mrsH from continually checking her work emails 24/7 as she’d get angry about what some idiot in China had done.

In our place come 5:15 the daily stay laters seem to just chat so I see no valid reason for them staying late. Mind you they are generally they same people who spend the day chatting.

If I need to stay to work on something I stay, but generally take the time back. Worked on a project recently and I was working 7am to 9pm. If I’m not on something like that I’m out the door for 5pm.

I’ll echo what Cougar wrote about the expectation to be a at work and the focus on the negatives from management.

I ran a R&D facility for a plastics manufacturer for about 5 years. It was a building full of machinery that was used by various project managers for process and material trials, producing samples, commissioning new tolling, etc. There was no give and take, stupid hours, never any overtime payments even though I was hourly paid. I made myself ill.

When they sold the business the new owners closed the R&D department and I went back to production. That was shift work so there was never any need to do overtime, only extra shifts when someone was on holiday.

My current job is again production 24/7, so the same situation. But when I started it was a new factory build and start up. So there were long hours, emails and phone calls outside of the contracted hours. But it only lasted 9 months until things settled down. I then turned off notifications so I’ll deal with it when I’m next on shift, there’s always someone else to take over. But I see the middle management guys and girls “working” when they should have finished for the day. I get paid overtime hours, but I’ve got an arrangement with my boss to take the time off when I’ve accrued enough hours to take a whole shift.

All of the guys on shift are expected to work a little flexiblly, be in 10 minutes early to hand over between shifts, but on the back of that if there’s little information to handover, other than “make more of those and those”, then they’ll be out of the door early. Especially on the last shift, 2 days / 2 nights, because everyone on my shift team rides, so they’ll be in the Forrest of Dean by 7am for a blast before bed!

It depends on if you are doing it because you have a stake in the outcome (either personal or financial) or you’re doing it because you’re being manipulated somehow.

work for free?

current place does overtime – fine with this

previous place tended to reward late stayers (providing you were visibly fixing something visible) with better bonuses – fine with that

in both these jobs I’d happily do extra hours if projects needed it

several previous places did neither bonus scheme nor overtime = on the clock and no extra hours

so glad i’m self employed and not working extra hours and really resenting it like some of the posts above, thats a mugs game. obviously paperwork/research/meetings/test shoots are all unpaid but the paid jobs more than make up for that and if i dont want to do anything on a particular day no manager is going to grizzle.
i do work for free though but it’s on my terms and i’ll only do it if i feel it benefits me (or others like the odd charity job)
anyone who comes to me telling me “it will be good exposure for you” is usually ignored as they just want exclusive high quality imagery for nothing.
just about everything i have done for free has usually led to other things that have paid off handsomely.
have a freebie on sunday as B-camera shooting part 2 of a horror movie trailer. not sure how thats going to benefit me but it’s good fun and better than building twig bridges and crossing streams on a ‘motivational team building weekend’ with people you hate.

i do work for free though but it’s on my terms

I think that’s the crux of it, isn’t it.

I’m happy to do a bit extra out of hours as a favour to someone who asks nicely, because I’m choosing to do so. If it’s a five minute job, like dialling in to a server to check that an upgrade has been successful or something, I’ll probably not bother claiming it back as it’ll take longer to write down than it took to do the job. Instead I’ll just take a POETS day on Friday, or quite often not even that as it’ll come out in the wash if I need to nip out to the shop later or some such.

It’s when it’s expected that I’m going to work for free that we have a problem. I work for one reason and that’s to get paid, if you’re not paying me then why am I working? That’s the behaviour of a mentalist and I’m not doing it.

AS it is me at the top, and my only boss is located 200km at another site, if it isn’t done by me, it doesn’t get done.

That is a considerable number of people effected, although I do get paid for the long hours just not an hourly rate, I would hate to calculate the actual rate though

i do work for free though but it’s on my terms

I think that’s the crux of it, isn’t it.

I’m happy to do a bit extra out of hours as a favour to someone who asks nicely, because I’m choosing to do so. If it’s a five minute job, like dialling in to a server to check that an upgrade has been successful or something, I’ll probably not bother claiming it back as it’ll take longer to write down than it took to do the job. Instead I’ll just take a POETS day on Friday, or quite often not even that as it’ll come out in the wash if I need to nip out to the shop later or some such.

It’s when it’s expected that I’m going to work for free that we have a problem. I work for one reason and that’s to get paid, if you’re not paying me then why am I working? That’s the behaviour of a mentalist and I’m not doing it.

This. I have objected quite vocally to people planning in work that required extended working when there was no good reason. Occasionally things go wrong and in those cases I’ll stay and help. More often than not the reason people here work long hours is because they’ve planned 6 months of work into 5.

AS it is me at the top, and my only boss is located 200km at another site, if it isn’t done by me, it doesn’t get done.

That is a considerable number of people effected, although I do get paid for the long hours just not an hourly rate, I would hate to calculate the actual rate though

You need to work on your understaffing policy.

I once worked freelance at a mahoosive American company. Most of the staff were freelance. We were all out of there bang on 5. As we were bang payed by the hour, this suited the company just fine. The management (the only full time salaried staff) would all stop late for hours every evening. They did **** all in that extra time (they mainly did **** all during the day, to be honest). But over the years a culture had developed where it was seen as bad form to leave on time, so they all just hung around pretending to be busy.

Absolutely bonkers!

Work free, are you mental? I work when required and keep the place ticking over, but otherwise, in at 9.30 out the door at 5.

if I was in charge, i’d implement a job and finish policy.

My current place is really reasonable, there’s the right amount of give and take, if either party took the piss there’d be trouble but it all works very well because none of us are failures as human beings. This attitude would not work in the bank.

Agreed, although not sure what bank you worked at but at mine its a case of ‘as long as you get the work done we don’t care when you start or leave’. Noone abuses the flexibility from either side.

lots of posting during the day on work time in this thread, so i guess you better stay late and make up your time 🙄

It depends. If it some minutes late then it is ok. Not hours, though. And I like taking my breaks, I think it is benefixial to take some time for yourself. I think I am more productive than I would be if I stayed in the office sitting in front of my computer

josephineperry – Member
It depends. If it some minutes late then it is ok. Not hours, though. And I like taking my breaks, I think it is benefixial to take some time for yourself. I think I am more productive than I would be if I stayed in the office sitting in front of my computer

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MrSmith I wondered when….. 😆