This had me pretty wound up ..

Bit of a story, but here goes ..
I ordered a set of carbon wheels off ebay the other week. When they arrived I realised the hub would not fit my new 11speed cassette.
Only option was to buy an 11speed hub and swap them over.

Decided to get a local shop in Risca to build it. Last Saturday I took in the rim, hub, spokes and nipples .. and fella said he would build it for £25 .. sweet!
He phones me Monday, and says the non driveside spokes are couple mill too short. He said he will have to order me longer spokes. This will cost me £2 each for the 12 new ones.
I asked him what spokes .. cos I have never paid more than £1 for a spoke … DTswiss spokes he says.
Fair enough I think. Twice as expensive as I can get them online .. but LBS prices eh!!
Wednesday I ring him up to see if its ready. Spokes not in yet, but he will ring me later to let me know … no phone call comes later.

I ring him Thursday. Spokes still not in he says. He will ring me later to let me know. Does not ring me again later to let me know..

I ring him Friday. Spokes in he says. Only problem is that the red nipples I gave him do not fit the new DTswiss spokes he fitting .. do I mind if he fits silver nipples … just fit them I say, spoke colour no big deal to me.

Finally I pick up wheel. Looks nice. £49 altogether ( £25 build & £24 for the 12 new DTswiss spokes ).
When I get in I fit rim tape. I notice a couple of threads showing on the non drive side spokes .. the spokes he said were the DTswiss ones he had to order ..
On closer look I can see all spokes, including the ones he said were DTswiss, were the mac spokes I had given him .. the flange were all clearly marked with an M … not the DTswiss emblem.
He had charged me £24 extra .. and used the spokes I had given him. The only thing he had changed were the spoke nipples in an attempt to dupe me into thinking he had swapped spokes.

Went to his shop first thing this morning.
Soon as he opened his door I was there.
He looked at me, and the look on his face told me he knew why I was there.
I asked him what he was playing at by trying to con me. He tried to say he had charged me £24 for changing the 12 nipples on non drive side … so I reminded him he had said he swapped them cos they didnt fit the new DTswiss spokes he was supposed to have fitted.

He had no answer. Just started mumbling something about he had made a mix up.
I got a refund. But what madness for him to even try such a blatant con job.
I dont imagine for one second I am the 1st person he has tried to thief off.
As for the shops name .. all I will say is that it sounds similar to Fartin Gashfield Bikles 😉

you got your red nips back ?

Mistakes do happen, and you’ve got a refund so he’s acknowledged that there was a mistake, the shop in question has a lot of happy customers including myself as it’s my local

Hardly seems a genuine mistake ..
How does he charge £24 extra when he knows he has only changed 12 spoke nipples?
And more so after he told me he had put 12 DTswiss spokes on .. and used ones I had provided??

If this is a mistake you too could/would make LOCO .. then I shall continue to give you a wide berth.

😆 I get people to build my wheels for me as i don’t have time, cheer up the suns out 😀

Yep know the guy myself worked with on the tour of Britain when he was the mech to the welsh squad top bloke all round .
You got a refund maybe it was just a mix up.
It’s always the eBay crap that causes grief .

I’m with you, mooman. It appears to be blatant dishonesty, and I’m glad you caught it.

Doesnt sound like an honest mistske to me. Why did you not ask for your original spokes back when you picked up your wheel though ?

Who knows ?
But he isn’t here to defend himself is he ?

so are the carbon wheels any good

where you riding with them this weekend?

+1 nonk, not something he’s likely to have done on purpose knowing him.

maybe he ordered the spokes, found they were wrongly sized, rebuilt with your old ones anyway (not sure about the nips though, unless the silver ones are longer and were an initial attempt to correct a too-short DT problem – or shorter to correct a too-long problem where the nipple runs right down the thread on the spoke)

possibly a mistake IF it wasn’t him that built the wheel and the builder didn’t mention the change of plan – can’t really see another way this could be an error

Not knowing him that is a blatant attempt to twist your nipples and charge you for the pleasure.

I remember the heady days where Watsontony was defended initially as well.
Doesn’t sound very honest mistake to me.

This had me pretty wound up ..

Sorry but LOL!!!

Brightened up a wet day

Doesn’t sound very honest mistake to me

50/50 either way in my opinion.

What PatriotPro said ^^^

asterix – Member

so are the carbon wheels any good

where you riding with them this weekend?

Yes – look good enough.
Still on winter bike. So wont be using them for awhile yet.

bam74 – Member

Doesnt sound like an honest mistske to me. Why did you not ask for your original spokes back when you picked up your wheel though ?

I didnt ask for them back because I forgot .. effects of working nightshift this week.

[/quote]scaredypants – Member

maybe he ordered the spokes, found they were wrongly sized, rebuilt with your old ones anyway (not sure about the nips though, unless the silver ones are longer and were an initial attempt to correct a too-short DT problem – or shorter to correct a too-long problem where the nipple runs right down the thread on the spoke)

possibly a mistake IF it wasn’t him that built the wheel and the builder didn’t mention the change of plan – can’t really see another way this could be an error

He is the wheel builder. I too was hoping it would be a mistake with mechanic in back etc.
Blatant attempt to con.

If the threads are showing it might be worth taking a peek under the rim tape to see if those spokes actually go into the nipple heads or are stopping short (unsupported nipples are a lot weaker)

We would all like to think the our lbs are the pinnacle of honesty but they can be just as dishonest as anyone. I had this sort of thing happen to me not long back, i took my bike in for a full service and had all new drive train parts fitted while it was in, they called me while working on it to tell me the bb was goosed and also the headset, I told them to replace the bb and put a Chris King replacement headset in, they did a great job and I came away happy. Then three weeks later I managed to get a new frame for a cracking price and asked them to swap everything over for me, this time I got a call saying the bb was nackered and needed replacing??? When I questioned him about it and told him I’d only ridden the bike once he changed his mind! You could say it was a mistake or you could say he was trying it on? It’ll cost him in the long run though cos I won’t go there again!

Edit: obviously I didn’t buy them enough biscuits?

jimification – Member

If the threads are showing it might be worth taking a peek under the rim tape to see if those spokes actually go into the nipple heads or are stopping short (unsupported nipples are a lot weaker)

Good call. Will check them.

The problem I have now is that I will have to take wheel to another shop to have wheel looked over because I have no faith/trust in the workmanship of the wheelbuilder.
Last thing I want is for the wheel to fold on a descent because the LBS wanted to thief a little extra money off me instead of putting the correct spokes on that I had paid for.

£2 a spoke IS too much. Ours are 80p for plain gauge and £1.19 double butted including nipples.

£2 a spoke IS too much. Ours are 80p for plain gauge and £1.19 double butted including nipples.

Totally depends on the spoke PP. You should know this by now! 😉

Anything bladed is going to be £2+ minimum, quite probably a fair bit more. Then there’s the fact the shop has to order in a size it wouldn’t normally use, probably in a box of 72… And…

Well… Losing the point here!

I’d say given the fact you’ve got your money back, what’s the issue? Honest mistakes do happen, you’re no worse off. You ever worked in an LBS where in general, the guys in there have to sell bikes, build bikes, fix bikes, order stock, book stock in, put stock on display, box stuff for dispatch, take stuff down the PO for dispatch, face up, sweep the floor, make the tea AND be nice to customers all at the same time!!!

Sometimes, things get innocently missed or forgotten.

I’d say chalk it up to experience, and just be wary next time. Obviously if he tried it on again, then you know where you stand, but I’d say given that you got your money back so readily it sounded like an honest mistake. I’m sure he felt a bit of a prat because of it, and next time you go in there with a packet of biscuits he’ll probably stick the kettle on and give you 10% off your next purchase by way of an apology… Maybe…

Or am I living in a dream world where everybody has got something better to do than get on their high horse and rant about the insignificant things that are (or have been) easily fixed? 😕

How come you didn’t realise this when you collected the wheel and the LBS didn’t return the spokes you gave him? I’d have thought it would have been picked up then as an issue.

Could well be a misunderstanding. Benefit of the doubt once? It’s a bit of a jump from that to pretty much naming the shop and saying

“I dont imagine for one second I am the 1st person he has tried to thief off.”

Mistakes do happen of course.
The fact I was waiting from Monday for the different spokes .. the fact i had phoned Wedn/Thurs/Friday and spoke replacement was main point of delay.

How then does he overlook replacing them ?

Yes – i should have given wheel a thorough look over in shop. I honestly didnt expect him to have not replaced them … Who would ??

He had no other option but to refund me. There was no doubt at all he hadnt replaced spokes.

But once bitten etc.
Will avoid the place like the plague.

Sounds to me like you’ve caught them trying it on and are well within your rights to be very annoyed. Not sure I agree with the “honest mistake” take from some on here, sound pretty clearcut from (admittedly 1 side of) the story I’ve heard.

Totally depends on the spoke PP. You should know this by now!

Anything bladed is going to be £2+ minimum, quite probably a fair bit more. Then there’s the fact the shop has to order in a size it wouldn’t normally use, probably in a box of 72… And…

Yeah. I do. No mention of this one being bladed though! He just says “DT Swiss” so I quoted prices for DT Swiss spokes….. 🙂
I know how to listen to a customer…… 😉

A packet of biscuits?

Is handing over of specified amount of money for service/products not enough?

Does anyone actually do this?

Just to clarify – spokes would have been aero type.

He did not mention if they were to be aero-lite/aero-comp/aero-speed .. only said DTswiss spokes.

Not that it matters any. Because he didnt fit them.

So if he’d fitted the Dt swiss spokes surely he would have given you your spokes back that you supplied when you collected the wheel ??? Therefore knowing he’d used the other spokes

Stick to skenes son. no nonsense and they won’t spend the first 10 minutes telling you how crap everything is that they don’t sell.

you got old stock dt spokes then peter …..

unless they have come down in price significantly since i left the trade your shop is selling at trade. or possibly even below.

I can only guess that the people who are offering excuses for what happened are people in the bike trade?

In which case .. surely these people should be trying to remove the bad apples that are giving their profession a bad name.

What difference does it make that I forgot to ask for spokes back?
At the same time I did not recieve a receipt off him either ..

He knew and I knew the situation … thats all that mattered in my eyes.

If I had gone there today and he refused to refund me. Which he could have. Then sure I would have been even more pissed … but for me the main reason to go back was to let him know I had rumbled him.
To tell him face to face I knew he had conned me and I would not be giving him the opportunity to do so again.

Bicycle businesses don’t go around trying to get rid of the bad apple’s. They just mind their own business and try and do their own thing in the bike trade.

It’s not like Tesco V Sainsbury’s. They don’t have the time to go out of their way to peeve off their competitors. They’ve got flippin wheels to build!

I can understand why the OP is annoyed, but it sounds to me like a mix-up on behalf of the shopkeeper. I guess I find it hard to believe that the proprietor of an established business would risk damage to his reputation for £24.

He tried to bum u

Well if you had asked for your spokes back when you picked up the wheel ….and he’d obviously used them …you could have tackled him there and then …save you time and rumbled him straight away …..just sayin !!

you got old stock dt spokes then peter …..

Do spokes have a sell by date? I think not.
In any case, that shop hasn’t been open 2 years yet, so no. And the DB price is for a new box I opened a couple of weeks ago…. 🙂

No we know that they’re bladed spokes, which the OP doesn’t mention, £2 is reasonable.. 🙂

i wish people would stop banging on about mistakes happen.
the bloke said spokes weren’t suitable then used them with the cover story that he’d bought additional spokes and nipples. he even used differently coloured nipples to give the impression that what he claimed was what had happened.

the lesson here is buyer beware and know your stuff even if you don’t have the skills to, for example, build a wheel. I would advise that even if you can’t do it you make sure they know that you know your stuff.

I’m with Collinnstifee, there’s little scope for confusion given the series of conversations that was had with the man who was doing the actual work.

Of course, we’re only hearing half of the story and no way of judging whether it’s the true half. As has been said, it seems a lot of trouble to go to just for £24 given the relative ease of confirming whether the work was completed or not – markings on spokes, requests for old spokes, etc.

One possible story could be that the shop had all of the right intentions to fit the right spokes, was struggling to get them, got fed up with a nagging customer so just rebuilt the wheel to get him off his back. By then, it would have been a difficult situation to own up to so kept the story going. Definitely dishonest but in part a situation created by the OP’s constant chasing.

We shall never truly know but it seems fair to assume a degree of caution should be taken when dealing with this shop.

Well, i did think from the op’s post it did seem a pretty clear cut case of an attempted fraud, but then i read this;

I’d say given the fact you’ve got your money back, what’s the issue? Honest mistakes do happen, you’re no worse off. You ever worked in an LBS where in general, the guys in there have to sell bikes, build bikes, fix bikes, order stock, book stock in, put stock on display, box stuff for dispatch, take stuff down the PO for dispatch, face up, sweep the floor, make the tea AND be nice to customers all at the same time!!!

Now I’m thinking of setting up a charity for the special souls that nobly staff our lbs’s.