Observation on price of a new Orange.......

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Observation on price of a new Orange.......

97 posts & 40 voices | Started 1 year ago by MikeT-23 | Latest reply from hora

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MikeT-23 - Member

As stated, this is just an observation worthy of, in my opinion, a 'WTF?' moment.
From previous threads, I am aware of reasons why this might be the case, but still.....I wanted to express my surprise.

Had been into the LBS to drop off a case of beer the week before xmas, and noticed that the 2011 P7 was in an initially fetching green colour. As I'd bought a 2010 frame in matt black, I made comment on the new colour and joked that I had two options: Halfords for some spray paint; or buying a new P7.
We all laughed.

Today I check the Orange website to determine said shade of green ('Kermit Green', FWIW), and notice the price of a new P7 - £1900?? Was it not something like £1400 last year? £1500 tops?

Dearie me. I'd best treat the current one very gently indeed so as to prolong its lifespan.

Hope you all had a great xmas, and have some good times planned for Hogmanay.

Posted 1 year ago #
ton - Member

orange bikes have always been vastly overpriced.
now with the prestige 'made in yorkshire' tags on the box welded stuff, they are just taking the pi55.

Posted 1 year ago #
Ewan - Member

Isn't the p7 made in taiwan tho? Or is that the crush? Either way it was 1100 when I looked at one in 2009. 1900 is a joke, has it a bb made of pure gold?

Posted 1 year ago #
ChunkyMTB - Member

Like that guy on here the other day who posted a pic of his build sheet. Can't believe people pay that money for an Orange.

Posted 1 year ago #
Edric 64 - Member

Even the bottom bracket upgrade to Hope is 60 quid.Is that above the base price of the bike ? because if it is and you are paying extra that makes it about 90 quid

Posted 1 year ago #
Mackem - Member

I wouldnt say Orange bikes have always been overpriced. I'm onto my 3rd P7 but I wouldnt buy another at current prices. For the price of a P7 frame I could something like a Blue pig and forks (or brakes).

Posted 1 year ago #
kaesae - Member

Posted 1 year ago #
Mackem - Member

eh?

Posted 1 year ago #
ChunkyMTB - Member

keep taking the drugs

Posted 1 year ago #
Ewan - Member

Tech specs? Few bits of steel welded together with a jig. Same as in 09.

Posted 1 year ago #
ChunkyMTB - Member

kaesae - Member

I can't really give a comparison without knowing technical spec for both years and also 2009, in relation to how much other companies bikes have increased in price.

There simply isn't enough data based on what you have said and the information you have provided to justify an informed and educated opinion on the matter.

There is however sufficient info to create an arguments, my gues is that you will get 6 posters all in.

Good point though, you have varified and in my opinion proved, beyond a shadow of a doubt that Orange make mountain bikes.

I've re evaluated my view point based on opinionism, 24 posters at most!

Posted 1 year ago #
lobby_dosser - Member

Looking at how much has groupsets and forks have went up since last year, i'm not surprised.

Posted 1 year ago #
spock - Member

Fox Floats - £400
Hope wheels - £250
SLX cranks - £100
Rear XT Front slx mech - £80
SLX Shifters - £60
Elixir 5 brakes - £200
Good Maxxis tyres - £50
Cassette and chain - £40
Finishing kit - £60
Headset £20
Frame - £500

£1760 Costs £1800 off orange

Doesn't seem massively unreasonable, Would cost more building it up yourself i reckon. And if the frame is hand welded in halifax you're gonna be paying a premium, but then it isn't being welded by someone getting payed an unfair wage in bad conditions.

(all prices rough guesses and i know they'd get them much much cheaper, but you wouldnt)

Posted 1 year ago #
thepodge - Member

P7 is Taiwanese

Posted 1 year ago #
goog - Member

overpriced English/Taiwanese tat

Posted 1 year ago #
spock - Member

I thought it had a handmade in halifax badge?

Posted 1 year ago #
Edric 64 - Member

Maybe the badge is

Posted 1 year ago #
PeterPoddy - Member

Frame - £500

And, love it or loathe it, I've just bought a carbon 456 with a headset and seatpost for £101 less than that.

£500 for an off the peg steel frame is crackers, no matter what it says on the downtube.

Posted 1 year ago #
MikeT-23 - Member

Aye well, it'll be Halfords next time after all, but not for paint.....
It'll be the whole bike I'm after!

Didnae wish to be starting any arguments, and thanks to spock for giving a components pricing breakdown - it does put things into perspective.

My next Orange purchase will be limited to a T-shirt, but not in Kermit green.

Posted 1 year ago #
Edric 64 - Member

And the R8 frame is 600 ,only overpriced by about 200 quid

Posted 1 year ago #
thedyslexic1 - Member

Maybe the badge is

+1

the oranges are over priced until you start with the alpine and the 5 ect also oranges keep there value better but dont hold me to that

Posted 1 year ago #
ton - Member

the prices spock quoted are price we pay to buy.
i thing orange will get things just a little bit cheaper.......not much cheaper tho........

Posted 1 year ago #
Bimbler - Member

Do Taiwanese bike workers get paid an unfair wage and work in bad conditions? Certainly the photos of Taiwanese bike factories I've seen recently look fine. Not sure about wages but I had a conversation with someone in the bike industry and he said the image we have of coolies slaving away in tin shack factories is out of date and that a wage of $20000 is not uncommon. Not sure why you can build steel framed bikes in Italy for £500 but the idea of doing the same in the Uk is deemed impossible.

Posted 1 year ago #
Blower - Member

STW dont half plug them in the mag of late....

Posted 1 year ago #
Ewan - Member

That price list is retail isn't it? Presumably orange pay a lot less than that. One of the main reasons you buy a ready made bike is because it's cheaper than the retail price of the bits. The orange isn't even that! They make the finish kit themselves as well, so 60 is way too high. 500 quid for the frame is ridiculous as well.

Rip off pure and simple. However fools are easily parted etc

Posted 1 year ago #
ivantate - Member

Orange are still a tiny company so will struggle to get the component prices down compared to some of their competition, although they will be quite a bit lower than the above prices. The also now have a reasonable overhead to provide service and sales backup to a huge chunk of the world they now sell bikes in.

Probably better than being sold in someone elses equivalent of halfords.

off to look at those p7 specs as the price sounds a bit silly, I have seen a pure7 somewhere which is a cut price version/excuse to bump to price of the normal one.

Posted 1 year ago #
ton - Member

if the frame price is correct, then a blue pig has got to be the bargain of the century (steel frame wise).

Posted 1 year ago #
gee - Member

I don't think £500 is too much for a nice steel frame - my Ala Carte is that much and it's well worth it - beautifully welded, excellent dropouts, nice tube profiles and lovely Japanese steel.

Given the price rises in steel compared to alu in recent years I'm not hugely surprised. Back in the day an Sworks hardtail frame was £699 for years - so £500 isn't too bad for a top end steel bike.

GB

Posted 1 year ago #
juan - Member

Well some people are not ready to pay premium for something made in the UK. Fair enough. However, what would happen when your boss will tell you that due to the lesser amount of people buying the good you produce, you'll be made redundant by the ned of the week?
Don't believe stoner's crap. What goes around comes around. The habit we have and the way we shop/consume is what keeps our jobs going. Yes you are paying a little extra, but then this little extra is what keeps your jobs afloat too.

I have never understood why most people on here would buy something like a santa cruz over an orange. The way I look at it, both are single pivot bike and they probably have a very similar geometry. The only difference is one brand communicate on the "American dream" and the other not. I am not sure if that is very relevant to the bike. Now I may be stupid but I don't buy my bike for pictures of them in the shiny pages in bike mags. I buy them for the ride. And lets face it. A uk made bike is going to ride so much better in the UK than a Californian bike. That is just my 2p.

Posted 1 year ago #
ton - Member

gee, a salsa al la carte is worlds away from the p7.
the p7 is standard gas pipe, like a on one or a blue pig.

Posted 1 year ago #
GEDA - Member

But in taiwan do you get à national health service, pension, environmental regulation, paus holiday.... I know where i would rather live and work. Makes things more expensive to produce though. Though the p7 frame is not uk produced it is à uk company. Stw goes for cheapness at any cost shocker. If you are worried aboutcost buy stuff secondhand.

Posted 1 year ago #
gee - Member

Is it just boggo steel? Didn't realise that. So is it UK welded or not? The Salsa is Taiwanese. Plus I imagine Orange don't sell as many?

Posted 1 year ago #
juan - Member

the p7 is standard gas pipe, like a on one or a blue pig.

No it's not. It's reynolds tubbing. Plus there is way more work on the P7 (mech hanger, bent braking tube, junction of head tubes).

Posted 1 year ago #
juiced - Member

Juan Santa Cruz design beyond the US market.

Posted 1 year ago #
gruffalo - Member

I like orange bikes. I had a five a few years back and I still have a clockwork (newer one) that I use as my winter bike. But I have to agree with the OP. They seem to me to be overpriced when you look at the alternatives.

Posted 1 year ago #