We’re thinking about escaping the traffic and rapidly-expanding urban life in a big city and bogging off somewhere quieter. Family of 4, me, my good lady and 2 girls 9 and 10 years old. And a dog. 2 cats. Lots of bikes.

Commuting to work doesn’t need to be every day (I work at home a few days a month already and I’m not scared of a 200 mile bike/train round trip occasionally), but main uncertainties are over schools and what’s a rough area and what’s not.
Schools in North Wales appear to mainly be Welsh-speaking. We view having to learn Welsh as a positive, but not if it’s needed to actually understand lessons from day 1.
I know that there’s some grot spots on the coast, we’re looking down the Conwy Valley.

We’re also looking at Scottish Borders – Castle Douglas looks like a possibility at the moment.

Anything else we need to think about?

Any thoughts?

I grew up near Llandudno but have since moved around the UK a lot, the rents still live there so I do go back a few times a year. In general, it’s a different place to what I left, riding there are almost infinite great opportunities, with a good scene from what I’ve noticed.

There is also just more acceptance that the ‘outdoor’ lifestyle is more acceptable, which has meant things such as Surf Snowdonia are there, unlike before where there was little.

Schools – I went to Eirias, also John Bright in Llandudno is English speaking, I believe Dyffryn Conwy is also English, one by Conwy marina is I think. None of them are too bad schools, Eirias was considered good, but has apparently gone downhill, but still decent.

Rough areas – avoid rhyl (obviously), Mochdre is a bit ming in places. Parents live in a little village called bryn Pydew, that would definetly work for you.

One piece of advice however is; there are very little opportunities in terms of well paid jobs, and your closest cities are around an hours drive. Sadly the traffic is still quite bad.

Drop me an email (in profile) if you need more info, as I know the area very well.

Moved from Northants to Dundee, then Fife.

Awful experience, hostile natives, awful beer, you can’t buy vegetables anywhere. And the Borders, don’t get me started, it like a post apocalyptic wasteland.

Aside from that, it’s ace! 🙂

As I posted in the thread about extractor fans we recently went to Argyll to see a super-efficient house somebody built, which is what we would like to do. The conversion ratio between England and Scotland is interesting – at the B&B where we stayed, the owner is selling two 10-acre plots with outline PP for £75,000 each. We reckon we can sell our 4 bed house in Lancashire and buy land and build a house in western Scotland without the need to dig into my pension.

Welsh girlfriend went to an English-language school as opposed to the Welsh-language one up the road. Did Welsh GCSE but lessons otherwise in English. This was in Mold though, so a reasonably big town and maybe not as far in as you’re looking.

Castle Douglas is a nice place, Have a look at Moffat/Bigger area too – Good biking both real biking and road biking nearby, and good transport links N and S via M74.

hostile natives

Sadly that is definitely a problem in Scotland, and the two girls would likely have to endure a certain amount of anti English hate at school.

Sadly that is definitely a problem in Scotland a very localised problem in some places, and the two girls would likely have to endure a certain amount of anti English hate at school.

Before you move anywhere, check that the broadband is good enough to allow you to work from home.
I have relatives just outside kirkcudbright and theirs is awful

Sadly that is definitely a problem in Scotland, and the two girls would likely have to endure a certain amount of anti English hate at school.

I’d say this is pish too. I’ve three kids,one at nursery and two at primary school, my wife is a guidance teacher as well and kids these days do not have a problem with people from other countries and cultures.

I’ve never felt any anti-English sentiment in the places we’ve been to regularly in the Borders. Anywhere in particular or is it just something that happens less now?

I moved up to Scotland from Yorkshire, lived there for 5 years then moved back to England.

I miss Scotland every day. The people are nicer, more generous, they have better politics, the trails are better, quieter and in many areas aren’t a slop fest. There’s so many things that are great about Scotland that just don’t apply to England and Wales.

I never came across any anti-English sentiments and I worked in some real shitholes (Kirkcaldy).

I don’t think anti-English is even a thing now to be honest, I don’t know if it ever really was…

Sadly that is definitely a problem in Scotland, and the two girls would likely have to endure a certain amount of anti English hate at school.

Utter nonsense.

The OP asked for experiences of people who have made the move – I gave the experience of my family.
Better than it was for sure, but still there.

Unless perhaps we all misinterpreted “F* off back home you English tw*t” on a daily basis?
My mum worked for 20yrs in a further education college, and found a sizeable proportion of the young adults there thought all the English should be sent home – although they hadn’t thought quite as far as if all the Scottish that had moved elsewhere should also be returned.

Edit: I should say that despite all that, there are indeed plenty of nice people, and I wouldn’t ever trade where I live for the urban sprawl and traffic jams down south.

I are up in north Wales, though a bit further west than you are suggesting. Moved there when I was 9 and loved every second.

Where I was, the local primary was welsh speaking, but after some lengthy negotiations I got a place at an English speaking primary not too far away. Secondary school was English speaking, which I think it probably still the case for the majority of secondaries.

We moved into a welsh speaking village – and this certainly created some barriers with the local children, so most of my friends were from school and a bike/lift away from home. I’d seriously consider whether this would suit you and your children, as can be a bit of a bind for parents until the girls are able to travel around independently.

Other than that I thoroughly loved growing up there, access to the mountains and coast gives so many options that I’d be back there in a flash if suitable jobs were available.

Plenty of english speaking schools in wales – view it as religious schools in england- and just pick an english speaking one. Conwy and gwynedd are “More Welsh” than the other areas.

IMHO it depends on whether the family can cope with just countryside and village type life
Quite a change from what Manchester will offer and the things you miss now you will get but you will also lose things you enjoy now that only a large conurbation can offer

Which your family value most I know not.

I’ve never felt any anti-English sentiment in the places we’ve been to regularly in the Borders.

Bit different when you are at school though.

On the Welsh thing, I’d be very surprised if all the schools in North Wales teach only in Welsh, just needs a bit of research.

Irrespective of where you move your contribution to the local community is key. My folks moved to Anglesey about 10yrs ago but they were still working and my Dad’s workshop used to take kids for work placements etc. So you get known in the local area. They’ve both retired now but the links they made locally before that was key in settling in and being “accepted”. They’re happier there than the previous 40yrs in Manchester.
The Welsh language is very important in local schools and English kids can be viewed as slowing the rest of the class down due to language difficulties as a lot of schools conduct lessons in Welsh. Some schools are 100% Welsh, others less so. Finding the right balance will be critical.
BTW, Anglesey, like much of N Wales, is full of northern monkeys but the ones who make some effort to blend in are most successful. Some of their neighbours are best avoided but they tend to be English people who moved there thinking that they were above the locals

Having kids will make it easier as you have to get involved and the conversations at the school gates will help you make new friends.

I’ll guess the biggest issue will be bored kids as they get older and the amount of Dad’s taxi runs you’ll be doing. We have friends near Aberdyfi, the 6th form college is in Aberystwyth. Local rugby/hockey/footy matches can be 2hrs drive each way. Regional ones 4hrs……

Other places to consider could be Northumberland, or maybe Peebles area. They are on or near the east coast mainline so work would be easier to accommodate.

“Sadly that is definitely a problem in Scotland, and the two girls would likely have to endure a certain amount of anti English hate at school.”

That’s complete bollox.
Maybe I am just lucky and my two boys go to a primary school in a very-mixed catchment – by which I mean Uni profs rub shoulders in the playground with parents who left school at 15. Never had a problem – and I know the majority of other parents (Indian/Iranian/Italian/Polish/Ukrainians) would say the same.

Having grown up in a few different bits of Wales as an “english” kid, despite Welsh heritage, the whole family suffered from racism to varying degrees.

Where every you think of going, please don’t underestimate this possibility. It made my childhood bloody miserable.

I live in Craig y Don, Llandudno.

Originally from the N.Wales coast but spent the majority of my 20’s in Liverpool / Wirral for Uni and job. Moved back due to having a city wage job available in N.Wales and starting a family I couldn’t think of many places better to bring a child up.

Love the place – scenery is stunning, riding is ace with endless possibilities and the activities for kids if they like the outdoors is amazing. Other facilities (general shopping) is mainly catered for and I rarely feel the need to visit a city for anything like that.

In certain areas of the coast, including Llandudno/Deganwy/Conwy, new restaurants and wine bars are popping up and the existing ones getting much better with a real push to quality. You can see the shift and the area is really starting to take shape and is much better than when I ‘left’ at 18/19.

In terms of schools; its Welsh Primary and Secondary if you go away from the coast so bear that in mind.

BTW, Anglesey, like much of N Wales, is full of northern monkeys but the ones who make some effort to blend in are most successful. Some of their neighbours are best avoided but they tend to be English people who moved there thinking that they were above the locals

I practically grew up on Anglesey, there are some semi-distant relatives there in fact.

@northerntom; sounds like your folks aren’t a million miles away from me! Should drop me a message when you are back and fancy a ride 😀

That’s complete bollox.
Maybe I am just lucky

Or maybe if you live in a city with a well-respected university and the diverse range of students that brings, you might never have experienced the hostility someone else might have encountered on moving to a more rural, insular, less diverse area of the country?

FWIW, I moved from Sheffield to Edinburgh to NE Fife. I’ve never experienced any anti-English hostility, apart from the odd SNP mouthbreather at the height of the indyref malarkey, but I think those occasions can safely be discounted given 99.9999% of folk up here (that I’ve met) are spot on. Would I move back? I can’t think of any reason why I would. It’s great up here.

FWIW, lived in West Wales for a couple of years. The Welsh were just not interested despite our best efforts to integrate. The kids never got asked for play dates etc, when we asked others the only people who responded were English. So you end up by default in an English clique. Eventually we gave it up as a bad job and moved back to England. Their loss.

How about Burnley?
The language might be a problem but you’ll get used to it.

Have friends who live in Dinorwic, right near the quarry.
Can pass on details if required.

Lived on west coast of Scotland for 3 years. Bit of anti English crap but as Scottish mate told me it sorts out the idiots quickly so you don’t waste time. Having just got back from Todridon I’m tempted to go back. Now in Liverpool but spend a lot of time in Wales which I’d happily move to if I could get permanent work. You meet idiots everywhere. If its not because you’re English it would be something else like the fact you have 2 legs.

So what we are seeing is that it is very much location and community dependent. The trend seems to be move somewhere that is not too incestuous, has public transport and public amenities, a mix of people from different backgrounds, a place with things to do e.g. mountains, sea etc.
The only downside is that it will be the place that everyone wants to live thus expensive. Houses in places like Rhosneigr, Aberdyfi and Conwy can be silly money.

Burnley? My poor son was born there and we moved out when violent drug dealers moved in next door.

TBH school bullying is a thing that happens- but the question is, do kids get bullied because they’re english, or do they get bullied because that happens to be the weapon that the bully picked up? My brother got bullied for being ginger, not because anyone really hates gingers (this was before scientists discovered they have no souls) but because they went right, let’s have a go at him, what will we use.

(at my school there were english kids that got a hard time for being english, and english kids that didn’t, asian kids that got racist abuse and others that didn’t. Gay kids that everyone liked and awkward heterosexual kids that got bullied for being teh gay. It’s not so simple. I think the english kids that got bullied, would have just got something else instead if that hadn’t been available)

Those saying that there’s no hostility to ‘incomers’ in Scotland have either been lucky, or aren’t English at school in Scotland. I’m not English, though I sound it, and have had the occasional comment – my son, however, who has been in Perthshire since he was 3 (17 now, but still doesn’t sound Scottish) says that the digs were fairly frequent during the first few years of secondary school.

But then I think there was as much needling when we lived in Kendal (we both have southern English accents), so it’s not necessarily a ‘Scottish’ thing per se. Possibly just tribalism which you can get anywhere.

I grew up in NW England, went to university in Bangor and have lived in Scotland for 20 years. My kids were born here. You only get anti English sentiment of any type in the rough areas. It’s a problem which is easy to solve.
Do it, but consider further north for better access to work in the central belt.

I live in Craig y Don, Llandudno.

Then I will have to pick your brains about the local riding next time I’m on my hols, we usually stop in Penrhyn Side.

The RAF took me from Bolton to Fife then Moray and I’ve finally settled in rural Aberdeenshire.
There was a brief period of anti-Englishness in Fife, but I think that was more to do with being single and in the RAF, I’ve not encountered it since.
I do not miss the dirtiness, the horrible traffic, the grey weather, the fear of my bike being stolen etc. of Greater Manchester.

…….and more importantly, the riding in Scotland is brilliant. From my door, at least six proper hills within 20 minutes drive, the Cairngorms about an hour and the West Coast in about 3 hours, all with open access.

I would not move back to England.

We’re also looking at Scottish Borders – Castle Douglas looks like a possibility at the moment.

We were considering moving there (or Dumfries) for a bit. Trekster of this forum gave me an honest and detailed view of Dumfrieshire, if you don’t know any locals.

I’d say that you need to make sure you know where you’re talking about.

I know people get grumpy in Kirkcudbright because it’s talked about as being in the borders when it’s not it’s in Dumfries and Galloway. It’s a small thing but

So what we are seeing is that it is very much location and community dependent.

Well, if he goes to the Borders it wont be a problem. It’s basically England down there. 😛

oops double post

Further to what I said before, I left N.Wales 10 years ago, and never really experienced anti-english sentiment, although I am welsh, so never would have received it directly.

Around the Conwy area, a lot of people are of North west England heritage anyway, and the local accent around the area has a particularly unpleasant scouse twang now, which has developed more recently (my little sister has this)…. (before an irrelevant argument regarding accents ensues, nothing wrong with welsh or scouse, just the combo is not particularly pleasant).

All I would say is, if you can make it work, do it, having lived in London for 4 years, I’m so glad I moved to Bristol, and whilst I love it here, I can’t wait to move into the mountains!

@buenfoxa – Yeah always keen for a ride when I’m back home, will let you know.

I’m in Edinburgh
My wife finds its less about being English and more about ‘which school did your husband go to’
It’s truly bizarre and where I did go to school flummoxes them a bit.